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Bus Eireann Possible Strike
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Here's a fixed link:
https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=1892153037769339&id=100009239844885
Bus Eireann have since confirmed to RTE that the figures quoted by Regina Doherty are correct.
that link works. thanks.ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.
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Bus Éireann has deferred the implementation of new cost saving rosters for drivers for a fortnight following discussions at the Workplace Relations Commission yesterday.
They will now be implemented on 12 November, with more regard given to seniority in the allocation of duties.
https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2017/1025/915211-bus-eireann/0 -
The new rosters which were due to come in on November 12 (see post above) were deferred due to no agreement between staff and management.
Now BE has stated they will introduce them from next Sunday - as a result the unions will be balloting for strike if they do.
More unrest ahead......0 -
The new rosters which were due to come in on November 12 (see post above) were deferred due to no agreement between staff and management.
Now BE has stated they will introduce them from next Sunday - as a result the unions will be balloting for strike if they do.
More unrest ahead......
So what are BE doing that wasn't in the Labour Court deal?0 -
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I figured that part but didn't the labour court deal mean major changes so any idea what the exact issue it they can't agree on?
As I understand it, that the changes that Bus Éireann wants to bring in, would mean that drivers - who are scheduled to drive services throughout the day, where in between services they drive, they can have two hours long gaps in between the services they are scheduled to drive - would only be paid for the time during the day that they are driving, even though they can have hours of a gap in between services they are scheduled to drive. I think it is often the case, that depending on where the drivers are located in between services, that it is not possible, or convenient, for them to go home, during the gap in between the services they are scheduled to drive.
My understanding is, that the changes will mean that they will only be paid for the time that they are driving, which means that they can be hanging around for a number of hours during the day, in between the particular services they are scheduled to drive, but not getting paid for the time they are waiting to drive their next scheduled service.0 -
I figured that part but didn't the labour court deal mean major changes so any idea what the exact issue it they can't agree on?
The amount of unpaid breaks (2 hours 45 minutes max) has increased under proposed rosters, also issues with rosters not available for discussion in the required 6 week timeframe and negotiations not taking place.
The recommendation also required any issues regarding rostering to be addressed via binding arbitration - the company are implementing the changes without going down this route.0 -
Lads, sort it out with talks don't screw over the public, please.
This sounds like a technical issue that could easily be overcome.
The strike totally backfired last time and there was no public support and political support was even less, played right into the hands of the hard right band of ideologues in FG who have plans you really don't want seeing the light of day and made it impossible for those of us on the center left to defend you
If you (and apparently you are)of a mind that even tendering out PSO routes the way is happening with DB is too much for you then all this will do is play right into the hands of those of us who want that to happen (or, as I said, those in FG who want full on privatization). The strike last time made people more aware of private alternatives that were reasonably priced and more comfortable in some cases, it only hurt you.
Don't make the same mistake twice. Like many PS workers in Ireland you labor under the false sense of having a permanent unremovable job so have a mentality of there is nothing to lose, but there is a lot to lose, it's not 1970 anymore there are alternative policy models out there and the decision on adopting them (and how secure you are in them) is in the hands of political leaders who can be elected (or not) by the passengers you annoy with this kind of action. Management and politicos are not hurt by the strike, only the voting public who have the power to take actions which will upset the very nice apple cart you have going in terms and conditions.0 -
Lads, sort it out with talks don't screw over the public, please.
This sounds like a technical issue that could easily be overcome.
if the company forces through the changes without the required agreement the staff are entitled to withdraw their labour, as the company hasn't stuck to it's side of the agreement. they do need to ultimately talk but the company is the one now causing the issue by forcing through changes without agreement and talks.
The strike totally backfired last time and there was no public support and political support was even less, played right into the hands of the hard right band of ideologues in FG who have plans you really don't want seeing the light of day and made it impossible for those of us on the center left to defend you
If you (and apparently you are)of a mind that even tendering out PSO routes the way is happening with DB is too much for you then all this will do is play right into the hands of those of us who want that to happen (or, as I said, those in FG who want full on privatization). The strike last time made people more aware of private alternatives that were reasonably priced and more comfortable in some cases, it only hurt you.
Don't make the same mistake twice. Like many PS workers in Ireland you labor under the false sense of having a permanent unremovable job so have a mentality of there is nothing to lose, but there is a lot to lose, it's not 1970 anymore there are alternative policy models out there and the decision on adopting them (and how secure you are in them) is in the hands of political leaders who can be elected (or not) by the passengers you annoy with this kind of action. Management and politicos are not hurt by the strike, only the voting public who have the power to take actions which will upset the very nice apple cart you have going in terms and conditions.
the strike didn't backfire as the changes proposed were going to be implemented whether there was a strike or not, the strike was more about forcing the company to talk, which until now it had done. it had a good bit of public support, public support never making any difference in terms of sorting out the issues between staff and their employer.
as a complete centrist, it was very easy for me to defend staff withdrawing their labour, and i and many others will continue to defend that ability. tendering/privatization will not stop strikes or any of the issues with public transport, so those who want it want it for the sake of it, as they already know the realities. prices would likely go up without a state operator in the mix, + it's government policy to insure the prices on subsidized services are high so that passengers pay the greater share for the service.
the alternative policy models usually end up more expensive for less, as government only ever works in it's own interest and not of the people's interest. public service terms and conditions won't be eroded, as the ps workers will do what they need to to insure it won't happen, and they will have mine, and many others full support. because if their terms are eroded, the rest of us will definitely have ours eroded, making us a low wage, no workers rights economy. the only people to blame for that will not be the public service workers, but those who want it to happen, who will use any excuse to get their way.ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.
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end of the road wrote: »the alternative policy models usually end up more expensive for less, as government only ever works in it's own interest and not of the people's interest.
Well the evidence here in Ireland seems to say otherwise.
Luas is incredibly successful and it requires no operating subsidy, actually makes a profit.
The new intercity bus services are the best thing to happen to intercity travel in more then a decade, having substantially grown the numbers of people using public transport intercity and have done so profitably with zero government subsidy.
Both are examples of alternative government policies and both have been very successful.
As for the government working for it's own interest! Huh, the government departments do what they are directed to do by the government ministers who are elected and re-elected by the people of Ireland.0 -
Well the evidence here in Ireland seems to say otherwise.
Luas is incredibly successful and it requires no operating subsidy, actually makes a profit.
it has the passenger patronage and it's infrastructure is quite minimal. that is why it makes a profit. i'd bet most tram systems make a profit or break even at least. i wouldn't put that down to privatization or private operation/tendering.The new intercity bus services are the best thing to happen to intercity travel in more then a decade, having substantially grown the numbers of people using public transport intercity and have done so profitably with zero government subsidy. Both are examples of alternative government policies and both have been very successful.
again they have the passenger patronage to allow for profitability. it just so happens to be some private operators operating quite a lot, but bus eireann, had they listened to their staff and implemented similar, would also be profitible on those routes. i believe they are profitible on the few big expressway routes they have. other expressway routes aren't really expressway. requiring no subsidy just proves that there is enough paying custom, it doesn't prove privatization works.As for the government working for it's own interest! Huh, the government departments do what they are directed to do by the government ministers who are elected and re-elected by the people of Ireland.
being elected makes no difference to politicians. they do what they like and work in their own interests.ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.
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Well the evidence here in Ireland seems to say otherwise.
Luas is incredibly successful and it requires no operating subsidy, actually makes a profit.
The new intercity bus services are the best thing to happen to intercity travel in more then a decade, having substantially grown the numbers of people using public transport intercity and have done so profitably with zero government subsidy.
Both are examples of alternative government policies and both have been very successful.
As for the government working for it's own interest! Huh, the government departments do what they are directed to do by the government ministers who are elected and re-elected by the people of Ireland.
I think end of the road makes a good point about the issue of terms and conditions of employment, and the importance of defending these terms and conditions.
Indeed, the Luas is a great service, but you'll recall the negative reaction from some people on boards.ie, and on other media outlets like RTE Liveline, when the Luas strike was on last year.
People saying things to the effect of; "What's their problem, why aren't they happy with what they're getting, for the simple job they do. All they do is push a button. Others are getting less than them."
Some of the callers on Liveline, on 1st April 2016, are an example of these type of comments. One guy, from Carlow, who seemingly never went into Dublin City Centre before the Luas was developed, blamed the strike for him not getting into town, to celebrate the 1916 Centenary events, despite the fact that he could have taken trains into Heuston Station, then connected with Dublin Bus, or taxi, or other bus services to Dublin from the town in which he lives.
This guy contradicts himself by saying that the Luas employees, aren't as badly off as people in other areas of employment, that do not have Trade Union representation, but at the same time he criticizes Luas employees who are members of Trade Unions, for taking a decision, in co-operation with Trade Unions, to campaign to uphold the terms and conditions of their employment.
Does he not consider, that if the people in employment with no Trade Union representation, had representation, that they might have better terms and conditions, or does he want any employees of any company, who might engage in industrial action, to have less terms and conditions, on the basis that employees in another company, have less terms and conditions?
Another guy insults the Luas employees by saying "a child could drive a Luas tram", and he basis this assertion by saying that children can operate aeroplanes on computer games.
https://rte.ie/r.html?rii=b9_20962166_53_01-04-2016_
http://www.rte.ie/radio1/liveline/programmes/2016/0401/778867-liveline-friday-1-april-2016/0 -
I figured that part but didn't the labour court deal mean major changes so any idea what the exact issue it they can't agree on?
Seems to me they want to keep the old rostering system that was in place but accept the new pay scale, without actually changing the rostering and work practices that was agreed at the LRC. Perhaps the penny is dropping for the drivers to what they singed up for?0 -
I don't want to go on strike again
I don't want to lose more money, I don't want the place to shut down resulting in thousands of jobs lost and also don't want people to get more pissed off at us
It has been a night mare since the last strike, people have been pissed off at us and still not forgiving us, people are ungodly rude to us, speak down to us like we are nothing, like sh!t , spit on us, call us abusive names and all sorts
And for what ? Us trying to do a job, us accepting a deal to help out the company when all others got pay rises and we got cuts.
All we want to do is our job but we can't be gone from the home for over 12 hours a day working for crap like the above and only getting paid 8 hours now when we are in from 7am until 8pm (like I am tomorrow start and finish time, not including the commute to and from the depot) ,
We really have no life thanks to all this, coupled with the fact we only get about 9 to 11 hours gap between working so that the rest time is used for sleeping.
The absenteeism is a lie, what actually happened is a hape of drivers took the voluntary severance package, a hape of drivers left the job at their own will over these crap working conditions, we must've lost near 60 drivers out of Dublin alone recently from just leaving and hopefully I will be one soon if this isint changed and I secure a new job.
The place is such a depressing kip to work in now with taking abuse from the inspectors and up aswell as being treated like dirt from the public,
A few times now I've just been tempted to take the keys out and walk away home mid route from some of the things that have been said to me it's that bad.
But yet we are the ones getting the blame for everything, like we made these decisions or implemented the new NX route without hiring drivers
We did not want to go on strike on indefinite terms, the worst think the poxy clowns did, lose 3 weeks wages, lose customers and piss everyone off, it was a poxy joke.
There is a strong belief among drivers that unions and management are in this together and we're all annoyed too, trying to either put us down and get rid of us or just playing with us altogether to see how far we go, but it's gotten stupid now at this stage and personally I don't have much hope anymore,
and sorry to the thousands of people that do not have access to private companies or rural transport (yes lads they are out there in their thousands who only have bus Eireann for a bus) but sadly you will be left without a bus soon for definite, thanks to the fine Gael government that just wants to privatise all buses and trains and do us out of the job like we are scum for some reason.
But I hope Regina Doherty is happy and has a lot to answer for when she supported a company decision to put over 3 thousand people on the social welfare , and I hope enda is happy on about 3 pensions in mayo when his family and friends and neighbors have no bus in mayo anymore from local, commuter and expressway.
Anne Graham of the NTA who gets paid the same amount of money as the Taoiseach of this country for no where near the same amount of work, happy to watch the working person suffer and give our work to private companies for their own greed.
Shane Ross as the minister for transport who supports the government in privatisation , who hasn't done much for transport but says he is giving more for this and that is more interested in avoiding transport issues, more interested in sport ,
And the public who fell for all this and agree , that when I'm trying to make my way home from work at night after a long day, when you have the handy Monday to Friday, 9 to 5 job and are having drinks with friends on a weekend, shout abuse at me in the street calling me a prick and saying they hope they do shut down and privatise us
I hope they all sleep well at night in comfort they are all safe and financially secure while about 3 thousands of us fear and stress and lose sleep not knowing if one day we won't have a job to go into or a weeks wages to come home with.
(All above happened to me)0 -
I reckon if a strike does happen it'll be the end of BÉ as we know it. There can't be an expectation to not deliver on productivity when earning twice as much as median wage.0
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Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »I don't want to go on strike again
I don't want to lose more money, I don't want the place to shut down resulting in thousands of jobs lost and also don't want people to get more pissed off at us
It has been a night mare since the last strike, people have been pissed off at us and still not forgiving us, people are ungodly rude to us, speak down to us like we are nothing, like sh!t , spit on us, call us abusive names and all sorts
And for what ? Us trying to do a job, us accepting a deal to help out the company when all others got pay rises and we got cuts.
All we want to do is our job but we can't be gone from the home for over 12 hours a day working for crap like the above and only getting paid 8 hours now when we are in from 7am until 8pm (like I am tomorrow start and finish time, not including the commute to and from the depot) ,
We really have no life thanks to all this, coupled with the fact we only get about 9 to 11 hours gap between working so that the rest time is used for sleeping.
The absenteeism is a lie, what actually happened is a hape of drivers took the voluntary severance package, a hape of drivers left the job at their own will over these crap working conditions, we must've lost near 60 drivers out of Dublin alone recently from just leaving and hopefully I will be one soon if this isint changed and I secure a new job.
The place is such a depressing kip to work in now with taking abuse from the inspectors and up aswell as being treated like dirt from the public,
A few times now I've just been tempted to take the keys out and walk away home mid route from some of the things that have been said to me it's that bad.
But yet we are the ones getting the blame for everything, like we made these decisions or implemented the new NX route without hiring drivers
We did not want to go on strike on indefinite terms, the worst think the poxy clowns did, lose 3 weeks wages, lose customers and piss everyone off, it was a poxy joke.
There is a strong belief among drivers that unions and management are in this together and we're all annoyed too, trying to either put us down and get rid of us or just playing with us altogether to see how far we go, but it's gotten stupid now at this stage and personally I don't have much hope anymore,
and sorry to the thousands of people that do not have access to private companies or rural transport (yes lads they are out there in their thousands who only have bus Eireann for a bus) but sadly you will be left without a bus soon for definite, thanks to the fine Gael government that just wants to privatise all buses and trains and do us out of the job like we are scum for some reason.
But I hope Regina Doherty is happy and has a lot to answer for when she supported a company decision to put over 3 thousand people on the social welfare , and I hope enda is happy on about 3 pensions in mayo when his family and friends and neighbors have no bus in mayo anymore from local, commuter and expressway.
Anne Graham of the NTA who gets paid the same amount of money as the Taoiseach of this country for no where near the same amount of work, happy to watch the working person suffer and give our work to private companies for their own greed.
Shane Ross as the minister for transport who supports the government in privatisation , who hasn't done much for transport but says he is giving more for this and that is more interested in avoiding transport issues, more interested in sport ,
And the public who fell for all this and agree , that when I'm trying to make my way home from work at night after a long day, when you have the handy Monday to Friday, 9 to 5 job and are having drinks with friends on a weekend, shout abuse at me in the street calling me a prick and saying they hope they do shut down and privatise us
I hope they all sleep well at night in comfort they are all safe and financially secure while about 3 thousands of us fear and stress and lose sleep not knowing if one day we won't have a job to go into or a weeks wages to come home with.
(All above happened to me)
A lot to take in there. Do you work 12 hours everyday. I thought the roster was split into a fortnight, so that you do your 80 hours or whatever it is over this timeframe, with no more premium payments for weekend work.0 -
Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »I don't want to go on strike again
I don't want to lose more money, I don't want the place to shut down resulting in thousands of jobs lost and also don't want people to get more pissed off at us
It has been a night mare since the last strike, people have been pissed off at us and still not forgiving us, people are ungodly rude to us, speak down to us like we are nothing, like sh!t , spit on us, call us abusive names and all sorts
And for what ? Us trying to do a job, us accepting a deal to help out the company when all others got pay rises and we got cuts.
All we want to do is our job but we can't be gone from the home for over 12 hours a day working for crap like the above and only getting paid 8 hours now when we are in from 7am until 8pm (like I am tomorrow start and finish time, not including the commute to and from the depot) ,
We really have no life thanks to all this, coupled with the fact we only get about 9 to 11 hours gap between working so that the rest time is used for sleeping.
The absenteeism is a lie, what actually happened is a hape of drivers took the voluntary severance package, a hape of drivers left the job at their own will over these crap working conditions, we must've lost near 60 drivers out of Dublin alone recently from just leaving and hopefully I will be one soon if this isint changed and I secure a new job.
The place is such a depressing kip to work in now with taking abuse from the inspectors and up aswell as being treated like dirt from the public,
A few times now I've just been tempted to take the keys out and walk away home mid route from some of the things that have been said to me it's that bad.
But yet we are the ones getting the blame for everything, like we made these decisions or implemented the new NX route without hiring drivers
We did not want to go on strike on indefinite terms, the worst think the poxy clowns did, lose 3 weeks wages, lose customers and piss everyone off, it was a poxy joke.
There is a strong belief among drivers that unions and management are in this together and we're all annoyed too, trying to either put us down and get rid of us or just playing with us altogether to see how far we go, but it's gotten stupid now at this stage and personally I don't have much hope anymore,
and sorry to the thousands of people that do not have access to private companies or rural transport (yes lads they are out there in their thousands who only have bus Eireann for a bus) but sadly you will be left without a bus soon for definite, thanks to the fine Gael government that just wants to privatise all buses and trains and do us out of the job like we are scum for some reason.
But I hope Regina Doherty is happy and has a lot to answer for when she supported a company decision to put over 3 thousand people on the social welfare , and I hope enda is happy on about 3 pensions in mayo when his family and friends and neighbors have no bus in mayo anymore from local, commuter and expressway.
Anne Graham of the NTA who gets paid the same amount of money as the Taoiseach of this country for no where near the same amount of work, happy to watch the working person suffer and give our work to private companies for their own greed.
Shane Ross as the minister for transport who supports the government in privatisation , who hasn't done much for transport but says he is giving more for this and that is more interested in avoiding transport issues, more interested in sport ,
And the public who fell for all this and agree , that when I'm trying to make my way home from work at night after a long day, when you have the handy Monday to Friday, 9 to 5 job and are having drinks with friends on a weekend, shout abuse at me in the street calling me a prick and saying they hope they do shut down and privatise us
I hope they all sleep well at night in comfort they are all safe and financially secure while about 3 thousands of us fear and stress and lose sleep not knowing if one day we won't have a job to go into or a weeks wages to come home with.
(All above happened to me)
i'm so very sorry for your situation and that of your fellow workers.
all you did was withdraw your labour, something anyone is entitled to do. i know you didn't want to have to do it but i completely understand you had no choice as the company would not talk.
the members of the public throwing abuse at you are nothing but vermin and that is me being polite on that description in this case.
they are the type who if i'm honest, would deserve to have no bus service, but unfortunately if they have none, others who don't abuse you would suffer, which wouldn't be fair.
i agree with you on your statements about ross and company.I reckon if a strike does happen it'll be the end of BÉ as we know it. There can't be an expectation to not deliver on productivity when earning twice as much as median wage.
to be fair, you can't expect the staff to stand for measures simply being pushed through when the agreement says they need to be discussed between all parties and agreed upon. it was pushing through things without insuring there were no issues that caused the last round of strike action. the management obviously haven't learned the lesson. another strike may very much be the end of be as we know it but it won't be prity when people are left without a bus service altogether for an unknown period of time. at least with a strike people know how long it will be before service resumes.ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.
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A lot to take in there. Do you work 12 hours everyday. I thought the roster was split into a fortnight, so that you do your 80 hours or whatever it is over this timeframe, with no more premium payments for weekend work.
I get a text message about 12 - 2pm during the day to tell me what I'm working the following day, so I have a history of all work in my phone, I can't screenshot them because they contain personal information about me
But my last 20 shifts that I did , 16 of them were 11hour 30mins and longer (up to 13 hours)
Of the four shifts that weren't 12 hours long, they were ONLY 9 hours long, 7 hour 50mins being the shortest.
End of the road, thanks for the kind words, much appreciated.0 -
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Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »I don't want to go on strike again
Mad idea. How about you don't? Don't want the public to turn against you, stop preventing them from getting to work. Do your job.Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »But yet we are the ones getting the blame for everything, like we made these decisions or implemented the new NX route without hiring drivers
And of course the unofficial strike action with the absentee rate increased massively has nothing to do with it eh? All management's fault again sure.Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »and sorry to the thousands of people that do not have access to private companies or rural transport (yes lads they are out there in their thousands who only have bus Eireann for a bus) but sadly you will be left without a bus soon for definite, thanks to the fine Gael government that just wants to privatise all buses and trains and do us out of the job like we are scum for some reason.
But I hope Regina Doherty is happy and has a lot to answer for when she supported a company decision to put over 3 thousand people on the social welfare , and I hope enda is happy on about 3 pensions in mayo when his family and friends and neighbors have no bus in mayo anymore from local, commuter and expressway.
The reason Fine Gael, and others, are looking to diversify the transport market is to reduce the dependence on one operator like yours who's unions decide to cause misery for the travelling public. The more competition for me getting to work the better. If BE is on strike I can walk across the river to get an AirCoach, or Dublin Coach, or CityLink. The more BE is broken up & PSO routes contracted out the better.0 -
Mad idea. How about you don't? Don't want the public to turn against you, stop preventing them from getting to work. Do your job.
he is doing his job. as are all bus eireann drivers.
the public have no right to abuse anyone. your victim blaming is shameful. how about the public stop abusing people for doing something they are entitled to do. while people don't have to agree with it, they have no right to disrespect people for withdrawing their labour, when those same members of the public could do it if they wanted.And of course the unofficial strike action with the absentee rate increased massively has nothing to do with it eh? All management's fault again sure.
there was no such action. as he said, a number of drivers took redundantsies and left.The reason Fine Gael, and others, are looking to diversify the transport market is to reduce the dependence on one operator like yours who's unions decide to cause misery for the travelling public.
no it's to try and degrade the terms and conditions of workers, and to remove accountability from themselves. at greater over all cost to the tax payer, as profit making businesses will expect to be paid and make a healthy profit. the unions will still be able to bring things to a stand still if they need to to insure the interests of their members are upheld, as they will deal with issues across all companies at the same time, meaning an all-out strike can and will still happen. the small amount of subsidized routes we have mean 1 company is the most cost effective. a market is only viable on profitible intercity routes, the rest of the routes are not a bus market and a bus market would lead to only one outcome.The more competition for me getting to work the better. If BE is on strike I can walk across the river to get an AirCoach, or Dublin Coach, or CityLink.
there will be no competition on the vast majority of subsidized routes as it's not financially viable. there may be the odd bit of over-lap of routes but that will be by accident.The more BE is broken up & PSO routes contracted out the better.
not the better at all, as duplication brings huge wastage and costs. all for nothing in return.
1 state company which is mostly non-profit, verses multiple companies who are profit making and who will require payment and to make a healthy profit on the most loss making of routes. waste of time over a day strike.ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.
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end of the road wrote: »he is doing his job. as are all bus eireann drivers.
the public have no right to abuse anyone. your victim blaming is shameful. how about the public stop abusing people for doing something they are entitled to do. while people don't have to agree with it, they have no right to disrespect people for withdrawing their labour, when those same members of the public could do it if they wanted.
Where did I say I supported abuse of anyone? I'm talking about public support. Please read a post before responding to it.
The public, any person for that matter, reserves the right to have an opinion on 'withdrawal of labour', especially when this action causes themselves to be without a days pay, lose an important appointment etc.end of the road wrote: »
no it's to try and degrade the terms and conditions of workers, and to remove accountability from themselves. at greater over all cost to the tax payer, as profit making businesses will expect to be paid and make a healthy profit. the unions will still be able to bring things to a stand still if they need to to insure the interests of their members are upheld, as they will deal with issues across all companies at the same time, meaning an all-out strike can and will still happen. the small amount of subsidized routes we have mean 1 company is the most cost effective. a market is only viable on profitible intercity routes, the rest of the routes are not a bus market and a bus market would lead to only one outcome.
there will be no competition on the vast majority of subsidized routes as it's not financially viable. there may be the odd bit of over-lap of routes but that will be by accident.
not the better at all, as duplication brings huge wastage and costs. all for nothing in return.
1 state company which is mostly non-profit, verses multiple companies who are profit making and who will require payment and to make a healthy profit on the most loss making of routes. waste of time over a day strike.
Again, please do try to read why I post. Contract out PSO routes to private operators. The competition is in the contracting. Not the running of the route. The free market has given us some healthy competition on the inter-urban routes, to which BE couldn't compete anymore. A bloated company, relic of an era where they had the monopoly.
BE, if it is still around in a few years, can tender for routes just as any other company can.0 -
Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »I get a text message about 12 - 2pm during the day to tell me what I'm working the following day, so I have a history of all work in my phone, I can't screenshot them because they contain personal information about me
But my last 20 shifts that I did , 16 of them were 11hour 30mins and longer (up to 13 hours)
Of the four shifts that weren't 12 hours long, they were ONLY 9 hours long, 7 hour 50mins being the shortest.
End of the road, thanks for the kind words, much appreciated.
Surely you aren't driving for 11 hours and 30 minutes or longer?
My OH is a nurse doing 13 hour shifts. Your clock watching has no comparison to what she has to say about her 13 hours.0 -
Where did I say I supported abuse of anyone? I'm talking about public support. Please read a post before responding to it.
i read the post, public support while nice means jot in a strike. it has never solved a dispute. there is no excuse for the abuse bus eireann drivers receive. you effectively implied that you condone such abuse in my view.The public, any person for that matter, reserves the right to have an opinion on 'withdrawal of labour', especially when this action causes themselves to be without a days pay, lose an important appointment etc.
they get notice. i knew plenty of people effected by the strike, however they would never under any circumstances abuse staff, in fact while a couple of them didn't support the strike, they completely understood that the staff felt they had no other option.Again, please do try to read why I post. Contract out PSO routes to private operators. The competition is in the contracting. Not the running of the route. The free market has given us some healthy competition on the inter-urban routes, to which BE couldn't compete anymore. A bloated company, relic of an era where they had the monopoly.
BE, if it is still around in a few years, can tender for routes just as any other company can.
contracting out to private operators is not financially viable in my view, as they have to make a profit, duplication usually brings greater cost, and there will never be anywhere enough small operators who would be willing to run for a few quid. contracting is not competition, the only competition is where the user actually benefits, IE from multiple operators on the same route. 1 operator bidding a bit less, to a regulated offering is not competition. be can more than compete, in fact they do on most of their expressway routes, however, they are effectively guilt tripped into continuing to serve towns via a couple of their expressway services. the free market only gave competition on the inter-urban routes because they are financially viable, the subsidized routes aren't, so can't have competition, the free market would require those routes to be withdrawn du to non-viability. be is not a bloated company, 30/40 years ago maybe but definitely not now.
be, if it is still around are the best option to run the routes as it keeps over-all costs low, it is not the job of the tax payer to subsidize private industry.jimmycrackcorm wrote: »Surely you aren't driving for 11 hours and 30 minutes or longer?
My OH is a nurse doing 13 hour shifts. Your clock watching has no comparison to what she has to say about her 13 hours.
it has a somewhat similar comparison. a driver who can be driving long distances on a regular basis needs to be hugely rested.ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.
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jimmycrackcorm wrote: »Surely you aren't driving for 11 hours and 30 minutes or longer?
My OH is a nurse doing 13 hour shifts. Your clock watching has no comparison to what she has to say about her 13 hours.
Noone should be working those hours constantly in the first place they're unhealty unsafe and in some circumstances illegal. Petty point scoring is meaningless on this as both roles shouldnt be working that long to begin with.0 -
All we want to do is our job but we can't be gone from the home for over 12 hours a day working for crap like the above and only getting paid 8 hours now when we are in from 7am until 8pm (like I am tomorrow start and finish time, not including the commute to and from the depot) ,
We really have no life thanks to all this, coupled with the fact we only get about 9 to 11 hours gap between working so that the rest time is used for sleeping.
Here a shocking thought, if you hate your job that much then quit and get a 9-5 job. Plenty of people have it much worse than bus drivers, lots doing 12 hour shifts and not coming out with anything close to a BE driver salary.
You can cry and moan all you want on the internet but you won't find much sympathy apart from other drivers. Or, you can stop crying and find a new job. No one is forcing you to drive a bus and that have no life, that is a choice you are making.
Since the strike BE services have been awful, buses not showing up, busesr
arriving over an hour late. Drivers refusing to stop at bus stops full of people, drivers refusing to get off their holes to put out the disable ramp. Saw that happen quite a bit lately as according to a driver "it's not his job". There was also an incident during the past week where a driver in Galway was reported to the guards for pushing a passenger out of a bus and hurting them badly as the driver did not believe that the passengers child had special needs. People see this carry on and it's why they have so little respect for drivers. Respect is earned and BE drivers have done nothing to earn it. When I asked a driver recently why the bus was an hour late, he replied screaming "why don't you **** yourself" followed by "cu*t". I was polite and not aggressive and just curious as to why it was late.
Take a look at the BE twitter, its thousands and thousands upon tweets replying to issues people are having. People are fed up of drivers being rude and disrespectful and then crying poor mouth at every chance.
As I said Koppenberg, why not find a job that suits you better instead of complaining on boards? Plenty of 9-5 jobs out there, but I suppose the 9-5 salary would be a huge cut in pay to a BE driver.0 -
jimmycrackcorm wrote: »Surely you aren't driving for 11 hours and 30 minutes or longer?
My OH is a nurse doing 13 hour shifts. Your clock watching has no comparison to what she has to say about her 13 hours.
Just a question about nurses are they too scared to go on strike or something.
It seems nurses are way too reluctant to go on strike to seek better pay and conditions while transport workers will with less than a moments notice why is that? Maybe its because nursing is a female dominated industry while most transport are male its just a guess not trying to be sexist or anything.0 -
Nurses care about the people who would be affected by their strike action, someone could die as a result. Bus Eireann staff don't give a toss about you or me.Just a question about nurses are they too scared to go on strike or something.
It seems nurses are way too reluctant to go on strike to seek better pay and conditions while transport workers will with less than a moments notice why is that? Maybe its because nursing is a female dominated industry while most transport are male its just a guess not trying to be sexist or anything.0 -
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Nurses care about the people who would be affected by their strike action, someone could die as a result. Bus Eireann staff don't give a toss about you or me.
People don't die when the transport unions end up striking, nurses on the other hand are afraid of people dying because they're striking for better pay and more reasonable hours and the HSE and that exploit them to the fullest because of it. It's disgusting and I wish that would change but sadly not soon enough. As for BE staff not caring thats just a base assumption.0
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