Are Saorview ever going to add more channels?

The Cush

Sam Russell wrote: »

We do not have the same regime as the UK. We have excess bandwidth on Saorview so we should use it. Also, if all channels increased bandwidth by say 25%, then we would still excess bandwidth, but the transmission charges would remain as is.

The point I was making was even in the UK they are removing the minimum resolution requirements for the main SD channels.

Carawaystick

lertsnim wrote: »

Why do so many people watch freely available tv channels? That's a real head scratcher.

there's no freely available tv channels, its a 160 minimum:cool:

As for people thinking an irish language tv station should provide english content...
All you need to know are Úd and Clibirt

Plus why are performing groups getting paid so much, or at all?

lertsnim

Carawaystick wrote: »

there's no freely available tv channels, its a 160 minimum:cool:

Pedantic. How nice.

dxhound2005

Thurston? wrote: »

The limit is always financial. You're conflating 2 completely different issues anyway, signal quality & resolution. Analogue resolution depended on bandwidth too, I assume you realise.

I think some of the discussion ignores the lack of finance. The freeze on the licence fee is coming up on 10 years. I gave some consideration to the options to raise more money.

1. Increase the licence fee every year or so like it was before 2008.

2. Replace the licence fee with a Broadcasting Charge.

3. Fund the system from general taxation.

4. Get increased advertising revenue.

5. Cut wages in RTE by 50%.

6. Privatise or move to Pay per View.

7. Do away with free licences.

8. Continue with the current licence fee and increase the borrowing to plug the financial gap.

Of all these options, the only one which I think will be acceptable in the country is number 8 and that will only keep things as they are.

Sam Russell

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I think some of the discussion ignores the lack of finance. The freeze on the licence fee is coming up on 10 years. I gave some consideration to the options to raise more money.

1. Increase the licence fee every year or so like it was before 2008.

2. Replace the licence fee with a Broadcasting Charge.

3. Fund the system from general taxation.

4. Get increased advertising revenue.

5. Cut wages in RTE by 50%.

6. Privatise or move to Pay per View.

7. Do away with free licences.

8. Continue with the current licence fee and increase the borrowing to plug the financial gap.

Of all these options, the only one which I think will be acceptable in the country is number 8 and that will only keep things as they are.

You missed one.

Charge payTV platforms for re-transmission rights. BBC already do
this, so why not RTE, TG4 and TV3? €1 per month per account would raise, maybe, €10 m per year.

Broadcasting charge would eliminate the non-payers, which if reflected in a reduction in the overall fee to say €140, it might not be that unpopular - at least with the payers. It might be possible to introduce a tiny levy on, say, text messages which might raise €10m or so - perhaps amounting to €5 - €10 per phone per year (averaged - depending on the text activity).

Getting increased advertising revenue requires either an increased advertising pot, or taking more of that pot. Reducing the allowed advertising minutes would not go down well with at least one TV company, and increasing RTE's available minutes would also not go down well with any of them. Of course, making it difficult for off-shore TV channels get Irish advertising revenue might be a help.

The problem with the national TV broadcaster being funded from general taxation would result in significant political interference, at least from one or other political party.

So overall, anything would be unpopular and the can will get kicked down the road. The minister could start by forcing the Saorview broadcasters to go HD, at least we would get a decent picture - shame about the content.

dxhound2005

I already posted earlier that Sky etc would drop RTE if they had to pay. So that was a non starter for my list. I can only go by their stated positions reiterated this week at the Dail Committee.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/media-and-marketing/sky-threatens-to-drop-rt%C3%A9-if-channels-are-not-offered-for-free-1.3243269

Gerry Wicklow

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I already posted earlier that Sky etc would drop RTE if they had to pay. So that was a non starter for my list. I can only go by their stated positions reiterated this week at the Dail Committee.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/media-and-marketing/sky-threatens-to-drop-rt%C3%A9-if-channels-are-not-offered-for-free-1.3243269

Well there's a surprise. The pay operators don't want to pay RTÉ :rolleyes:

Johnboy1951

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I already posted earlier that Sky etc would drop RTE if they had to pay. So that was a non starter for my list. I can only go by their stated positions reiterated this week at the Dail Committee.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/media-and-marketing/sky-threatens-to-drop-rt%C3%A9-if-channels-are-not-offered-for-free-1.3243269

That might well wake up many of Sky's customers in Ireland that they are paying for what they can receive without any sub.
I would reckon that Sky would be a big loser in Ireland if they dropped RTE channels.

I would like to see RTE given the freedom to negotiate the terms.

Mickey Mike

Does anybody know what's coming on Channel 27? Its a test card, Channel 15 has ceased. I read in some news article where TV3 will never go HD because of the high charge from RTE. I can't understand why 2rn run a HD test card now for 4 years.

Sam Russell

Mickey Mike wrote: »

Does anybody know what's coming on Channel 27? Its a test card, Channel 15 has ceased. I read in some news article where TV3 will never go HD because of the high charge from RTE. I can't understand why 2rn run a HD test card now for 4 years.

The reason for this is that ComReg and BAI have set up a schedule of charging that has tied 2RN's charging system to bandwidth used. Each channel gets charged for the bandwidth used, based on the total used. The total cost of running 2 muxes on Saorview is €12 m, which means if 40% of the bandwidth is wasted, it does not affect 2RN. What it does mean is that for a single channel to go HD means they take a larger share of the €12 m, which TV3/Virgin will not pay.

There are two possible solutions - either RTE move to mux 1, and let TV3 and TG4 pay the €6 m for mux 2 between them, or all channels have to go HD and share the €12 m between them. Either would have the result that all channels would go HD. At the moment, spare capacity is just burnt off.

Hope that explains the insanity that is tolerated on Saorview. Wasted bandwidth is just one problem.

STB.

Sam Russell wrote: »

The reason for this is that ComReg and BAI have set up a schedule of charging that has tied 2RN's charging system to bandwidth used. Each channel gets charged for the bandwidth used, based on the total used. The total cost of running 2 muxes on Saorview is €12 m, which means if 40% of the bandwidth is wasted, it does not affect 2RN. What it does mean is that for a single channel to go HD means they take a larger share of the €12 m, which TV3/Virgin will not pay.

There are two possible solutions - either RTE move to mux 1, and let TV3 and TG4 pay the €6 m for mux 2 between them, or all channels have to go HD and share the €12 m between them. Either would have the result that all channels would go HD. At the moment, spare capacity is just burnt off.

Hope that explains the insanity that is tolerated on Saorview. Wasted bandwidth is just one problem.

The tariff system is based on average bit rate consumption. And why TV3 dont really care that their stations looks crap. They are not committed to the platform whatsoever, other than fulfill the basic terms of their licence. Be FTA.

Capt'n Midnight

The wonderful thing is the bandwidth thing also affects SaorSat even though there aren't any commercial channels on it.

Or why else isn't TG4 in HD there ??? :mad::mad::mad:

https://www.lyngsat.com/Eutelsat-9B-and-Ka-Sat-9A.html

STB.

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

The wonderful thing is the bandwidth thing also affects SaorSat even though there aren't any commercial channels on it.

Or why else isn't TG4 in HD there ??? :mad::mad::mad:

https://www.lyngsat.com/Eutelsat-9B-and-Ka-Sat-9A.html

Dont know what the ins and outs of the DTH agreement with eutelsat but it could be on the basis for payment is bit rate usage. More bit rate required for HD. TG4 dont have the cash.

Mickey Mike

Mickey Mike wrote: »

Does anybody know what's coming on Channel 27? Its a test card, Channel 15 has ceased. I read in some news article where TV3 will never go HD because of the high charge from RTE. I can't understand why 2rn run a HD test card now for 4 years.

This is on my TV's epg (27) and not just one of those hidden test card channels. First time there has been something added to the epg in quite a while. Anything happening I wonder?

Capt'n Midnight

STB. wrote: »

Dont know what the ins and outs of the DTH agreement with eutelsat but it could be on the basis for payment is bit rate usage. More bit rate required for HD. TG4 dont have the cash.

I doubt that TG4 are dealing directly with TG4. also Saorsat has a full transponder to itself with all those test cards burning bandwidth.


At least I get to see some of the stuff in HD, when BBC NI show it on Freesat. :rolleyes:

Mickey Mike

[Deleted User] wrote: »

This is on my TV's epg (27) and not just one of those hidden test card channels. First time there has been something added to the epg in quite a while. Anything happening I wonder?

Ah now there we have it (ch27) another Saorview information channel! Is that the best they can do?

Harry Palmr

Those are mad numbers, are the saorview transmitters made of gold?

Capt'n Midnight

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Those are mad numbers, are the saorview transmitters made of gold?

No.

But they eat electricity.

Sam Russell

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

No.

But they eat electricity.

They would only save electricity if they shut down one of the muxes. With two muxes there is plenty of free capacity, enough for TV3 and TG4 to go HD. It is only the charging regime that has them SD (plus the reluctance of TV3 to pay out for HD).

Mickey Mike

I understand RTE are removing RTE NewsNow from Saorview in early 2019 and replaced with RTE2+1 if they get approval from the BAI.
So no increase in channels, just a little step backwards.

STB.

Sam Russell wrote: »

They would only save electricity if they shut down one of the muxes. With two muxes there is plenty of free capacity, enough for TV3 and TG4 to go HD. It is only the charging regime that has them SD (plus the reluctance of TV3 to pay out for HD).

Sam TV3 have no interest whatsoever in the Saorview platform other than to garner access to sports rights and protected sports rights pitches. They are rebranding and you will shortly see the emergence of a dedicated virgin sports channel. There's all kinds of rights floating around some of which will be FTA some which won't be.

TV3 could have handed back their PSB licence and applied for a content licence but they possibly wouldn't qualify for FTA sports pitching etc.

It's not rtes fault that the commercial operator wants to do the bare minimum to fulfill their PSB requirements.

Sam Russell

STB. wrote: »

It's not rtes fault that the commercial operator wants to do the bare minimum to fulfill their PSB requirements.

But the fault lies with the Dept, the BAI and COMreg.

There is nothing to stop 2RN being allowed to up the spec for SD to be 720 by 576i, obviously with Ministerial approval.

If RTE were given the rights to bring on their proposed RTE 3, an archive based channel, then we might see some competition with TV3, after all, TV3 are only broadcasting archive ITV content at the moment.

Mickey Mike

I think its now its high time for channel shake up, the rebranding of the TV3 group is not adding much variety. The purposed RTE3HD is what's needed, with the pending closure of RTE News Now in 2019 and replacing it with RTE2+1. We could do with a little more choice.

STB.

Sam Russell wrote: »

STB. wrote: »

It's not rtes fault that the commercial operator wants to do the bare minimum to fulfill their PSB requirements.

But the fault lies with the Dept, the BAI and COMreg.

There is nothing to stop 2RN being allowed to up the spec for SD to be 720 by 576i, obviously with Ministerial approval.

.

Your joking right ?

Acceptable Image formats and bit rates are set by the European Broadcasting Union. There's an even lower one than 544x576.

Furthermore it's reiterated in the minimum requirements of Saorview receivers. TV3 and tg4 would have 2rn before the commission if they started dictating Minimum standards outside of these!

It's up to the broadcasters to pick how Shiite they wish to look.

Atlantic Dawn

Mickey Mike wrote: »

I understand RTE are removing RTE NewsNow from Saorview in early 2019 and replaced with RTE2+1 if they get approval from the BAI.
So no increase in channels, just a little step backwards.

In the world of PVR and in RTE's case the fact they repeat almost all of their own RTE2 shows about 2 days later what the hell is the point of RTE2+1 it will have zero audience.

Mickey Mike

I forgot to mention Saorview have added a new radio channel "Radio Maria Ireland" epg 210. Isn't this exciting! Hope its a start, I'd like to see many other stations joining as well ie. Newstalk, Spirit Radio, 4fm and even Today FM.

lertsnim

4FM would be nice to cover the parts of the country where it's not on FM.

Former Former

Mickey Mike wrote: »

I think its now its high time for channel shake up, the rebranding of the TV3 group is not adding much variety. The purposed RTE3HD is what's needed, with the pending closure of RTE News Now in 2019 and replacing it with RTE2+1. We could do with a little more choice.

RTE barely have enough content for two channels, what would RTE3 actually show?

Harry Palmr

Mickey Mike wrote: »

I forgot to mention Saorview have added a new radio channel "Radio Maria Ireland" epg 210. Isn't this exciting! Hope its a start, I'd like to see many other stations joining as well ie. Newstalk, Spirit Radio, 4fm and even Today FM.

DOB Radio should be on saorview no question but given his line of thinking he'd probably refuse to allow it!

Mickey Mike

Former Former wrote: »

RTE barely have enough content for two channels, what would RTE3 actually show?

My thinking is for RTE Junior to run as it is now and the new RTE3 to take over at 7pm (same channel shared).
RTE3 can be a film or an archive channel, I'm sure they have a big library of martial of old shows and so on.