The poor farmer hypocrisy

Feckoffcup

Chap said to me there's no money in farming and what he was doing was making no money. A couple of mins later he went on to explain he bought a 200hp New Holland for £54,000 recently. Now this guy doesn't have big machinery to pull... Oh and he hopped back into his 2016 Hilux.
Am I missing something here?

Grueller

Feckoffcup wrote: »

Chap said to me there's no money in farming and what he was doing was making no money. A couple of mins later he went on to explain he bought a 200hp New Holland for £54,000 recently. Now this guy doesn't have big machinery to pull... Oh and he hopped back into his 2016 Hilux.
Am I missing something here?

Not missing anything. You saw exactly where all his money was "invested" if as you say he has no big machinery to pull.

grassroot1

yes the chance to say that to him

kk.man

Some Fellas go around putting on a poor show hoping people believe them..its a kinda sick way to act.
A fella said to me once...you should dress down going to the Mart cause people think ya have money.

Willfarman

There's lads that'd moan if they won the lotto because they'd have to go to collect it..

Waffletraktor

Feckoffcup wrote: »

Am I missing something here?

Not much only the usual nonsense.
See it the whole time if a farm does have a good year they fill the yard with shiny new toys and just pay more out on rents to produce more hoping next year is even better back to square one. Spuds are the worst for it.

mf240

Farmers complain 11 months of the year that there making no money and then the other month complaining about paying tax. Some of the worst offenders would make Mary Lou look like an optimist.

Willfarman

kk.man wrote: »

Some Fellas go around putting on a poor show hoping people believe them..its a kinda sick way to act.
A fella said to me once...you should dress down going to the Mart cause people think ya have money.

I think the opposite is often the case.. the wannabe dealers wearing the designer label jumpers and jackets and then see them huddled in booth in the office in hushed tones.. il pay for last week and the week before. Put that animal down to such and such..

whelan2

Just because they have shiny new machinery doesn't mean they can afford to pay for it.

K.G.

Very simple.you are equating large investment with making money and that guy probaly is making no money.the guy with clapped out jeep and clapped out tractor could be making a fortune though.very common mistake you are making which alot of farmers themselves make. I ve relation that calls to farmers now and again and often remarks how common it for farmers to new machinery and faney cattle houses yet be living in sqauler in the farm house.

_Brian

I deal with allot of farmers and most smaller farms are making nothing, or essentially nothing.
I’d hazard a guess that 30-40% of farms are making nothing bar the cheque in the post and for many that’s not anything near a wage.

What I’m seeing ian lots of bachelors where their pension oryounfwr men SW is keeping them, other than that a wife out working is holding things together financially.

Markcheese

True, but a shiney new jeep that you can't write off against profit, because you don't have any??

patsy_mccabe

Why are people so opposed to buying things new? Would you criticize a carpenter for buying a new saw? We can't all keep trading in second hand machinery. Soemone has to buy them new, to keep the cycle going.
(Says the guy with the 40 year old tractor. )

whelan2

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Why are people so opposed to buying things new? Would you criticize a carpenter for buying a new saw? We can't all keep trading in second hand machinery. Soemone has to buy them new, to keep the cycle going.
(Says the guy with the 40 year old tractor. )

No shiny metal disease here, was thinking of trading in our digger or tractor earlier in the year but they are both going grand- touch wood- got a new clutch and hydraulic pump in the tm125 last month, should keep it going for another while. Although when I get the bill it might have been cheaper to get a new tractor :eek:

voz es

Based in the west of Ireland on a sluckler farm.

We have had a few new attachments and the odd new topper or transport box over the years. But to be buying a new tractor would be a half decades profit. I would love to know how it is done!

Even running a 15 year old landcruiser over a caddy van seems strange when i look at some of the 40 acre set ups around me. I understand the need when it is a greatly fragmented farm with high stocking intensity but a good 80/90hp 4WD tractor should cover next to everything on a farm.
I think myself a 40k box tractor would be enough for most lads. I know lads worry about front loaders on the road, but surly investing in a proper frame for the front loader that makes putting it on and taking it off easy is a wiser move.

foxy farmer

Some people are unbelievably tight. I was looking at a shed that was damaged in a storm. 3 bay Round roof and bay of a leanto whipped off completely. Remains of the roof are 100 yrds away in a tangled mess. Yer man is talking about stripping the sheets straightening them and putting them back up. The whole shed is 42x37. The same lad is milking 200 cows.

Timmaay

foxy farmer wrote: »

Some people are unbelievably tight. I was looking at a shed that was damaged in a storm. 3 bay Round roof and bay of a leanto whipped off completely. Remains of the roof are 100 yrds away in a tangled mess. Yer man is talking about stripping the sheets straightening them and putting them back up. The whole shed is 42x37. The same lad is milking 200 cows.

Each to their own, if he has the time and skill to do it and is happy it's worth salvaging then work away.

lalababa

If a fella is buying new tractors and Jeep's then he must have quite a lump of money. If he doesn't have a lump then he is probably going to get into trouble.
Look up average farm incomes on cso or teagasc , it doesn't make good reading especially on beef and tillage.
Yer man is just a complaining gob****e.

simx

There's a few different types

The lad that buys a heap of new machinery, always putting up sheds and then gives out about no money, the same lad would probably buy a new tractor before buying a new battery for a old one

The lad that keeps it low cost but still is cute, he's proabably making a few bob and saying nothing about it, this is the lad that arrives to a land auction and buys the land when everyone thought the other lad would buy it

Markcheese

patsy_mccabe wrote:

Why are people so opposed to buying things new? Would you criticize a carpenter for buying a new saw? We can't all keep trading in second hand machinery. Soemone has to buy them new, to keep the cycle going. (Says the guy with the 40 year old tractor. )

Depends on the amount of usage, and the value though.. I dont think anyone begrudges a farmer a decent pair of wellies or a new dung pike. (-: .. But if a fella has 10 scrawny cattle and a brand new jeep in the yard that's his own issue till he starts an Beal bocht..

simx

Markcheese wrote: »

Depends on the amount of usage, and the value though.. I dont think anyone begrudges a farmer a decent pair of wellies or a new dung pike. (-: .. But if a fella has 10 scrawny cattle and a brand new jeep in the yard that's his own issue till he starts an Beal bocht..

So many farmers think they need a jeep that don't too I think, the new jeep or tractor is a status symbol too

MIKEKC

whelan2 wrote: »

Just because they have shiny new machinery doesn't mean they can afford to pay for it.

If they don't surely it will be taken away. More shame

jaymla627

simx wrote: »

So many farmers think they need a jeep that don't too I think, the new jeep or tractor is a status symbol too

Putting up 1500 plus hours on the tractor here a year, with the cost of repairs and downtime running older kit that's working hard id rather change the tractor every four years before it gets into needing a fortune spent on it to keep it running, if you have the misfortune of a gearbox failure on a high houred modern tractor you could be talking 10k plus to put it right and the tractor won't be worth a penny more either

simx

jaymla627 wrote: »

Putting up 1500 plus hours on the tractor here a year, with the cost of repairs and downtime running older kit that's working hard id rather change the tractor every four years before it gets into needing a fortune spent on it to keep it running, if you have the misfortune of a gearbox failure on a high houred modern tractor you could be talking 10k plus to put it right and the tractor won't be worth a penny more either

Ah no I understand that, but plenty lads wouldn't be putting many hours on tractors yearly but "need" a new one, the same lads would never reseed a field etc.

larthehar

Farming like any other business needs to have decent equipment to operate.. some lads over do it and other under do it but the business should be able to support equipment maintenance/renewal..

On the money subject, i think that money can be easily made out of farming but making a living is whole different ball game.. the average industrial wage is 35k.. from a beef perspective if you could clear 200/hd on every animal that is still 175 animals to make a living..

PMU

yes simx, they will buy meal before fertilizer

Limestone Cowboy

I think myself it's very easy to spend a big lump of money if you can access it easily on something that's not necessarily needed, I'd have notions myself at times but when it comes to the crunch if it's not going to pay it's way it'll become a non runner.

simx

Limestone Cowboy wrote: »

I think myself it's very easy to spend a big lump of money if you can access it easily on something that's not necessarily needed, I'd have notions myself at times but when it comes to the crunch if it's not going to pay it's way it'll become a non runner.

All comes back to the thing of 'want or need'

lakill Farm

from a tax perspective since the introduction of s392 and being able to offset capital allowances in a loss making year its a handy tool if you have an off farm income

personally I have invested a few euro in machinery since we bought here. but at the stage now that I have a few more small items (all second-hand if I can source) and that's it. trying to stand a shed to put machines into also

half the reason I buy machines is being able to do stuff myself when I want and it does cut down on contractor fee and tax side wraps up the other half

Donegalforever

Feckoffcup wrote: »

Chap said to me there's no money in farming and what he was doing was making no money. A couple of mins later he went on to explain he bought a 200hp New Holland for £54,000 recently. Now this guy doesn't have big machinery to pull... Oh and he hopped back into his 2016 Hilux.
Am I missing something here?

Did he pay for the New Holland and the Hilux or are they on HP or leased?
Some like to show off yet they are into their eyeballs in debt.

patsy_mccabe

It's not rocket science. It's easy know what kinda profit anyone is making on their farm. Costs, farm gate prices and even average profits for each sector of the industry are well documented.

Off farm incomes and fellas maximising their capital allowances are a different matter altogether.