Belfast rape trial - all 4 found not guilty Mod Note post one

Grayson

ShowMeTheCash wrote: »

Best strawman I have seen in a while!
Universally does not mean "in all times"!
Why do people go to these lengths to make idiotic statements?
You want to try and make an argument about cultures of the past?
Maybe you want to talk about cavemen while you are at it and and pretend that it is relevant?

Name one culture in society today where rape is acceptable?

Yes it does mean that. It means that something is true despite any other factor such as race, gender, sex, culture or any other factor.
I'd suggest you look up what universal morals are.
As for a culture where rape is ok today? How about in ISIS occupied territory.

Grayson

goz83 wrote: »

:eek::eek::eek:

Does that mean the Universal Social Charge applies to all people, in all cultures, of all time?

Damn the gubbermint!

No. Its used in a different context. Google ethics and universal. See that context.

RuMan

Faugheen wrote: »

Or, just maybe, we could ask men to, you know, not rape people?

Don't victim blame. It sums up exactly what people mean when they say we have a rape culture here.

We should ask RAPISTS to not rape people.

Robbers not to rob and murderers not to murder.

Most people dont commit those crimes so please dont tar all men with ur sweeping generalisations. Prosecute convicted rapists anf impose harsh sentences rather then virtue signalling after 4 innocent men are found not guilty of all charges.

RabbleRouser2k

RuMan wrote: »

Look mate you said " he hadnt played a game comptetively in 24 months"

A statement that was completely and utterly false. You had ur ass handed to u, stop embarrassing urself further. Bye bye

Still not your 'mate'-never will be. (And I don't remember any physical combat-so my buttocks remain firmly entrenched where they are wanted). As I said, Test matches are not competitive-so you haven't made a point-you're just trolling. No falsities in both those statements.

And you continue to not answer questions-by me and others-what is your investment in Jackson? You've been refuted by many others, yet you continue to acertain people want Jackson back, yet ignore Olding as he's not 'valuable'.

Irish rugby is enjoying a real boom-there are many players to replace Jackson, who even prior to this case showed he was a liability.

upandcumming wrote: »

That was a tongue in cheek comment rather than being serious. I really don't think anyone should be banned from the games for their beliefs.


The reason I brought Ched Evans into this, relates to the farcical 'petition'. My point is that thousands of people from all around the world signed a petition to prevent him from signing for Sheffield, and Oldham when they simply knew nothing of the case or the clubs involved. Anyone can signed a change.org petition, it is completely meaningless.

Yeah, I saw someone signing the petition to get Paddy Jackson back under the name 'Jimmy Saville'.
Now unless there is a poor fella who actually is named Jimmy Saville, I'll take those words back.

FrancieBrady

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

Still not your 'mate'-never will be. (And I don't remember any physical combat-so my buttocks remain firmly entrenched where they are wanted). As I said, Test matches are not competitive-so you haven't made a point-you're just trolling. No falsities in both those statements.

And you continue to not answer questions-by me and others-what is your investment in Jackson? You've been refuted by many others, yet you continue to acertain people want Jackson back, yet ignore Olding as he's not 'valuable'.

Irish rugby is enjoying a real boom-there are many players to replace Jackson, who even prior to this case showed he was a liability.

Where did he show he was a liability?

goz83

Grayson wrote: »

No. Its used in a different context. Google ethics and universal. See that context.

Sarcasm was hiding under your bed when I wrote that.

RabbleRouser2k

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Where did he show he was a liability?

When he dressed in blackface, with the big smiling head on him.

Many apologies had to be made by Ulster Rugby, and politicians and members of political parties were also offended.

Apparently Ulster Rugby's twitter page is blocking people now-that's really bizarre.
I wonder if it's a temporary block-due to the irfu investigation, but it's bad form-seems they are using a block bot, and many UR fans are blocked.

Grayson

RuMan wrote: »

We should ask RAPISTS to not rape people.

Robbers not to rob and murderers not to murder.

Most people dont commit those crimes so please dont tar all men with ur sweeping generalisations. Prosecute convicted rapists anf impose harsh sentences rather then virtue signalling after 4 innocent men are found not guilty of all charges.

What?

Grayson

goz83 wrote: »

Sarcasm was hiding under your bed when I wrote that.

It's easy to take people literally online. Use a smiley next time :P

FrancieBrady

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

When he dressed in blackface, with the big smiling head on him.

Many apologies had to be made by Ulster Rugby, and politicians and members of political parties were also offended.

Apparently Ulster Rugby's twitter page is blocking people now-that's really bizarre.
I wonder if it's a temporary block-due to the irfu investigation, but it's bad form-seems they are using a block bot, and many UR fans are blocked.

4 years ago? And he was a 'liability' you say?

Somebody shoulda told Joe Schimdt that in 2017. :rolleyes:

https://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/paddy-jacksons-humble-words-joe-schmidt-dropped-mark-man-114528

I understand you are cross about all this, but can you keep it in perspective and somewhere near reality?

RuMan

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

Still not your 'mate'-never will be. (And I don't remember any physical combat-so my buttocks remain firmly entrenched where they are wanted). As I said, Test matches are not competitive-so you haven't made a point-you're just trolling. No falsities in both those statements.

And you continue to not answer questions-by me and others-what is your investment in Jackson? You've been refuted by many others, yet you continue to acertain people want Jackson back, yet ignore Olding as he's not 'valuable'.

Irish rugby is enjoying a real boom-there are many players to replace Jackson, who even prior to this case showed he was a liability.




Yeah, I saw someone signing the petition to get Paddy Jackson back under the name 'Jimmy Saville'.
Now unless there is a poor fella who actually is named Jimmy Saville, I'll take those words back.

Look child you stated that he hadnt played competitively for 24 months. You further stated that 24 months out of the game was 2 long.

I pointed out that he played for the National team against Japan in June 2017.

You then responded by saying it was 2016. I sent you a link with the match report from June 2017.

You now say " tests matches are not competitive "

You are a moron

RabbleRouser2k

RuMan wrote: »

Look child you stated that he hadnt played competitively for 24 months. You further stated that 24 months out of the game was 2 long.

I pointed out that he played for the National team against Japan in June 2017.

You then responded by saying it was 2016. I sent you a link with the match report from June 2017.

You now say " tests matches are not competitive "

You are a moron

I never said 2016-that wasn't me, you're conflating posters, and again, you don't answer questions. Just abuse-ridiculous.

RuMan

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

I never said 2016-that wasn't me, you're conflating posters, and again, you don't answer questions. Just abuse-ridiculous.

You stated he hadnt played for 24 months when in fact he last played in June 2017.
Are you going to admit you were wrong?

I have answered many questions from people who know what they are talking about. When u admit ur error I will consider responding to u.

goz83

Grayson wrote: »

It's easy to take people literally online. Use a smiley next time :P

Noted

Ken.

Mod-Ruman don't post in this thread again. Reason- Personal abuse/uncivility.

JRant

Grayson wrote: »

try and answer my question. How is it universally accepted? Universally accepted implies that in all cultures, in all times, that rape has been reviled.

The fact is that it has been considered perfectly acceptable by many cultures at various times.

Remember, you're the one that said it's a universally accepted fact. That's about as broad and sweeping statement as is possible to make. I'm asking you to back it up.

Why don't you back up the claims you made earlier in this thread that these men destroyed evidence and were, in your eyes, "guilty".

RabbleRouser2k

FrancieBrady wrote: »

4 years ago? And he was a 'liability' you say?

Somebody shoulda told Joe Schimdt that in 2017. :rolleyes:

https://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/paddy-jacksons-humble-words-joe-schmidt-dropped-mark-man-114528

I understand you are cross about all this, but can you keep it in perspective and somewhere near reality?

Oh, he was brought back into the squad-sure, that's no problem. After many apologies were made, and the photo taken down. But you can understand he more than likely got a tongue lashing behind the scenes.

(Btw, that post link talks about him being dropped-I don't know what purpose that serves regarding Schmidt and Jacksons relationship.)

Gilroy was suspended for sending a whatsapp message-so it makes me wonder what sort of punishment the guys will get. Already, politicians are handing in their season passes-and that's further adding to the pressure.

Contrary to some opinions, I am trying to stay calm about this-I'm not as bad as others might think.

FrancieBrady

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

Oh, he was brought back into the squad-sure, that's no problem. After many apologies were made, and the photo taken down. But you can understand he more than likely got a tongue lashing behind the scenes.

(Btw, that post link talks about him being dropped-I don't know what purpose that serves regarding Schmidt and Jacksons relationship.)

Gilroy was suspended for sending a whatsapp message-so it makes me wonder what sort of punishment the guys will get. Already, politicians are handing in their season passes-and that's further adding to the pressure.

Contrary to some opinions, I am trying to stay calm about this-I'm not as bad as others might think.

Ulster Rugby apologised once in an official statement.

You are running away with a story and trying to paint a picture here.

The facts don't support it unfortunately.

capefear

Claire Byrne rte 1 9.30 is going to discuss if the lads should be let play for Ireland again.

Mrsmum

There is going to be a piece on Claire Byrne Live tonight about whether people would like to see them playing for Ireland again or not.

Mrsmum

capefear wrote: »

Claire Byrne rte 1 9.30 is going to discuss if the lads should be let play for Ireland again.

Snap.

FrancieBrady

Mrsmum wrote: »

There is going to be a piece on Claire Byrne Live tonight about whether people would like to see them playing for Ireland again or not.

Hopefully it will be a bit more balanced than the Prime Time sham on the night of the verdict.
The online poll is now up to nearly 12,000
https://www.change.org/p/ulster-rugby-get-paddy-jackson-and-stuart-olding-back-playing-for-ulster-rugby?recruiter=453366214&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink&utm_campaign=share_petition&utm_term=psf_combo_share_initial.nafta_milestone_share_ask_victory.control

RuMan

Conspectus wrote: »

Mod-Ruman don't post in this thread again. Reason- Personal abuse/uncivility.

Fine for ur mate to accuse me of trolling and and just state that Jackson hasnt played for 24 months. Is the term "blackface" not abuse ?

Mod-Banned

upandcumming

RuMan wrote: »

Fine for ur mate to accuse me of trolling and and just state that Jackson hasnt played for 24 months. Is the term "blackface" not abuse ?

Hit him, HIT HIM!

:pac:

Grayson

JRant wrote: »

Why don't you back up the claims you made earlier in this thread that these men destroyed evidence and were, in your eyes, "guilty".

They deleted messages. That's destroying evidence.

And I explained why I believed they were guilty. It was the same post where I said i thought they were guilty so you read it. Also, I don't know why you feel the need to put quotation marks around it.

upandcumming

Grayson wrote: »

They deleted messages. That's destroying evidence.

And I explained why I believed they were guilty. It was the same post where I said i thought they were guilty so you read it. Also, I don't know why you feel the need to put quotation marks around it.

When were the messages deleted? Before or after they were charged?

joe40

I know the people who think he did nothing wrong want him play again if selected. My question is for those who would rather he didn't play, would you make a distinction between playing for Ulster, which is a professional rugby club (basically a business) and playing for ireland where he is representing the country. Would you find club acceptable but not the national team. Is there even a distinction?

RabbleRouser2k

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Hopefully it will be a bit more balanced than the Prime Time sham on the night of the verdict.
The online poll is now up to nearly 12,000
https://www.change.org/p/ulster-rugby-get-paddy-jackson-and-stuart-olding-back-playing-for-ulster-rugby?recruiter=453366214&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink&utm_campaign=share_petition&utm_term=psf_combo_share_initial.nafta_milestone_share_ask_victory.control

I normally wouldn't say this-I swear-but Una Mullaly was actually reasoned with her analysis of the case and aftermath. (Yeah, I had to check I actually said that too).

Prime Time was terrible-I agree on that. The tonight show was more reasoned-Prime Time felt very rushed, the 'rush to get the story' showed.

It'll be interesting to see if it get's to 67 000, the number who were anti. Who knows. Not that polls matter...

I have to wonder if I plan to subject myself to CB tonight...she's like the Irish Sun of tv shows.

FrancieBrady

joe40 wrote: »

I know the people who think he did nothing wrong want him play again if selected. My question is for those who would rather he didn't play, would you make a distinction between playing for Ulster, which is a professional rugby club (basically a business) and playing for ireland where he is representing the country. Would you find club acceptable but not the national team. Is there even a distinction?

Business or not (the Irish team is a business too) he represents me when he plays for Ulster (I'm an Ulsterman) just as any player represents me when they play for Ireland.

No distinction. And I think their penalty for the whole affair is extreme, and they should be allowed to play immediately.

pleas advice

trial by media on Claire Byrne right now, 55% of those polled don't want paddy jackson or stewart olding playing for Ireland again,