Gangland Shootings [Mod Note in Post #1]

hatrickpatrick

PLOPS wrote: »

I 100% agree with you, and it was me who had said the Hutches seemed to have more public sympathy.

The more i think about it, Gary Hutch was a suspect in a few murders, 'Sympathy' is stretching it, i think the public don't really care once its just criminals involved.

I have a feeling that the longer-term background to the whole thing isn't known to most average punters commenting on it, tbh - if I can find the original article I'll post it, but most of the anecdotal public opinion I've alluded to stemmed from one specific article, I think perhaps in the Indo, which painted Kinahan as a backstabbing traitor and the Hutch family as being set upon even after successfully pleading (and paying) for Gary's life.

Media reporting in the aftermath of something like the Regency has an immense power to shape long term public opinion of the fallout. Without that article, people would probably feel very differently. Immediately after the shooting, most people were like "absolute scumbags attacking a weigh in like that", and suddenly after that article went viral, it switched to "absolute scumbags going back on an agreement like that, they deserved what they got".

spider baby 172

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

I have a feeling that the longer-term background to the whole thing isn't known to most average punters commenting on it, tbh - if I can find the original article I'll post it, but most of the anecdotal public opinion I've alluded to stemmed from one specific article, I think perhaps in the Indo, which painted Kinahan as a backstabbing traitor and the Hutch family as being set upon even after successfully pleading (and paying) for Gary's life.

Media reporting in the aftermath of something like the Regency has an immense power to shape long term public opinion of the fallout. Without that article, people would probably feel very differently. Immediately after the shooting, most people were like "absolute scumbags attacking a weigh in like that", and suddenly after that article went viral, it switched to "absolute scumbags going back on an agreement like that, they deserved what they got".

Agreed. I think sometimes the public feeling can be more of distain towards the Kinahan / Byrne gang for their lack of empathy to the lives and communities they are destroying, rather than sympathy for the Hutches.

The media are playing a huge part in this, and obviously we are not getting the full story, and we rarely do. Will be interesting to see how much coverage there will be for Patrick Hutch next trial date, and results of inquest into Garda death etc.

rondog

Og81 wrote: »

No.

C'mon.He owned his own house which was bought outright in Crumlin and he was on the scratcher??When raided,it was found to have a Rolex in it with expensive champagne.Tell me if you dont have any other income than your dole how you can buy a gaff outright.His bird was also found to have made multiple trips to spain ,amsterdam and dubai,David himself spent months in marbs training in MGMs gym,how did he fund that?

hatrickpatrick

This seems to be the article I mentioned earlier - was hard to find since the Sunday World has removed its online editions, can only be found through Wayback:

https://web.archive.org/web/20160216201928/www.sundayworld.com/news/news/hutch-family-gives-its-side-of-the-feud-that-has-affected-them-deeply

A senior member of the Hutch family issued the statement to the Sunday Times in which the family described how they paid 200,000 to the Kinahans in a bid to spare Gary’s life and that they are being chased for €200,000 more.

“Gary had a falling out with the Kinahan organisation,” the statement reads. “This matter was resolved and €200,000 in cash was paid over to the Kinahans.

“We shook hands and agreed to walk way. Gary was then murdered for no reason. You cannot trust these people.”

The statement then details a meeting in Europe two weeks ago between both sides when a demand was made on the Hutch family for another €200,000.

“The Kinahan organisation has attempted to kill Gerry on several occasions in recent months. We are being terrorised by the cartel, “the statement adds.

“Kinahan’s representatives said members of our family would be killed or forced to leave their homes and Ireland if their demands for money were not met.

”We believe the Kinahan drugs cartel murdered Eddie at his home in Dublin last Monday having approached him days before with demands for money.

“Our extended family are under threat from these people.”

The statement insists the family did not want to become embroiled in violence.

“Our family is not involved in a drugs war,” it adds. “We are well known in the north inner city and have no involvement in drugs.”

Again, I'm not saying I personally believe this version of events, but to people who knew absolutely nothing about these gangs, this was literally the first "official" word about what the hell was going on. The statement was published the day after the shooting of Eddie Hutch, and at that stage all most non-involved folks knew about this whole business was "this looks like the start of a massive gang war, wonder what it's about or why they're going after eachother". That statement was published and boom, it became a story of betrayal and revenge.

PLOPS

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

This seems to be the article I mentioned earlier - was hard to find since the Sunday World has removed its online editions, can only be found through Wayback:

https://web.archive.org/web/20160216201928/www.sundayworld.com/news/news/hutch-family-gives-its-side-of-the-feud-that-has-affected-them-deeply



Again, I'm not saying I personally believe this version of events, but to people who knew absolutely nothing about these gangs, this was literally the first "official" word about what the hell was going on. The statement was published the day after the shooting of Eddie Hutch, and at that stage all most non-involved folks knew about this whole business was "this looks like the start of a massive gang war, wonder what it's about or why they're going after eachother". That statement was published and boom, it became a story of betrayal and revenge.

When you get to the nucleus of this feud, its two drug dealing families fighting over who is the toughest.

OG81 claimed that Eddie had given his car and that I had ignored this, I had a look and can't see anything online. I also think that he wants us to see that the Hutch's have brought this on themselves and Dots (As he calls him) was a great fella. I won't be losing sleep knowing he's not in this world anymore. Sure he seems to think he wasn't even a criminal, so these are the sort of people you are dealing with, low level scum bags who deal drugs and laugh at normal working people.

Og81

PLOPS wrote: »

When you get to the nucleus of this feud, its two drug dealing families fighting over who is the toughest.

OG81 claimed that Eddie had given his car and that I had ignored this, I had a look and can't see anything online. I also think that he wants us to see that the Hutch's have brought this on themselves and Dots (As he calls him) was a great fella. I won't be losing sleep knowing he's not in this world anymore. Sure he seems to think he wasn't even a criminal, so these are the sort of people you are dealing with, low level scum bags who deal drugs and laugh at normal working people.

Good man

PLOPS

Og81 wrote: »

Good man

do you work?

also, do you think people deserve to be murdered on either sides?

Og81

PLOPS wrote: »

do you work?

also, do you think people deserve to be murdered on either sides?

I don’t work. I have a shop

hatrickpatrick

PLOPS wrote: »

When you get to the nucleus of this feud, its two drug dealing families fighting over who is the toughest.

If that's the case (and I'm not disputing it, I just don't know enough about the history) then the Hutch's either have a good way with PR, or the journalists who reported on the immediate aftermath of the Regency got everything badly wrong. Regardless, that in my view is where the public opinion comes from, not the death toll being slanted.

Put it this way: If it had been widely reported that the Regency itself was an unprovoked attack in furtherance of a territorial dispute as opposed to a retaliation for an unprovoked murder, and everything else had panned out exactly as it has with most of the victims coming from the Hutch side, I'd say you'd see far more people saying "f*ckers deserved it after that hotel scumbaggery". The media's reports on the background and history to the feud have most certainly coloured the general public's opinions of who are the aggressors and who are the persecuted.

I mean it's astonishing if you think about it. The Regency was a ridiculously high profile mafia style hit, in broad daylight, which made international headlines all over the world for its sheer intensity and the brazenness of its setting. For the faction who orchestrated that to be viewed as the victims in the overall feud, there has to be a widespread belief that they were at least somewhat justified in their anger which led them to carry out that attack in the first place.

To give you a small-time analogy, if I kick the sh!t out of someone in the street, I'm most likely going to be regarded as an out and out scumbag and the guy I attacked regarded as an innocent victim minding his own business. If I kick the sh!t out of someone in the street and it's then revealed in public that the same individual assaulted my girlfriend, or stabbed my brother, or shot my father, months previously, I may not be viewed as the good guy but any sympathy the public had for my victim will evaporate overnight.

Even just a few weeks ago, someone was convicted of a murder in Dublin, I can't remember where - but I remember most people reacting with horror because the murder involved deliberately running someone over with a vehicle. However, as the case unfolded, it was reported that the deceased in that case had fired shots into the killer's house, and it was after this that the killer had jumped into his car and gone after the deceased. And certainly among folk I saw commenting on the case, the mood immediately changed from calling the killer a savage, to calling the deceased a scumbag.

For all our supposed modern beliefs about justice, forgiveness, two wrongs don't make a right, etc, humans still have a basic instinct which says that whoever starts something unprovoked is a bigger asshole than someone who commits violence in revenge for unprovoked violence committed against him or her. And that's exactly how people reacted to this feud once it was reported by the press that "Daniel Kinahan started it by killing Gary Hutch in cold blood and for no reason".

PLOPS

That case of the guy getting run over definitely did a few flips, the guy had shot at the house as one of the sons owed money for drugs. They chased him Back to his house and ran over him, But I think the point were they got out and held him up as the hit him again with the car was the point people felt zero sympathy for either side.

Really and truely though, if your involved with selling drugs you really are just low life. I also think that the people buying the drugs need to realise they are contributing to this feud in some way. Drugs have never interested me, and I'm glad I do t have to deal with these dangerous scum bags.

Og81

PLOPS wrote: »

That case of the guy getting run over definitely did a few flips, the guy had shot at the house as one of the sons owed money for drugs. They chased him Back to his house and ran over him, But I think the point were they got out and held him up as the hit him again with the car was the point people felt zero sympathy for either side.

Really and truely though, if your involved with selling drugs you really are just low life. I also think that the people buying the drugs need to realise they are contributing to this feud in some way. Drugs have never interested me, and I'm glad I do t have to deal with these dangerous scum bags.

Good for you. Hopefully your children have the same morals as you. A bastion of morality.

Tricky Dicky Ireland

Og81 wrote: »

I don’t work. I have a shop

Dots was an out and out toe rag
A mealy mouthed nobody who thought he was a somebody because of his connections
Jaws and Sadie called him the runt of the litter, never on time and full of excuses
JC was right when he said the dirth of Dublin will bring us down
I'm glad that christope5 felt pain at the loss of his kid which was unfortunate
The same pain that the innocent families have felt

Tricky Dicky Ireland

GHMF2015
That's the password for ALL kinahan social media accounts
Be it Twitter Facebook Instagram or whatever

PLOPS

So do I. I can see why you wouldn't like that opinion, sometimes it's hard to see the forest from the trees.

Isn't it amazing when you don't take drugs or agree with murder you claim Im a bastion of morality? When you have such a low opinion of life, having such fundamentals is classed as outrageous. You also had to use the line I had already used today, nothing original to offer?

Jeff2

The long post here asking questions I can only assume are journals or others.

PLOPS

Jeff2 wrote:

The long post here asking questions I can only assume are journals or others.

Journals or others?

Suckit

Journalists or Gardaí? I'm guessing.

PLOPS

Haven't noticed. It's great that both sides kinda have a PR person on the thread defending certain incidents. A bit sureal actually

Jeff2

Suckit wrote: »

Journalists or Gardaí? I'm guessing.

Yes.

Jeff2

PLOPS wrote: »

Haven't noticed. It's great that both sides kinda have a PR person on the thread defending sertain incidents. A bit sureal actually

Yep, that was a short post from you.

PLOPS

Jeff2 wrote:

Yep, that was a short post from you.

Ha, you think I'm a garda or a journalist. I'll take that as a compliment.... I think.

mynamejeff

Og81 wrote: »

Good for you. Hopefully your children have the same morals as you. A bastion of morality.

you know not all people are amoral criminals

your looking for sympathy for parasitic pieces of excrement whose main source of funds is drug dealing and other criminality ?

GFY your like the moth of one of these scumbags saying on facebook that he was a great fella full of fun and a good family man when in reality he was a piece of dirt who beat the crap out of her every time he had a bag of coke and he deserved to die.

Id be fully in favor of a death penalty for anyone who carried out a organised crime murder id i really doubt that id be the only one

F%$K them they knew the rules and broke them so chuck them out of the game

PLOPS

Og81 wrote:

I don’t work. I have a shop

And say if that shop was robbed, would you ring the gardai?

begbysback

PLOPS wrote: »

And say if that shop was robbed, would you ring the gardai?

It seems a lot of this is actually going over your head, his merchandise wouldn’t be insured, taxed or visibly imported.

To understand what is going on here requires some level of empathy, even from those of us not involved in criminality.

PLOPS

begbysback wrote: »

It seems a lot of this is actually going over your head, his merchandise wouldn’t be insured, taxed or visibly imported.

To understand what is going on here requires some level of empathy, even from those of us not involved in criminality.

Nothing is going over my head.

Most of it’s going over mine

enricoh

Two down, another 50 to go!

https://www.thejournal.ie/thermal-gardai-4369848-Nov2018/

John Sacrimoni

enricoh wrote: »

Two down, another 50 to go!

https://www.thejournal.ie/thermal-gardai-4369848-Nov2018/

Next stop D1 wing in mountjoy hopefully.

Clytus

What I find strange, is that at this stage the Kinahan group and anyone associated with it are more toxic than a Corleone! All these organised crime groups rely on keeping their heads down and not drawing attention to themselves ..yet these guys seem to have gone the other direction, to the point where there's a thread on boards.ie with over 2000 posts about the Kinahans!

It also seems very strange how the Kinahans have avoided the fate of the likes of Guzman, Escobar, Noriega,in avoiding an any indictment in some jurisdiction considering the vast amount of confident reporting citing them as drug dealing criminals. And when you think this through further..how is it possible to have an organised crime group worth a €billion and not come to the focus of authorities? This has me believing some of the stuff John Smith says about the Kinahans being in cahoots with certain national intelligence groups like MI5.

Clytus

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Most of it’s going over mine

..I actually had the very same thing written down!!