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How did PCP work out in the end?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,162 ✭✭✭MarkN


    Something else I just noticed with PCP as someone I work with has received their quote to replace their 2015 Octavia - if the price of the car has gone up (his has by €1300 for the same car) that obviously erodes a chunk of your deposit for the next car too. If he puts down €2,000 again (put down €4,000/just over 20% 3 years ago) his payments go from €181 to €230 ish. 0% finance.

    Something else to factor in on top of being at the mercy of what the dealer is offering over and above what you owe the bank at the end of 36 months.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,293 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    Not really a pcp issue but I get your point re someone wanting to just jump into the same car again yet they need to come up with more money even if they get equity similar to original deposit back. On the flip side, there are contributions on offer to take up some of the slack.
    I actually think I like where the pcp boom and the sterling rates are pushing the manufacturers. A few years back I would look towards uk ads and see that nobody was paying retail price while we were paying far too close to retail. At least now, every manufacturer has an offer on and its only moving further in that direction. Ive said it before but I believe we are heading quickly towards private lease deals where there is no proposed equity or anything else at end just a payment based on low deposit and hand back.
    In the uk, bmw are typically doing 3 or 6 months payment as deposit and then monthly with hand back at the end. They are often hiding massive discount in those deals specially on stuff like 7 series. I think seeing how equity in bmws in burning customers big time, they will have to go that way.
    So maybe 6 x €450 deposit on a 3 series and €450 per month - that would be 19k paid for a 3 series for 3 years, shouldnt be a million miles away with suitable discount etc. I cant see how bmw will sell cars to returning customers otherwise. This will also give certainty to customer and they will know they will need a small deposit again and not be shocked like they currently are when trying to trade in expecting 10k in equity only to be told its actually zero.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭Mickiemcfist


    Long term private leases are illegal in Ireland AFAIK, might be wrong on that but I thought that's why they're never offered


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,162 ✭✭✭MarkN


    mickdw wrote: »
    Not really a pcp issue but I get your point re someone wanting to just jump into the same car again yet they need to come up with more money even if they get equity similar to original deposit back. On the flip side, there are contributions on offer to take up some of the slack.
    I actually think I like where the pcp boom and the sterling rates are pushing the manufacturers. A few years back I would look towards uk ads and see that nobody was paying retail price while we were paying far too close to retail. At least now, every manufacturer has an offer on and its only moving further in that direction. Ive said it before but I believe we are heading quickly towards private lease deals where there is no proposed equity or anything else at end just a payment based on low deposit and hand back.
    In the uk, bmw are typically doing 3 or 6 months payment as deposit and then monthly with hand back at the end. They are often hiding massive discount in those deals specially on stuff like 7 series. I think seeing how equity in bmws in burning customers big time, they will have to go that way.
    So maybe 6 x €450 deposit on a 3 series and €450 per month - that would be 19k paid for a 3 series for 3 years, shouldnt be a million miles away with suitable discount etc. I cant see how bmw will sell cars to returning customers otherwise. This will also give certainty to customer and they will know they will need a small deposit again and not be shocked like they currently are when trying to trade in expecting 10k in equity only to be told its actually zero.

    This has HB Dennis leasing on the reg plates and the first thing I googled when I got home was HB Dennis leasing just to see if they are doing individual leases at all. I'd happily just pay per month and hand a car back as it would suit me down to the ground the way I like to change cars.

    39278735204_1e6bdec1a2_c.jpg


  • Registered Users Posts: 788 ✭✭✭rustynutz


    If leasing was available I would be interested too, the older I get the more I realise that with something that depreciates as quickly as a car, you never truly own itt. Even if you buy it outright, you still need to start saving straight away in order to upgrade it down the line, if you buy on finance by the time its paid off, its worth very little anyway


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,611 ✭✭✭Mooooo


    Was at a company in the UK that leases out farm and constructuon machinery, the business was basically buy x amount of a certain machine lease it out till a minimum of 1000 hrs on it and then sell. The minimum hrs figure is where manufacturers are happy with otherwise they wouldn't deal with him, and he ends up selling a good share for more than what he paid due to the discount he gets. Typically holds on to the machine for 1 to 3 years. Market not really here for machinery for it but you'd think something similar would work for cars?


  • Registered Users Posts: 310 ✭✭photosmart


    Do you know what they offered him for his 2015 Octavia? ie how much did it depreciate over three years as per dealers offer?

    MarkN wrote: »
    Something else I just noticed with PCP as someone I work with has received their quote to replace their 2015 Octavia - if the price of the car has gone up (his has by €1300 for the same car) that obviously erodes a chunk of your deposit for the next car too. If he puts down €2,000 again (put down €4,000/just over 20% 3 years ago) his payments go from €181 to €230 ish. 0% finance.

    Something else to factor in on top of being at the mercy of what the dealer is offering over and above what you owe the bank at the end of 36 months.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,162 ✭✭✭MarkN


    photosmart wrote: »
    Do you know what they offered him for his 2015 Octavia? ie how much did it depreciate over three years as per dealers offer?

    €11,300 I think. Not less than 11 and not more than 11,500, I’ll double check tomorrow. Basic, basic spec one. The windows in the back have manual wind ups :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,293 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    Just back to the leasing argument. A bmw 420d can be had for 258 sterling per month with 2300 deposit on a 4 year deal. Tiny mileage allowance of 5k miles per year but still you could probably just about buy 2 of them for the cost of one here.


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,515 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    mickdw wrote: »
    Just back to the leasing argument. A bmw 420d can be had for 258 sterling per month with 2300 deposit on a 4 year deal. Tiny mileage allowance of 5k miles per year but still you could probably just about buy 2 of them for the cost of one here.

    5k miles !!
    Essentially your buying a motor to park in the driveway and say “look what I can afford”


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  • Registered Users Posts: 365 ✭✭KellyXX


    mickdw wrote: »
    Just back to the leasing argument. A bmw 420d can be had for 258 sterling per month with 2300 deposit on a 4 year deal. Tiny mileage allowance of 5k miles per year but still you could probably just about buy 2 of them for the cost of one here.

    When I lived in the UK we just leased our car.
    It worked out really well for us, and when we left we just gave it back, no strings.

    You can pay a few quid more for more miles/kms, or you can just pay, in think it was 5p per mile you went over on handing back.

    You could even change the rate during the lease if you found you were going over enough to warrant it

    Is a similar deal allowed in Ireland? Would the govt object in case they lost out in the vrt jackpot? Are there any anti competition laws to allow this in ireland.?

    Running a car is so expensive in Ireland compared to the UK.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,421 ✭✭✭✭Blazer


    Volvo are apparently going to launch a leasing package shortly this year. It will cover the car rental, insurance and tax and service costs.
    I’d seriously consider this when it launches.


  • Registered Users Posts: 365 ✭✭KellyXX


    Blazer wrote: »
    Volvo are apparently going to launch a leasing package shortly this year. It will cover the car rental, insurance and tax and service costs.
    I’d seriously consider this when it launches.


    That would be a game changer here.
    Hopefully there will be a few more so there is competition.


  • Registered Users Posts: 42 Doddles88


    Quick search of car leasing in UK and some of the deals are very good. Granted they are all 8k miles per annum but it really just goes to show how much we get ripped off in Ireland. If you are ok not ever owning the car and get in the frame of mind of treating it like an expense similar to your broadband, your phone or your electricity, leasing is a fantastic option. I wish they would bring it in here! Anybody know whether personal leasing is new to the UK or has it been around a long time? I know I had family that had been using PCP before it was even ever mentioned over here.
    Deals I found
    - BMW 520d M Sport..........Deposit  2,039.....Monthly 340
    - MB E220d AMG..........2,069........345
    -Audi A5 2.0tdi S-line.........2045........341
    -VW Tiguan 2.0tdi 4Motion R-Line..........1895......315


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,655 ✭✭✭draiochtanois


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 509 ✭✭✭numorouno


    Doddles88 wrote: »
    Deals I found
    - BMW 520d M Sport..........Deposit  2,039.....Monthly 340
    - MB E220d AMG..........2,069........345
    -Audi A5 2.0tdi S-line.........2045........341
    -VW Tiguan 2.0tdi 4Motion R-Line..........1895......315

    As regards the deposit does this follow through if you change your car or are you paying a deposit each time you commence a lease arrangement


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,293 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    _Brian wrote: »
    5k miles !!
    Essentially your buying a motor to park in the driveway and say “look what I can afford”

    Ya but I did say you could 2 of them for the price od one here so increasing that mileage wont come anywhere near the cost here


  • Registered Users Posts: 192 ✭✭setanta1000


    According to the European Courts you can offer a lease in Ireland without having to charge VRT (I think!!):
    https://www.rte.ie/news/2017/0919/905877-vehicle-registration-tax/


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,293 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    This post has been deleted.


    That doesnt fully explain it. For example a 318i se is 27k sterling and you can have one for 4 years for 12.5k sterling - thats 46% of new price to use for 4 years and that includes any cost of finance etc.

    Take a similar car here at 36k euro, to drive for 4 years and pay 46% is 16560 euro. So 3k deposit & 282.50 monthly for 4 years then hand back.
    To get anywhere near those figures here you would be putting down 30% deposit and getting little back


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,293 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    According to the European Courts you can offer a lease in Ireland without having to charge VRT (I think!!):
    https://www.rte.ie/news/2017/0919/905877-vehicle-registration-tax/

    I wouldnt think so.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 918 ✭✭✭Jakey Rolling


    _Brian wrote: »
    Surely it matters if I’m trading up to a new motor as it will eliminate any equity which would be the deposit for the next motor.

    When you are trading in, any dealer will price the car according to open market re-sale value minus their cut - and yes, if it's higher mileage it will be worth less.

    This 15c/100km only applies when you hand the car back and walk away, as the finance company want to be sure they recover the full cost of the car if it is worth less than the GMFV.

    Trying to get my OH to understand this - if you do more mileage, the car will be worth less!

    If you start out with a smaller deposit, low GMFV and higher monthly payments (closer to a HP deal) then there is less scope for a shock when it comes to closing out the PCP. If you're getting all the above on a 0% deal, and happy to accept the depreciation of buying new, then you have the best of both worlds.

    100412.2526@compuserve.com



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭Mickiemcfist



    Trying to get my OH to understand this - if you do more mileage, the car will be worth less!
    .

    If ever this has to be a discussion in my house, I'll buy a cheaper car. Cars are for driving, I absolutely hate the "keeping the mileage down" mindset.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭Mickiemcfist


    Yes it does.

    VRT doesn't have a residual value
    A hunk of metal, plastics, and electronics does.

    VRT does have a residual value, you could export it at that point and receive the remaining portion of the VRT.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭Mickiemcfist


    less the admin fee
    less the cost of exporting it

    so it's not something the average job is going to do

    No, but that intrinsic value is still priced into the value of the car.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,932 ✭✭✭ewj1978


    quick thought, on night shift..

    Get a PCP with say 12k p/year mileage but do 25k p/year. so at the end just keep the car and pay final GMFV and not pay mileage costs. Is this a doer or i'm assuming is covered in contract?


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,293 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    Of course you can do that. Finance company don't care if you have cut the car in 2 halves or if you use it as a hen house if you are buying it out. It is then your car fully paid for.
    Any extra mileage will effect a pcp in 2 ways -
    If trading for new car, the car will be valued based on mileage and condition same as any other car. Higher mileage will mean a lower offer. There will be no direct charge per excess mile but that will be roughly accounted for in the trade in offer.
    If handing back the car, you pay agreed excess mileage charge per mile.
    Tbh, if handing back, you are generally getting screwed over anyway in losing out any built up equity.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,862 ✭✭✭RobAMerc


    Blazer wrote: »
    Volvo are apparently going to launch a leasing package shortly this year. It will cover the car rental, insurance and tax and service costs.
    I’d seriously consider this when it launches.

    Ford are doing this in a few markets too.
    You can hire a Mustang 5.0, tax, insurance, servicing, the works for about 500 a month in Italy


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,585 ✭✭✭jca


    ewj1978 wrote: »
    quick thought, on night shift..

    Get a PCP with say 12k p/year mileage but do 25k p/year. so at the end just keep the car and pay final GMFV and not pay mileage costs. Is this a doer or i'm assuming is covered in contract?

    What contract? Of course you can pay off the car after the 3 years.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,932 ✭✭✭ewj1978


    basically I do 40k/kms a year. was thinking I can't even look at PCP with that mileage. hence my thinking on trying to bring down monthly costs. I'd obv be thinking i'd pay the GMFV at the end of the 3 years.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,027 ✭✭✭Lantus


    ewj1978 wrote:
    basically I do 40k/kms a year. was thinking I can't even look at PCP with that mileage. hence my thinking on trying to bring down monthly costs. I'd obv be thinking i'd pay the GMFV at the end of the 3 years.


    If you can I would advise of the mileage and get the gmfv adjusted down so you pay off slightly more over the first 3 years.

    I'd also budget for more tyres and extra servicing within the first 3 years as you will move outside your service allowance which is typically 3 services once every 15 to 20k or year.

    Other than that load your deposit to minimise interest if any and enjoy!


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