Virgin Media - House move not possible - cancellation fee

blagards · 26-06-2017 5:11pm #1

So we're currently moving house. We have a contract with Virgin media for the next 6 months. Virgin don't offer coverage in the area we are moving to, despite it being only half an hour from Dublin city centre. They claim we have to pay a cancellation fee because of this, even though it's their fault. Is there any way out of this?
Moving house is expensive enough as it is!

Cool_CM · 26-06-2017 5:51pm

You signed a contract with them, how is it their fault exactly?

blagards · 26-06-2017 5:52pm

Cool_CM wrote: »

You signed a contract with them, how is it their fault exactly?

They don't provide a service in the new area. I have no problem with this, but it's a bit much to charge a cancellation fee for a service they can't provide!

Graham · 26-06-2017 5:59pm

blagards wrote: »

They don't provide a service in the new area. I have no problem with this, but it's a bit much to charge a cancellation fee for a service they can't provide!

You signed a contract agreeing to pay for xx months of service at your current address. I assume Virgin are happy to continue to supply the service you contracted.

Now you want to cancel that contract early.

Why are you surprised they charge a fee for cancelling the contract early?

Vic_08 · 26-06-2017 6:01pm

blagards wrote: »

They don't provide a service in the new area. I have no problem with this, but it's a bit much to charge a cancellation fee for a service they can't provide!

You signed up for a contract at your current address, it is not their responsibility to provide service at a random address that you choose to move to.

Best you can do is look for some goodwill from them in allowing you to break the contract early, can't see that happening if you go at them with the sense of entitlement you are displaying here though.

Bubbaclaus · 26-06-2017 6:03pm

It's their fault you are moving house?

What?

You'll have to explain the logic beyond that one (hint: there is no logic behind it).

blagards · 26-06-2017 6:16pm

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

It's their fault you are moving house?

What?

You'll have to explain the logic beyond that one (hint: there is no logic behind it).

It's not their fault I'm moving house. I have no problem that they don't provide a service at the new address. However, it's a bit much to charge a cancellation fee because they don't provide a service at a new address.

Graham · 26-06-2017 6:18pm

blagards wrote: »

It's not their fault I'm moving house. I have no problem that they don't provide a service at the new address. However, it's a bit much to charge a cancellation fee because they don't provide a service at a new address.

They're not charging a cancellation fee because they don't provide a service.

They're charging a cancellation fee because you are cancelling the service.

whiterebel · 26-06-2017 6:20pm

Or maybe they think its a bit unfair of you to move to a house that they can't provide a service for.....

BlinkingLights · 26-06-2017 6:22pm

UPC used to allow people to leave without an issue if they were genuinely moving to an out-of-service area. Provided, you returned the equipment and they checked the new address.

Have you actually spoken to them to confirm this is *really* the policy and they have not just made an error?

ThisRegard · 26-06-2017 6:23pm

In fairness to the OP I do think that Virgin can do better if you're moving to a house not served by them, such as a refund when provided proof of new address.

I only got out of it myself as my move just happened to coincide with the price increase so I cancelled within that window without penalty.

BlinkingLights, it is their policy alright.

blagards · 26-06-2017 6:23pm

Vic_08 wrote: »

You signed up for a contract at your current address, it is not their responsibility to provide service at a random address that you choose to move to.

Best you can do is look for some goodwill from them in allowing you to break the contract early, can't see that happening if you go at them with the sense of entitlement you are displaying here though.

"sense of entitlement"? I don't think being a bit surprised at being charged a cancellation fee when a service provider doesn't provide a service amounts to a sense of entitlement. I don't have any issue with them not being able to provide a service, but to charge a cancellation fee? When it's advertised on their site that moving home is easy?

I'd be happy to stay with them otherwise, their broadband is fast, and their customer service team were helpful today (albeit they couldn't help on the cancellation fee).

This is a civil thread to discuss the issues, let's not resort to name-calling (although I've been called worse!)

blagards · 26-06-2017 6:31pm

BlinkingLights wrote: »

UPC used to allow people to leave without an issue if they were genuinely moving to an out-of-service area. Provided, you returned the equipment and they checked the new address.

Have you actually spoken to them to confirm this is *really* the policy and they have not just made an error?

Unfortunately I have, I was on the phone to their customer service department today and I explained the situation. To be fair, they were very apologetic, but there didn't seem to be any budge on it.

BlinkingLights · 26-06-2017 6:37pm

Seems they've really gone to pot since they became Virgin Media. UPC always seemed more reasonable to deal with an also better from a tech support point of view.

Virgin in the UK was never wonderful and it seems British standards now apply here.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1 · 26-06-2017 6:50pm

How far in to a contract are you?

B00MSTICK · 26-06-2017 7:01pm

This is standard enough tbh - they definitely build it into their pricing.
It was worse when the usual contract length was 18 months - particularly tough on students that.

I'm sure the first 4/6 months were at a nice discount.

Think of it like a contract on a mobile phone - you get a nice discount (usually the handset is free or at a much reduced one off cost) and then you are stuck paying bills for X months.
If you move house to somewhere where the coverage is patchy/no 4G signal they wont let you off the hook.

blagards · 26-06-2017 7:10pm

June Important Shepherdess wrote: »

How far in to a contract are you?

Only 6 months unfortunately.

blagards · 26-06-2017 7:13pm

B00MSTICK wrote: »

This is standard enough tbh - they definitely build it into their pricing.
It was worse when the usual contract length was 18 months - particularly tough on students that.

I'm sure the first 4/6 months were at a nice discount.

Think of it like a contract on a mobile phone - you get a nice discount (usually the handset is free or at a much reduced one off cost) and then you are stuck paying bills for X months.
If you move house to somewhere where the coverage is patchy/no 4G signal they wont let you off the hook.

It's not quite like that though. I'm not going to get to keep the virgin box or anything afterwards. And it's not just that the broadband isn't good in the new location. So this is more like a phone contract where I didn't get a new phone at the start, just a small discount, and then move to a location where you could reasonably expect service (it's a pretty built up area), and have no service at all whatsoever.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1 · 26-06-2017 7:16pm

blagards wrote: »

Only 6 months unfortunately.

Then tough. You committed to a contract and after only six months want out of it. Not their fault you are moving.

Bubbaclaus · 26-06-2017 8:02pm

blagards wrote: »

"sense of entitlement"? I don't think being a bit surprised at being charged a cancellation fee when a service provider doesn't provide a service amounts to a sense of entitlement. I don't have any issue with them not being able to provide a service, but to charge a cancellation fee? When it's advertised on their site that moving home is easy?

I'd be happy to stay with them otherwise, their broadband is fast, and their customer service team were helpful today (albeit they couldn't help on the cancellation fee).

This is a civil thread to discuss the issues, let's not resort to name-calling (although I've been called worse!)

You signed a contract and are now cancelling that contract. You are the one cancelling the service. You are the one not upholding your side of the contract. You are the one blaming the other party for you failing to uphold your side of the contract.

For clarification, it is you cancelling the service, not Virgin.

blagards · 26-06-2017 9:20pm

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

You signed a contract and are now cancelling that contract. You are the one cancelling the service. You are the one not upholding your side of the contract. You are the one blaming the other party for you failing to uphold your side of the contract.

For clarification, it is you cancelling the service, not Virgin.

While I am cancelling it, I feel that it is not quite as simple as you make it out to be. I would like to continue with the plan. Obviously it is my 'fault' I am moving house, but it is Virgin who can't offer me a deal at the new location. I'm not demanding that Virgin offer me broadband at the new location, just that I feel that it's a bit much to charge a cancellation fee

colm_mcm · 26-06-2017 9:23pm

This was policy before virgin media came along.

davo10 · 26-06-2017 9:26pm

blagards wrote: »

While I am cancelling it, I feel that it is not quite as simple as you make it out to be. I would like to continue with the plan. Obviously it is my 'fault' I am moving house, but it is Virgin who can't offer me a deal at the new location. I'm not demanding that Virgin offer me broadband at the new location, just that I feel that it's a bit much to charge a cancellation fee

I really don't understand why you think you are entitled to have the cancellation fee waived. Your contract with Virgin was to provide a service at your current location, they are providing it and will continue to do so. You are moving, not the service, they are not obligated to provide it at another location, but you are obligated to pay for it where you are. The terms are laid out in your contract, it cannot be one sided, if they withdrew the service and kept charging you, you would be very unhappy indeed.

It is pretty simple, you are getting the service you agreed to when you agreed to the contract.

jimmycrackcorm · 26-06-2017 9:27pm

blagards wrote: »

"sense of entitlement"? I don't think being a bit surprised at being charged a cancellation fee when a service provider doesn't provide a service amounts to a sense of entitlement. I don't have any issue with them not being able to provide a service, but to charge a cancellation fee? When it's advertised on their site that moving home is easy?

I'd be happy to stay with them otherwise, their broadband is fast, and their customer service team were helpful today (albeit they couldn't help on the cancellation fee).

This is a civil thread to discuss the issues, let's not resort to name-calling (although I've been called worse!)

I worry for the youth of today.

Why didn't you sign up for their 30 day contract which would have suited your situation?

blagards · 26-06-2017 9:36pm

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I worry for the youth of today.

Why didn't you sign up for their 30 day contract which would have suited your situation?

'the youth of today'? Why do some people here have to resort to name calling and an air of superiority?

Maybe because we didn't anticipate moving house quite so quickly? Maybe because the majority of locations we would move to are covered? Maybe because it doesn't include TV?

davo10 · 26-06-2017 9:39pm

blagards wrote: »

'the youth of today'? Why do some people here have to resort to name calling and an air of superiority?

Maybe because we didn't anticipate moving house quite so quickly? Maybe because the majority of locations we would move to are covered? Maybe because it doesn't include TV?

Maybe that is not the service providers fault.

Vic_08 · 26-06-2017 9:47pm

blagards wrote: »

'the youth of today'? Why do some people here have to resort to name calling and an air of superiority?

Maybe because we didn't anticipate moving house quite so quickly? Maybe because the majority of locations we would move to are covered? Maybe because it doesn't include TV?

Because you wanted the benefits of a 12 month contract but now don't want to take the responsibility of honouring your side of it which includes an early cancellation fee.

ThisRegard · 26-06-2017 11:13pm

davo10 wrote: »

Maybe that is not the service providers fault.

Well, it often is.

There are a lot of dickish responses here.

AudreyHepburn · 27-06-2017 7:32am

ThisRegard wrote: »

Well, it often is.

There are a lot of dickish responses here.

In this case it isn't though. The OP cannot hold the provider responsible for her decision to move to an area they do not cover.

The OP wants to break contract, of course she must pay a fee.

Why is this so hard for people to understand? The sense of self entitlement in this country is staggering at times.

davo10 · 27-06-2017 7:46am

ThisRegard wrote: »

Well, it often is.

There are a lot of dickish responses here.

You are saying it is Virgin's fault that the op is moving away from the property where the provider is contracted to provide the service?

Could you explain that? This I gotta read.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1 · 27-06-2017 7:54am

ThisRegard wrote: »

Well, it often is.

There are a lot of dickish responses here.

Most certainly not in this case. The OP went in to a contract and obtained a service only to want out of it just six months later. Fairness works both ways and in this case the OP is being unrealistic expecting to walk away from this.

Lux23 · 27-06-2017 9:13am

Maybe go back to them and ask them if their cancellation policy aligns with S.I. No. 27/1995 - European Communities (Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts) Regulations, 1995 and to explain how. It probably does but it might not be worth their while getting someone to explain this to you. And don't be fobbed off with a simple yes - ask for their interpretation.

It worked for me a couple of times.

ThisRegard · 27-06-2017 9:16am

davo10 wrote: »

You are saying it is Virgin's fault that the op is moving away from the property where the provider is contracted to provide the service?

Could you explain that? This I gotta read.

No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that it's not the fault of the customer that there's no service in areas they may move to. The difference might be a bit too subtle for you.

davo10 · 27-06-2017 9:36am

ThisRegard wrote: »

No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that it's not the fault of the customer that there's no service in areas they may move to. The difference might be a bit too subtle for you.

No subtlety required, just an understanding of the contract signed and a little bit of common sense on your part.

The pertinent points in this thread are that the op agreed to a service at one property, but believes he/she should not be charged to cancel the agreement just because the service is not provided at a completely different location. That does not need to be subtle, it's factual. You said it's "often" the service providers fault, I fail to see how.

ED E · 27-06-2017 9:36am

ThisRegard wrote: »

No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that it's not the fault of the customer that there's no service in areas they may move to. The difference might be a bit too subtle for you.

So should non ubiquitous providers just never use contracts then?

Virgin paid the installation fees for the OP, in return he agreed to a term. Thats the deal. It wasnt hidden. If the broadband just randomly stopped working for a week I'm sure the OP would be raging against CS with "breach of contract" etc. Thats a two way street.

ThisRegard · 27-06-2017 9:38am

And like I said, it's good PR and practise to wave or reduce the cancellation fee in such circumstances. Everyone has acknowledged the existence of the contract.

seamus · 27-06-2017 9:52am

ThisRegard wrote: »

And like I said, it's good PR and practise to wave or reduce the cancellation fee in such circumstances. Everyone has acknowledged the existence of the contract.

In exceptional circumstances. Moving house is not an exceptional circumstance.

As said early in the thread, it would be too abusable. How can Virgin verify the person is moving house and not just switching provider? They can't.

ThisRegard · 27-06-2017 10:12am

Proof of address like new bills etc, like you're authenticated now.

blagards · 27-06-2017 10:12am

ED E wrote: »

So should non ubiquitous providers just never use contracts then?

Virgin paid the installation fees for the OP, in return he agreed to a term. Thats the deal. It wasnt hidden. If the broadband just randomly stopped working for a week I'm sure the OP would be raging against CS with "breach of contract" etc. Thats a two way street.

Virgin didn't pay any installation fees. The wall point was already installed, they simply sent out a box (which will be returned, and I would be happy to refund them their postage costs).

I think the contract is very asymmetric, in that Virgin can simply decide to stop serving me (unlikely, but the contract allows this), and I amn't entitled to any cancellation fee from them (not that I should be), but if I leave the contract at my end, I have to pay a fee. This is a clear asymmetry in the contract, which is disadvantageous to the customer.

blagards · 27-06-2017 10:13am

Lux23 wrote: »

Maybe go back to them and ask them if their cancellation policy aligns with S.I. No. 27/1995 - European Communities (Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts) Regulations, 1995 and to explain how. It probably does but it might not be worth their while getting someone to explain this to you. And don't be fobbed off with a simple yes - ask for their interpretation.

It worked for me a couple of times.

Thanks for this, it's worth a try anyway.

AudreyHepburn · 27-06-2017 10:45am

ThisRegard wrote: »

And like I said, it's good PR and practise to wave or reduce the cancellation fee in such circumstances. Everyone has acknowledged the existence of the contract.

In what such circumstances?

The OP is moving house, not exactly an unusual or exceptional circumstance. Why should the provider just let her break contract without some form of payment?

blagards · 27-06-2017 10:55am

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

In what such circumstances?

The OP is moving house, not exactly an unusual or exceptional circumstance. Why should the provider just let her break contract without some form of payment?

The unusual/exceptional circumstance arises because the service is not available at the new location.

Former Former · 27-06-2017 11:28am

blagards wrote: »

The unusual/exceptional circumstance arises because the service is not available at the new location.

Then anyone could just say "I'm moving to the Aran Islands, let me out of my contract".

How much is the cancellation fee?

Bubbaclaus · 27-06-2017 11:59am

This is hysterical. The self entitlement in Ireland is astonishing.

You signed up to a 12 month contract and now are moaning that you're not allowed leave for free before the end of it. You are severing the contract, not the other way around.

You're lucky it's just the cancellation fee you have to pay, and not see out the remainder of the contract costs.

blagards · 27-06-2017 1:07pm

Former Former wrote: »

Then anyone could just say "I'm moving to the Aran Islands, let me out of my contract".

How much is the cancellation fee?

I understand that, and I think they should ask for proof of house move before they allow it. I don't think many people will actually move to the Aran Islands to get out of a broadband contract!

blagards · 27-06-2017 1:09pm

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

This is hysterical. The self entitlement in Ireland is astonishing.

You signed up to a 12 month contract and now are moaning that you're not allowed leave for free before the end of it. You are severing the contract, not the other way around.

You're lucky it's just the cancellation fee you have to pay, and not see out the remainder of the contract costs.

Hysterical? Self entitlement? This is a one sided contract, which allows the company to break with no penalty (not that they have done this here - but it is allowed), but not the customer, even when there is mitigating circumstances (as here)

theteal · 27-06-2017 1:24pm

blagards wrote: »

Hysterical? Self entitlement? This is a one sided contract, which allows the company to break with no penalty (not that they have done this here - but it is allowed), but not the customer, even when there is mitigating circumstances (as here)

Actually, you can leave the contact penalty free if this happens - as many have done multiple times when they introduce price increases.

I actually agree that once a new valid proof of address can be produced, there should be some kind of concession on the providers part. The above though is not really a point to argue in your favour.

AudreyHepburn · 27-06-2017 1:41pm

blagards wrote: »

The unusual/exceptional circumstance arises because the service is not available at the new location.

That's not exceptional in the slightest - not every provider will be available in every area.

Bubbaclaus · 27-06-2017 8:01pm

blagards wrote: »

Hysterical? Self entitlement? This is a one sided contract, which allows the company to break with no penalty (not that they have done this here - but it is allowed), but not the customer, even when there is mitigating circumstances (as here)

Why did you sign the contract if you don't agree with the contents?

blagards · 27-06-2017 9:32pm

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Why did you sign the contract if you don't agree with the contents?

Because like most people, I didn't read it. Not ideal but unfortunately it's what happens. Do you read every terms and conditions whenever you sign up for anything?

Bubbaclaus · 28-06-2017 5:34am

blagards wrote: »

Because like most people, I didn't read it. Not ideal but unfortunately it's what happens. Do you read every terms and conditions whenever you sign up for anything?

If I'm signing a long term contract I do.

You can't really complain can you if you didn't even read the damn thing you signed up to.

Virgin Media - House move not possible - cancellation fee

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