One in four people in Ireland experience sexual abuse.

.........

One in four people in Ireland experience sexual abuse.

from oneinfour.ie

"One in four people in Ireland experience sexual abuse. It might be you, someone, you care about or someone you're friendly with."

Does anyone else find this statistic shocking and outraging, and that it is still going on day in day out in so called modern Ireland, behind closed doors by parents, uncles, brothers, neighbours, state/hse care etc. If this statistic is accurate, then there seems to be a huge current day wall of silence in Ireland and in the Irish media about the massive levels of current day ongoing sexual abuse. How does this statistic compare with other countries or is Ireland particularly perverted by comparison ?

dar100

It's actually moe like 2 in 4

DrumSteve

dar100 wrote: »

It's actually moe like 2 in 4

Is that not 1 in 2

Also feels like one of those fishing threads where a new account puts one of these questions out there so we can all be quoted in the Daily Star

.........

Also feels like one of those fishing threads where a new account puts one of these questions out there so we can all be quoted in the Daily Star

A better question would be why some people feel threatened by an open discussion, and want this swept under the carpet ?

DrumSteve

......... wrote: »

A better question would be why some people feel threatened by an open discussion, and want this swept under the carpet ?

Well how about giving your opinion on the matter rather than posting a bunch of vaguely leading questions and get the ball rolling? Go on, the floor is yours.

stefanovich

......... wrote: »

One in four people in Ireland experience sexual abuse.

from oneinfour.ie

"One in four people in Ireland experience sexual abuse. It might be you, someone, you care about or someone you're friendly with."

I'd love to know what they define sexual abuse as. I'm guessing they have a very broad definition.

.........

Well how about giving your opinion on the matter rather than posting a bunch of vaguely leading questions and get the ball rolling? Go on, the floor is yours.

Read the OP I already did, so rather than trying to bury it and silence it, what is your opinion about the rate of sexual abuse in Ireland ?

Arcade_Tryer

......... wrote: »

Does anyone else find this statistic shocking

It's 2017. Nothing is shocking.

Richard Hillman

The usual click-baity type stats. They work out how many people have admitted that they were abused, then they multiply it by the highest possible factor of people who may not be telling the truth or are hiding what happened.

DrumSteve

......... wrote: »

Read the OP I already did, so rather than trying to bury it and silence it, what is your opinion about the rate of sexual abuse in Ireland ?

Bury it and silence it? Lol.

Us responding to you is keeping your thread at the top of the most popular forum in Ireland so get out of here with that.

endacl

......... wrote: »

what is your opinion about the rate of sexual abuse in Ireland ?

I think it should be lower...?

Noddyholder

......... wrote: »

One in four people in Ireland experience sexual abuse.

from oneinfour.ie

"One in four people in Ireland experience sexual abuse. It might be you, someone, you care about or someone you're friendly with."

Does anyone else find this statistic shocking and outraging, and that it is still going on day in day out in so called modern Ireland, behind closed doors by parents, uncles, brothers, neighbours, state/hse care etc. If this statistic is accurate, then there seems to be a huge current day wall of silence in Ireland and in the Irish media about the massive levels of current day ongoing sexual abuse. How does this statistic compare with other countries or is Ireland particularly perverted by comparison ?

I went into 1in4 website, It says the same there, but no links or where there getting that information from ? Seems very high...

Outlaw Pete

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

It's 2017. Nothing is shocking.

2017? Sure Perry Farrell's been saying that for 29 years.

suicide_circus

#myquangoneedsfunding

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

They have been using that statistic since 2002. And they say it is still exactly the same?

One eyed Jack

......... wrote: »

One in four people in Ireland experience sexual abuse.

from oneinfour.ie

"One in four people in Ireland experience sexual abuse. It might be you, someone, you care about or someone you're friendly with."

Does anyone else find this statistic shocking and outraging, and that it is still going on day in day out in so called modern Ireland, behind closed doors by parents, uncles, brothers, neighbours, state/hse care etc. If this statistic is accurate, then there seems to be a huge current day wall of silence in Ireland and in the Irish media about the massive levels of current day ongoing sexual abuse. How does this statistic compare with other countries or is Ireland particularly perverted by comparison ?

The statistic/slogan is designed to be shocking. It's entirely and utterly without foundation though. How does it compare to other countries? Well you have self-interested lobby groups peddling the same slogan/stastic for their own political purposes / social ideology too.

I wouldn't panic about it and it wouldn't cause me to become paranoid either. Here in Ireland at least everyone in society is entitled to their good name and the presumption of innocence.

stefanovich

It'd be fun to see who was behind this website and what their ulterior motives are.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

One eyed Jack wrote: »

The statistic/slogan is designed to be shocking. It's entirely and utterly without foundation though. How does it compare to other countries? Well you have self-interested lobby groups peddling the same slogan/stastic for their own political purposes / social ideology too.

I wouldn't panic about it and it wouldn't cause me to become paranoid either. Here in Ireland at least everyone in society is entitled to their good name and the presumption of innocence.

Interestingly , oneinfour in the UK and the USA both claim the figure is....

Surprise surprise...

One in Four.

Too coincidental for my tastes.

.........

I went into 1in4 website, It says the same there, but no links or where there getting that information from ? Seems very high...

I'm wondering how accurate it is, it's shocking if its the current rate, we're often led to believe it's some sort of historical problem in Ireland rather than current day.

Dublin rape crisis centre reports 1 in 3 women and 1 in 5 men report has having been sexually abused as children here.

drcc.ie/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/RCC_CSA_2012.pdf

The CARI foundation, cari.ie are reporting one in 5 children in Ireland are affected by sexual abuse.

If any of these statistics are even roughly accurate it's appealing that there is a wall of silence in the Irish media that this level of abuse is STILL going on in this country, day in day out.

One eyed Jack

stefanovich wrote: »

It'd be fun to see who was behind this website and what their ulterior motives are.

http://m.independent.ie/irish-news/one-in-four-head-colm-ogorman-earns-80k-a-year-26236325.html

That was in 2003, Colm O' Gormless is head of Amnesty Ireland now and campaigns for issues like abortion and prostitution to be decriminalised in Ireland

A bit of an about-turn really, a full 180 in fact.

RDM_83 again

If i remember rightly the high figure quoted works of historic abuse that occured pre 1980's, so the percentage should be dropping considerably. Pointing this out would lead to less funding so they play it like the 1-4 figure is what's happening today
Was a thread on this exact topic before

.........

If i remember rightly the high figure quoted works of historic abuse that occured pre 1980's, so the percentage should be dropping considerably. Pointing this out would lead to less funding so they play it like the 1-4 figure is what's happening today
Was a thread on this exact topic before

The statistic/slogan is designed to be shocking. It's entirely and utterly without foundation though. How does it compare to other countries? Well you have self-interested lobby groups peddling the same slogan/stastic for their own political purposes / social ideology too.

I wouldn't panic about it and it wouldn't cause me to become paranoid either. Here in Ireland at least everyone in society is entitled to their good name and the presumption of innocence.

I find it hard to believe Dublin Rape Crisis centre and CARI who also quote similar figures are also making them up or are also deliberately trying to mislead people.

One eyed Jack

......... wrote: »

I find it hard to believe Dublin Rape Crisis centre and CARI who also quote similar figures are making them up.

I don't.

childsplay

If you took a survey of the number of women who have been groped or had their bottoms pinched then that might be close to one in four. I know that some of you won't agree that this kind of behaviour constitutes sexual contact. I think it is because it's an unasked for and uninvited invasion of a persons body in a very intimate and sexual manner. If someone walks up to you and puts their hands on you without your permission in law they have committed assault and battery.

That said, it's assault at the very lowest level and I don't think it's fair to call it sexual violence.

.........

I don't.

Really you're claiming Dublin Rape Crisis Centre make up their figures and why ? What are you basing this allegation on exactly ?

stefanovich

......... wrote: »

Really you're claiming Dublin Rape Crisis Centre make up their figures and why ? What are you basing this allegation on exactly ?

Big numbers means big funding.

Barry Badrinath

......... wrote: »

Read the OP I already did, so rather than trying to bury it and silence it, what is your opinion about the rate of sexual abuse in Ireland ?

Its too low.

I havent been sexually abused in weeks.

.........

Big numbers means big funding.

Let me get this right, the claim is Dublin Rape Crisis Centre and other such organisations are producing false figures in order to defraud the state of funding ? What evidence is there of this ?

Its too low.

I haven't been sexually abused in weeks.

Pretty sad you think sexual abuse is funny, it might not be so funny when it happens one of your family or friends.

Noddyholder

In Ireland research has shown that one in four children (27%) will experience sexual abuse before the age of 18. Despite well publicized scandals and reports, many Irish people remain unable to respond to this problem and the long term damage it creates individually and at societal level. Our determined aim is to change this.

Statistics source material: SAVI Report, The Ferns Report , The Ryan Report, The Murphy Report





That's were they get it from, its on there webpage.

Barry Badrinath

......... wrote: »

Let me get this right, the claim is Dublin Rape Crisis Centre and other such organisations are producing false figures in order to defraud the state of funding ? What evidence is there of this ?

1 in 4

Barry Badrinath

......... wrote: »

Glad you think sexual abuse is funny, it might not be so funny when it happens one of your family or friends.

You threatening my family and friends with sexual abuse OP?

You looking to make it 1 in 3 are ye?

Lets see how brave you are at dawn, bring your pistol and a bodybag that will fit you.

Bon chance

.........

"In Ireland research has shown that one in four children (27%) will experience sexual abuse before the age of 18. Despite well publicized scandals and reports, many Irish people remain unable to respond to this problem and the long term damage it creates individually and at societal level. Our determined aim is to change this."

Instead there seem to be a great wall of silence over this current abuse going on in Irish society though.

Is sexual abuse to include things like being swatted on the backside in pubs? If that's the case I believe it but it's still misleading. I'd call that harassment rather than abuse.

.........

You threatening my family and friends with sexual abuse OP?

You looking to make it 1 in 3 are ye?

Lets see how brave you are at dawn, bring your pistol and a bodybag that will fit you.

Bon chance

No, as well you know, I hope it never happens one of them and I doubt you'll think it as funny if it does.

Yourself isit

......... wrote: »

Let me get this right, the claim is Dublin Rape Crisis Centre and other such organisations are producing false figures in order to defraud the state of funding ? What evidence is there of this ?



Pretty sad you think sexual abuse is funny, it might not be so funny when it happens one of your family or friends.

surely it has happened to one of his family or friends. Statistically speaking.

222233

......... wrote: »

Really you're claiming Dublin Rape Crisis Centre make up their figures and why ? What are you basing this allegation on exactly ?

As of last census approx. 4,713,993 people in the country
1 / 4 of this population would be 1, 178, 498.

The statistic says 1 in 4 experience sexual abuse; what does sexual abuse in the context of this statistic describe?

Is it including everything that is constituted as sexual abuse?

Sexual abuse can be physical, verbal or emotional and involves tricking, bribing, forcing, pressurising or threatening a child or teenager into sexual awareness or activity. Sexual abuse involves the use of a child or teenager by an older or more knowledgeable person for their own sexual pleasure. It often begins gradually and increases insidiously over time.

Irish Health

RDM_83 again

Noddyholder wrote: »

In Ireland research has shown that one in four children (27%) will experience sexual abuse before the age of 18. Despite well publicized scandals and reports, many Irish people remain unable to respond to this problem and the long term damage it creates individually and at societal level. Our determined aim is to change this.

Statistics source material: SAVI Report, The Ferns Report , The Ryan Report, The Murphy Report





That's were they get it from, its on there webpage.

As I said above using those as sources means your giving a historic figure not a figure for children now.

It's like if you carried out interviews of the general English population and asked if they had fought in a war, then used those figures to say that there is X chance of people fighting in a war today ignoring the fact the figure is completely skewed by WW2/Korean vets.

One eyed Jack

......... wrote: »

Really you're claiming Dublin Rape Crisis Centre make up their figures and why ? What are you basing this allegation on exactly ?

I'm basing it on the fact that I've read the RCNI's annual reports for the last number of years, I've been to the conferences, I've met the donors, I've met the people who are paid to massage these figures until they represent what those commissioning the research want them to suggest and support, so honestly - no, I outright reject the 1 in 4 nonsemse.

I've also studied international studies and numerous other sources to try and gain a more informed perspective on the scale of how they manage to compile the figures for these studies and surveys, and definitions alone vary wildly, as well as accounts, testimonials and subjective perspectives.

Objectivity is like a dirty word to many of these groups who virtue signal about helping people, but really all they're set up for is to syphon funding from the HSE and private donors. The contributions of the general public on flag days would only make up a pittance of their funding.

.........

surely it has happened to one of his family or friends. Statistically speaking.

I hope not, but possibly if he knew it all. Any rate is too high, whatever the rate.

222233

One eyed Jack wrote: »

I'm basing it on the fact that I've read the RCNI's annual reports for the last number of years, I've been to the conferences, I've met the donors, I've met the people who are paid to massage these figures until they represent what those commissioning the research want them to suggest and support, so honestly - no, I outright reject the 1 in 4 nonsemse.

.

I had a look at these reports too and felt the figures were much smaller than I would expect to support a one in four statistic. I am however curious they simply said "one in four experience sexual abuse", as this is quite a vague description there is the possibility that other incidents classified as sexual abuse are being incorporated into the figure?

Edit: DOES anyone have access to or know where one can find the research conducted as part of the one in four campaign?

.........

I'm basing it on the fact that I've read the RCNI's annual reports for the last number of years, I've been to the conferences, I've met the donors, I've met the people who are paid to massage these figures until they represent what those commissioning the research want them to suggest and support, so honestly - no, I outright reject the 1 in 4 nonsemse.

I've also studied international studies and numerous other sources to try and gain a more informed perspective on the scale of how they manage to compile the figures for these studies and surveys, and definitions alone vary wildly, as well as accounts, testimonials and subjective perspectives.

Objectivity is like a dirty word to many of these groups who virtue signal about helping people, but really all they're set up for is to syphon funding from the HSE and private donors. The contributions of the general public on flag days would only make up a pittance of their funding.

If the Dublin Rape Crisis Centre, and One in Four are using false statistics to defraud the state of funding as you seem to be claiming, why have you not reported the fraud to the Garda ?

One eyed Jack

......... wrote: »

If the Dublin Rape Crisis Centre, and One in Four are using false statistics to defraud the state of funding as you seem to be claiming, why have you not reported the fraud to the Garda ?

Because they're not committing fraud?

Their statistics aren't false, their survey and research methods are poor, but I never suggested any criminal behaviour.

Wibbs

......... wrote: »

If the Dublin Rape Crisis Centre, and One in Four are using false statistics to defraud the state of funding as you seem to be claiming, why have you not reported the fraud to the Garda ?

Ahhh the perennial favourite of the rape panic quangos and their mouthpieces. I broke this down in a previous thread on a similar subject. Quick search and I found it. Some home truths for you....

*Me. In a previous thread.*

The Koss study(and I use the term broadly) back in the 1980's was the one that kicked this "one in four" stuff off and her methodology was beyond risible. It has since been repeated so often it has become a "fact", a meme. Sometimes it's 1 in 4, sometimes 1 in 3, now 1 in 5 seems the go to figure.

But let's not let facts get in the way of reality, god forbid...

US gov led studies(PDF) into the reported incidence of sexual violence* in the wider US shows at worst 5 in a 1000 women in 1995(the rates of what they term "completed rape" actually dropped from nearly 4 to under 2 per 1000 women from 1995-2010). These are averages taken over two year periods. So how do we get that figure up to one of 250 per 1000 women? Unless we want to believe that US colleges are rape centers of a level that would suggest military intervention? Interestingly and because of the panic surrounding this "study" and worries about lawsuits, colleges themselves by law have to compile and provide reported crime stats on campus - Example 1/Example 2 - and their stats reflect the wider national stats the government study found, not within an asses roar of "one in four" or five for that matter. Indeed a woman at college is at less risk of rape compared to her sisters outside.

But let's take another US government study(PDF) that seems to back the high figure up. As an exercise take out all other criteria of sexual victimisation* and just look at the stats for completed rapes. This comes to just under 2% of those surveyed. 2% is still far too many BTW.

However even looking at that 2% of would be defined in the common mind as "obvious rape" the report states;

"In each incident report, respondents were asked, “Do you consider this incident to be a rape?”. For the 86 incidents categorized as a completed rape, 46.5 percent (n = 40) of the women answered “yes,” 48.8 percent (n = 42) answered “no,” and 4.7 percent (n = 4) answered “don’t know.”.

So of the women in the study whose experience was considered to be clear cut, no question rape, nearly half of them didn't consider it to be. Now of course sexual assault is a minefield of horrible emotional upset and people can easily blot out an incident or pass it off at the time, but when nearly half of a survey of people who apparently fit the bill of full on rape state that they don't consider it such other questions have to be asked. In the original "1 in 4" Koss study this figure was even higher. 73% of those women didn't consider it rape(and 40 odd per cent of them continued sleeping with the same guy). Apparently we "should just believe women", except when it suits some not to of course...

It's not unlike the cops showing to your house and telling you you've been burgled because you're missing a couple of DVD's and you telling them that you gave them to a mate, yet they continue to insist it was a robbery and report it in the stats. You couldn't make this guff up folks. And because the R word is so emotive(naturally), you will rarely hear this unfounded stat being questioned, never mind debunked.









*This runs the gamut from rape through unwanted fondling to verbal threats of a sexual nature.

That enough for you OP?

.........

"
Because they're not committing fraud?

Their statistics aren't false, their survey and research methods are poor, but I never suggested any criminal behaviour."

You just claimed 10 minutes ago people are paid to massage the figures, and funding is obtained using these figures, so which is it ?

wakka12

Yeh Ireland's particularly perverted :roll eyes: Im sure women and children are so much safer in countries where law enforcement are hopelessly incompetent and corrupt and women are treated like dirt,and theres practically no rescources for those affected by sexual assault, which is a very large amount of countries in the world

Yourself isit

Here's the main report they tend to use.

http://www.oneinfour.ie/content/resources/savi.pdf

wakka12

Also as others have pointed out, this 'shocking' statistic is useless without any context. The criteria which was considered to determine whether it was sexual abuse is important info, as is the sample size of those interviewed, and the demographics of those interviewed, and then how they estimated the final 1 in 4 figure.

No point even discussing this figure unless these things are known

CIARAN_BOYLE

wakka12 wrote: »

Also as others have pointed out, this 'shocking' statistic is useless without any context. The criteria which was considered to determine whether it was sexual abuse is important info, as is the sample size of those interviewed, and the demographics of those interviewed, and then how they estimated the final 1 in 4 figure.

No point even discussing this figure unless these things are known

Agreed.

If you include two 15 year olds having sex with each other as both being abused (statutory rape) I wouldn't be surprised by the idea that one in four Irish people are abused.

Or if you include consensual sex when one or both parties have had a level of alcohol as abuse.

I'm sure 90% of the population would be abused by one of the two situations I mention above. 90% of the population though wouldnt really consider it abuse.

Wibbs

......... wrote: »

Any rate is too high, whatever the rate.

Indeed, but that's not an argument, it's arse covering and a way to dismiss any actual fact that may creep in. IE "1 in 4": Disproven/Reasonably questioned. Response: "well it doesn't matter if it's 1 in 4 or 1 in 40, or 400, 1 is too many! Rape is rape!" Eh yeah, but just because we have cases of malaria in Ireland every year, this does not mean Ireland has a malaria problem and it kinda does matter if one is looking for some sort of objective reality and not political or ideological bias.

Yourself isit

Here are the categorizations.

. During your childhood or adolescence did anyone ever show you or persuade you to look at pornographic material (for example, magazines, videos, internet, etc.) in a way that made you feel uncomfortable?
2. Did anyone ever make you or persuade you to take off your clothes, or have you pose alone or with others in a sexually suggestive way or in ways that made you feel confused or uncomfortable in order to photograph or video you?
3. As a child or adolescent, did anyone expose their sexual organs to you?
4. During this time did anyone masturbate in front of you?
5. Did anyone touch your body, including your breasts or genitals, in a sexual way? a
6. During your childhood or adolescence, did anyone try to have you arouse them, or touch their body in a sexual way?
7. Did anyone rub their genitals against your body in a sexual way?
8. Did anyone attempt to have sexual intercourse with you?
9. Did anyone succeed in having sexual intercourse with you?
10. Did anyone, male or female, make you or persuade you to have oral sex?
11. Did a man make you or persuade you to have anal sex?
12. Did anyone put their fingers or objects in your vagina or anus (back passage)? a

Now it strikes me that I am in fact a victim, as in fact on a school trip to Paris we ( group of male and female 13 year olds getting off a bus) were accosted by a guy who had on a trench coat and nothing else. I remember giggling as the teacher told him to piss off.

In the table you will see that penatrative sexual activity is about 2%.

.........

Ahhh the perennial favourite of the rape panic quangos and their mouthpieces. I broke this down in a previous thread on a similar subject. Quick search and I found it. Some home truths for you....

*Me. In a previous thread.*

The Koss study(and I use the term broadly) back in the 1980's was the one that kicked this "one in four" stuff off and her methodology was beyond risible. It has since been repeated so often it has become a "fact", a meme. Sometimes it's 1 in 4, sometimes 1 in 3, now 1 in 5 seems the go to figure.

But let's not let facts get in the way of reality, god forbid...

US gov led studies(PDF) into the reported incidence of sexual violence* in the wider US shows at worst 5 in a 1000 women in 1995(the rates of what they term "completed rape" actually dropped from nearly 4 to under 2 per 1000 women from 1995-2010). These are averages taken over two year periods. So how do we get that figure up to one of 250 per 1000 women? Unless we want to believe that US colleges are rape centers of a level that would suggest military intervention? Interestingly and because of the panic surrounding this "study" and worries about lawsuits, colleges themselves by law have to compile and provide reported crime stats on campus - Example 1/Example 2 - and their stats reflect the wider national stats the government study found, not within an asses roar of "one in four" or five for that matter. Indeed a woman at college is at less risk of rape compared to her sisters outside.

But let's take another US government study(PDF) that seems to back the high figure up. As an exercise take out all other criteria of sexual victimisation* and just look at the stats for completed rapes. This comes to just under 2% of those surveyed. 2% is still far too many BTW.

However even looking at that 2% of would be defined in the common mind as "obvious rape" the report states;

"In each incident report, respondents were asked, “Do you consider this incident to be a rape?”. For the 86 incidents categorized as a completed rape, 46.5 percent (n = 40) of the women answered “yes,” 48.8 percent (n = 42) answered “no,” and 4.7 percent (n = 4) answered “don’t know.”.

So of the women in the study whose experience was considered to be clear cut, no question rape, nearly half of them didn't consider it to be. Now of course sexual assault is a minefield of horrible emotional upset and people can easily blot out an incident or pass it off at the time, but when nearly half of a survey of people who apparently fit the bill of full on rape state that they don't consider it such other questions have to be asked. In the original "1 in 4" Koss study this figure was even higher. 73% of those women didn't consider it rape(and 40 odd per cent of them continued sleeping with the same guy). Apparently we "should just believe women", except when it suits some not to of course...

It's not unlike the cops showing to your house and telling you you've been burgled because you're missing a couple of DVD's and you telling them that you gave them to a mate, yet they continue to insist it was a robbery and report it in the stats. You couldn't make this guff up folks. And because the R word is so emotive(naturally), you will rarely hear this unfounded stat being questioned, never mind debunked.

Some home truths for you....

The real truth is, before you went off half cocked, in the OP one of my primary question was how accurate are the statistics for Ireland. I'm not into the political spin by them or you.

So the abuse statistics in common used in Ireland by abuse support organisations are made up. I have yet to see any convincing evidence that is true, but I'm open to accurate independent statistics and studies for IRELAND if you have any, rather than ranting about the USA.

Lets say we should believe you instead of the Dublin Rape Crisis centre, One in Four, CARI, etc. etc. etc., what are the accurate statistics in Ireland, because that's what I'm interested in right from the beginning of the OP.