Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

Gusser09

Has anyone seen any reports of the explosion in drug use since the implementation of mup? Ive heard that recreational drug use has gone through the roof at home. Interesting to see the stats.

techman1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120289912#Comment_120289912

Always be fearful of fundamentalists, imagine if these guys were in front of the nuclear button

rob316

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120449252#Comment_120449252

I didn't mention expense. I drink whiskey at 60 quid a bottle and craft beers 3 euro plus they were always that price.

For instance I loved strana in Aldi it was 1.09 a bottle now it's 1.99

It's inexpensive to me still but my point was I can't enjoy it as much, I'm paying almost 200% for some bs reason like MUP not market inflation.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450444#Comment_120450444

If people are still buying it in the same qty, it is a fair price.

It was under priced to begin with.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450665#Comment_120450665

If its still selling in the same quantity, then Aldi had underpriced it in the first place.

A beer that costs less than a 330ml can of coke was clearly at a very low price point.

Perhaps even a loss leader.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450750#Comment_120450750

If it's selling in the same quantity then the entire MUP theory is busted.

How about comparing like for like - ALDI's version of cola with ALDI's beer? You want to find the alcoholic product in ALDI that was cheaper per litre than their soft drinks?

It's a bit misleading comparison otherwise.

Mr. teddywinkles

Tell me one sector where government meddling hasn't resulted in the citizens of ireland either getting screwed or fooking it up beyond all repair. Fubar.

Mr. teddywinkles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120449252#Comment_120449252

16e for 8 cans is well expensive especially for muck brands

Dont go travelling the continent. Ya might have a heart attack.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450734#Comment_120450734

There is no logic in your post.

People who like a drink at home and can afford the new price will just pay it or head for NI.

I've already explained to you that there is no such thing as under priced.

Check out the price of beer in supermarkets in the EU.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450772#Comment_120450772

If Aldi do a cheap cola, thats irrelevant. Its not a can of coca cola.

My point is you can still buy a can of beer for the price as you can purchase a can of coca cola.

its a stretch therefore to say that MUP has made alcohol expensive.

That said, my original point was that something being expensive is an abstract concept.

A 2 euro can of beer is expensive to some, but its very cheap to the 7 euro a pint man.

There was a link posted that cider sales had reduced by 18.5% in Scotland as a result of MUP. so it perhaps is doing what it intended to do?

I do wonder whether those sales were diverted to other drinks though. Or was there a genuine reduction in consumption. Hard to say.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450831#Comment_120450831

I travel a lot and I know its cheaper in many european countries. So are lots of things.

Thats not a MUP phenomenon.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450844#Comment_120450844

And ive already explained to you that there is such a thing as under priced.

if people continue to buy at the same quantity then the item was originally under priced and your product continues to secure its place in the market.

Its basic economics.

We are never going to agree on this whole MUP being expensive point, but what I would say is that the majority of people dont think its expensive.

There is no real objection to it amongst the population.

So unless the MUP Floor price considerably increased to say 3 or 4 euro a can, there isnt going to be a large scale push back against it.

Most people that drink in pubs or restaurants, even ocassionally, wouldnt even notice MUP exists, since the comparitive price of alcohol is still so cheap.

If you drink anything other than the very low priced products, MUP isnt noticable anyway.

Its here to stay so people need to get used to it.

But the simple fact is that it really doesnt affect enough people to create any noticable opposition to it.

rob316

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450750#Comment_120450750

They didn't have it under priced, MUP has created a false base for what the market price is. You are now forced to pay 70-100% more for the same product due to an ineffective law.

Beer is relatively cheap to make at a mass level, as cheap as a can of coke. Your point is moot as the likes of Dutch gold, aldi's own brands were selling under €1 per can, the whole alcohol section can't be a loss leader.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450847#Comment_120450847

Or maybe it shows that a price of a can of coca cola IS expensive. When you can buy a 2 litre of Tesco or ALDI cola for a fraction of the price. And you can buy a 2 litre bottle of Cola for a fraction of the equivalent price of any alcoholic beverage. So why a can of coca cola sold singly has become the metric is without foundation.

How is the price of a cola is ALDI NOT relevant to a discussion on the price of alcohol in ALDI? Absurd.

And a 2 euro can is expensive to the people who have been shopping the supermarket all along.

Which again is surely the most relevant comparison - the people who are actually buying it in that supermarket and have been doing so.

Given all the changes happening over the last few years, pandemic, shifting demographics and drinking patterns - I think so far all that has shown is correlation and not causation. But if it was a causative effect, then it would contradict your earlier post that alcohol was under priced.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450878#Comment_120450878

You haven't backed up your under priced claim.

People who like a drink at home have to pay MUP prices or travel north.

Nothing to do with economics it's consumer behaviour.

As for no opposition, it's pretty difficult to organise opposition to a measure that is supported by all political parties.

Those who drink in pubs and restaurants are unaffected by MUP because their drinks were always above the minimum price.

MUP doesn't only affect "very low priced products".

Before MUP we could regularly buy a 24 can case of main brand ie. Heineken, Carlsberg 4.3% beer for €24 now it costs about €40 to buy the same amount.

We are getting used to it but we will never accept it.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450948#Comment_120450948

Low price point alcohol in the supermarket is priced slightly higher than it once was.

Thats the only tangible difference.

Its still cheap.

Granted, the percentage increase is quite large, but as mentioned, if the sales are holding up, then the implication is that the product was under priced in the first place.

Does MUP get reviewed to account for inflation?

Given the general price rises linked to inflation over the past 12 months, it would seem logical to increase MUP further, to account for general price inflation.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451007#Comment_120451007

It's not "slightly higher". There are figures listed on the thread showing increases of 50% in some items. Paying €20 for something that was €13, or €8 for something that was €5, or €2 for something that was €1 - nobody having to pay that would describe that as "slightly" higher. Nobody. And it's utterly disingenuous to describe it in those terms.

If you had to pay €20 for washing powder than was €13 would you honestly say you're paying a slightly higher price??? Nope you would not. Nobody would.

MUP itself is contributing to tracked inflation as noted in media articles on the topic ... so you would increase MUP to account for inflation caused by MUP! Doesn't seem logical to me.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450977#Comment_120450977

Heineken and especially Calrsberg are both muck.

€1.66 for a can of either cannot be considered anything other than dirt cheap lol!!

Its 2023!

As per my last post, MUP really needs to be reviewed upwards as a result of price rise inflation.

The price floor introduced 15 months ago is realistically too low, post rapid inflation over the past year or so.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451036#Comment_120451036

All products are subject to inflation.

You cant exclude MUP products because the other non MUP items will move further away from MUP levels on the price scale.

Leaving MUP at an artificially low level that is not in context with the market.

A rising tide lifts all boats.

I would expect an inflation linked upward review in the not too distant future.

Maybe not this year, but soon enough.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451058#Comment_120451058

Not all products are subject to a specific recent government measure to increase their prices artificially far out of line with market \ inflation.

It is already not in context with the market.

And what comes up may come down wrt inflation.

andrew1977

8 pints of Guinness now in my local = 44 Euro

8 cans of Guinness in my local supermarket = 13.50 euro

Difference of 30.50 euro.

Publicans wanted people back in the pubs and pushed the MUP, for me personally with the increase in pints prices, I don't go the pub as much anymore.

I used to tip in for 2-3 pints couple of times a week or to watch a match, not anymore, I can get an 8 pack of Guinness now which will do me 2 nights watching the matches on telly at home.

I go the pub maybe 1 night a month for a good night out , be it MUP or inflation , mixture of both, I don't cross the pub door as much.

dxhound2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450900#Comment_120450900

In Scotland, and other jurisdictions where MUP is obviously still in the early years, there is a lot of research being carried out to evaluate the effect of MUP. In Scotland and here there are Sunset Clauses in the legislation, meaning that research will have to show the justification for it's continuance. Or more likey probably advocate for a higher MUP.

Politicians will have their chance to do away with the regulations. It's not like Brexit which is done forever. I don't accept your assertion that the law is ineffective. Too soon to say, and I doubt you are qualified to make that judgement. Price has a part to pay in any approach to lessen alcohol harm.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451040#Comment_120451040

I'm not really concerned about your taste in beer.

I was just using Heineken and Carlsberg as examples because whatever you think about them they are popular brand.

So now skipping over the points I raised you are pushing on to a new idea.

You want to add even more expense to the weekly bills of already hard pressed consumers.

Well good luck with that.

dxhound2005

Hard pressed consumers were paying over €7 billion for alcohol in 2019. After the Covid effect is fully out of the figures, we will be able to see what effect the higher prices for essentials will have on the spending on alcohol and other discretionary items. In there also the researchers will have to evaluate the effect of MUP.

If people have to divert some discretionary spending on to essentials so be it. It would be awful if they were going to the North to fill vans with drink, and at the same time neglecting their diet and not paying their electric bills.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451065#Comment_120451065

they were under priced to begin with.

good luck with seeing deflation and price drops any time soon.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451097#Comment_120451097

I think this is a good point and MUP has possibly damaged rural pubs to an extent.

I hear stories that they are much quieter.

But of course there are lots of other reasons for that, including general cost of living and a return to the office which pulls people back towards the cities.

Dublin is still booming.

Pubs are packed all the time with new ones opening, so MUP certainly hasnt had a negative impact on pubs in the capital.

I appreciate it could have a larger impact on rural pubs though.

You could well argue too many licences are in operation in rurual ireland anyway and once the new night economy legislation comes in and removes the requirement for a license, we will probably see more pubs close in rural ireland as their license isnt a winning lottery ticket anymore.

dxhound2005

10 cents for a gram of alcohol. I wouldn't give the excuse to pubs to blame MUP, if they are selling at prices way above that level. Before MUP as well.

"The price of a pint or other alcoholic drinks sold in pubs, clubs or restaurants will not be impacted by minimum unit pricing. This is because most drinks sold in pubs and restaurants already cost more than €1 per standard drink (10g alcohol)."

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450734#Comment_120450734

"Under-priced"? Is there such a concept? I don't think so.

Retailers are rational.

If a can of beer was 1.09 before MUP, and 1.99 now, then the 1.09 was the price, not "too low a price".

dxhound2005

Whatever way it is described, I don't think we would have the massive Booze Deals Megathreads discussions unless they were doing something to alter the prices from time to time.

Continuation of the previous Booze deals [Megathread] thread after reaching 10,000 posts. December 2020.

bluedex

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120450632#Comment_120450632

Not official reports as such but anecdotal evidence of a big increase in drug use, which is a reflection of what happened in Scotland, based on research there.