Go-Ahead Dublin City Routes - Updates and Discussion

antoinolachtnai

GM228 wrote: »

I work it out as:-

840km per day x 364 = 305,760 annual km x 3 = 917,280 contract km, divided by €749,227 = €1.22 per km + vat = €1.50 per km approximately.

Public transport contracts are subject to VAT?

1.50 is about a third of the BE operating costs (360 million euros to operate 80 million km last year)

GM228

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

Public transport contracts are subject to VAT?

Open to correction, but I believe so, there is an option to exempt the provision of equipment etc related to passenger carriage under the VAT Directive, but we only took the option of exempting transport of passengers and their accompanying baggage and not the supply of such under the Value-Added Tax Consolidation Act 2010.

If not then the cost per km is even lower at €1.22.

antoinolachtnai

Contract for the transport of passengers, so VAT exempt as far as I know.

You can claim back VAT on tour buses. But not on a vehicle you buy for public transport.

https://www.revenue.ie/en/vat/vat-rates/search-vat-rates/B/bus.aspx

https://www.revenue.ie/en/vat/vat-rates/search-vat-rates/T/transport-of-passengers-bus-services-exemptions-by-derogation-in-accordance-with-articl-.aspx

https://www.revenue.ie/en/vat/vat-rates/search-vat-rates/T/transport-of-passengers-exemptions-by-derogation-in-accordance-with-articl-.aspx

It is possible they are treating it as a 'hire' contract, but I don't think that would really sound right (since it is the service of transportation that is being purchased and not merely access to the vehicle)

antoinolachtnai

GM228 wrote: »

I work it out as:-

840km per day x 364 = 305,760 annual km x 3 = 917,280 contract km, divided by €749,227 = €1.22 per km + vat = €1.50 per km approximately.

Your calculation looks more correct the my first attempt, but surely it should be €749,227/917,280km rather than the other way around?

GM228

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

Your calculation looks more correct the my first attempt, but surely it should be €749,227/917,280km rather than the other way around?

Your right, which makes it even cheaper at €0.81 per km.

antoinolachtnai

There is no way that that is not a major line in the sand for Bus Eireann.

dublinbuster

brokenarms wrote: »

Drivers out on the sick for literally years and their marked in position kept for them.

.

that has changed, the positions are up for marking in now

GM228

Bit late on reporting from the media I think considering GA announced recruitment some time ago.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2018/0607/968783-go-ahead-ireland/

http://www.thejournal.ie/go-ahead-ireland-jobs-4057205-Jun2018/

Contrails

GM228 wrote: »

Bit late on reporting from the media I think considering GA announced recruitment some time ago.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2018/0607/968783-go-ahead-ireland/

http://www.thejournal.ie/go-ahead-ireland-jobs-4057205-Jun2018/

It's being reported now because GoAhead are putting on a show. And they're making a show of it because they're not getting the volume and quality of applicants they'd like.

bk

Contrails wrote: »

It's being reported now because GoAhead are putting on a show. And they're making a show of it because they're not getting the volume and quality of applicants they'd like.

It could also be a case that now is the right time to start hiring the bulk of drivers. After all, it doesn't make sense to hire lots of drivers 6 months ahead of you actually starting driving. 3 to 4 months before sounds about right, for training, etc.

Stephen15

bk wrote: »

It could also be a case that now is the right time to start hiring the bulk of drivers. After all, it doesn't make sense to hire lots of drivers 6 months ahead of you actually starting driving. 3 to 4 months before sounds about right, for training, etc.

Apparently they don't mind now if you have up to 6 penalty points on your licence. They are desparate for staff.

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

Stephen15 wrote: »

Apparently they don't mind now if you have up to 6 penalty points on your licence. They are desparate for staff.

Cooooll

So all the 21/24 year old boy racers will be in with their car licences because they think it's a handy job, get a bus licence out of them and make a bollox of it


Good oul deco around the corner who drivers a suped up glanza (but has it insured under his grandmother as an unmodified starlet) will be driving you to and from work / shops etc in a bus ?

Good luck lad !

GM228

Stephen15 wrote: »

Apparently they don't mind now if you have up to 6 penalty points on your licence.

Indeed.

https://www.go-aheaddublin.ie/bus-driver/application-notes/

Points to consider when making your application

You must have no more than six penalty points on your licence.

Dr Brown

Its a sad day for Dublin Bus.

I hope they resist privatization.

Dr Brown

dublinbuster wrote: »

On Go Ahead web site, earn wages up to 32k
DB have 6 year pay scale.
Dont think it unreasonable to think Go Ahead will be similar
So just a guess, start at 26k and go up 1k per year

Less than DB/BE and Aircoach?

I'd imagine go ahead will probably take on a lot of non-national drivers to keep costs down.

punisher5112

Dr Brown wrote: »

I'd imagine go ahead will probably take on a lot of non-national drivers to keep costs down.

That's exactly what will happen and I wouldn't be surprised if they were put up in housing with many others.

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

Dr Brown wrote: »

I'd imagine go ahead will probably take on a lot of non-national drivers to keep costs down.

It's better again

We have it confirmed, people on the dole long term are being sent to go ahead for jobs because they are providing training for them.

So Gazzer on the scratch will take a job with go ahead and go out and keep causing accidents so they sack him and go on the sick....

Or keep failing the test on purpose

punisher5112

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »

It's better again

We have it confirmed, people on the dole long term are being sent to go ahead for jobs because they are providing training for them.

So Gazzer on the scratch will take a job with go ahead and go out and keep causing accidents so they sack him and go on the sick....

Or keep failing the test on purpose

I crash all the time well not technically me it's just others tend to bounce off the bus.

It brings me back to the recession when people hated us drivers as we had a job and as these scrounging scum bags would say they would do the job for half what we on. The funny thing is they couldn't get anyone to do it for half.

Laugh when I think back.

Dravokivich

Dr Brown wrote: »

I'd imagine go ahead will probably take on a lot of non-national drivers to keep costs down.

Huh? That'd be discrimination to target lower wages based on nationality, no?

CeilingFly

Finally a company not beset by unionisation and the ridiculous overpayment to drivers like Dublin Bus / Bus Eireann / Irish Rail who take the absolute p1ss in terms of screwing the fare paying passengers.

Reasonable basic salary + plenty of opportunity for overtime.


I'll assume that they'll do heath checks on their drivers - so that they don't suffer the mandatory average 4 weeks of paid sick leave a year just like Dublin bus?

markodaly

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »

It's better again

We have it confirmed, people on the dole long term are being sent to go ahead for jobs because they are providing training for them.

So Gazzer on the scratch will take a job with go ahead and go out and keep causing accidents so they sack him and go on the sick....

Or keep failing the test on purpose

Or maybe it will give someone a leg up, to improve their lot and get themselves a job. You know, what most normal people do.

For people who seem to care about DB and their own (NRBU & SIPTU lads), you sure love to hate those just a rung below you on the social ladder.

punisher5112

CeilingFly wrote: »

Finally a company not beset by unionisation and the ridiculous overpayment to drivers like Dublin Bus / Bus Eireann / Irish Rail who take the absolute p1ss in terms of screwing the fare paying passengers.

Reasonable basic salary + plenty of opportunity for overtime.


I'll assume that they'll do heath checks on their drivers - so that they don't suffer the mandatory average 4 weeks of paid sick leave a year just like Dublin bus?

You need to educate yourself a little better there.

The NTA has all the control.

The NTA control prices and route frequency.

If an extra bus is needed they need to approve.

This whole process will cost more in the end.

Contrails

CeilingFly wrote: »

Finally a company not beset by unionisation and the ridiculous overpayment to drivers like Dublin Bus / Bus Eireann / Irish Rail who take the absolute p1ss in terms of screwing the fare paying passengers.

Reasonable basic salary + plenty of opportunity for overtime.


I'll assume that they'll do heath checks on their drivers - so that they don't suffer the mandatory average 4 weeks of paid sick leave a year just like Dublin bus?

GoAhead will look after their shareholders, not you or I. The lower driver salaries will also have zero impact on your bus fare as it's NTA set. So more profit for shareholders.

Also entirely disagree with your overpayment remark. 40k seems reasonable for the shift patterns/ split shifts, level of responsibility, training. Everyone on a bus these days is a walking lawsuit. There's more on a driver's shoulders than you'd think.

And if you think drivers in GoAhead won't unionize and seek pay parity, you're having a laugh. Just look at transdev for God sake.

(Disclosure: I do not work for any CIE affiliated company, just an interested passenger)

GM228

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »

It's better again

We have it confirmed, people on the dole long term are being sent to go ahead for jobs because they are providing training for them.

Are you talking about the JobsPlus scheme? GA are not eligible for the scheme.

GM228

punisher5112 wrote: »

This whole process will cost more in the end.

Another baseless "fact".

GM228

Contrails wrote: »

And if you think drivers in GoAhead won't unionize and seek pay parity, you're having a laugh. Just look at transdev for God sake.

GA may not even recognise unions.

Xterminator

punisher5112 wrote: »

You need to educate yourself a little better there.

This whole process will cost more in the end.

no, your completely wrong.

companies like transdev come in, create a lean operation that can operate the service without the management heavy, overly unionised workforce.

This cost saving is passed onto the taxpayer via a smaller subvention, and to a lesser extend the fare paying public by not needed inflation busting fare increases every year to cover spiralling costs.

In addition you are likely to get a service run for the convenience of the customer with targets published on quality of service provided etc.

punisher5112

Xterminator wrote: »

no, your completely wrong.

companies like transdev come in, create a lean operation that can operate the service without the management heavy, overly unionised workforce.

This cost saving is passed onto the taxpayer via a smaller subvention, and to a lesser extend the fare paying public by not needed inflation busting fare increases every year to cover spiralling costs.

In addition you are likely to get a service run for the convenience of the customer with targets published on quality of service provided etc.

But they have huge management and likes of share holders and tram driver wages are huge.

They also are in a union.

These companies come in cut everything to the Bone and some and all it will do is create jobs which no one could live off as wages are so poor.

They are about profit nothing else.

I think the announcement of the jobs today is to do with them being rebranded as go ahead ireland instead of going ahead dublin. This is to do with them operating the bus eireann routes in the next few months. They will struggle to get and keep drivers but only partly due to wages, every bus company is facing the same challenge even bus eireann has a high turn over rate. With building work booming again guys are going for big money working on sites etc but personally I'd rather tip away slow and steady in a secure job.

TallGlass

I would have gone for it as I previously said before if it was starting 33/35k -45k more reasonable long term.

Anyone joing on 24k isn't there for the long haul IMO, short stop. Might save a bit but with constant retraining and how many hours lost on routes.