Should we stop bullying the United Kingdom?

prinzeugen

prinzeugen wrote: »

A gay Irish-half Indian that is taking orders from the other global buccanering EU powers.

He is just a French and German puppet. You want the UK to be bullied? That will workout well next time Ireland needs a financial bailout.

Your paranoia really is unmatched.

Duckworth_Luas

They've done a trade deal with the Faroe Islands!!!

prinzeugen

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Your paranoia really is unmatched.

Ok...

Avatar MIA

prinzeugen wrote: »

That will workout well next time Ireland needs a financial bailout.

I still don't understand why Ireland took a loan off the British. It seemed like a symbolic sack cloth and ashes.

But, the phrase, 'with friends like these...' Comes to mind. And they've not allowed Ireland repay early to keep being paid punitive interest. Others allowed early loan repayment.

Kermit.de.frog

That "bailout" from Britain was, I think, 5% of the total bailout?

Lucy8080

Avatar MIA wrote: »

I still don't understand why Ireland took a loan off the British. It seemed like a symbolic sack cloth and ashes.

I can think of two reasons.

1. The British looking after British investment concerns in Ireland.

2. The E.U. rules would not allow us to raise interest rates to take the heat out of the economy( house prices etc.). Our hands were tied.

Rock and hard place,eh?

fash

Lucy8080 wrote: »

2. The E.U. rules would not allow us to raise interest rates to take the heat out of the economy( house prices etc.). Our hands were tied.

Rock and hard place,eh?

Plenty of other ways to take the heat of the economy - mortgage restrictions (like we have now) - even an SSIA.

Balanadan

Let's build a wall and get them to pay for it.

mickoneill31

prinzeugen wrote: »

A gay Irish-half Indian that is taking orders from the other global buccanering EU powers.

He is just a French and German puppet. You want the UK to be bullied? That will workout well next time Ireland needs a financial bailout.

Jesus. Maybe don't post in the middle of the night.

I don't get why people in the UK think it's everybody against them. In every part of life getting a group together makes the consituent parts stronger. In the British media and government it was alway UK & the EU. I don't think it clicked that they're part of the EU.

They were always whinging about laws that they didn't have control of. When you ask them they talk about bendy bananas. They don't seem to know about the employment rights, consumer protections etc. that the EU actually does do and that benefit us all.

And moaning that Leo is a French and German puppet is pretty pathetic. Most of us in Ireland think that the government has done a good job with Brexit. So he's doing what we want. You know, that's what politicans are meant to do. We're not going to adopt the British model of draw a line in the sand and then fight amongst ourselves for years while the rest of the world looks on in bemusement.

ToddyDoody

I was only thinking.

Theresa May, as we know, is wooden.

The UK political process has ground to a halt.

Maybe a more wheeler dealer UK taoiseach is needed, someone with a bit of flexibility who can grease the wheels a little and keep things moving.

I can only imagine how Bertie would have negotiated this given a half-dodgy chance.

ancapailldorcha

ToddyDoody wrote: »

I was only thinking.

Theresa May, as we know, is wooden.

The UK political process has ground to a halt.

Maybe a more wheeler dealer UK taoiseach is needed, someone with a bit of flexibility who can grease the wheels a little and keep things moving.

I can only imagine how Bertie would have negotiated this given a half-dodgy chance.

Bertie wouldn't have been stupid enough to call a dodgy referendum to placate fanatical parasites. He's have rightly told his Eurosceptics where to go if he had any.

ToddyDoody

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Bertie wouldn't have been stupid enough to call a dodgy referendum to placate fanatical parasites. He's have rightly told his Eurosceptics where to go if he had any.

In which case let me give you the more sober Brian Cowan (forgive the irony) shtick of "we are where we are"

is_that_so

ToddyDoody wrote: »

In which case let me give you the more sober Brian Cowan (forgive the irony) shtick of "we are where we are"

TBH even if Eamon Gilmore were Taoiseach you still would never have had such a stupid referendum.

mickoneill31

When you look at the way the British parties are and the FPTP system I think we can see something that exacerbates the problem.
You can people with left wing ideologies and other with right wing ones in the same party. So Theresa is left with a section of the party that are ERG and people who lean a little bit more to the left. She's trying to keep them all happy. That's not possible.
Same with Labour. Most of the party are leaning one way but Jeremy and a select few are leaning another. That should really be two parties but if they did that, with FPTP they'd never be elected again.

In our system we have more parties and if people have one particular ideology they can find a party that fits them. So people know what they're voting for. Then if coalitions are formed you determine a programme for government and work towards that goal. I used to think our system was complicated and meant we'd always have confused governements. It is and we do. But after seeing the UK system in action for the last few years I think ours is great now

is_that_so

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Bertie wouldn't have been stupid enough to call a dodgy referendum to placate fanatical parasites. He's have rightly told his Eurosceptics where to go if he had any.

He's have done what any party here would do, make them put up or walk. Euroscepticism is not a thing in Ireland.

ToddyDoody

is_that_so wrote: »

TBH even if Eamon Gilmore were Taoiseach you still would never have had such a stupid referendum.

The referendum isn't up for debate unfortunately.

Who'd dare Italy to call a similar referendum just for the craic?

is_that_so

ToddyDoody wrote: »

The referendum isn't up for debate unfortunately.

Who'd dare Italy to call a similar referendum just for the craic?

Well I'd buy a lotto ticket sooner. Be more confident of the outcome.

ToddyDoody

is_that_so wrote: »

Well I'd buy a lotto ticket sooner. Be more confident of the outcome.

Better ignore this so.

https://www.thelocal.it/20181017/italy-eu-eurosceptic-italexit-brexit

is_that_so

ToddyDoody wrote: »

Better ignore this so.

https://www.thelocal.it/20181017/italy-eu-eurosceptic-italexit-brexit

Poll questions are just that, a question in time. Answer really means very little when you have nearly a third undecided.

ToddyDoody

is_that_so wrote: »

Poll questions are just that, a question in time. Answer really means very little when you have nearly a third undecided.

Fair enough but I personally wouldn't brush a survey like that under the carpet.

Sure we in Ireland are very happy with the EU but I'd acknowledge that all is not rosy in the garden for everyone and far from it in Italy's case.

is_that_so

ToddyDoody wrote: »

Fair enough but I personally wouldn't brush a survey like that under the carpet.

Sure we in Ireland are very happy with the EU but I'd acknowledge that all is not rosy in the garden for everyone and far from it in Italy's case.

Italians just want a properly functioning country. They've been waiting since 1945! A little bit of real political reform would go some part of the way.

Capt'n Midnight

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

They've done a trade deal with the Faroe Islands!!!

The UK buy a third of the Faroeses exports, imports from the UK are only 3% of that. A case where "they need us more than we need them" actually makes sense.

Also May's government is dependant on the 8 or so East coast Scottish Tory MP's who got elected on the basis of fishing. So if there ever was a case of getting tough for political reasons this is it.


Needless to say, because this is Brexit,
the deal means that Scottish boats are banned from Faroese waters
but the Faroe Islanders can catch fish in Scottish waters to sell back to Scotland.


And it's probably only going to cost the Tories a majority in the next election.

ToddyDoody

I'm imagining the stops Bertie would pull to buy off the opposition in these Brexit votes.

I think Theresa May has notions of honour or something like that when it comes to negotiating. See how far that's got her.

From the Guardian:

"A national change of heart on the whole Brexit business would still be welcome in Brussels but it is not expected, and the priority is to escort a troublesome ex-member off the premises with a minimum of disruption before those MEP ballots get under way.

Does May like this plan? It doesn’t matter. She wasn’t in the room where it happened. The summit conclusions were handed down to the petitioning nation as it paced around an antechamber. This is the power relationship between a “third country” and the EU. Britain had better get used to it.

The terms of the extension are not drafted for the prime minister’s benefit. They contain a message from the EU direct to the House of Commons. In crude terms: piss or get off the pot. If you want to leave with a deal, vote for the damned deal. If you are foolish enough to leave without a deal, do not blame us. Have a couple more weeks to think about it. But if you want something else, a referendum or a softer Brexit, work it out soon. And then send someone who isn’t Theresa May to talk to us about it."

Peregrinus

ToddyDoody wrote: »

Fair enough but I personally wouldn't brush a survey like that under the carpet.

Neither would I. It shows that support for "Remain" is twice as high as support for "Leave".

Note that the poll was taken about six months ago, and it's sometimes cited as one of the reasons why Italian populist parties have pivotted away from Italexit, and towards a position of calling for EU reforms.

is_that_so wrote: »

Italians just want a properly functioning country. They've been waiting since 1945! A little bit of real political reform would go some part of the way.

Hardly fair. Italy since 1945 has on the whole been a much more successful country than, say, oh, the UK. The politics are Byzantine, I agree, but somehow they work, in terms of delivering social and economic progress.