Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

...And Justice

Allinall wrote: »

By their own free choice.

Cloud 9 anyone. This bill will not curb drinking, just make more children hungry. I personally don't drink much, only at home at the weekend with a take away with the wife. But I would seriously consider going to the north and buying 6 months of wine and beers for our Saturday night in, rather than pay for that bôllocks. Either that or give up the bit of craic I have on a Saturday night with the missus. We work hard, but it's impossible to get out.

MeatTwoVeg

VinLieger wrote: »

Tell that to children who go hungry due to alcoholic parents spending whatever is left for food on the price increase.

If you claim that wont happen your either ignorant or have your own bias and agenda on this

Reduce alcohol prices so that alcho parents have more money to buy food for their kids?

Very dumb argument tbf.

Who are these alco parents? Are they all around us? How come they're managing to keep the kids fed at the moment but they'll choose alcohol over the kids food when the price goes up?

Very strange group to be engineering our laws around.

I say, if they exist, fcuk them, take the kids off them and push through the price increase anyway.

MeatTwoVeg

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Generation snowflake??? So alcoholism is a new phenomenon then? If your chronic alcoholic had €10 to spend and spent, say, €4 on four cans and the rest on food, will he/she cut back on his/her drinking to spend the same amount on food under the MUP structure?

Who cares?

andekwarhola

People being expertly wound up here by the looks of it.

dr.fuzzenstein

MeatTwoVeg wrote: »

Reduce alcohol prices so that alcho parents have more money to buy food for their kids?

Very dumb argument tbf.

Who are these alco parents? Are they all around us? How come they're managing to keep the kids fed at the moment but they'll choose alcohol over the kids food when the price goes up?

Very strange group to be engineering our laws around.

I say, if they exist, fcuk them, take the kids off them and push through the price increase anyway.

So Ireland doesn't have an alcohol problem? Then we don't need minimum pricing.
You're a lazy, lazy troll that simply changes his position post by post. I know you are disingenuous in your arguments. If you don't believe your own bullsh*t, you're on a road to nowhere.

Allinall

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

So Ireland doesn't have an alcohol problem? Then we don't need minimum pricing.
You're a lazy, lazy troll that simply changes his position post by post. I know you are disingenuous in your arguments. If you don't believe your own bullsh*t, you're on a road to nowhere.

When you resort to name calling, you're losing.

Ireland does have an alcohol problem. Anyone that denies that isn't facing reality.

When you say "we don't need minimum pricing"- who are you referring to exactly?

Oodoov

MeatTwoVeg wrote: »

Most moderate drinkers who enjoy the taste of beer or wine won't even notice this measure. They're not going to be buying the slabs of cheap muck anyway or horrible plonk.


It's the people drinking lots of cheap alcohol that'll be hit.

There you go again thinking money grows on trees.

...And Justice

Allinall wrote: »

When you resort to name calling, you're losing.

Ireland does have an alcohol problem. Anyone that denies that isn't facing reality.

When you say "we don't need minimum pricing"- who are you referring to exactly?

Minimum pricing will drive decent beers, that I enjoy to unsustainable levels, I can see it now, €2 for Dutch gold, €10 for a craft beer. How is it that a bottle of Bailey's is €12 on the continent and is over €20 here?. Tax, vintners scrambling for "New" business. It's the downfall of the drinking industry in this country. Good enough fûck the vintners. They'll be a long time dead lobbying the government. It won't get me into the pub.

Oodoov

...And Justice wrote: »

Cloud 9 anyone. This bill will not curb drinking, just make more children hungry. I personally don't drink much, only at home at the weekend with a take away with the wife. But I would seriously consider going to the north and buying 6 months of wine and beers for our Saturday night in, rather than pay for that bôllocks. Either that or give up the bit of craic I have on a Saturday night with the missus. We work hard, but it's impossible to get out.

Some posters on here think money grows on trees and the increase won't matter to you. I drink spirits only and usually Absolute or Smirnoff and cranberry juice. If the bottle goes up from 28 to 38 euro i'll go up north and buy in bulk. At present rates it's circa 18 euro a bottle when converted from sterling so i'll be saving 20 euro a bottle.

I'll also be buying bulk a lot of groceries and goods whilst im up there taking business away from the supermarkets and butchers here locally but so be it im sick of this government taking the piss out of me. I work hard enough they can go fcuk themselves if they think im paying those prices.

MeatTwoVeg

MeatTwoVeg wrote: »

Who cares?

Hmmm, you'll have to do a tad better than that to convince me that MUP will actually do what it says on the tin. (excuse the pun).

Capt'n Midnight

BrokenArrows wrote: »

Is the minimum price a tax or just a minimum price?
So does the supplier and seller both increase their profit margins here?

It's a minimum price so no extra tax. In fact if it reduces alcohol consumption they will probably need to increase taxes elsewhere to compensate.

Diageo & Co. will most likely increase their wholesale prices so small shops won't see a red cent extra.

It also means that supermarkets will pocket the increase on generic beers because they can bypass Irish distributors and get beer at the same price as before.

The proposed minimum prices won't affect premium brands directly, but expect them to continue to carry a premium price over the generics. It won't affect pub prices.

Publicans probably think that making it more expensive to drink at home will encourage people to go the pub. But it will mean that some will have less money to spend in the pub.


Increasing the Excise would have the same effect and provide extra tax revenue that could be spent on the health system. It might hurt the publicans pockets though, given that they've added far more to the price of a pint than excise has over the last 20 years.

problemnext

Is this definitely going to happen. Like is there a date set for its introduction.

Arcade_Tryer

Fine Gael's ability to consistently out-Fine Gael themselves is quite astonishing.

Geuze

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

Geuze wrote: »

I disagree.

Lots of moderate drinkers buy cases of beer, e.g. at Xmas, priced at maybe 24-30 for 24 cans 500ml.

These responsible consumers will now have to pay more.

But precisely because they are responsible it won't be much more.

Geuze

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

Geuze wrote: »

Excise duty revenue will likely fall, not rise, due to less purchases in RoI.

VAT revenue might rise, or fall, depending on how quantity responds to the price rise.

The idea is that MUP will be introduced in the North and South at the same time so there's no reason people will go North because of this: "The Government plans to introduce MUP as one of the key measures alcohol harm reduction measures included in the Public Health (Alcohol) Bill. It is planned to introduce a minimum price for alcohol in conjunction with the Government in Northern Ireland."

Minimum Unit Pricing in Ireland

Oodoov

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

Oodoov wrote: »

Some posters on here think money grows on trees and the increase won't matter to you. I drink spirits only and usually Absolute or Smirnoff and cranberry juice. If the bottle goes up from 28 to 38 euro i'll go up north and buy in bulk. At present rates it's circa 18 euro a bottle when converted from sterling so i'll be saving 20 euro a bottle.

You won't, because MUP will be introduced into both jurisdictions in the country at the same time, as this makes clear.

Nuts102

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

Nuts102 wrote: »

Alcoholics will get there drink no matter how much it costs which I am sure will include robberies.

Then again the excessive cost might just be the final straw that quickens the pace of their redemption and gets them to come to terms with the consequences of their choices. It's not as if most people with drink problems drink themselves to death. They reach their low and most of them cop on/grow up and get back pulling their weight in society.

...And Justice

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

...And Justice wrote: »

When are these bunch of nannies enacting this godforsaken búll shíte?...
I'll go north and buy booze, rather than pay for that bôllocks.

...And Justice wrote: »

But I would seriously consider going to the north and buying 6 months of wine and beers for our Saturday night in, rather than pay for that bôllocks

There's little point going North when both parts of Ireland are bringing MUP in together.

The flying mouse

Deleted User wrote: »

Then again the excessive cost might just be the final straw that quickens the pace of their redemption and gets them to come to terms with the consequences of their choices. It's not as if most people with drink problems drink themselves to death. They reach their low and most of them cop on/grow up and get back pulling their weight in society.

Have to disagree there, for alcoholics or abusive drinkers cost does not come into it, I have never met any alcoholic or abusive drinker who stopped because of the price of it, & I would know & come into contact with a lot on a daily basis.

Also it's not just as simple as seeing the consequences of your choices,For alcoholics there is no choice,it's a very serious deadly addiction & if you get it it's very hard to stop.The majority of time you would need professional medical help.

Re people drinking them selfs to death ,

Alcohol is responsible for 88 deaths every month in Ireland. That’s over 1,000 deaths per year. - See more at: http://alcoholireland.ie/facts/alcohol-related-harm-facts-and-statistics/#sthash.sBe08wiy.dpuf

_Jamie_

dfeo wrote: »

70cl bottles will be €28

Wait, even wine? :eek:

dwayneshintzy

3rd option for me; "We have a serious drinking problem, but I think minimum pricing is a nonsense idea"

VinLieger

Deleted User wrote: »

But precisely because they are responsible it won't be much more.

It will be double the price..... not sure what money tree filled land your living in but twice the price for something is quite a lot more for a lot of people

VinLieger

_Jamie_ wrote: »

Wait, even wine? :eek:

A bottle of 11% wines gonna be about 8.50 minimum

VinLieger

I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.

VinLieger wrote: »

It will be double the price..... not sure what money tree filled land your living in but twice the price for something is quite a lot more for a lot of people

But they're responsible so they'll either only get a small amount of it or - something that is seemingly anathema to most people here - come up with a mad idea like 'I can do without alcohol'.

VinLieger

Deleted User wrote: »

But they're responsible so they'll either only get a small amount of it or - something that is seemingly anathema to most people here - come up with a mad idea like 'I can do without alcohol'.

But why should they have to? Why should they be punished for the excesses of others?

Mortpourvelo

VinLieger wrote: »

But why should they have to? Why should they be punished for the excesses of others?

Because the "drink is evil" brigade have jumped all over MUP and won't be happy until no one drinks.

Mortpourvelo

Deleted User wrote: »

But they're responsible so they'll either only get a small amount of it or - something that is seemingly anathema to most people here - come up with a mad idea like 'I can do without alcohol'.

Your Temperance Society roots are showing.

There is nothing wrong with drinking.

There is LOTS wrong with EXCESSIVE anything - drinking, anything at all.

But you need to realise that the vast majority of us after working hard all week might fancy a few beers in the house watching telly.

We're of age, we've paid all relevant duties and purchase price and I see no reason to be against that.

Unless you are against all drink and therefore that's a different argument for a different day I would humbly suggest.

Mr. teddywinkles

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Anything the brings the cost to me down of funding these idiots with alcohol problems is welcome.

I'm sick of them clogging up our A&E departments, killing hundreds of people on Irish roads each year, missing innumerable work days which my taxes have to subsidise, assaulting innocent people on our streets, and destroying the lives of chislers and their long-suffering partners because of their addiction. All of society suffers because of their weakness/selfishness.

At the very, very least all alcohol advertising should be banned in its entirety. It's not as if these drug companies are advertising because it's ineffective at increasing the purchase of their drug.

The same unevolved troglodytes (with apologies for the tautology) who scream "nanny state" at this one would have also been outraged at the
"interference" which fire, food and safety regulations symbolised when they were first introduced in a different era.

And this will definitely stop that for ya wont it. I know one local alcoholic who's down the pub all weekend. Prices their dont affect him and the onset of alcoholism is nothing to do with the price but stems from personal issues.

Geuze

BrokenArrows wrote: »

Is the minimum price a tax or just a minimum price?
So does the supplier and seller both increase their profit margins here?

It's not a tax, as I have repeatedly stated.

The existing excise regime is not part of this proposal.

It is a min price.

Yes, the manufacturer/distributor/retailer all get a share of the higher price.

VAT will also rise, somewhat.

Geuze

MeatTwoVeg wrote: »

Newsflash. We're not like other European countries.

We've a problem with excessive and binge drinking, particularly among our young population.

€2 a can is actually too cheap IMO.

Why can't we be more like other countries?

In Lidl/Aldi in Germany, the cheapest 50cl can/bottle is under 30 cent.

Germany is a massive exporting nation, with low unemployment, and especially low youth unemployment.