Heavyweight Boxing

The Davestator

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119950606#Comment_119950606

I don't rate his legacy personally but lots do. I think he's the luckiest champ since Douglas or Late career Foreman!

The Davestator

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119950470#Comment_119950470

I think we're agreed that Holmes is underrated. Unlucky to span two great eras

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119950606#Comment_119950606

And a drugs cheat. His legacy will always have an asterisk.

but forgetting PEDs, he is up there as best of his era. I just think the era is pretty poor, and he really hasn’t done enough compared to greats from other eras.

33 fights and 5 title fights.. one these against Dillian Whyte, and three against the same man…and his next one against an absolute tomato can!!

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119950638#Comment_119950638

Lucky in what way?

squinn2912

That’s some shite talk. Fury would make mince meat out of Douglas and I’d back him against any version of Foreman. Like him or not he’s the best there is

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119952061#Comment_119952061

I wouldn’t back him against the best 70s or best 80s-90s Foremam.

Foreman was very physically strong and heavy-handed. And he had a solid chin. Fury won’t be able to hurt him to stop him piling on heavy hitting pressure.

A good analysis in terms of height and size is Gerry Cooney, who was almost as tall as Fury, and who could punch. George walked through him, landed heavy and closed the show.

A far better puncher than wild right hand Wilder. If Foreman had Fury hurt like Wilder did, no way Foreman is as weak or as inefficient following up. Foreman hurts Fury everywhere and knocks him out. Fury won’t escape.

walshb

The only possible bit of interest tonight is Usyk sitting ringside.

iebamm2580

Just a tune up fight for the best heavyweight of his era and possibly would go unbeaten in any era due to his sheer size so wont mind forking out the 32quid. Comparing eras very hard and fruitless exercise, fury is way bigger and heavier then the vast majority, anybody that thinks a 6-3 215ponds ali would have chance against somebody as big as fury knows nothing about size advantage when it comes to boxing. Hes obviously a bit mad but he is now an entertaining fighter with movement for a man his size, he should just be enjoyed while he is boxing and ignoring all the mad stuff he says, mostly mind games with him. Like it or not furys legacy will be the same as marciano, unbeaten heavyweight champ.

walshb

I actually think Fury beats Ali 9/10times. Size and style important. And Ali is my favorite ever sports athlete.

It’s big strong physical punchers that beat Fury. Foreman/Lewis are two I would back on knocking Fury out.

iebamm2580

I find it hard to imagine fury being knocked out by anyone, his recovery powers are freakish.

walshb

He was knocked out in rd 12 v Wilder. Yes, got up at 10 seconds, but was kind of out.

Absolute no way a monster puncher like Lewis, who was a far better overall puncher than Wilder, doesn’t land clean to take him out, and if not, follow up to take him out.

iebamm2580

his recovery to go on and win the rest of the round to me showed unreal heart and incredible recovery powers. Hard to argue against wilder being hardest puncher of all time either as people these days are naturally bigger and stronger. Also at count 5 he looked wide awake and lucid, jus took the extra seconds being smart.

walshb

Lewis and Foreman can easily land harder/cleaner shots than the ones landed in rd 12.

Also, their accuracy and follow ups far better than Wilder.

Wilder is not naturally bigger than Lewis or Foreman. Taller is all.

Apart from Fury, nobody is naturally bigger than men who fought in the 1990s. Fatter, maybe. Go back years before, yes..

iebamm2580

Fury is too smart, he would smother any follow ups, as i said at count 5 fury was perfect again, you can see him not and get up around 6 second mark, we will never know and we wont agree about foreman etc.

iebamm2580

Drug testing wasn't near the same as nowadays so cant really talk about natural fighters in the 90s with any certainty and yes i know you will bring up furys ped failure but that has nothing to do with his natural zize.

squinn2912

For God’s sake Cooney was retired! He was just after a loss to Spinks. What would Fury do with him?

george fought wide as wide open goes and Fury would outthink him every day of the week. Very slow. He’d take a shot to get one in but Fury would keep him away and really test his fitness. Very late stoppage for Fury

walshb

He’s a big man. There were big men in the 1990s. Lewis and Bowe both 6 feet 5 and 240 lbs. Big units. Kilts are from the 1990s. Two big men.

The 1990s were 30 years ago, not 300 years ago.

Fury’s PED failure has 0 to do with him being 6 feet 8/9 and 265-270 lbs. A lot of Fury’s weight is not that toned anyway. He’s just a big skilled man.

All these 250-260 lbs men weighing today. Look at them. Out of shape slobs most them. Nothing whatsoever to do with naturally being bigger.

iebamm2580

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZRDVA-u3Io

1:10 on, clear as day at count 5 fury was lucid, amazing recovery.

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119952800#Comment_119952800

Sorry, who said Fury wouldn’t beat Cooney? He would. My point was in terms of their physical size/image and makeup.

Foreman would find Fury’s chin and seal the deal.

guys, other than one shot power, Wilder isn’t remotely near the talent of Foreman, and Wilder came within a whisker of beating Fury.

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119952780#Comment_119952780

Yes. One thing I will say is that Fury has ring smarts and is very resourceful and fit.

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119952800#Comment_119952800

Interesting..

and as you should know, a 1980s/1990s Foreman was a far better managed boxer in terms of fitness management compared to the more frenetic 1970s. He was very fit, and this was down to economy.

So, it would not at all be a surprise to see Foreman being the one testing Fury’s fitness.

And Foreman will not fight at all as casually as Wilder. Wilder tried to be cute. Foreman will be forward pressing heavy handed all the time. He will be the one really testing Fury’s resilience and stamina. On him all night.

Also, Fury man-handled Wilder a lot. He will not find it near as easy to man-handle a naturally strong 250 lbs Foreman. So, Fury’s efforts to contain Foreman in close will be much tougher.

Great fight. But one I’d make Foreman a winner 8/10 times.

The Nal

When Foreman fought Cooney he was 64-2 with 60 KOs. Silly stuff. A lot of nobodys in there granted.

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119953022#Comment_119953022

Still remains the most ruthless KO ever. That uppercut to end it was quite possibly the cleanest hardest connecting uppercut ever..and just to make sure, the chopping right hand to finish!!!

squinn2912

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119952985#Comment_119952985

He wasn’t as reckless but he got even slower. It’s an early one but I’m watching the Young fight here and Fury batters that man.

Fury dances around him, huge reach to keep him away and hand speed to catch George as he leads with his cheek. Foreman is a very compelling character and doubtless big achievements but I always thought he was overrated as a boxer. Yes could take a shot and won a few shoot outs like Lyle and Moorer but Ali’s ridicule was bang on. Mummy

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119953151#Comment_119953151

Well, funnily, I’d give Fury a better chance vs. 1970s Foreman. Best 70s Foreman was 1973/1974. Against the older/comeback Foreman I think George’s extra size, better ring IQ, better stamina (all compared to the 1970s) makes him a very difficult task for Fury.

Other than a past it Wlad, and Wilder, I just can’t see the performances whereby Fury beats some greats from the past.

His skills and size will see him beating a fair few past greats, but several I think are too good.

The Nal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119953052#Comment_119953052

Yep

squinn2912

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119953268#Comment_119953268

From my memory did he not spend most of the 80s Foreman not go through a pile of cans and have a very poor showing against the most “permissive” Tommy Morrison? I’d actually count Tommy a tougher fight for Fury. George was ok in a brawl when it’s right there but so slow. Awful feet. Terrible balance. Anyone with footwork gives him a terrible time and Fury also has the reach and hand speed advantages. I could see George getting to wlad and wilder would be some watch too but I think Fury has his number in a straightforward way

OmegaGene

Won’t be long now for the dubois fight

ctrl-alt-delete

Very strange that - thought I heard him ask What Happened

Definitely his ankle looking at the start of round two.

OmegaGene

Well Lorena turned out to be a donkey in disguise as a boxer, dubois smashed him to bits even with a David Haye style ankle injury and after going down three times