Donald Trump Presidency discussion thread III

Zubeneschamali

kilns wrote: »

If he goes it could end in disaster due to his ego, unless he gets played just like Macron tried to play him

The man's an idiot, of course the Koreans (North and South) will play him.

kilns

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

kilns wrote: »

If he goes it could end in disaster due to his ego, unless he gets played just like Macron tried to play him

The man's an idiot, of course the Koreans (North and South) will play him.

Yes but optics will have to be different, NK will never want to look weak to a US President especially an idiot like Trump

Zubeneschamali

kilns wrote: »

Yes but optics will have to be different, NK will never want to look weak to a US President especially an idiot like Trump

Which is why they certainly will not give up their nukes.

Apparently they had a cave-in at their underground testing site, so they can agree to halt further tests for a year or two while they fix that.

BabyCheeses

2 Scoops wrote: »

I'd say the bar is fairly low after Obama's win

Can't be that low if people think their god should get it. The arrogance of Americans to think that their president deserves praise while another leader is standing on the other side of the border.

Pepefrogok

What trump has achieved here is amazing, this wouldn't be happening without him, so far by every metric he has been a success, be that the economy, jobs, world peace etc yet you guys will cling to your manufactured rage harping on about locker room talk etc while body shaming him, yous look foolish but being such a vocal minority yous don't realise it yet!

Be honest with yourself, if someone had of said after trumps first year the economy would be where it is by jobs, stock market, GDP growth and that NK would be agreeing to unilateral nuclear disarmament and China would be at the table to talk about tariffs/intellectual property etc yous should have called them Cray Cray! Will any of yous who were predicting economic collapse, world war etc now have the courage to admit he has defied your expectations? I am not braving here and trying to rub your noses in it, hell iv been wrong about so many politicians and thought trump has been a bit of an ass in some regards i.e many of his boastful tweets etc but some of yous must be ready to admit he has done better than many here expected? <snip>

robinph

Seems they have agreed to work to rid the peninsular of nuclear weapons, which when Trump wakes up he'll claim to have been responsible for.

I don't really see that as too crazy an outcome though. The North was only trying to get a seat at the table to talk and be noticed. They are not really stupid enough to think that they could even vaguely accumulate an arsenal which would scare any other nuclear power, other than the existing powers may be required to use their weapons. NK would get one shot and then it would be game over for them in response to anything they fired.

Now they have shown that they can fire big'ish missiles in a straight line and can set off nuclear devices underground. That gets them a decent hand at the negotiating table, but they can now back off and save whatever money they have been wasting on the nuclear development. They have still shown that they are capable if they had the desire/ need to at a later date.

robinph

Pepefrogok wrote: »

What trump has achieved here is amazing,

What has he done regarding North Korea other than antagonise Kim on twitter by calling him names?

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Second term for trump, the perception of success is working

Pepefrogok wrote: »

What trump has achieved here is amazing....

.....

dudara

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Which is why they certainly will not give up their nukes.

Apparently they had a cave-in at their underground testing site, so they can agree to halt further tests for a year or two while they fix that.

Exactly. The repair works means that they can say that they have ceased testing. The North Koreans have been the real winners here so far. They've bought the US to the table.

Sonics2k

robinph wrote: »

What has he done regarding North Korea other than antagonise Kim on twitter by calling him names?

Meh, Trump has achieved one thing, more out of 50/50 luck than anything else.

We all knew that N.Korea could never take on the US in an actual war, not these days. By flexing at Kim it put Kim in a do or die situation.

The only way Kim can keep ruling North Korea now was to back down and agree to meet with South Korea.

The sad, sad thing here is that this is being treated as a real victory, and it's not. The people of North Korea are still tortured, starved and brainwashed in to thinking that fat oaf of a man is their Great Leader.

BabyCheeses

Wanderer78 wrote: »

.....

Former miners can't buy a house with perception of success. Whatever happened to America first?

Wanderer78

BabyCheeses wrote: »

Former miners can't buy a house with perception of success. Whatever happened to America first?

a good conman!

Pepefrogok

robinph wrote: »

What has he done regarding North Korea other than antagonise Kim on twitter by calling him names?

Come on guys, now's the time to be reasonable and admit trump has done good!

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-42636101

South Korea's President Moon Jae-in says his US counterpart, Donald Trump, "deserves big credit" for talks between South and North Korea.

The talks, held on Tuesday, were the first in two years and led to the announcement that North Korea would send a delegation to the Olympics in Pyeongchang later this year.

Mr Moon said he wanted to show Mr Trump his gratitude.

The US president tweeted a week ago that he had brought the talks about.

He said he had done so by being "firm, strong and willing to commit our total 'might' against the North".

Mr Moon told reporters on Wednesday: "I think President Trump deserves big credit for bringing about the inter-Korean talks.

"It could be a resulting work of the US-led sanctions and pressure," he said.

Mr.Micro

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

The man's an idiot, of course the Koreans (North and South) will play him.

Kim vs Trump, mad vs mad. So the former is canny enough to see the unpredictability of the latter. Hence Kim puts his programme on hold.

josip

Pepe, have you considered that Moon Jae-in might be playing to Trump's ego instead of genuinely believing what he says?
Undoubtedly South Korea should be grateful to the US for their historic and ongoing military support with an unstable North for neighbours.
Although I would assume this 'support' involves South Korea purchasing large amounts of US made equipment.
But to think that Trump is the main reason for the apparent change of tack from North Korea does not stand up to scrutiny.
The only Trump-specific reason that I can think of for this happening, is that North Korea realise that there will never again be such an incompetent president in the White House and now is the best time to negotiate.

Professor Moriarty

Pepefrogok wrote: »

Come on guys, now's the time to be reasonable and admit trump has done good!

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-42636101

South Korea's President Moon Jae-in says his US counterpart, Donald Trump, "deserves big credit" for talks between South and North Korea.

The talks, held on Tuesday, were the first in two years and led to the announcement that North Korea would send a delegation to the Olympics in Pyeongchang later this year.

Mr Moon said he wanted to show Mr Trump his gratitude.

The US president tweeted a week ago that he had brought the talks about.

He said he had done so by being "firm, strong and willing to commit our total 'might' against the North".

Mr Moon told reporters on Wednesday: "I think President Trump deserves big credit for bringing about the inter-Korean talks.

"It could be a resulting work of the US-led sanctions and pressure," he said.

Yeah. Calling him Rocket Man in a tweet isn't good diplomacy. Just because The Donald tweets that he brought about the talks doesn't mean that he actually did. I don't believe anything The Donald tweets and you shouldn't either.

Of course Moon Jae-in is praising Trump. The US handed its power to a four year old. So, when you have deep economic and security ties to the US, you praise the four year old because that's what he likes. Meanwhile, everybody ignores the child playing in the White House and gets on with the real politik of making peace.

Pepefrogok

Amazing, trump said he would sort It, it's happening under his watch while there was not a hint of it happening under the previous president and the leader of South Korea has said that trump deserves a lot of credit for it happening but you guys still say nothing to do with him!?!?! That's crazy lads, what about the booming economy, is that still nothing to do with trump?

BabyCheeses

Pepefrogok wrote: »

Amazing, trump said he would sort It, it's happening under his watch while there was not a hint of it happening under the previous president and the leader of South Korea has said that trump deserves a lot of credit for it happening but you guys still say nothing to do with him!?!?! That's crazy lads, what about the booming economy, is that still nothing to do with trump?

Trump says lots of things.
The new president of SK ran on a platform of being peaceful towards NK.
The economy isn't booming.

You are free to explain what Trump has done in this situation outside of tweeting rocket man. Instead of repeating the same Trump is great why don't you try convincing people?

Professor Moriarty

Pepefrogok wrote: »

Amazing, trump said he would sort It, it's happening under his watch while there was not a hint of it happening under the previous president and the leader of South Korea has said that trump deserves a lot of credit for it happening but you guys still say nothing to do with him!?!?! That's crazy lads, what about the booming economy, is that still nothing to do with trump?

Any thoughts on the booming deficit? Or had that not occurred to you? It certainly hasn't occurred to The Donald. But why would it? Talking about creating a massive debt problem for the next generation won't get him the admiration and approval he desperately craves.

Chips Lovell

It's only midday and I've already had to card two people for attacking other posters rather than debating the topic at hand.

RobertKK

So the Korean War formally ends during the Trump presidency.
The extremists were crying we were going to have a nuclear war instead.

Wanderer78

RobertKK wrote: »

So the Korean War formally ends during the Trump presidency.
The extremists were crying we were going to have a nuclear war instead.

relax lads, its the first day of negotiations, a lot of optics going on here to, it is politics after all

robinph

Do you think the solution to wars to have a madman with a Twitter account and a massive nuclear arsenal then?

What has Trump actually done other than threaten to wipe North Korea off the map on Twitter? I don't believe for a second though that Kim thought that a serious prospect of happening. Kim fired some missiles, got invited to talks because the west was scared of him being able to aim them mildly accurately and they really didn't want to have to respond to that, Kim accepted.

Nothing to do with Trump sending crazy tweets. Whatever has just happened, happened because of Kim and South Korea agreeing to talk. Trump has just been a distraction in the background shouting crazy things.

RobertKK

BabyCheeses wrote: »

Trump says lots of things.
The new president of SK ran on a platform of being peaceful towards NK.
The economy isn't booming.

You are free to explain what Trump has done in this situation outside of tweeting rocket man. Instead of repeating the same Trump is great why don't you try convincing people?

Mike Pompeo went to Pyongyang to meet Kim Jong Un. They have agreed to a summit.
Maybe the nuclear threat to the US and the subsequent war of words led to change. Maybe Kim Jong Un went to Beijing to make sure North Korea would be protected if they got rid of their nuclear weapons, given China said if North Korea was to launch an attack they would not come to North Korea’s aid.
Maybe the whole situation needed a Donald Trump and a South Korea President so one could play bad cop and the other good cop.
The fact is after decades of no real change, the Korean War is going to formally end, and both of the Korean nations have agreed to work towards total denuclearisation of the Korean Peninsula.

mcmoustache

RobertKK wrote: »

So the Korean War formally ends during the Trump presidency.
The extremists were crying we were going to have a nuclear war instead.

Were people really saying that or is this some generalisation that you would like to be true. From my own recollection, most people objected to his Little Rocketman nonsense on the twitter.

But sure, make up what you want if it makes you feel better.

RobertKK

mcmoustache wrote: »

Were people really saying that or is this some generalisation that you would like to be true. From my own recollection, most people objected to his Little Rocketman nonsense on the twitter.

But sure, make up what you want if it makes you feel better.

There are a lot of people who object to everything Trump does. Both men were involved in name calling. Yet they will now meet at some point.
I didn’t object as it is better than some former presidents like Bush, Obama etc who didn’t name call but did start new wars.
At least these guys are talking.

Wanderer78

RobertKK wrote: »

There are a lot of people who object to everything Trump does. Both men were involved in name calling. Yet they will now meet at some point.
I didn’t object as it is better than some former presidents like Bush, Obama etc who didn’t name call but did start new wars.
At least these guys are talking.

'name calling', kinna disturbing from world leaders though?

Quin_Dub

As other posters have said.. Trump didn't bring Kim to the table. Kim bright Trump to the table.

NK have been wanting to negotiate for years but were refusing to make any consessions, so they never took place.

So what do we have now?

NK stopped testing Nukes?
Evidence from China is that is because the test site is destroyed, nothing to do with Trump.

What NK want is access to money.. they were never going to use the nukes.. What they have now achieved is a bargaining to to be able to say. We'll give up the nukes if we can trade.

They change nothing at home, the people are still screwed and Trump thinks he's won something because he's a political infant.

So far it's simply very well played by Kim Jong Un.

BabyCheeses

RobertKK wrote: »

So the Korean War formally ends during the Trump presidency.
The extremists were crying we were going to have a nuclear war instead.

Who were the extremists? I remember Trump and Kim talking about using nukes. I remember you saying there would be war in Syria which would lead to US vs Russia if Clinton won (so much for that)

RobertKK wrote: »

Mike Pompeo went to Pyongyang to meet Kim Jong Un. They have agreed to a summit.
Maybe the nuclear threat to the US and the subsequent war of words led to change. Maybe Kim Jong Un went to Beijing to make sure North Korea would be protected if they got rid of their nuclear weapons, given China said if North Korea was to launch an attack they would not come to North Korea’s aid.
Maybe the whole situation needed a Donald Trump and a South Korea President so one could play bad cop and the other good cop.
The fact is after decades of no real change, the Korean War is going to formally end, and both of the Korean nations have agreed to work towards total denuclearisation of the Korean Peninsula.

They have agreed to talk while NK and SK have already been talking and come up with some proposals. This still suggests that this has little to do with Trump.

jooksavage

Now Trump is threatening other countries not to oppose the North American World Cup bid. Christ. Can he actually go 24 hours without looking like a despot?