Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Whole food plant based MD

Options
13»

Comments

  • Options
    #62
    Tar.Aldarion
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,082 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    Ah I see, apologies. Yes, concluding nature is right and the healthiest thing is completely incorrect and that idea has to die. Natural does not mean good. There are legitimate reasons somebody needs medication that no diet can hope to cure. Unfortunately people can be so against medicaation that they end up hurting themselves.


  • Options
    #63
    weisses
    Registered Users Posts: 9,437 ✭✭✭weisses


    pone2012 wrote: »
    It's actually contextually bound to this thread..I usually eat 2 vegan meals out of 3 per day ... and no dairy so I drink almond milk too.. no problem here

    Person in question was arguing big pharma nonsense... clearly in the position that "nature" would sort it out ( the OP posited a plant based diet..and said individual implied he agreed medicine was a bad idea)

    I have pointed out that nature alone cannot even sort out a simple vegan diet.. let alone what could be a congenitally predisposed issue

    A fair conclusion I would argue.


    No I was arguing Doctors are there to prescribe drugs ... which is what big pharma wants ...

    https://www.google.ie/search?q=doctors+incentives+big+pharma&rlz=1C1CHBF_enIE751IE751&oq=doctors+incentives+big+pharma&aqs=chrome..69i57.10501j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

    Plus I adressed the nonsense in you claiming a healthy plant based diet lacks nutrition ...

    Maybe do a bit less assuming and produce some facts

    Can you point out where I stated medicine was a bad idea ?


  • Options
    #64
    weisses
    Registered Users Posts: 9,437 ✭✭✭weisses


    Tar.Aldarion wrote: »
    Ah I see, apologies. Yes, concluding nature is right and the healthiest thing is completely incorrect and that idea has to die. Natural does not mean good. There are legitimate reasons somebody needs medication that no diet can hope to cure. Unfortunately people can be so against medicaation that they end up hurting themselves.

    Do you agree a proper diet can lower your Cholesterol ?

    Or can help with type 2 diabetes ?

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5466941/

    Why would it so bad for the OP to try (with the help of a GP) to see if both conditions can be brought under control with a proper plant based diet ?

    According to the other poster that seems to be nonsesical ... which I disagree with see below
    pone2012 wrote: »
    Read again the OP...the poster wants a "yes " person to agree with them and their perception of what is right..not an objective medical professionals opinion...

    No where is the poster looking for a "yes" person .. Only a GP who could help with this reasonable request

    the poster seems to believe that an objective medical professional could not advise or help getting healthier by diet


  • Options
    #65
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    weisses wrote: »
    Do you agree a proper diet can lower your Cholesterol ?

    Or can help with type 2 diabetes ?

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5466941/

    Why would it so bad for the OP to try (with the help of a GP) to see if both conditions can be brought under control with a proper plant based diet ?

    According to the other poster that seems to be nonsesical ... which I disagree with see below



    No where is the poster looking for a "yes" person .. Only a GP who could help with this reasonable request

    the poster seems to believe that an objective medical professional could not advise or help getting healthier by diet

    In fairness the OP said that the doctor said there was no way his cholesterol dropped by that much due to the change in diet not that the OP's diet couldn't reduce cholesterol.

    I'm assuming the doctor wants the cholesterol as low as possible due to family history and diet might at best lead to a 20% reduction (from a quick google search).


  • Options
    #66
    jigglypuffstuff
    Registered Users Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭jigglypuffstuff


    weisses wrote: »
    Do you agree a proper diet can lower your Cholesterol ?

    Or can help with type 2 diabetes ?

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5466941/

    Why would it so bad for the OP to try (with the help of a GP) to see if both conditions can be brought under control with a proper plant based diet ?

    According to the other poster that seems to be nonsesical ... which I disagree with see below



    No where is the poster looking for a "yes" person .. Only a GP who could help with this reasonable request

    the poster seems to believe that an objective medical professional could not advise or help getting healthier by diet

    I never once said it couldn't help ...I said it could be congenitally predisposed...in which case medicine is required......do continue to misrepresent me

    What is wrong is that it could be medically dangerous.. you are not in a position to state otherwise..the GP of said patient is

    Yes and implied in that statement is that the poster believes diet is the answer... which if congenitally predisposed it isn't.

    Furthermore they stated they want someone "on board" meaning someone who agrees with them...which is effectively a yes person...the OP would have been off the medicine had their GP seen it fit

    Do continue please....


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #67
    weisses
    Registered Users Posts: 9,437 ✭✭✭weisses


    pone2012 wrote: »
    I never once said it couldn't help ...I said it could be congenitally predisposed...in which case medicine is required......do continue to misrepresent me

    Well it kinda started with the nonsense in your post below
    pone2012 wrote: »
    I'm well aware of the pitfalls of nutritional understanding in medical schools

    But read OPs post..we are talking about medicine...and abstaining from in favour of a diet that lacks nutritionally... which as pointed out is not a good idea

    Doctor's are more than qualified to advise in that case..we are talking about actual medicine here Incase you missed that?
    pone2012 wrote: »
    What is wrong is that it could be medically dangerous.. you are not in a position to state otherwise..the GP of said patient is

    So a Doctor could not take a blood sample and blood pressure .. Give the OP all the necessary tips in regards to cholesterol lowering foods/lifestyle/diets and set an appointment for a month/6 weeks later to check bloods and blood pressure again ?
    pone2012 wrote: »
    Yes and implied in that statement is that the poster believes diet is the answer... which if congenitally predisposed it isn't.

    OP stated that the pills are working but rather not be on them for the rest of their life

    OP said there was heart dissease in the family but I didnt see a post stating he/she suffers from Familial hypercholesterolemia
    pone2012 wrote: »
    Furthermore they stated they want someone "on board" meaning someone who agrees with them...which is effectively a yes person..the OP would have been off the medicine had their GP seen it fit

    So if a GP says "yes" to a healthy plant based diet and lifestyle to maybe get a patient of medication that is a bad thing ? And of course if a GP says its okay to take the route the OP is suggesting then what is wrong with it according to yourself they are the professionals

    If a proper plant based diet plus a general healthy lifestyle can keep OP's cholesterol under control and off the tablets then that is a big win .... It may save OP from developing type 2 diabetes as well then ... win win


  • Options
    #68
    jigglypuffstuff
    Registered Users Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭jigglypuffstuff


    weisses wrote: »
    Well it kinda started with the nonsense in your post below





    So a Doctor could not take a blood sample and blood pressure .. Give the OP all the necessary tips in regards to cholesterol lowering foods/lifestyle/diets and set an appointment for a month/6 weeks later to check bloods and blood pressure again ?



    OP stated that the pills are working but rather not be on them for the rest of their life

    OP said there was heart dissease in the family but I didnt see a post stating he/she suffers from Familial hypercholesterolemia



    So if a GP says "yes" to a healthy plant based diet and lifestyle to maybe get a patient of medication that is a bad thing ? And of course if a GP says its okay to take the route the OP is suggesting then what is wrong with it according to yourself they are the professionals

    If a proper plant based diet plus a general healthy lifestyle can keep OP's cholesterol under control and off the tablets then that is a big win .... It may save OP from developing type 2 diabetes as well then ... win win

    Wow the level of delusion in this post is just unreal

    Pills are working... medicine is doing its job....you've already seen it mentioned several times that the reduction from diet is approx 20%..

    OP has said a cardiologist was happy with that result.... and this is a heart specialist we are talking about. And there is a history of heart problems... and you are here promoting advice against trained professionals... please give it a rest.. you are neither a medical doctor nor cardiologist. Let the professionals give the medical advice

    Forget about a medicine free plant based diet sorting anything out.... ...you cannot even provide me with with a supplement/fortified free plant based diet that is nutritionally sufficient... let alone do anything else.

    I've pointed out the tool to do so, so by all means go ahead..


  • Options
    #69
    jigglypuffstuff
    Registered Users Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭jigglypuffstuff


    And on top of that...the very fact that s person would have to go looking for a "plant based" doctor is evidence enough that the vast consensus would view the idea as both dangerous, unnecessary, and for want of a better word, ridiculous


  • Options
    #70
    WannaGetFit
    Registered Users Posts: 154 ✭✭WannaGetFit


    Another poster sent me a GP that does what I need. Thanks for all the help. No need for anymore discussion. You would think you guys were the ones that were gonna die if I went off my meds.

    Dr Esselstyn who wrote the book Prevent and Reverse Heart Disease, that says a whole food plant based diet is the way to prevent and reverse heart disease, is a Cardiologist.

    There are many Drs who agree with him and there are many books saying the same thing.

    Don’t worry if it’s dangerous for me. I am not.
    Peace.
    😄


  • Options
    #71
    jigglypuffstuff
    Registered Users Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭jigglypuffstuff


    WannaGetFit wrote: »
    Another poster sent me a GP that does what I need. Thanks for all the help. No need for anymore discussion. You would think you guys were the ones that were gonna die if I went off my meds.

    Dr Esselstyn who wrote the book Prevent and Reverse Heart Disease, that says a whole food plant based diet is the way to prevent and reverse heart disease, is a Cardiologist.

    There are many Drs who agree with him and there are many books saying the same thing.

    Don’t worry if it’s dangerous for me. I am not.
    Peace.
    😄

    And he's been criticized and debunked thoroughly...a quick Google will show rife inaccuracies and an abundance of bad science... so if you believe that over decades of peer reviewed research... it's evident that your opinion is more important than the facts to you....

    Like I said before... it's a yes person you're looking for not an objective medical opinion..I'm glad you've clarified that. Thank you

    But no problems...the posters on here who were actually advocating that you stick with your doctor's advice... were not doing so based on opinions or feelings (or big pharma tinfoil hat conspiracy theories) ...they did so based on both scientific consensus and documented facts.

    I cannot say the same for the rest...


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #72
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,754 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    weisses wrote: »
    But is it medically dangerous if you are on a proper plant based diet ?

    If you still have high blood pressure and high cholesterol, yes.


  • Options
    #73
    sousou
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭sousou


    B12 injections .

    .hi im needing to start si injections of b12 ''does anyone here si inject , thast can give me info on where to buy them and needles etc or if there is any clinics in dublin that do them ..


Advertisement