Final Fantasy VII - 20 Years On!

Retr0gamer

Deleted User wrote: »

What was the biggest JRPG before this?

JRPG sales were very low in the west and very few got released before FF7. FF7 made them massive mainstream releases during the PS1/PS2 era.

As said Dragon Quest 6 was probably the biggest before it, Dragon Quest is basically the Call of Duty of Japan and is far more popular than FF (and dare I say a better in some cases).

Before that in the west the biggest were probably FF6, Chrono Trigger and FF6, all of which never made it to Europe. Secret of Mana might have sold more considering it also got a European release.

super_furry

Still a great game to my mind and second only to FF IX in the series - although I haven't played FF XV yet.

Retr0gamer

Retr0gamer wrote: »

JRPG sales were very low in the west and very few got released before FF7. FF7 made them massive mainstream releases during the PS1/PS2 era.

As said Dragon Quest 6 was probably the biggest before it, Dragon Quest is basically the Call of Duty of Japan and is far more popular than FF (and dare I say a better in some cases).

Before that in the west the biggest were probably FF6, Chrono Trigger and FF6, all of which never made it to Europe. Secret of Mana might have sold more considering it also got a European release.

Bonkers to think FF6 and Chrono Trigger didn't come to Europe. The two best RPG's from that era imo.

Retr0gamer

Well Nintendo thought Europeans didn't like RPGs so never bothered to release any.

We did get a few though. Mostly action RPGs like secret of mana and terrangina which was Europe exclusive in English for some bizarre reason.

We did get some turn based stuff, France got the sailor moon RPG and Lufia 2 was released across Europe. Not too shabby. I consider Lufia 2 one of the greatest RPGs of all time, up there with Dragon Quest 5, earthbound and chrono trigger on the SNES. Also it's a narrative masterpiece, it's got a strangely well handled and realistic depiction of a relationship. Usually in videogames it's the hero gets the girl, Lufia 2 has something far more complex and realistic. It's bizarre to have in a 16 but RPG considering no other game comes close to matching it.

Sega were a lot better and brought the entire Shining series and Phantasy Star series to the west before they became assholes after the Dreamcast collapsed.

johnny_ultimate

It's been the guts of a decade since I've played it. I'm sure if I went back now I'd be less forgiving of the narrative clichés, the tonal bipolarity, the limited combat system, the misjudged asides, the less-than-exemplary mini-games etc... In some senses, I'm pretty reluctant to go back for those reasons.

Yet if I think back to games from my childhood, few if any resonate quite so strongly today. It was as far as I recall my first RPG of any sort, so some allowances should be made for that. But even then playing a game of such scope and vastness was a very special experience.

It does one thing I don't think any Final Fantasy after has managed (even though - and I haven't played it since basically release - FFIX is almost certainly the superior game) - or, for that matter, many games at all. It really nails the moments. The way the (superb) art design and (even better) music come together with everything else to create really iconic sequences and events. I mean - jumping off the train as 'bombing mission' plays in what was - for the time, I cannot stress enough - 'seamless'; encountering Aeries for the first time; leaving Midgar; the Cosmo Canyon observatory; the date(s) in the Gold Saucer; the whole Vincent sequence; taking to the skies in the Highwind for the first time; FINALLY getting that damn Gold chocobo; descending into the crater to fight Sephiroth. There's many more than those as well. Few games are as purely iconic.

Again, it's been so long that I'd struggle to really say anything about how they fit into a whole, and even in my less critical early days some bits were a pain in the arse (copying the marches springs to mind, and the early chocobo races before you effectively become godobo and barely have to press a button). In my memory anyway they all coalesce into something that I recall as perhaps more epic than they really were. But perhaps that's not fair - as flawed as the game surely was (and is more so now, given its existence in a medium that ages rather viciously) it was a genuine landmark at the time, and one thing that's near impossible to deny is that it was instrumental in paving the way for the many amazing things that came afterwards. Only the rare few can earn such praise.

Retr0gamer

It holds up alright, I played it again not too long ago with the fan translation and despite all the criticism you can level at the game it's still a lot of fun to play. It's well paced without any dull moments, except those accursed minigames which are all frankly utter ****e.

riffmongous

Retr0gamer wrote: »

It holds up alright, I played it again not too long ago with the fan translation and despite all the criticism you can level at the game it's still a lot of fun to play. It's well paced without any dull moments, except those accursed minigames which are all frankly utter ****e.

Motorcycle section at least had a cool song, I hated the submarine bit

YouSavedMyLife

riffmongous wrote: »

Motorcycle section at least had a cool song, I hated the submarine bit

Everything about the game was amazing

Retr0gamer

YouSavedMyLife wrote: »

Everything about the game was amazing

J Mysterio

This thread has inspired me to play this again. This was such an incredible game. A watershed moment in gaming.

YouSavedMyLife

J Mysterio wrote: »

This thread has inspired me to play this again. This was such an incredible game. A watershed moment in gaming.

You must be a fanboi

Taylor365

Best game of all time when you played it between the age of 7-14.

Probably wouldn't have such a big impact on a more mature taste.

Also, most people only had it because it was bundled with the Playstation!

Liam McPoyle

Currently playing it for the first time and enjoying it well enough.

It is of course very limited given its age but its a good story with some good characters. As a nostalgia trip its cool.

Retr0gamer

Taylor365 wrote: »

Also, most people only had it because it was bundled with the Playstation!

It never was?

RobbingBandit

First video game soundtrack I ever bought, spent months finding all the materia, great character development throughout the game, took ages to beat the ruby and emerald weapons, the gold saucer was a place of infinite horror upgrading the limit breaks took forever. Favorite game followed by Ocarina and Persona 4 golden.

Pac1Man

Zero-Cool wrote: »

Anyone else make a balls of their leaving cert because of this game?

That's a great thread idea!

Fekin Pro Evo 6 local multiplayer.

Sonics2k

Final Fantasy VII was my first true love of gaming. I'd been playing video games since the 80's and had a fair few favourites like Warcraft and Mario/Sonic etc.

FF7 was the first game I fell in love with. Honestly, it was the moment I first left Midgar was the blow away moment for me. The story was pretty involving, and whilst it did go bat**** crazy in the middle, I loved the twists involving Sephiroth and Clouds past.

Was it the greatest game ever made? No.
Was it the best JRPG or even Final Fantasy game? No.

But FF7 is a fantastic game, deeply set into a great world and great challenges outside the main game too.
I still have my original copy, as well as purchases on Steam and PSN.

Up until the release of the Witcher 3 it held my personal title of Best Game Ever.

Retr0gamer

RobbingBandit wrote: »

First video game soundtrack I ever bought, spent months finding all the materia, great character development throughout the game, took ages to beat the ruby and emerald weapons, the gold saucer was a place of infinite horror upgrading the limit breaks took forever. Favorite game followed by Ocarina and Persona 4 golden.

While I believe the compositions are exceptional for the most part (there's a few stinkers in there) the instrumentation used is god awful. As a result the soundtrack is actually a massive step backwards from Uematsu's compositions on the SNES as the instruments sound lower quality than even the SNES's compressed sound samples.

I always believed this was a sound engineer issue due to people not being experienced with the PS1 hardware but the recent article by Polygon revealed it was Uematsu's call and was there to keep load times down. Apparently he was pretty envious when he heard the Suikoden soundtrack and compared it to his FF7 work. Thankfully all subsequent PS1 square games said to hell with load times and were much higher quality in terms of samples used. FFVIII is a massive leap over FFVII and even Parasite Eve which arrived shortly after FF7.

Sephiroth_dude

RopeDrink wrote: »

Musically, brilliant - and to think it was all MIDI back then.
.

Nobuo's best work imo.

RedXIV

Retr0gamer wrote: »

It never was?

It was commonly sold with the playstation if you bought from Argos The bundle we got from xmas had Crash Bandicoot 2, Porsche Challenge, Cool Boarders 2 and ......Final Fantasy VII


I'm mature enough to acknowledge that Final Fantasy VII isn't the best game in the world, and that I've thoroughly enjoyed other games. But the age I was when I got the game, combined with the love I never knew I had for JRPGs has left me with fantastic, nostalgic love for the game. I play the game maybe once a year, I still own the game on any platform you can get it on and I'm one of the few I'd say who watched FFVII:AC more than once

Took me nearly 6 months to get past the shinra building because I was too young to understand how the materia system worked and the elevator boss killed me every time

johnny_ultimate

Retr0gamer wrote: »

the instrumentation used is god awful

I would not change a single goddamn thing about the instrumentation for Fight On!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsLnioY3FVY

Retr0gamer

While the drums and synth sound good but not great the guitar, organ, violins and a few others sound pretty ropey. If the actual composer actually recognises the flaw in his own work well then you know it's flawed. Just compare that to the quality of the samples in FF8, especially the organ and guitar. It's a world apart. I think one winged Angel is the only track where Uematsu actually used higher quality samples.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZMWszd5SRk

J Mysterio

I work in the translation industry and I can tell you that what you are saying is entirely correct. Companies pay the translators nothing, adopt interns that are used and abused, and have no real QA worthy of the name. It is quick turnarounds with little room for creative thinking or care.

Retr0gamer

The problem with that example isn't the grammar, it's the fact that the instructions it gives you are the opposite of what you should do.

Also you arent takingb into account squaresoft 16 bit translations were amazing for the time coming to the end of that generation. Ted Woolsey did amazing work on the likes of FF6, Chromo Trigger and Super Mario RPG. FF7 was a massive step backwards to the utter rubbish that passed for localisation for the likes of breath of fire 2 and FF2/4. Saying that, FF Tactics was even worse.

The localisers themselves admit it was awful and should have been better in the polygon article. No need to try and defend it, it's universally regarded as awful.

Thankfully it had one good outcome. It was so awful it made Alexander O Smith apply for contracting work there to make things better and he would later go on to localise the likes of Vagrant Story FF12 and FF10 (laugh at that all you want but read the usgamer article on it. It's a miracle it was coherent at all considering the BS he had to put up with due to awful coding work by the original team).

NoviGlitzko

Funnily enough I thought one game bettered it the year after (or was it two?), Final Fantasy VIII. Still my favourite game after nearly two decades.

Evade

Retr0gamer wrote: »

The problem with that example isn't the grammar, it's the fact that the instructions it gives you are the opposite of what you should do.

It's a bad sentence break but it's not like it doesn't tell you it will counter attack in the next window.

Retr0gamer

Evade wrote: »

It's a bad sentence break but it's not like it doesn't tell you it will counter attack in the next window.

Well it's not how I ever interpreted it. For me it was:

Barret: 'Attack while it's tail is up! It's gonna counter attack with its laser!'

One turn later

Cloud: '**** you Barret'

Evade

I always read the counter attack in the second sentence being caused by attack in the first sentence.

One thing that does really annoy me in the game is enemies that are weak to wind with no obvious wind magic available.

EDIT: There's tornado in the contain materia but that's practically end game and the first enemy that's weak to wind is in Midgar.

YouSavedMyLife

Evade wrote: »

I always read the counter attack in the second sentence being caused by attack in the first sentence.

One thing that does really annoy me in the game is enemies that are weak to wind with no obvious wind magic available.

EDIT: There's tornado in the contain materia but that's practically end game and the first enemy that's weak to wind is in Midgar.

Aren't all flying enemies weak to wind? Not sure if its listed when you Sense them but its kinda been common knowledge in JRPG for some time. Also doesn't one of the Contain magic spells do %based HP damage? Maybe the wind one?

Vicxas

God Damnit now i want to play this again.

I've played this a good 20 ish times, still always stick with the 3 guys every single time.

Cloud, Barret, Vincent.