Munster Team Talk Thread VI - Stander Up and Fight

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

Munster have very little beyond Murray and Williams at scrum half (assuming Matthewson leaves which I'm not sure he will). James Hart is not near the required quality. Neil Cronin is almost 26 and completely unproven. It's worth noting that Duncan Williams was a big improvement on him in the match against Glasgow when he came on. Jack Stafford is 21 and isn't threatening the 23 any time soon.

If Williams wants to take another contract I would be confident that Munster will put one on the table and rightly so. He has a wealth of experience and is proven to be a solid squad player.

Regardless, if I was JVG, I'd be looking to keep Matthewson for an additional 18 months or bring in another scrum half with the space created by Kleyn and Marshall becoming IQ .

Dubinusa

Sean O Connor is coming thru also. FW should be kept as he has potential.
Hart will be let go imo, based on current form.
I wonder if any of the players would be enticed to Stade withPOC there? TOD and Earl's would be good value for Stade. Plus they'll make more cash to bump the pension.

Mc Love

Buer wrote: »

Munster have very little beyond Murray and Williams at scrum half (assuming Matthewson leaves which I'm not sure he will). James Hart is not near the required quality. Neil Cronin is almost 26 and completely unproven. It's worth noting that Duncan Williams was a big improvement on him in the match against Glasgow when he came on. Jack Stafford is 21 and isn't threatening the 23 any time soon.

If Williams wants to take another contract I would be confident that Munster will put one on the table and rightly so. He has a wealth of experience and is proven to be a solid squad player.

Regardless, if I was JVG, I'd be looking to keep Matthewson for an additional 18 months or bring in another scrum half with the space created by Kleyn and Marshall becoming IQ .

Haha I thanked the post for the last paragraph.

But the suggestion that DW is a solid squad player is laughable at best. When he came on for AM on Saturday, I and many others were like there's any hope of us securing even a losing bp. His passing is just too inconsistent to be a solid option behind CM. He's in the same group as JH for me. Now that we know how inconsistent DW is, it's up to Munster to give NC and JS a chance at 9,that's if AM doesn't stick around or is injured for a while.

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

I think you have a much loftier idea of what a squad player is than what it actually is. He would be third choice. A player called upon when others are unavailable. The only reason he'll feature this weekend is because two others are injured.

There's nothing laughable about him being a solid squad player. Do you really think 4 consecutive head coaches are completely wrong? Look at the third choice scrum halves at the other provinces. Williams compares quite favourably. The equivalent would be Leinster going into a match with Nick McCarthy or Ulster with David Shanahan.

Mc Love

Buer wrote: »

I think you have a much loftier idea of what a squad player is than what it actually is. He would be third choice. A player called upon when others are unavailable. The only reason he'll feature this weekend is because two others are injured.

There's nothing laughable about him being a solid squad player. Do you really think 4 consecutive head coaches are completely wrong? Look at the third choice scrum halves at the other provinces. Williams compares quite favourably. The equivalent would be Leinster going into a match with Nick McCarthy or Ulster with David Shanahan.

At least we agree he's third choice scrum half. I just worry about the performance on Saturday given how he's not had good Heineken cup matches before

Caranica

Buer wrote: »

There's nothing laughable about him being a solid squad player. Do you really think 4 consecutive head coaches are completely wrong?.

How much of a say did the coaches have? Or would connections in high places carry more influence than it should?

thomond2006

A new born king to see POM POM POM POM POM

#CorkConMafia

awec

Caranica wrote: »

How much of a say did the coaches have? Or would connections in high places carry more influence than it should?

Coaches could replace him, but it would be difficult. Not because of connections, but just down to how the provinces are run and also in this case any new signing would know they are guaranteed to be second choice forever. Not many decent players would be willing to sign up for that.

razorblunt

The thing about Williams is that I don't think he's done anymore than any other scrum halfs would have done given the repeated chances he's been given.
It's also a bit mad he's been there since the Academy days, that's a hell of a run.

dregin

Sabre0001 wrote: »

Another injury...

https://twitter.com/Munsterrugby/status/1049584527457349632




(If anyone picks up injuries from these soccer sessions though..... )

I once lost a toenail stubbing it on a football when we resorted to playing five a side when the pitch we were to train on was waterlogged. Goes to prove that soccer is indeed the worst.

Clegg

Munster A to take on Leinster A. Great to see Tyler B back. But can't help but feel that the boat has sailed on his Munster career. He can't be trusted to stay fit and Joey has usurped him as Munster's starting 10 I'm the senior side.

Munster A: Stephen Fitzgerald; Liam Coombes, Shane Daly, Alex McHenry, Alex Wootton; Bill Johnston (C), Charlie O’Doherty; Josh Wycherley, Diarmuid Barron, Jeremy Loughman; Fineen Wycherley, Darren O’Shea; Sean O’Connor, Gavin Coombes, Dave O’Callaghan.

Replacements: Kevin O’Byrne, Cronan Gleeson, Keynan Knox, Paddy Kelly, Dan Walsh, Evan Maher, Tyler Bleyendaal, Sean French.

Clegg

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

Clegg wrote: »

Munster A to take on Leinster A. Great to see Tyler B back. But can't help but feel that the boat has sailed on his Munster career. He can't be trusted to stay fit and Joey has usurped him as Munster's starting 10 I'm the senior side.

Munster A: Stephen Fitzgerald; Liam Coombes, Shane Daly, Alex McHenry, Alex Wootton; Bill Johnston (C), Charlie O’Doherty; Josh Wycherley, Diarmuid Barron, Jeremy Loughman; Fineen Wycherley, Darren O’Shea; Sean O’Connor, Gavin Coombes, Dave O’Callaghan.

Replacements: Kevin O’Byrne, Cronan Gleeson, Keynan Knox, Paddy Kelly, Dan Walsh, Evan Maher, Tyler Bleyendaal, Sean French.

If Tyler has the work ethic to come back from not 1, but 2 serious injury set backs then he has the work ethic to put Carbery under plenty of pressure which is good for both.

Leinster have named a strong enough side - should be a good game.

aloooof

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

It's an interesting one, as all 3 of Tyler B, JJ and Keatley's contracts are up at the end of the season. And Tyler's pretty much been injured the entire time since JVG's arrival. With the RWC as well at the start of next season, whomever gets preferred will get a decent run of games.

Personally, I'd love that to be Tyler if he can put his injury woes behind him (which is a massive questions mark).

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

Clegg wrote: »

Munster A to take on Leinster A. Great to see Tyler B back. But can't help but feel that the boat has sailed on his Munster career. He can't be trusted to stay fit and Joey has usurped him as Munster's starting 10 I'm the senior side.

Munster A: Stephen Fitzgerald; Liam Coombes, Shane Daly, Alex McHenry, Alex Wootton; Bill Johnston (C), Charlie O’Doherty; Josh Wycherley, Diarmuid Barron, Jeremy Loughman; Fineen Wycherley, Darren O’Shea; Sean O’Connor, Gavin Coombes, Dave O’Callaghan.

Replacements: Kevin O’Byrne, Cronan Gleeson, Keynan Knox, Paddy Kelly, Dan Walsh, Evan Maher, Tyler Bleyendaal, Sean French.

With Keatley and JJH both out of contract next summer also, there's no reason TB can't earn himself a new deal over the next few months. His age profile puts him in a better spot than Keatley and his overall ability and pedigree puts him in a better spot than JJH. All he needs to do is stay fit for 12 weeks and get pen to paper, I reckon.

shootermacg

Guess Who's Back, Back Again? JJ's Back, Tell a Friend

TBH, I'd keep Keats and let the others go. I wouldn't be asking Keats to kick though!

Dubinusa

Bill Johnson could be the the future. TB is getting on in age and is a walking medical encyclopedia. I'd dump him first and the JJ.

The Lost Sheep

A new born king to see POM POM POM POM POM

Dubinusa wrote: »

Bill Johnson could be the the future. TB is getting on in age and is a walking medical encyclopedia. I'd dump him first and the JJ.

Tyler is 28 so not that bad.
Bill Johnson needs to show far more at the lower levels and then maybe looked at more for pro14 level

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

shootermacg wrote: »

TBH, I'd keep Keats and let the others go. I wouldn't be asking Keats to kick though!

I'd say the same if Keatley wasn't 32 in the spring. Munster have to plan a little for the future. His best days are definitely behind him. I would say a one year extension at best. It's a shame because I think he has looked really good in the little game time he has been afforded this season.

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

Dubinusa wrote: »

Bill Johnson could be the the future. TB is getting on in age

He's 28! We're all screwed if that's getting on in age!

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

Jesus I must be way over the hill so, there goes the dream of starting 10 for Munster!

Squidgy Black

Deysel powered va JJ

Buer wrote: »

He's 28! We're all screwed if that's getting on in age!

Yeah they should release TB because at 28 he's over the hill.

But should keep the 32 year old Keatley.....

Burkie1203

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Jesus I must be way over the hill so, there goes the dream of starting 10 for Munster!

There is always Ulster tho

shootermacg

Guess Who's Back, Back Again? JJ's Back, Tell a Friend

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Yeah they should release TB because at 28 he's over the hill.

But should keep the 32 year old Keatley.....

Yeah TB is practically 20 in games played per year!

Caranica

JJ should go imo. He's not top 2 for any of the positions he covers

slingerz

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Tyler is 28 so not that bad.
Bill Johnson needs to show far more at the lower levels and then maybe looked at more for pro14 level

Bill Johnston has shown more than JJ/Keatley off the tee for me and should be involved more

The Lost Sheep

A new born king to see POM POM POM POM POM

slingerz wrote: »

Bill Johnston has shown more than JJ/Keatley off the tee for me and should be involved more

There's a lot more than kicking off the tee and what else has Johnson shown to be involved more?

thomond2006

A new born king to see POM POM POM POM POM

Indo reporting that Scannell and Goggin will start at centre, with Haley also set to feature.

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

thomond2006 wrote: »

Indo reporting that Scannell and Goggin will start at centre, with Haley also set to feature.

That's an interesting call. Would seem the writing is on the wall for Taute's Munster career possibly? Wouldn't make much sense for Munster to retain a NIQ player who would be on a decent wedge and isn't making the team.

Munster are going to possibly be in a Leinster-esque backrow situation with their centres. They've a glut of them who are all very good and it's going to be near impossible to keep them all happy. I'd imagine Farrell will be back into the side upon his return (assuming he hits form/fitness) but Sam Arnold is someone that could be looking at his options this time next year if he's failing to get into the European sides.

aloooof

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

Buer wrote: »

That's an interesting call. Would seem the writing is on the wall for Taute's Munster career possibly? Wouldn't make much sense for Munster to retain a NIQ player who would be on a decent wedge and isn't making the team.

Munster are going to possibly be in a Leinster-esque backrow situation with their centres. They've a glut of them who are all very good and it's going to be near impossible to keep them all happy. I'd imagine Farrell will be back into the side upon his return (assuming he hits form/fitness) but Sam Arnold is someone that could be looking at his options this time next year if he's failing to get into the European sides.

It's certainly a far cry from a few seasons ago when we fielded Hurley and Andrew Smith in midfield in a Pro12 final.

thomond2006

A new born king to see POM POM POM POM POM

Buer wrote: »

That's an interesting call. Would seem the writing is on the wall for Taute's Munster career possibly? Wouldn't make much sense for Munster to retain a NIQ player who would be on a decent wedge and isn't making the team.

Munster are going to possibly be in a Leinster-esque backrow situation with their centres. They've a glut of them who are all very good and it's going to be near impossible to keep them all happy. I'd imagine Farrell will be back into the side upon his return (assuming he hits form/fitness) but Sam Arnold is someone that could be looking at his options this time next year if he's failing to get into the European sides.

Arnold being eligible for England adds to his value over there too. I really hope Munster can get a deal done, he's still got years to develop.