Broodmother wants more children

mariaalice

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

From the IT article:



Never ceases to amaze me how well-informed people like this are of their "rights".

Yes they can have as many kids as they want, but absolutely not should the State be expected to pickup the increasing tab indefinitely - especially as there's no mention of any struggles to get back into the workforce or education in the articles - it's all about their "rights" and "entitlements"

Social Welfare should be there in sufficient amounts for those who genuinely need it, but it should NOT become a substitute for work and a lifestyle choice as it apparently has here. I don't care what their background is either.. this applies universally in my eyes.. Irish, foreign, Traveller or whatever.

It would be interesting to know who took the judicial review for them and who is advising because you can be sure they are not doing this by themselves.

Kivaro

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

On Budget night the audience will be full of people complaining that social welfare increases weren't enough even though we are one of the most generous welfare systems in the world.

Yes, and how is that pushed out to the public on Budget Night?
RTE stacks up the audience in a way that is not representative of the country.
RTE's biased antics of stacking liberal and leftist "guests" in the audience are obvious to most (except for most Irish politicians but there's a quid pro quo going on there with RTE). The irony is that the people whom they are hanging out to dry (the tax payer) are the ones forced to pay the outrageous salaries of the RTE panelists/presenters.

VinLieger

end of the road wrote: »

you get public services. schools, hospitals, roads, and more. they aren't perfect by any stretch but we still get them, so to say we get nothing is a lie.
of course us tax payers have to pay for everything we use, we technically aren't in need of assistence as far as the system is concerned.

Yes because we are capable of living within our means and dont treat shagging and having children as a way of increasing your income.

Out of interest do you honestly think there are any houses on the social housing list that would be capable of adequately housing a family of 10?

Widdershins

I'm in favour of supporting people in bringing up their children but the fact that she keeps having more and more despite knowing she cannot provide for them and needs the state to do it for her is a sign of something wrong with her parenting abilities. I'd be ashamed to blatantly state I'd like even more than the gang she has and that I expect the state to pay for them. I think she's brazen. On the other hand I've rarely met a traveller woman who would admit to not wanting more children even though some of the girls I knew were secretly on the pill or implant. Not the case with her, clearly.

The Welfare State wasn't set up with people and situations like this in mind and not only does it make a mockery of it but she and others like her are undermining it and threatening it.

People who say 'if you think people on the dole are so much better off than workers, why don't you go on the dole?'' are forgetting that you can't claim it if you resign, and you really need a hard neck to milk the system like certain people do. Not only that but the scammers and schemers often seem to have money to tide them over while claims are processed. Honest people who are hard-up do not, so they might stick with a badly paid job but wonder why they bother.

end of the road

VinLieger wrote: »

Yes because we are capable of living within our means and dont treat shagging and having children as a way of increasing your income.

no it's because we aren't in need as far as the system is concerned. plenty of fellow members of our group however didn't live within their means which was one of the reasons for the recession.

VinLieger wrote: »

Out of interest do you honestly think there are any houses on the social housing list that would be capable of adequately housing a family of 10?

i don't work for the housing departments, so i wouldn't know. you will have to email, call or write to each one and ask them for yourself whether such houses are availible.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

end of the road wrote: »

no it's because we aren't in need as far as the system is concerned. plenty of fellow members of our group however didn't live within their means which was one of the reasons for the recession.



i don't work for the housing departments, so i wouldn't know. you will have to email, call or write to each one and ask them for yourself whether such houses are availible.

Are you for real? Not in need? Young parents going back to work with one salary going on childminding costs and one salary to live on with the hopes that they'll have more money and security once the kids start school. Or if you've worked your entire adult life and always contributed to the pot, you leave your job to set up your own business the social welfare would leave you starving. A friend of mine recently set up his own workshop and needed assistance from social welfare and they told him there wasn't a thing that he was entitled to, despite him having paid income tax/USC and prsi for the past 11 years. He was advised to deregister his business and come back with proof he was no longer working.
If you're self employed and something happens, the dole don't want to know.

But the more kids you have, the less you want to help yourself the more you're entitled to.

Will I Am Not

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

What do I get?

I have to pay for healthcare, if I've to go to the doctor it's 50 quid just to walk in the door.

The secondary roads are a joke, so scratch that as well for people living in rural areas, and even the quality of some of the primary roads leave a lot to be desired also.

I pay to have my refuse taken away, another thing the people you are rushing to defend don't have to worry about, sure they let it pile up until the council do it for free.

There's a traveller woman living on my road, never had any bother with her myself but paying for refuse collection is an alien concept to her and any other travellers I have encountered.

When we had bin tags in our area she used to steal them from the neighbours' bins. Ever since they have been done away with she empties her bin at the end of the green and burns it all, along with another traveller family from around the corner.
She would tell you herself you're a sucker for paying for that service.

end of the road

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Are you for real? Not in need? Young parents going back to work with one salary going on childminding costs and one salary to live on with the hopes that they'll have more money and security once the kids start school. Or if you've worked your entire adult life and always contributed to the pot, you leave your job to set up your own business the social welfare would leave you starving. A friend of mine recently set up his own workshop and needed assistance from social welfare and they told him there wasn't a thing that he was entitled to, despite him having paid income tax/USC and prsi for the past 11 years. He was advised to deregister his business and come back with proof he was no longer working.
If you're self employed and something happens, the dole don't want to know.

But the more kids you have, the less you want to help yourself the more you're entitled to.

yes as far as the system is concerned they aren't in need. you will have to take it up with the government, i don't make the rules. i'm just telling you how the system sees things.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

end of the road wrote: »

yes as far as the system is concerned they aren't in need. you will have to take it up with the government, i don't make the rules. i'm just telling you how the system sees things.

In the real world when people can't afford to eat because they're not earning enough because they have rent to pay expenses and can't afford bills/food. That's "in need"

VinLieger

end of the road wrote: »

no it's because we aren't in need as far as the system is concerned. plenty of fellow members of our group however didn't live within their means which was one of the reasons for the recession.

Well as far as the system is concerned they arent in need of being on a housing list anymore.

When did this thread become about the recession? Pathetic deflection from you, nowhere near up to your usual standard.

end of the road

VinLieger wrote: »

Well as far as the system is concerned they arent in need of being on a housing list anymore.

yes i agree. i never stated otherwise.

VinLieger wrote: »

When did this thread become about the recession? Pathetic deflection from you, nowhere near up to your usual standard.

yeah whateves init

the_syco

Widdershins wrote: »

People who say 'if you think people on the dole are so much better off than workers, why don't you go on the dole?'' are forgetting that you can't claim it if you resign, and you really need a hard neck to milk the system like certain people do. Not only that but the scammers and schemers often seem to have money to tide them over while claims are processed. Honest people who are hard-up do not, so they might stick with a badly paid job but wonder why they bother.

Agreed. Also, many people working (and those that are on the dole for only a few years) are quite often the people who want to work.

VinLieger wrote: »

Out of interest do you honestly think there are any houses on the social housing list that would be capable of adequately housing a family of 10?

Depends on the boy/girl split. Unless it's a 50:50 split, a 4 bedroom house may be enough. It depends. Some people just demand a bigger house, and when they don't get one, expand their family to try to force the corporation to give them one!

jmayo

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Are you for real? Not in need? Young parents going back to work with one salary going on childminding costs and one salary to live on with the hopes that they'll have more money and security once the kids start school. Or if you've worked your entire adult life and always contributed to the pot, you leave your job to set up your own business the social welfare would leave you starving. A friend of mine recently set up his own workshop and needed assistance from social welfare and they told him there wasn't a thing that he was entitled to, despite him having paid income tax/USC and prsi for the past 11 years. He was advised to deregister his business and come back with proof he was no longer working.
If you're self employed and something happens, the dole don't want to know.

But the more kids you have, the less you want to help yourself the more you're entitled to.

This is one of the most ridiculous and unfair things about the Irish welfare state.

if you are self employed and contributing all your life there can be nothing for you if you fall on hard times.
Yet the welfare careerist like the above mentioned family will leech not alone for their entire lifetime but for generations.

And the usual apologists like eotr will tell you tough, that is the way the system is, all the while excusing the aforementioned woman spewing out even more kids they cannot afford and that the taxpayers will have to rear.

It is a joke of a system and the only way it will really stop is when the economy totally collapses some day.
The madness didn't even abate when we had to get a bailout from the troika so unless we go totally bust nothing will truly change.

Wheeliebin30

jmayo wrote: »

This is one of the most ridiculous and unfair things about the Irish welfare state.

if you are self employed and contributing all your life there can be nothing for you if you fall on hard times.
Yet the welfare careerist like the above mentioned family will leech not alone for their entire lifetime but for generations.

And the usual apologists like eotr will tell you tough, that is the way the system is, all the while excusing the aforementioned woman spewing out even more kids they cannot afford and that the taxpayers will have to rear.

It is a joke of a system and the only way it will really stop is when the economy totally collapses some day.
The madness didn't even abate when we had to get a bailout from the troika so unless we go totally bust nothing will truly change.

Not forgetting the troika warned us to reform the welfare system.

Kivaro

jmayo wrote: »

And the usual apologists like eotr will tell you tough, that is the way the system is, all the while excusing the aforementioned woman spewing out even more kids they cannot afford and that the taxpayers will have to rear.

People should really stop responding/listening to people like that.
They continuously try to de-rail discussions by making outrageous and antagonising statements e.g. the poster mentioned above stated on another thread that a Danish girl being sexuality assaulted by migrants broke the law by trying to protect herself with pepper spray.

People like that do not live in the "real world" and will continue to push their liberal stances on social policies irrespective of those policies being obviously unfair/unrealistic/unworkable.

The 'ignore' feature is a handy one on boards.

kupus

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Not forgetting the troika warned us to reform the welfare system.

They also told us to reform the justice industry.

HAH!

Cute hoor paddy can't be having any of that sthuff going on round these here parts.

There is still money to be milked from taxpayers.

And all these little sprogs are going to turn out to be rocket scientists.

Like fcuk they are.

They are going to be cash cows, a returnable customer for life for some parasitic lawyer.

And the circle continues.

Duncanwooly

OldNotWIse wrote: »

I really take issue with terminology such as "stuck in the poverty trap" when it is clear as day that many of these people choose to be the way they are and are happy to adopt an a la carte approach to adulting. It doesn't pay them to work. The only ones stuck here are the middle income workers having their salaries raped every month so that people like this can continue to procreate and refuse to be accountable.

They are in a poverty trap whether they chose it or now. They don't have the means (or access to) escape. We all have to pay tax, not one likes giving the revenue commissioners a slice of their wages.

I'm not surprised they chose it over working a minimum wage job, with few additional perks. The system is flawed. To fix it, you have to provide an alternative that doesn't dehumanise people.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

DEFTLEFTHAND

kupus wrote: »

They also told us to reform the justice industry.

HAH!

Cute hoor paddy can't be having any of that sthuff going on round these here parts.

There is still money to be milked from taxpayers.

And all these little sprogs are going to turn out to be rocket scientists.

Like fcuk they are.

They are going to be cash cows, a returnable customer for life for some parasitic lawyer.

And the circle continues.

No lawyer makes their fortune representing low level criminals on free legal aid. The State finds it very difficult to fill a panel of Solicitors because nobody wants to do it.

You'll also find a lot of younger solicitors providing pro bono work to the scum.

end of the road

jmayo wrote: »

This is one of the most ridiculous and unfair things about the Irish welfare state.

if you are self employed and contributing all your life there can be nothing for you if you fall on hard times.
Yet the welfare careerist like the above mentioned family will leech not alone for their entire lifetime but for generations.

And the usual apologists like eotr will tell you tough, that is the way the system is, all the while excusing the aforementioned woman spewing out even more kids they cannot afford and that the taxpayers will have to rear.

It is a joke of a system and the only way it will really stop is when the economy totally collapses some day.
The madness didn't even abate when we had to get a bailout from the troika so unless we go totally bust nothing will truly change.

you are making up things and therefore your post has lost it's validity.
i have never ever excused this woman and her husband. i have said they are wrong, however i recognise that at the end of the day there are children and they will need to be supported regardless of my opinion of the parents. in relation to the system, i have said there are certain criteria that one will need to meet before they can be considered to be in need, i have never said that i personally agree with all of that criteria, but some of it i do. i have stated plenty of times on boards i disagree with those who are self employed not being able to access the doal and other benefits should they need to.

Geuze

jmayo wrote: »

if you are self employed and contributing all your life there can be nothing for you if you fall on hard times.

Overall I agree with you, but note that self-employed people are perfectly entitled to apply for JSA, the same as anybody else.

The media keep saying that self-employed can't get welfare, but that is incorrect.

They can get JSA = "dole", the same as anybody else.

OldNotWIse

end of the road wrote: »

a points based system doesn't work. it relies more on the person telling the truth then the current means. it's also not cost effective for ireland. anyone wanting it is unfortunately engaging in idealism and wishful thinking. all the rest including the legal system can easily be reformed and must be.



this is the second time i have had to debunk this lie. the issue people had was leo's suggestions, which were mostly unworkable. not him wanting a reform of the system, which 99% of people agree with.



not enough work to go around, and a very high cost of living meaning people in some cases have to be topped up by benefits.



interesting, i never heard or knew that. how long has that been the case?

Since the birth (if you pardon the pun) of the PC brigade - early nineties I am guessing.

skylight1987

while scrolling down after hours I read it as" Broadmoor wants more children" and I thought what the hell is that all about, how could a prison want more kids

Widdershins

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Yes we can blame them for being exceptionally greedy and exploitative. There has to be some presumption of good faith on behalf of the public for the welfare state to have been set up and for it to survive.

Galwayguy35

Doubtful anyone in the Dail has the stones to come out and say that the welfare system needs to be reformed, the hard left certainly won't anyway because telling their voters that they shouldn't have to pay for anything is their meal ticket for re election.

I'd say even Varadker won't go near it again seeing as he got rounded on for daring to say maybe taxpayers should get a bit of a break for once.

Kristopherus

Pat mustard 69 wrote: »

A troll is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.
Just as bad as trolling is "Feeding the Trolls". Please do not reply to comments that are blatantly from a troll. Do not to abuse them or call these posters trolls. It is up to the moderators to judge this, so simply report the posts or private message any moderator of after hours.

How many threads have you posted that inciteful info on?:D

end of the road

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Doubtful anyone in the Dail has the stones to come out and say that the welfare system needs to be reformed,

plenty have.

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

the hard left certainly won't anyway because telling their voters that they shouldn't have to pay for anything is their meal ticket for re election.

the hard left aren't in government or in the dail.

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

I'd say even Varadker won't go near it again seeing as he got rounded on for daring to say maybe taxpayers should get a bit of a break for once.

he will go near it again, and he was not rounded on for suggesting that tax payers should get a break as he never said tax payers should get a break.
what he said was that the system needs reform, but he was rounded on because his suggestions on how to do that were laughable and unworkable.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Doubtful anyone in the Dail has the stones to come out and say that the welfare system needs to be reformed, the hard left certainly won't anyway because telling their voters that they shouldn't have to pay for anything is their meal ticket for re election.

I'd say even Varadker won't go near it again seeing as he got rounded on for daring to say maybe taxpayers should get a bit of a break for once.

Vote Lexie for Taoiseach

Widdershins

Geuze wrote: »

Overall I agree with you, but note that self-employed people are perfectly entitled to apply for JSA, the same as anybody else.

The media keep saying that self-employed can't get welfare, but that is incorrect.

They can get JSA = "dole", the same as anybody else.

How can they? Do they claim for the days they haven't had work, or what?

I'm hearing Leo Varadkar's supposed to be getting tough on benefit claimants. I wonder if he's going after easy targets and leaving the Broodmothers of Ireland alone?
My cousin's been summoned to a review of his carer's benefit, as if his mother's alzheimers disease could have magically vanished.

Geuze

Widdershins wrote: »

How can they? Do they claim for the days they haven't had work, or what?

If a self-employed person's trade ceases, just like if a job ceases, they apply for JSA.

It's JSB that they can't get.