B&I LIONS vs Blues: Wed @ 08h35

razorblunt

Clegg wrote: »

Isn't Rob Howley the backs coach? Good luck getting a cohesive attacking strategy out of him.

That's the issue here really.
A nothing coach, rolls into the Lions.

They defended way too narrow, Iaone was having a field day against Nowell.
Daly was probably only delighted he was on the other wing.

Poor attempt from Halfpenny at the end, he almost missed a tackle leading to the first try. Door is open for Hogg again, or perhaps Payne (in whispered toned).

Kanrith

shuffol wrote: »

I'm struggling to think of any real positive impacts he had on the game, we got a poor return on his kicking from hand and he's struggling with his touch finders from penalties. The last one should've been right in the corner.

His passing was really good throughout. We got a poor return but all of those kicks were contestable. We also got possession straight back from his kick off after the Blues try.

irishman86

wp_rathead wrote: »

Wonder will Ringrose be parachuted in Payne ruled out
Be a shame as he was having a very good game

Id hope so but wouldnt be shocked if Gats brought Roberts instead, I suppose with Howley in charge of backs it doesnt matter who they would bring

Buer

shuffol wrote: »

I'm struggling to think of any real positive impacts he had on the game, we got a poor return on his kicking from hand and he's struggling with his touch finders from penalties. The last one should've been right in the corner.

He was much improved. Passed well and move the back line decently when we actually put the ball out to the back line.

Not a vintage showing and the kick from hand that led to the try was poor but he was solid enough.

Interested Observer

razorblunt wrote: »

That's the issue here really.
A nothing coach, rolls into the Lions.

As has been pointed out a few times, he wanted Gregor Townsend but Townsend declined. Got stuck with Howley then, there wasn't a whole lot of other choices.

hinault

hinault wrote: »

Personally I'm lukewarm about the Lions concept.

Old enough to remember the amateur days, when international games were few and far between and when for the amateur player selection for the Lions allowed them to live as professional players. Tours also involved playing many local matches throughout whatever country was being toured. Access to the players was important,

These days international games are two a penny. The rugby season is far longer. And Lions tours don't visit much of the country where they are touring and they don' play against local teams anymore. Plus it's a money spinner.

It probably means more to us Antipodeans. I was back home for the 2005 tour, and had to go home last Xmas so couldn't justify the trip out again for this tour. I think that it's once every 12 years in my eyes, so it is a big deal. I have much less interest when the Lions are in Aussie or SA.

irishbucsfan

sydthebeat wrote: »

for posters who dont watch super rugby

the blues are the poorest NZ side who constantly leak tries.
it doesnt bode well that the lions could only score 1 try and that was a 5 m maul.

Serious questions need to be asked of howley.
The backs line seemed to play extermely deep, very much a 45 deg line, but there was very little imagination within it to open up space.

Absolutely. The best rugby they played was in the opening quarter when they had their 10 and forwards coming onto the ball flat and showed up the Blues organisational issues.

Webb's part in their good play will stand to him.

We need Farrell in form and confident at 10 but I'd worry that we also need someone else capable of playing at first receiver who can come onto the ball confidently when the 10 is missing (and Farrell goes missing at times when he's carrying or involved in defense).

That'd normally mean a 12 or 15, I'm just not sure we anyone with form who can do that for us on this tour. Our 12 will likely be Henshaw or Te'o, the only place I can see that option coming from is if Hogg improves and wins the 15 jersey. Without that I think our attack isn't going to be nearly incisive enough and we'll be totally reliant on penalties and set pieces for scoring opportunities.

Interested Observer

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Without that I think our attack isn't going to be nearly incisive enough and we'll be totally reliant on penalties and set pieces for scoring opportunities.

I don't think there's any chance of winning a test if this is the case. NZ are going to score a couple of tries, guaranteed. Can't beat them without doing the same I think.

awec

Buer wrote: »

It's not bereft of ideas, the kicking is the idea.

How many times did Webb kick long without the ball even going out to the back line? I imagine they have a plan of the scrum half kicking unless they're in the opposition half and only trying to move the ball when they're within 30-40m of the opposition try line.

For context, Webb kicked twice as many times as Sexton and Biggar combined.

Fair point. Not only is it aids to watch as a spectator but it isn't working at all.

That final try from the Blues today, there is no hope of seeing this Lions team score anything like that. Too much of this percentage play muck. Too many players who just run straight for the nearest defender, too many guys happy to constantly kick it away.

Nowell was the worst player on the field but I have to say Henshaw was completely outshone and outdone by his opposite number.

sting60

As I've posted from squad announcement I strongly believe our forwards will hold their own but our backs are not physically up to the task and to mention Ringrose or Zebo as potential squad members is complete and utter nonsense.There will be plenty of knockers regarding the Welsh presence including Howley and with some justification imo.

Cookie_Monster

pickarooney wrote: »

This is just going to get worse and worse, isn't it?

sure is. The Blues are terrible compared to every other NZ team

shuffol

Saturdays game takes on huge importance now with the Highlanders game up next after it. It's easy to see them losing both. They could do with some cannon fodder to build a bit of confidence.

Henry Ford III

A bad loss. Williams was awful. Sexton is on a road to nowhere.

ThisRegard

showpony1 wrote: »

We are playing experimental sides against teams playing their cup finals.
Wait until we play the All Blacks before judging our British Lions

A bit trollish, and you know the team they played on Saturday were only together a week don't you?

sydthebeat

sting60 wrote: »

As I've posted from squad announcement I strongly believe our forwards will hold their own but our backs are not physically up to the task and to mention Ringrose or Zebo as potential squad members is complete and utter nonsense.There will be plenty of knockers regarding the Welsh presence including Howley and with some justification imo.

they hold their own physically but not skillswise.

theres not many NH hookers who can make line breaks from rucks like parsons did today. Itoje is probably the only lion forward that i would say has the basic skill level to challange for a AB place.

Im sure they take Furlong as well just cos hes a leg-bag.

Luatuas inside off load to SBW made that last try... and then it was West's familiarity with sonny that allowed him to his his shoulder at just the right time to take the second off load.

The lions forwards will also be better matched on saturday

things arent going to get any easier for the lions

sydthebeat

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Absolutely. The best rugby they played was in the opening quarter when they had their 10 and forwards coming onto the ball flat and showed up the Blues organisational issues.

Webb's part in their good play will stand to him.

We need Farrell in form and confident at 10 but I'd worry that we also need someone else capable of playing at first receiver who can come onto the ball confidently when the 10 is missing (and Farrell goes missing at times when he's carrying or involved in defense).

That'd normally mean a 12 or 15, I'm just not sure we anyone with form who can do that for us on this tour. Our 12 will likely be Henshaw or Te'o, the only place I can see that option coming from is if Hogg improves and wins the 15 jersey. Without that I think our attack isn't going to be nearly incisive enough and we'll be totally reliant on penalties and set pieces for scoring opportunities.

yeah, if anything they appear to be trying to get away from "warrenball" when in reality they need to embrace it as a base line tactic and expand from there.
id like to see a back line of Murray, sexton, farrell, henshaw though

molloyjh

Buer wrote: »

I imagine they have a plan of the scrum half kicking unless they're in the opposition half and only trying to move the ball when they're within 30-40m of the opposition try line.

Isn't that how Treviso beat Ospreys this season? Refused to play rugby in their half at all. Are the Lions now Treviso?

If that is the plan then I'm even less interested in the Lions tour than I was. I knew this coaching team wouldn't produce much in the way of decent rugby. It is made all the more difficult in such a short window to be fair. But if they can't find a way to beat the worst Kiwi SR side then that doesn't bode well for the rest of the tour. And I'm not sure I could bring myself to get up early to watch losing dross.

Buer

sydthebeat wrote: »

things arent going to get any easier for the lions

*clutches bet slip*

Lets hope not.

.ak

Rob Howley the biggest villain there.

Too much emphasis on a forwards coaching ticket. Should've got someone external with a good track record of attacking play.

Buer

Buer wrote: »

*clutches bet slip*

Lets hope not.

Flights for my family holiday are paid for if the Lions only beat the Maori's. I fully expect them to improve, though.

dregin

Hey now, Williams is a smashing player on his day. Could someone just PLEASE tell him to stay on the ****ing ground?!

molloyjh

.ak wrote: »

Rob Howley the biggest villain there.

Too much emphasis on a forwards coaching ticket. Should've got someone external with a good track record of attacking play.

He was hardly first choice though. Nobody else seemed to want the gig or be available for it.

Buer

It's worth saying that this might be the worst Kiwi Super Rugby side but that does not equate to them being a bad side. They've still won 7 and drawn 1 (against the Chiefs) of their 14 games this season. Even away to the on fire Crusaders, they only lost by 9 points.

They're a good side. Unfortunately for the Lions, that's scant consolation as the games are still going to get harder from here on in.

.ak

molloyjh wrote: »

He was hardly first choice though. Nobody else seemed to want the gig or be available for it.

Maybe - we don't know that for sure though.

Yeah it's a shame, when you see the coaching ticket they're all ex-forwards afaik, it's no wonder they're trying to play it up the jumper.

thomond2006

Buer wrote: »

*clutches bet slip*

Lets hope not.

Careful Buer. The FAKE MSM will screw you like they did with Nigel Carolan and Connacht. Disgraceful!

sydthebeat

Buer wrote: »

*clutches bet slip*

Lets hope not.

im worried about the highlanders game.

It all depends on whos released from the all black squad for it.. if no one is and we're without Dixon, Squire up front and the 2 smiths, sopoaga, fekitoa and naholo then were very much weakened.

should the lions lose against the crusaders, they will have to put out a strong team against the highlanders or risk a very real tour white wash (not counting the NZPB)

irishbucsfan

.ak wrote: »

Maybe - we don't know that for sure though.

Yeah it's a shame, when you see the coaching ticket they're all ex-forwards afaik, it's no wonder they're trying to play it up the jumper.

By all accounts Gregor Townsend turned them down. Howley and Farrell weren't forwards.

thomond2006

Buer wrote: »

It's worth saying that this might be the worst Kiwi Super Rugby side but that does not equate to them being a bad side. They've still won 7 and drawn 1 (against the Chiefs) of their 14 games this season. Even away to the on fire Crusaders, they only lost by 9 points.

They're a good side. Unfortunately for the Lions, that's scant consolation as the games are still going to get harder from here on in.

I'm sure Woodward is loving this so far.

covfefe

I thought they could only improve on last week, I was wrong

Buer

.ak wrote: »

Rob Howley the biggest villain there.

Too much emphasis on a forwards coaching ticket. Should've got someone external with a good track record of attacking play.

Who though? We had this discussion before and there was a complete absence of options.

Townsend and Schmidt both turned it down, I believe.