The League is over - Who is going to be in the Super 8s?

Fr Tod Umptious

TrueGael wrote: »

SO let me get this straight Dublin are guaranteed 2 Home Games to everyone elses 1 and also whoever plays them in their 'Croke Park' fixture will have 2 away matches which nobody else will have

And people who dare question Dublin's preferred status within the GAA bitter culchies:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Might as well call it the Dublin Juggernaut Invitational

Let's not turn it into a anti Dublin whinge fest please.

Fr Tod Umptious

rossie1977 wrote: »

I don't think anyone outside Dublin and Kerry should feel they have an automatic right to be in the final 8 this year.

Obviously Mayo and Tyrone will expect to be there but both have very tough first round games to Galway and Monaghan respectively. Win those and it's pretty much nailed on they reach the last eight, lose them and it's four qualifier games and while both have shown they can traverse that route it only takes one poor performance to be knocked out.

Elsewhere I expect the winner of Cavan and Donegal to get that far, it's a long route for the winner of that game still but Derry and the winner of Down/Antrim shouldn't halt eithers momentum.

After that it's a toss up. Kildare probably only need to win one qualifier game to reach last game, same with winner of Cork and Tipp. Galway look very impressive so far but it's depends on Mayo game, again win it and they should reach that stage comfortably, lose it and it's a long road. If we (Roscommon) win Connacht we will obviously be there but if we lose in Connacht our record in the qualifiers is awful and I think fourth round qualifer is again six days after Connacht final like in 2016.

There is always a dark horse every year that nobody expects it seems. Longford, laois, meath, sligo, clare could spring a surprise or two this year.

No it's not

The round 4 qualifier (7th July) is 3 weeks after the Connacht final (17th June)

aidan24326

manofwisdom wrote: »

I for one don't see that Galway game as important as its made out to be. Mayo are one of the most seasoned and experienced teams around i will be shocked if they don't reach the last 8 via the front or back door this summer.

The point people are making is that this is an ageing Mayo team with a serious amount of mileage, and that they were very lucky to come through the qualifiers in one piece last year.

You could never write this Mayo team off but I think the game on May 13th is even more important for Mayo than for Galway, as they won't fancy another slog through the qualifiers with an ageing and not overly deep squad.

Galway on the other hand are a young team with lots of options off the bench who are well equipped to go the backdoor route if that's how it plays out. But right now I think that game in Castlebar is a hard one to call. Mayo at their very best are still a better team than Galway in terms of proven big-match results but with Lee Keegan and Cillian O'Connor missing and facing a much-improved Galway team, Mayo are up against it.

I still think they'll probably be knocking around later in the Summer but I've no doubt they'd rather go the direct route, which makes the Galway game a crucial one.

corny

TrueGael wrote: »

SO let me get this straight Dublin are guaranteed 2 Home Games to everyone elses 1 and also whoever plays them in their 'Croke Park' fixture will have 2 away matches which nobody else will have

And people who dare question Dublin's preferred status within the GAA bitter culchies:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Might as well call it the Dublin Juggernaut Invitational

Its the 'bitter culchies' putting Dublin in Croke Park so you kind of forfeit on the sympathy vote.

largepants

TrueGael wrote: »

SO let me get this straight Dublin are guaranteed 2 Home Games to everyone elses 1 and also whoever plays them in their 'Croke Park' fixture will have 2 away matches which nobody else will have

And people who dare question Dublin's preferred status within the GAA bitter culchies:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Might as well call it the Dublin Juggernaut Invitational

Careful now.

You'll either be accused of being bitter or begrudging or both. You dare not bring any of the above up in any thread because it's not to be discussed under any circumstances.

You simply bow down to the powers that be and hand over your hard earned money to ensure that it continues.

C__MC

I think the rossies could well win Connacht again. They have a stronger panel then last year and will have a home final plus an easy semi final. There panel also stronger than last year.

Kerry will win Munster at a canter as will Dublin in Leinster

Donegal have a great chance in ulster. They are improving despite relegation and have an easy side to draw.

My bets
Dublin
Kerry
Roscommon
Donegal

Tyrone
Mayo
Galway
Armagh/Tipperary

Are the qualifiers based on two seperate draws again this year?

munsterlegend

C__MC wrote: »

I think the rossies could well win Connacht again. They have a stronger panel then last year and will have a home final plus an easy semi final. There panel also stronger than last year.

Kerry will win Munster at a canter as will Dublin in Leinster

Donegal have a great chance in ulster. They are improving despite relegation and have an easy side to draw.

My bets
Dublin
Kerry
Roscommon
Donegal

Tyrone
Mayo
Galway
Armagh/Tipperary

Are the qualifiers based on two seperate draws again this year?

I'd agree with most of your selections. If Cork can get everyone fit and the nemo players back I think they will beat tipp and get the last spot.

Fr Tod Umptious

C__MC wrote: »

I think the rossies could well win Connacht again. They have a stronger panel then last year and will have a home final plus an easy semi final. There panel also stronger than last year.

Kerry will win Munster at a canter as will Dublin in Leinster

Donegal have a great chance in ulster. They are improving despite relegation and have an easy side to draw.

My bets
Dublin
Kerry
Roscommon
Donegal

Tyrone
Mayo
Galway
Armagh/Tipperary

Are the qualifiers based on two seperate draws again this year?

They are playing Cavan in the preliminary, nothing easy about that.

Qualifiers this year are in a single draw, no A or B side.

EICVD

threeball wrote: »

Dublin should have to play 2 away games every second year they qualify to bring some bit of fairness to the structure.

& not one Dub would disagree, we wouldn’t even complain if we play our ‘home’ one away every year

RayVaughan1984

Hopefully Tipp can make it.It would really cement their progress.

blanch152

EICVD wrote: »

& not one Dub would disagree, we wouldn’t even complain if we play our ‘home’ one away every year

This Croke Park thing is a myth.

In the League, where we have to play as many games away as at home, we have reached the last 6 finals, winning 5 of them. That is better than our record in the Championship where we play all but one at home.

How do the Dublin-haters explain that?

munsterlegend

blanch152 wrote: »

This Croke Park thing is a myth.

In the League, where we have to play as many games away as at home, we have reached the last 6 finals, winning 5 of them. That is better than our record in the Championship where we play all but one at home.

How do the Dublin-haters explain that?

There is an advantage playing on the same pitch all the time. What's debatable is how much difference it makes. In Leinster not much but if dublin had to go to say Killarney to play kerry in an all Ireland quarter final onwards it would definitely narrow the gap.

Bonniedog

As EICVD said above, no-one in Dublin would object to playing two games away from CP - one being a neutral venue. It is of course an advantage. Leinster is irrelevant - only lost I think one game away out of 35 going back to 70s, 80s and 90s when away games in Leinster were common, depending on the draw.

Would be interesting to see a group game between say Dublin and one of the Ulster teams at a neutral venue other than Croke Park.

Decision is not Dublin's. It is based on GAA's thinking regarding attendances, as was consistent policy of Leinster council - made up of all Leinster counties - to play all Dublin games since late 90s in Croke Park.

Thurles, Limerick, Cork would be adequate for travelling support from Dublin and whoever they played. GAA will also be crossing fingers that Dublin and Mayo are not drawn away against a county with a capacity that would not hold season and county board pass holders from either, never mind club members!

StupidLikeAFox

Think this is going to be great. Each of the last 4 games before super 8s (provincial losers vs qualifiers) are going to be like a final for the teams involved. Then you are going to have proper, meaningful football being played all over the country in August.

TrueGael

blanch152 wrote: »

This Croke Park thing is a myth.

In the League, where we have to play as many games away as at home, we have reached the last 6 finals, winning 5 of them. That is better than our record in the Championship where we play all but one at home.

How do the Dublin-haters explain that?

“I honestly believe Croke Park must be worth an eight-point advantage to Dublin,”

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/how-big-is-dublins-croker-shadow-468882.html

You and your cohorts are fooling nobody that home advantage doesn't exist big time for Dublin. Every one of those finals and semi finals were at home regardless of how where ye finished in the league table.

Galway finished 1st in the table yet their reward was an away final(what other sport in the world would that happen?) which by the way could easily have been played at Salthill given the pitiful attendance (even Dublin fans are well bored now and not willing to fork out money and who could blame them)

In the 'Super 8' if ye draw Tyrone, Mayo and Tipperary it doesn't take a genius to work out which game they will 'force' ye to play away now does it?

Its bad enough that the 2 Home Games is another advantage to be added to the long list but this years Ulster Champions will have to play 2 games AWAY from home which means whoever gets to the Ulster Final would be much much better off losing which is all because of the GAA's obsession with pandering to the Juggernaut

Bonniedog

127 posts all whinging about Dublin!

Do you not have your own county to be talking about?

Mushy

StupidLikeAFox wrote: »

Think this is going to be great. Each of the last 4 games before super 8s (provincial losers vs qualifiers) are going to be like a final for the teams involved. Then you are going to have proper, meaningful football being played all over the country in August.

Couldnt agree more, its making me excited for the football championship more than ever id say. Having competitive games in neutral grounds will make for great encounters, look at Kerry-mayo in Limerick. Should be great atmosphere at them, the towns will be busy which will help it. Better than half empty Croker week in week out.

Fr Tod Umptious

Mushy wrote: »

Couldnt agree more, its making me excited for the football championship more than ever id say. Having competitive games in neutral grounds will make for great encounters, look at Kerry-mayo in Limerick. Should be great atmosphere at them, the towns will be busy which will help it. Better than half empty Croker week in week out.

They won't be in neutral grounds other than CP.
For example
Mayo v Kerry will be in CP

Mayo v Qualifier will be in Mayo

Qualifier v Mayo will be at qualifiers venue.

Provincial champ v Provincial champ and Qualifier v Qualifier = Croke Park

Provincial champ v qualifier = home/away.

blanch152

TrueGael wrote: »

“I honestly believe Croke Park must be worth an eight-point advantage to Dublin,”

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/how-big-is-dublins-croker-shadow-468882.html

You and your cohorts are fooling nobody that home advantage doesn't exist big time for Dublin. Every one of those finals and semi finals were at home regardless of how where ye finished in the league table.

Galway finished 1st in the table yet their reward was an away final(what other sport in the world would that happen?) which by the way could easily have been played at Salthill given the pitiful attendance (even Dublin fans are well bored now and not willing to fork out money and who could blame them)

In the 'Super 8' if ye draw Tyrone, Mayo and Tipperary it doesn't take a genius to work out which game they will 'force' ye to play away now does it?

Its bad enough that the 2 Home Games is another advantage to be added to the long list but this years Ulster Champions will have to play 2 games AWAY from home which means whoever gets to the Ulster Final would be much much better off losing which is all because of the GAA's obsession with pandering to the Juggernaut

You haven't addressed my main point. Why have Dublin done better in the League than in the Championship over the last six seasons, given they play a higher proportion of away games in the League?

danganabu

blanch152 wrote: »

This Croke Park thing is a myth.

In the League, where we have to play as many games away as at home, we have reached the last 6 finals, winning 5 of them. That is better than our record in the Championship where we play all but one at home.

How do the Dublin-haters explain that?

So we finally have you admitting that Croke Park is a home game for Dublin, not hiding behind this facade of Parnell Park? Some of your fellow jacks not going to be best pleased :D

Bonniedog

danganabu wrote: »

So we finally have you admitting that Croke Park is a home game for Dublin, not hiding behind this facade of Parnell Park? Some of your fellow jacks not going to be best pleased :D

Hurlers set the balance right. In last three years, we've had three "home" games from 11. Two of them in Croke Park which is certainly not an advantage to Dublin. no-one ever mentions that


Incidentally Dangan old chap, Tipp have had 6 of their 9 Munster, qualifier and quarter finals in Thurles over same period.

Who will stop the Tipp juggernaut? The stadium doping ;-)

danganabu

Bonniedog wrote: »

Hurlers set the balance right. In last three years, we've had three "home" games from 11. Two of them in Croke Park which is certainly not an advantage to Dublin. no-one ever mentions that

I have no problem at all with the footballers playing in Croker, it makes sense on pretty much every level, however the pretence from some that its not a home game and not an advantage is silly.

danganabu

Bonniedog wrote: »

Incidentally Dangan old chap, Tipp have had 6 of their 9 Munster, qualifier and quarter finals in Thurles over same period.

Who will stop the Tipp juggernaut? The stadium doping ;-)

When Waterford county board get their finger out and now we have Frank Bowl it wont take long for that to be addressed.

Bonniedog

danganabu wrote: »

When Waterford county board get their finger out and now we have Frank Bowl it wont take long for that to be addressed.

Only joking.

Thurles is the elephants graveyard of Dublin hurling. Can only recall us winning once there - beating Limerick in quarter finals in 2012 - in nearly 50 years! And usually hidings of enormous proportions.

Actually I think counties like playing in Thurles and CP even when Tipp and Dubs are the opponents. It is obviously a big advantage against weaker teams, but not so much at the business end of Munster or in Dublin's case in AI semis and finals.

Meath used to surrender home advantage in Navan to play in Croke Park before Leinster Council ever intervened.

TrueGael

blanch152 wrote: »

You haven't addressed my main point. Why have Dublin done better in the League than in the Championship over the last six seasons, given they play a higher proportion of away games in the League?

Well I wouldn't say there is a huge disparity, the main difference for the League is the likes of Kerry, Donegal and in particular Mayo have their players scattered throughout the country and thus cannot hope to be in serious nick for March April (which is why Dublin hammer them really bad in the League)and have to focus on July/August which is risky as Mayo almost found to their cost a good few times last summer

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/football/the-biggest-obstacle-between-mayo-and-glory-their-location-424072.html

TrueGael

Bonniedog wrote: »

Hurlers set the balance right. In last three years, we've had three "home" games from 11. Two of them in Croke Park which is certainly not an advantage to Dublin. no-one ever mentions that


Incidentally Dangan old chap, Tipp have had 6 of their 9 Munster, qualifier and quarter finals in Thurles over same period.

Who will stop the Tipp juggernaut? The stadium doping ;-)

That is because Cork had no stadium and Waterford went to Thurles as they preferred it to Limerick (they have a shocking record there) The qualifiers are random luck they drew Kilkenny a few years back away

Nobody has ever claimed Semple wasn't their home ground or that it wasn't a significant advantage - indeed there was a lot of criticism when Galway had to play the U21 Final against them there in 2010 and rightly so

Mushy

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Mushy wrote: »

Couldnt agree more, its making me excited for the football championship more than ever id say. Having competitive games in neutral grounds will make for great encounters, look at Kerry-mayo in Limerick. Should be great atmosphere at them, the towns will be busy which will help it. Better than half empty Croker week in week out.

They won't be in neutral grounds other than CP.
For example
Mayo v Kerry will be in CP

Mayo v Qualifier will be in Mayo

Qualifier v Mayo will be at qualifiers venue.

Provincial champ v Provincial champ and Qualifier v Qualifier = Croke Park

Provincial champ v qualifier = home/away.

Sorry, yes, this is true. What I should have said was just having games in regional grounds will be great, neutral or not

nice_guy80

Don't know why the other 31 counties financed a neutral stadium for Dublin to play all their games in

Anyway, realistically what other 'neutral' venue will the Dubs actually be dragged to?

dxhound2005

Parnell Park.

ProudDUB

There is no such thing as neutral venue for the Dubs. We'll be loathed and despised in equal measure, regardless of what venue in the colonies we rock up to.

Personally, I'd bleedin' love Castlebar. We find it easier to win there, than in Croker. Mad 'wha?