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Official Conor McGregor thread (part 3) *Updated Warning in 1st Post Re:Boxing match
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Thanks for all the PM's and well-wishes. Don't drink and drive over the next month and have a good one
Couldn't resist
.....1. I've never met the Mcgregor to know what he is thinking. 2. Historically, you win a belt, you defend the belt.....
1. So, If you meet him you'll become telepathic and know what goes on inside his head? That's X-Men level stuff.
2. Historically, yes you're correct - defending your title is the fight where both fighter and promoter can make the most money.
When this is not the case, a lot of champions and promoters pursue fights from elsewhere.
For example, there were plenty of legitimate Light-Heavyweight contenders for Bob Foster to fight in 1970 yet he chose to fight Smokin' Joe Frazier for the Heavyweight Championship.
Why? It made him the most money and vice versa for Frazier.
In fact, 3 of Foster's 5 fights in 1970 were non-title fights at Heavyweight, despite being the undisputed Lineal Champion of the World at Light-Heavyweight.
Why wasn't Foster stripped of his title? I'll get to that.
Tony Bellew v David Haye is a more current example. Bellew is the WBC Cruiserweight World Champion. He's now facing Haye at heavyweight in a non-title fight.
Fighters, Promoters and Sanctioning Bodies are always willing to follow the money.
In boxing, Sanctioning Bodies tend not to strip belts for fighting outside the weight class. Part of the reason these fights are tolerated, and even encouraged, is the following:(b) In the event that a WBC champion competes in any bout in which his WBC title is not at stake, the champion is obligated to pay to the WBC fifty percent (50%) of the WBC sanction fee payable as if the bout were a title defense, in view of the market value brought to the bout as a result of his standing attained as a WBC champion.
Section 7.3 of the WBC Regulations. In the case of Bellew v Haye, it probably works out at around $200,000 going towards the WBC for doing absolutely nothing, plus they get more spotlight during the Fight Promotion with endless outlets reminding the public that Bellew is the WBC Cruiserweight Champion.
Normally, a WBC champion is required to undertake at least 1 mandatory defence of his title per year. But this can be (and is often) waived as a requirement, as long as the champion is active in other weight classes (and making the WBC money and raising the profile of the WBC). So they will allow Bellew to retain his title here.
Bellew v Haye makes literally every party involved more money than Bellew defending his title against anybody in his own division and everyone - from fighter, promoter, trainer, sanctioning body and most importantly, the overwhelming majority of fans,are perfectly happy with this.
Part of the reason we have not seen this much in the UFC, over it's short history, is that there were very few instances, and very few fighters, that would make trips outside the division worthwhile financially - and the few that were chose not to.
Ronda Rousey had every opportunity and, more importantly, leverage, to push the UFC into a 140lb or 145lb catchweight super-fight against Cris Cyborg. She was the Golden Girl of the UFC for many years with all the power in the world to get her own way. If she truly wanted Cyborg at 140 or even 145lbs, she would have got her wish as it would have made both fighter and promoter far more money than a defence of her title.
Jose Aldo repeatedly discussed fighting Pettis, yet ultimately it never materialised. During the discussions, Dana White said Aldo would vacate the 145lb title. Yet BJ Penn was never forced to do so.
Why?
Simple. BJ Penn was a huge name and a relatively big draw at the peak of his powers. Jose Aldo was neither; in fact, pre-McGregor his level of fame was very similar to Mighty Mouse - acknowledged as a supreme fighter with no drawing power and almost unknown outside MMA-circles.
Demetrious Johnson himself has less leverage and less power than either Ronda or Aldo but with his record in the division, and lack of contenders, he could easily have pushed for a TJ Dillashaw at bantamweight when he was the champion. He didn't.
The reality is this: Some fighters are quite content to boss their own division.
That should never be interpreted as criticism either; it takes consistent brilliance to dominate a division. These fighters are content with the money for being champion in the division and feel it's not worth the risk to their a) brand b) record and c) health in moving up to take on a larger opponent.
That last part is something real. At an elite level, where skills are so evenly matched, weight matters. A lot. 10lbs between evenly matched fighters is a gulf to overcome by skill. Ronda Rousey was clearly hesitant to take that risk.
People like to talk about the amount of weight Conor cuts to FW in an effort to downplay the risks he takes in higher weight divisions. As if the weight cut to Featherweight is a ridiculous one that nobody else endures and he fights midgets he has 20lbs advantage on.
They'd be very wrong.
Jose Aldo and Anthony Pettis cut from higher than 170lbs too. Max Holloway has said himself he gets above 180lbs when not in camp due to a love of food.
Aldo - 170+ cut http://www.espn.com/blog/mma/post/_/id/21357/aldo-easier-cut-means-no-move-up
Pettis - Admits to being 175 before camp - http://www.si.com/edge/2014/07/22/behind-body-ufc-lightweight-champion-anthony-pettis
That makes what Conor did against Nate and Eddie even more impressive.Alvarez - "I can't cut to 145 [pounds]. I'd have to cut a leg off. I come into camps around 186 pounds. ... I'm not going to listen to somebody from the outside tell me what weight I should be fighting at."
http://www.espn.com/blog/mma/post/_/id/22031/alvarez-says-dana-white-encouraged-move-to-featherweight
So, the truth is you're right when you say historically champions win a belt and defend a belt.
But you're very wrong in using that assertion as a stick to beat Conor or the UFC with.
It takes a special kind of balls for fighters like Bob Foster to move up a weight class to challenge Joe Frazier, who had wrecked his previous opponent (sound familiar?).
Yes, money is a large part of the attraction in fighting outside your weight class. The likes of Joe Frazier, a dance partner to make a lot of money with, doesn't come along very often. For every Joe Frazier or Nate Diaz, a competitor that brings out the best and the bucks, there's a hundred Cole Miller's.
Conor had 3 fights outside the division. In boxing, he wouldn't have been stripped of his title for the Diaz fights because the sanctioning bodies all have clauses that allow these non-title fights to go ahead.
His 3 fights against Nate and Eddie were monumental risks to take. To his brand, to his career, to the profitability of the UFC and, most importantly, to his health. They were both against bigger men than he would have been defending against at Featherweight.
When a fighter like Frazier or McGregor comes along, every party involved usually sings from the same hymn sheet:
Go to whatever weight class you want (up or down), the belt will sit tight - go make EVERYONE a truck load of money and come back when the MONEY-FIGHT re-emerges in your division.
That's how prize-fighting works. It's called "boxing" and it's called "Mixed Martial Arts" but the truth is both are prize-fighting. Every promoter wants the biggest fights regardless of weight or titles. Not every fighter has the balls to risk it. Some do.
Big Irish Balls.Aldo shouldn't feel like a knob, Mcgregor should.......
Jose Aldo is a tremendous fighter and seems to be a doting father. He lost a fight against Conor. Big deal. He's doing his best for himself, his family and to represent Brazil. He has nothing to feel bad for.
Conor McGregor is a tremendous fighter and I'm sure he'll wind up a good father like Aldo. He's doing his best for himself, his family and to represent Ireland. He has nothing to feel bad for.
Aldo did get an immediate offer of a rematch when RDA got injured and he turned it down. He pulled out of the initial fight last year, eventually showed up, it was short-lived and he declined the short-notice rematch. He wasn't ready, that's fine, but he got the offer! The narrative of Conor swerving him is funny.
The first person they called was Aldo.
The same Aldo who was 3 and a half years in giving Edgar his rematch and that first fight was 48-47 on some scorecards (wrongly imo). The same Aldo who was almost 3 years in giving Chad Mendes a rematch and everyone knows how close that first fight was.
Conor went a step further than Aldo in that he offered Jose the immediate short-notice rematch. Aldo did not do the same for Frankie or Chad - he went on to fight Chang Sung and Lamas in between.
You're beating the drum that Conor is a disgrace and poor Jose...... When, in reality, he was a) actually offered the rematch and b) when he was champion himself, he didn't dish out quick rematches against fighters who came close to beating him.
You can Scrooge all you want on Conor's ability, personality, fight choices and career but it's not doing you any favours other than looking foolish, illogical and vindictive. Begrudgery.
The UFC might be able to take his belt but you can never take his achievements off him - no matter how much you try to.0 -
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