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After BXD: The next big public transport project for Dublin?3

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    #152
    Dr Crayfish
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,960 ✭✭✭Dr Crayfish


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    What is there to making traffic lights wait for oncoming buses and trams?

    Why not have buses fitted with dash cams to take pictures of cars in bus lanes? These would of course have to be accepted as robust evidence in FPN or subsequent court case.

    Why not have some bus lanes designated as bus only (no taxis)?

    Lots of small steps to make buses go faster. If a bus goes 10% faster, it is equivalent to having 10% more buses and more revenue.

    Well basically what I'm saying is have routes like the Luas but just put buses on it. Why the need to have tracks laid etc? I know it's more comfortable but I wouldn't be complaining if we had fast reliable bus services that were prioritised in traffic.


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    #153
    Dr Crayfish
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,960 ✭✭✭Dr Crayfish


    If you could just jump onto them and not have to dick around with money with the driver it would save a lot of time. So ticket dispensers at the stops and card scanning facilities on the buses themselves, with inspectors on the routes from time to time. It seems like a simple traffic solution to me.


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    #154
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,524 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Dr Crayfish wrote: »
    Well basically what I'm saying is have routes like the Luas but just put buses on it. Why the need to have tracks laid etc? I know it's more comfortable but I wouldn't be complaining if we had fast reliable bus services that were prioritised in traffic.
    Dr Crayfish wrote: »
    If you could just jump onto them and not have to dick around with money with the driver it would save a lot of time. So ticket dispensers at the stops and card scanning facilities on the buses themselves, with inspectors on the routes from time to time. It seems like a simple traffic solution to me.

    Basically BRT, what is planned for Swiftway. They seem to be planning three of these routes.


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    #155
    Dr Crayfish
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,960 ✭✭✭Dr Crayfish


    bk wrote: »
    Basically BRT, what is planned for Swiftway. They seem to be planning three of these routes.

    Is that what BRT is? I will look it up. I would have no problem having these routes over expensive Luaii.


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    #156
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,524 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Dr Crayfish wrote: »
    Is that what BRT is? I will look it up. I would have no problem having these routes over expensive Luaii.

    BRT is cheaper then Luas/Tram, but it also can't carry as many passenger per route per hour. So if you build Luas or BRT should come down purely to the demand along the route, not really just cost.


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    #157
    Dr Crayfish
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,960 ✭✭✭Dr Crayfish


    So i was just reading about swiftway etc I live on one of the proposed routes. Is it just pie in the sky now or have they started widening roads or building stops or whatever they need to do?


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    #158
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,524 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Dr Crayfish wrote: »
    So i was just reading about swiftway etc I live on one of the proposed routes. Is it just pie in the sky now or have they started widening roads or building stops or whatever they need to do?

    It hasn't started. Seems to have gotten delayed due to the larger BusConnects project. Hopefully it or some form of it gets the go ahead.


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    #159
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    bk wrote: »
    It hasn't started. Seems to have gotten delayed due to the larger BusConnects project. Hopefully it or some form of it gets the go ahead.

    Weren't there lots of objections as people thought it was a cheap alternative to MN.


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    #160
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    Hyperloop. (not on the list of options and probably highly unlikely, currently)

    Plenty of folks already live in an insular vacum bubble, so won't take much getting used to ;)
    Cork-Dublin-Belfast in about the same time it takes to watch a single episode of fair city.


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    #161
    Uranium
    Registered Users Posts: 19 ✭Uranium


    Be great if the were all built but MN and interconnector are coming in at €4BN each


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    #162
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    Teagan Lemon Dandruff wrote: »
    Hyperloop. (not on the list of options and probably highly unlikely, currently)

    Cork-Dublin-Belfast in about the same time it takes to watch a single episode of fair city.

    But will it be built to Irish standard gauge? We should at least be able to send a few of the Mk3s down the new route


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    #163
    Peregrine
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,399 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine


    Uranium wrote: »
    Be great if the were all built but MN and interconnector are coming in at €4BN each

    MN won't cost anywhere near €4bn unless the new redesign includes several kms of tunnelling on the Southside also which is unlikely. The cost of the original MN was around €2.6bn.


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    #164
    markpb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,255 ✭✭✭markpb


    Uranium wrote: »
    Be great if the were all built but MN and interconnector are coming in at €4BN each

    4bn is not actually a huge sum of money for the Irish government. It ignores the fact that the company building it would be hiring staff who will pay income tax in Ireland, they'll be renting construction equipment from Irish companies who will pay corporation tax and income tax. More importantly, it could be paid over 3-5 years (of construction) or over 30 years (of operation). For comparison, the state took in 51bn in tax, 3bn from the partial sale of AIB and 8bn in prsi last year alone.


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    #165
    Zebra3
    Registered Users Posts: 13,858 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    Would be good to get the smaller net cost to the state out there.


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    #166
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    AngryLips wrote: »
    But will it be built to Irish standard gauge? We should at least be able to send a few of the Mk3s down the new route

    No idea, essentially it's a small vacum tube with a small footprint that moves people about in pods cleaner and quicker than a 747 racing up at 30,000ft at full throttle.

    The aul hyperloop is probably another decade away from being a realistic option (outside of Cali or UAE).

    But then again between quangos, unions, heavy construction etc., any serious construction project now might also be a decade or so from realisation.


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    #167
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,529 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    Teagan Lemon Dandruff wrote: »
    No idea, essentially it's a small vacum tube with a small footprint that moves people about in pods cleaner and quicker than a 747 racing up at 30,000ft at full throttle.

    The aul hyperloop is probably another decade away from being a realistic option (outside of Cali or UAE).

    But then again between quangos, unions, heavy construction etc., any serious construction project now might also be a decade or so from realisation.

    Hyperloop is obviously complete sci-fi stuff at the minute and nowhere near becoming a reality, nevermind in Ireland. But more importantly, it would never work out on a cost basis as a public transport option in Dublin (the topic of the thread!).


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    #168
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    MJohnston wrote: »
    Hyperloop is obviously complete sci-fi stuff at the minute and nowhere near becoming a reality, nevermind in Ireland. But more importantly, it would never work out on a cost basis as a public transport option in Dublin (the topic of the thread!).

    Becoming a reality in many places over the next few years, HTT just signed an agreement for travel between Vijaywada to Amaravati (over in {not yet} 1st world, India).

    Meanwhile Richard Branson is throwing some serious dollas behind the concept.

    The 1st fully fledged system from Musk, is expected 2021.


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    #169
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,529 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    Teagan Lemon Dandruff wrote: »
    Becoming a reality in many places over the next few years, HTT just signed an agreement for travel between Vijaywada to Amaravati (over in {not yet} 1st world, India).

    Meanwhile Richard Branson is throwing some serious dollas behind the concept.

    The 1st fully fledged system from Musk, is expected 2021.

    Yeah, so at least 20 years off from being a reality in Ireland. But still - nothing to do with Dublin public transport.


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    #170
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    MJohnston wrote: »
    Yeah, so at least 20 years off from being a reality in Ireland. But still - nothing to do with Dublin public transport.

    In terms of getting in and out of Dublin (to other major population centers) a 12 foot wide hollow tube on stilts doesn't sound too messy, and would relive pressure on all other city routes for the more local commuters). 2021 is just 3yrs away.

    It's a bit like someone buying a 2.0 VW Diesel a couple of years ago for occasional trip, then having a spin around town in one of these new but basic electric cars, worlds apart.


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    #171
    MJohnston
    Registered Users Posts: 10,529 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    Teagan Lemon Dandruff wrote: »
    In terms of getting in and out of Dublin (to other major population centers) a 12 foot wide hollow tube on stilts doesn't sound too messy, and would relive pressure on all other city routes for the more local commuters). 2021 is just 3yrs away.

    It's a bit like someone buying a 2.0 VW Diesel a couple of years ago for occasional trip, then having a spin around town in one of these new but basic electric cars, worlds apart.

    It's not what the thread is about though.


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    #172
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Teagan Lemon Dandruff wrote: »
    In terms of getting in and out of Dublin (to other major population centers) a 12 foot wide hollow tube on stilts doesn't sound too messy, and would relive pressure on all other city routes for the more local commuters). 2021 is just 3yrs away.

    It's a bit like someone buying a 2.0 VW Diesel a couple of years ago for occasional trip, then having a spin around town in one of these new but basic electric cars, worlds apart.

    But electric cars were around 3 years ago they're only increasing in popularity now. Hyperloops are not around yet.


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    #173
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    But electric cars were around 3 years ago they're only increasing in popularity now. Hyperloops are not around yet.

    Suppose the question is would it be easier to wait a bit longer to evaluate and plan around it as a possibility, than rush ahead with existing options.

    Bearing in mind 12 foot wide hollow tubes may well be easier to install, maintain and upgrade that large bridges, tracks, new roads or other.

    Sending commuters in/out of central Dublin efficiently to elsewhere could be classed as a Dublin based infrastructure project.


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    #174
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Tbh with you hyperloops don't look very pleasant to travel in aswell. I personally would not like to travel in a vehicle without windows which hyperloops don't seem to have. They also don't look like a system that's capable of carrying a high capacity with a hyperloop vehicle incapable of carrying more passengers than a standard plane so about 190 people as opposed to train that could carry over 1,000 people so not really a practicle solution.


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    #175
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Tbh with you hyperloops don't look very pleasant to travel in aswell. I personally would not like to travel in a vehicle without windows which hyperloops don't seem to have. They also don't look like a system that's capable of carrying a high capacity with a hyperloop vehicle incapable of carrying more passengers than a standard plane so about 190 people as opposed to train that could carry over 1,000 people so not really a practicle solution.

    Perhaps, but that's actually the bonus. The individual pods would actually be very small, hence the low footprint. The capacity factor is present, thanks to the immense speed which equates to very high frequency. No moving parts, no machinery, just a sealed pod. From factory to back of truck, direct to loopstation.

    Anyway once the concept is fully proven, shares in HTT would be an idea.


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    #176
    Van.Bosch
    Registered Users Posts: 2,851 ✭✭✭Van.Bosch


    Teagan Lemon Dandruff wrote: »
    Perhaps, but that's actually the bonus. The individual pods would actually be very small, hence the low footprint. The capacity factor is present, thanks to the immense speed which equates to very high frequency. No moving parts, no machinery, just a sealed pod. From factory to back of truck, direct to loopstation.

    Anyway once the concept is fully proven, shares in HTT would be an idea.

    I wouldn’t be worrying about hyperloop’s! We can’t even have a DART train run on time


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    #177
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,355 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Van.Bosch wrote: »
    I wouldn’t be worrying about hyperloop’s! We can’t even have a DART train run on time
    I would imagine the hyperloops would be automated.

    You wouldn't have the hyperloop being represented by Dermot O'Leary or Brendan Ogle and going on strike regularly. The hyperloop wouldn't complain about getting a Dunnes voucher for Christmas either.


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    #178
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    Van.Bosch wrote: »
    I wouldn’t be worrying about hyperloop’s! We can’t even have a DART train run on time

    Sure, it's a all abit 2025.

    But think of all the excuses that would be more or less eliminated: Leaves on tracks, traffic accidents, staff (yes fully automated, a specturm48 could probably run it), any type of weather event, track jumpers, derailments, cyclists, engine failure etc etc...


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    #179
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Teagan Lemon Dandruff wrote: »
    Sure, it's a all abit 2025.

    But think of all the excuses that would be more or less eliminated: Leaves on tracks, traffic accidents, staff (yes fully automated, a specturm48 could probably run it), any type of weather event, track jumpers, derailments, cyclists, engine failure etc etc...

    You'd actually find the concept the hyperloop dates back to the 1800s but has yet to take off oddly enough Dalkey once had one.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_railway#


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    #180
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Teagan Lemon Dandruff wrote: »
    Perhaps, but that's actually the bonus. The individual pods would actually be very small, hence the low footprint. The capacity factor is present, thanks to the immense speed which equates to very high frequency. No moving parts, no machinery, just a sealed pod. From factory to back of truck, direct to loopstation.

    Anyway once the concept is fully proven, shares in HTT would be an idea.

    But you would have to have hyperloops services well spaced in order to prevent a pod jam.


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    #181
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    You'd actually find the concept the hyperloop dates back to the 1800s but has yet to take off oddly enough Dalkey once had one.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_railway#

    But did it do 387km/h (240mph) like the 3rd phase of successful testing at the DevLoop site in Nevada?

    All components of the system were put through their paces during the full-scale test on December 15.

    This includes the airlock, electric motor, advanced controls and power electronics, custom magnetic levitation and guidance, pod suspension, and the vacuum.

    That arty chap Da Vinci b.1452 did some great conceptual/feasability sketches of helicopters, but seems they haven't got it right yet, sure people are still constantly making newer, better, faster ones.


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