My frame is killing my chances with females

LegacyUser

I workout and ****, I'm in alright shape(Objectively I'm in pretty good shape but nothing that is gonna wow anyone) however i have a small frame so I never really look like I work out. I just feel that it's a huge deterrent and I'm not viewed as manly due to my frame. I'm 5'8'' but I feel I look a little shorter due to having a stocky type body(short legs and arms)

I don't know what to do, females don't so much as look at me. I spent 50 minutes in the club seething on Friday night, throwing daggers at every female who walked past. I've tried to be a positive, fun guy but never manifests in cold hard results.

Neyite

FOREVERALONE2018 wrote: »

I don't know what to do, females don't so much as look at me. I spent 50 minutes in the club seething on Friday night, throwing daggers at every female who walked past. I've tried to be a positive, fun guy but never manifests in cold hard results.

It's not your frame that's causing your lack of success. People are very perceptive and women are hardly going to throw a 'chat me up' glance at a bloke that's glaring angrily at every woman that walks past.

Why are you seething?

Xterminator

Hi Op

Please dont take this advice the wrong way. It's not your frame. its your state of mind, and how you come across.

There are some red flags in your post.

I spent 50 minutes in the club seething on Friday night, throwing daggers at every female who walked past.

&

but never manifests in cold hard results.

sounds a little obsessive and angry to me.

The fact your sure it your 'frame', makes me think you need to look long and hard at yourself - but not in the mirror. You need to examine what has lead you to believe your body shape is 'whats wrong' with you.

You need to understand that a nice confidant man who is friendly and kind will be seen as better boyfriend material than a ripped body obsessed man who stares daggers at strangers.

do you have any female friends who you could talk with ? You seem to have a unbalanced perception of what is important, and why your are not having relationship success.

perhaps a good starting point would be to read a good book on relationships. you dont seem t have any insight into what a potential partner would look for?

strandroad

It's not your frame, it's your attitude. You keep referring to women as females, admit to glowering at them in public places... why would they want to talk to you at all?

Bambi985

Women are not "cold, hard results". They are humans that pick up on things they like and things they don't like just like you do. Treating them like they're some sort of sub-human prize to be won based on working out enough or a different species that you entitled to "pull" to bolster your own fragile ego tells me everything about why you're not attracting them.

We don't like that. We also don't like bitter, angry men with low self-esteem tied into how much they don't get "cold, hard results". Try treating them like humans and bringing something more to the table than how much you work out and things might change.

Or don't. You could always just continue glaring at women in clubs for not looking your way. That's definitely going to work...

Bunny Colvin

In fairness to the OP, maybe he was just having a bad night in the club and doesn't always behave like that? That's understandable. But the advice you've received here is correct. Be positive, if you can't do that then act it.

Ursus Horribilis

Maybe nightclubs aren't for you?

Pluto Planet

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

Maybe nightclubs aren't for you?

That is a defeatist attitude, attracting and seducing women is a skill you can learn.

OP, by the sounds of it your mindset is the main problem, not your height. For a start I would say let go of the need to pull for a minute. Focus on expressing yourself authentically. Share your authentic personality, rather than trying to "get something" from people. See the light hearted and fun side if the world.

Ursus Horribilis

Pluto Planet wrote: »

That is a defeatist attitude, attracting and seducing women is a skill you can learn.

Oh ,are we in pick up artist territory here?

Neyite

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

Oh ,are we in pick up artist territory here?

I hope not. Because that is forbidden by the charter to discuss here...;)

cruizer101

FOREVERALONE2018 wrote: »

I don't know what to do, females don't so much as look at me.

To be fair in general men have to do the approaching of women, even if decent looking.

Your frame has little to do with it, confidence and a fun, positive attitude will attract far more women than good looks but bad attitude. I'm not saying that is easy mind but you need to change your attitude a bit to start with anyway.

silverharp

Basically OP your aim seems to be to become a nite club douche, its very superficial and within a few years most women would treat you like a joke. If you want to avoid getting angry towards women you need to pivot in a new direction. Take up some social or sports activities where you can see women as individuals and take it from there.

Dial Hard

Perhaps start by referring to them as women, not females.

kylith

silverharp wrote: »

Basically OP your aim seems to be to become a nite club douche, its very superficial and within a few years most women would treat you like a joke. If you want to avoid getting angry towards women you need to pivot in a new direction. Take up some social or sports activities where you can see women as individuals and take it from there.

This is good advice. Learn to socialise with women in a non-sexual way and it will stand you in good stead. Your current attitude of hating yourself and hating women will get you nowhere but in a downward spiral.

Mr. Incognito

Hello there

I'm 5'7 and stockier than you. Currently benching 100kg and squatting 120Kg so I'm no shrinking violet and I've been knocking it out of the park for years with the ladies

The secret is confidence. That's all there is too it. People are attracted to confident people. Work on yourself, your hobbies and interests.

I play music, write, work a lot, travel, hike, and date and have dated stunning looking women who are sound. Because I am sound.

Water attracts its own level. Work on yourself and people will respond to that self confidence.

And I havent stepped foot in a night club in years.

ManOfMystery

FOREVERALONE2018 wrote: »

I workout and ****, I'm in alright shape(Objectively I'm in pretty good shape but nothing that is gonna wow anyone) however i have a small frame so I never really look like I work out. I just feel that it's a huge deterrent and I'm not viewed as manly due to my frame. I'm 5'8'' but I feel I look a little shorter due to having a stocky type body(short legs and arms)

I don't know what to do, females don't so much as look at me. I spent 50 minutes in the club seething on Friday night, throwing daggers at every female who walked past. I've tried to be a positive, fun guy but never manifests in cold hard results.

Your looks are not the issue here. You're not obese, abnormally tall, abnormally short, or malnourished looking - by your own admission, you're in good shape. Even if you were those things, that would still not preclude you from meeting a partner. 

All over the world there are skinny men, fat men, old men, ugly men, short men, all types of men who have managed to have relationships. Looks are an important factor in initial attraction, but they are not the only factor. And to some potential partners, they are low down the priority list. 

Take some of that gym time and spend it instead on working on your confidence, your demeanour, and your attitude. These are the things which seem to be causing your problem, not looks.

Pluto Planet

Practice approaching woman and just chatting and being friendly, nothing else, just chat and then leave.

qwerty13

Your attitude in your post came off really really badly towards women. Pretty repulsive. Let’s just say that you feel let down in your dating history, and that you had a temporary women-hating moment. The alternative doesn’t bear thinking about, that you actually despise women.

You seem to think of women as conquests. And take rejection incredibly badly. To me, that says that you aren’t happy in yourself, and you aren’t ready for a relationship. There’s something just not right in your views. I don’t believe that you see women as equal partners. I really do believe that you need to sort yourself out before you could have a decent relationship

Big Bag of Chips

One of my exes was about 5'6. He was quite stocky, (had a bit of a beer belly!) but other than my now husband he is really the only other boyfriend I truly loved. He was funny, kind, popular with his friends, he was so relaxed and easy going, his family were relaxed and welcoming, and he made me feel loved.

My boyfriend before him was probably 5' 11" and quite skinny, played hurling etc. Shape and size have little to do with how attractive you are. It's all about what sort of person you project. Women don't owe you attention. Going to the gym doesn't mean much. My husband has never set foot in one, yet we're together 18 years. Change your attitude and you might find your luck changes.

woodchuck

OP if you want to work out, do it for yourself, not in an attempt to attract women. I hate to break it to you, but a lot of women don't care about muscles on guys...

I agree with others that it's more about attitude than looks.

Also, clubs aren't a great place to meet women, unless you're just looking for a fling. Do you have any hobbies that get you out mingling? Have you tried online dating?

leggo

FOREVERALONE2018 wrote: »

I don't know what to do, females don't so much as look at me. I spent 50 minutes in the club seething on Friday night, throwing daggers at every female who walked past.

Read those two lines OP, over and over. If this is what you're doing, WHY do you expect women to be throwing themselves at the aggressive looking lad in the corner?!

Truth is, you're in a rut and this is a symptom of that. Forget about women and 'cold hard results' for a bit. Stop trying to work out and 'be sound' with the goal of attracting people, these people aren't dumb, they can see right through that stuff and it comes across as desperate. Become comfortable in yourself, someone that's interesting, happy in his own skin and others want to be around where you're currently bitter and aggressive-seeming. Your 'cold hard results' will improve instantly.

Airyfairy12

If people arent responding to you the way youd like then maybe have a look at your personality and mind set and ask yourself is there anything you could work on or improve? Ill make some suggestions to get you started..
1. You could drop the sexist attitude and try to see 'females' as actual real people with emotions, thoughts, autonomy etc.
2. You might not realise youre sexist but thats because you lack self awareness - this would be a great place to start evaluating your mindset and how you perceive yourself and others. Youre very insecure and it sounds like youre projecting your own self hatred onto other people (mostly women) by blaming them for how you feel, explicitly referring to women as 'females' and having feelings of anger towards them for not giving you sexual attention is sexist and worrying behaviour imo. As a general rule to keep in mind nobody owes you anything and that includes sex or relationships.
3. You could try to learn how to take rejection in a positive way - some counselling would be great in this respect as difficulties with rejection often stem from low self esteem which is an obvious issue for you judging by your post.

HumbleBumble

I'm not sure what you meant by cold hard results. I'll assume you're there trying to get lucky by the use of that language. In fairness I don't think women in clubs are just going to start throwing themselves at some seething angry guy glaring at them walking by.

If I saw someone you just described I'd avoid them too. Maybe you should adjust your attitude a little.

LegacyUser

My husband is 5ft8inches and I would never have looked at his frame when we met he just genuinely a nice person we married 34 years u need to lighten up and enjoy life I'm 5ft6inches

LolaJJ

I used to say guys who were under 5ft 10" were too short for me. It was a serious deal breaker.....;)

My current boyfriend is 5ft 6", doesn't work out. But...He is really confident and a really great, kind, fun, genuine person. I would have been doing myself SUCH a disservice to let his height stop me from falling in love with him.

The point is, no one really cares, even the girls who think they care...they don't actually care. Just be you, be fun, be confident. Standing angrily in pubs is just standing in your own way

hsjsj

Op you're frame isn't the problem, you just need to learn to love what you have, confidence is the most attractive thing anyway

LegacyUser

OP here,

Thanks for replies, it took me a while to log back in here.

TBH, there is probably a degree of coping blaming in on my frame entirely(also it is certainty a factor), I am also probably not as facially attractive as I think anyway(I just judge myself off best pics and not my awful selfies or what I look like in bad lighting, I just assume how the public sees me is how I look in my best pictures)

Personality wise, I can't change much tbh. I am losing my enthusiasm and rush of liking girls because I know inevitably they won't feel the same. Only recently I messaged a girl in the AM that I used to like a few years ago and she replied politely but swerved my obvious advances. It was pretty brutal. I thought my 'transformation' meant I just had to have 'confidence' to approach and she would reciprocate. Just further compounded that these girls don't like me, because if they did they would make their intentions clear.

My personality is terrible but I also think it's a two way street. It's terrible in a I'm just a regular guy who likes music and football and can't flirt for **** type of way. If a girl was reciprocal to my humour and demeanour I would buzz of them and be able to have a good rapport but girls are ambivalent towards me. I know that. I've seen guys who aren't funny that girls call funny because they are attracted to them.

witchgirl26

OP I'm going to go through some of your points individually below.

HitMeLikeaHurricane wrote: »

OP here,

Thanks for replies, it took me a while to log back in here.

TBH, there is probably a degree of coping blaming in on my frame entirely(also it is certainty a factor), I am also probably not as facially attractive as I think anyway(I just judge myself off best pics and not my awful selfies or what I look like in bad lighting, I just assume how the public sees me is how I look in my best pictures)

While attractiveness is important to a degree to attract someone to you initially, what one person finds attractive can vary massively to what someone else will. I think you're getting too hung up here on the physical appearance aspect. As many have noted previously, frame has flip all to do with a lot of why someone ends up with someone else. Likewise, I have a very different "type" to that of my best friend. We would rarely find the same guy attractive.

HitMeLikeaHurricane wrote: »

Personality wise, I can't change much tbh. I am losing my enthusiasm and rush of liking girls because I know inevitably they won't feel the same. Only recently I messaged a girl in the AM that I used to like a few years ago and she replied politely but swerved my obvious advances. It was pretty brutal. I thought my 'transformation' meant I just had to have 'confidence' to approach and she would reciprocate. Just further compounded that these girls don't like me, because if they did they would make their intentions clear.

Ok just because you changed how you appear physically does not mean that girls will reciprocate if they don't want to. If she politely swerved it then it wasn't brutal - she's just not interested. That doesn't mean someone else won't be but no one is under an obligation to find you attractive just because you've worked out. If you go forward with the idea though that inevitably a girl won't like you then you will not attract anyone because that in itself is unattractive. It's a cliche but you have to love yourself before someone can love you.

HitMeLikeaHurricane wrote: »

My personality is terrible but I also think it's a two way street. It's terrible in a I'm just a regular guy who likes music and football and can't flirt for **** type of way. If a girl was reciprocal to my humour and demeanour I would buzz of them and be able to have a good rapport but girls are ambivalent towards me. I know that. I've seen guys who aren't funny that girls call funny because they are attracted to them.

What is terrible about being a regular guy?! Most girls, including myself, that's all we really want. A guy who has interests that he's passionate about, things he enjoys doing and an ability to chat about them.

So maybe you've been trying with the wrong type of girls. The only demeanour you've mentioned is glaring at girls in a club which isn't going to get any girl to want to be reciprocal at all.

OP it sounds like you're trying to be something you're not sometimes with this and that can be very unattractive. Instead of trying to be funny and make girls get your humour, just be genuine and talk to them like they're normal people about your interests, about theirs and find common ground. Chat up lines and trying too hard to be funny aren't going to get most girls interested as it says nothing much about you as a person so ditch that if that's what you're doing.

baby and crumble

HitMeLikeaHurricane wrote: »

Personality wise, I can't change much tbh. I am losing my enthusiasm and rush of liking girls because I know inevitably they won't feel the same.

You're in the middle of a self-fulfilling prophecy so. If it's "inevitable" they won't like you, then you're not making any effort to like them or engage meaningfully with them. Why would anyone find that attractive?

HitMeLikeaHurricane wrote: »

Only recently I messaged a girl in the AM that I used to like a few years ago and she replied politely but swerved my obvious advances. It was pretty brutal.

Ok well, was this out of the blue for her? I can't really blame her if so, getting random "Obvious advances" from a dude she knew a few years ago is hardly going to get her motor running. Also being polite isn't 'brutal'.

HitMeLikeaHurricane wrote: »

I thought my 'transformation' meant I just had to have 'confidence' to approach and she would reciprocate. Just further compounded that these girls don't like me, because if they did they would make their intentions clear.

So you basically think all women just want a hot muscle dude? If that was the case, no gym bunnies would be single, ever, and no-one like me would ever be with anyone. A 'trasnformation' means nothing to people, not as much as it does to the person who has done the transformation. You may have worked very hard to look like you do now, but so what?

HitMeLikeaHurricane wrote: »

It's terrible in a I'm just a regular guy who likes music and football and can't flirt for **** type of way. If a girl was reciprocal to my humour and demeanour I would buzz of them and be able to have a good rapport but girls are ambivalent towards me. I know that.

99% of straight women are with guys exactly like you describe. They have things they are interested in, and just live their lives, just without expecting women to fall at their feet because they work out. Women are often accused of being shallow, when it's obvious they're not. Otherwise the objectively "good looking" people would all be partnered up.

HitMeLikeaHurricane wrote: »

I've seen guys who aren't funny that girls call funny because they are attracted to them.

They aren't funny to you, OP. They obviously are to other people. All you have to do is look at the popularity of certain comeidans to know that just like look, "funny" is subjective. I can't think of anythign worse than to have to sit through a set from Frankie Boyle, for example. But he's very popular.

It must be hard to have done all that work physically and fall short of what you had imagined. I think it might be time to take a look inward, at your personality. You say it can't be changed- I don't agree. I have met people from school 10 years after doing the leaving cert and they are totally different people. Sometimes for good, sometimes bad.

Neyite

Originally Posted by HitMeLikeaHurricane
It's terrible in a I'm just a regular guy who likes music and football and can't flirt for **** type of way. If a girl was reciprocal to my humour and demeanour I would buzz of them and be able to have a good rapport but girls are ambivalent towards me. I know that.

You sound like my partner then.

Is it possibly when you are talking to women you are trying too hard to impress /be witty and it's coming across as awkward and clunky and a bit off putting? Nervousness can make that worse too.

Sincerity and good listening skills would work way more in your favour.

Humour is very subjective. I found in my dating years that often what a bloke would think as humour was actually lad-banter and while he thought he was impressing me with his wit, I was actually bored and uncomfortable at him jumping in to take the piss out of stuff like he might with his best mate and usually would write them off as being juvenile. I'm not saying women have a different sense of humour but you tailor the humour to the recipient and err on the side of caution.

Teyla Emmagan

Do you know what women like? Men who like women. Not men who want to shag women, but men that like being with us and listening to us and talking rubbish with us and making us laugh. And you don't need to be gorgeous to manage any of that. But you will need to start trying to get to know women for themselves, not just as bodies.