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Journalism and cycling

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    #3152
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,349 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    well, look at it this way - he probably managed to destroy any chance people will remember any actual counter argument he made.


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    #3153
    Pinch Flat
    Registered Users Posts: 7,761 ✭✭✭Pinch Flat


    Fahrrad macht frei


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    #3154
    1bryan
    Registered Users Posts: 815 ✭✭✭1bryan


    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/bike-blog/2017/nov/17/why-are-cyclists-the-one-minority-group-the-bbc-feels-its-ok-to-demonise


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    #3155
    1bryan
    Registered Users Posts: 815 ✭✭✭1bryan


    1bryan wrote: »
    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/bike-blog/2017/nov/17/why-are-cyclists-the-one-minority-group-the-bbc-feels-its-ok-to-demonise

    judging by the amount of deleted comment I'd say they're regretting opening them up in the first place .


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    #3156
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,743 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    Peter Walker expresses himself well and seems thoroughly decent.


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    #3157
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,349 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    damien o'tuama is going to be on matt cooper at about 5:15; to lament the very existence of george hook, i hope.


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    #3158
    Danbo!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,942 ✭✭✭Danbo!


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    it has been reported that the other vehicle was a large roadsweeping truck.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/male-cyclist-dies-after-truck-collision-in-rathfarnham-1.3295785


    Are these usually left hand drive?


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    #3159
    mr spuckler
    Registered Users Posts: 3,107 ✭✭✭mr spuckler


    Danbo! wrote: »
    Mirror has a photo of roadsweeper

    and of the bicycle underneath it from what I can see?


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    #3160
    mr spuckler
    Registered Users Posts: 3,107 ✭✭✭mr spuckler


    Danbo! wrote: »
    Oh, I didn't notice that, sorry. I'm not sure looking at it now.

    Poor guy. Another middle of the day incident too, on a dry bright clear day :(

    i certainly wasn't having a go at you, i figured you hadn't seen it when you didn't mention it. the paper shouldn't be publishing it if it is the case though.


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    #3161
    Danbo!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,942 ✭✭✭Danbo!


    mr spuckler wrote: »
    i certainly wasn't having a go at you, i figured you hadn't seen it when you didn't mention it. the paper shouldn't be publishing it if it is the case though.

    No I know that, I mean sorry for posting it at all if it is visible. Removed anyway.


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    #3162
    mr spuckler
    Registered Users Posts: 3,107 ✭✭✭mr spuckler


    seamus wrote: »
    Bit insensitive of the IT to publish close-up photos of the bike. Family and clubmates could recognise a rider by their bike.

    i was about to post exactly that - the bike is quite distinctive looking.

    edit: I don't see an easy way to contact the journalist to request it be edited to remove those photos? am not on twitter - they have him as @jackpower83 if someone wants to message to remove it?


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    #3163
    Bigus
    Registered Users Posts: 4,939 ✭✭✭Bigus


    seamus wrote: »
    Bit insensitive of the IT to publish close-up photos of the bike. Family and clubmates could recognise a rider by their bike.

    RIP to the rider. Passed a sweeper myself near there (not the same one) this morning, they're a law unto themselves.

    I don't agree with you, I think they are right to publish ,

    I think the more cyclists see the aftermath and the more real it is with the bike showing caught underneath the slow moving truck along with the immediacy,
    May mean vulnerable road users taking extra precautions around trucks and buses tonight.

    Rip to the cyclist and condolences to his family.


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    #3164
    TallGlass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,935 ✭✭✭TallGlass


    seamus wrote: »
    Bit insensitive of the IT to publish close-up photos of the bike. Family and clubmates could recognise a rider by their bike.

    RIP to the rider. Passed a sweeper myself near there (not the same one) this morning, they're a law unto themselves.

    To be honest, people need to stop hiding away from the reality of what is happening out there on our roads. Dying in a road accident is brutal, that's the reality.

    To me, looking at that truck, it shouldn't be on the road that tyre in the picture to me is bald and has threads showing. What a joke, and I am not pointing the blame, but HGV drivers need to hold a higher standard of driving than others.

    That's not acceptable.


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    #3165
    TallGlass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,935 ✭✭✭TallGlass


    Bigus wrote: »
    I think the more cyclists see the aftermath and the more real it is with the bike showing caught underneath the slow moving truck along with the immediacy,
    May mean vulnerable road users taking extra precautions around trucks and buses tonight.

    While I agree with you, they shouldn't be just showing it for vulnerable road users but for all users.

    Imagine, if that was you in that truck, regardless of what the circumstances are, you have to live with the trauma from this event for the rest of your life. That's not an easy burden to carry for most people.

    Cyclists shouldn't be careful just around HGVs we have been killed by static people crossing out without looking. So keep your eyes peeled for everything. Then there are times your not at fault, your at the mercy of someone else's actions or inaction.


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    #3166
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    TallGlass wrote: »
    To be honest, people need to stop hiding away from the reality of what is happening out there on our roads. Dying in a road accident is brutal, that's the reality.
    My point is that there will be people who are unaware that a family member, friend or club mate has passed away, are only learning about it from some close-up photos of their bike published by the Irish Times.

    There's a protocol for this, and I think the IT have overstepped the mark.


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    #3167
    Bigus
    Registered Users Posts: 4,939 ✭✭✭Bigus


    seamus wrote: »
    My point is that there will be people who are unaware that a family member, friend or club mate has passed away, are only learning about it from some close-up photos of their bike published by the Irish Times.

    There's a protocol for this, and I think the IT have overstepped the mark.

    Well I walked up the road and saw the same as the photographer, so who's protecting me ?

    And he was taking the pictures on a long lens as I viewed the scene,

    I'll restate , no harm for ordinary people see reality immediately like the unfortunate traffic corps do daily.


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    #3168
    TallGlass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,935 ✭✭✭TallGlass


    seamus wrote: »
    My point is that there will be people who are unaware that a family member, friend or club mate has passed away, are only learning about it from some close-up photos of their bike published by the Irish Times.

    There's a protocol for this, and I think the IT have overstepped the mark.

    I understand what you are saying.

    If that was me, publish away if it means it stops and gets people thinking.

    It's too common a headline reading some static heading 'cyclist killed' with a stock image means nothing these days.

    Actual pictures of the incident bring it home to people. I'd like to think.


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    #3169
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,349 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    posts regarding the use of photos of incident scenes have been moved here


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    #3170
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,349 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    FWIW, regarding those photos - i don't have too much of an issue with it; you see photos of aftermaths of incidents all the time.


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    #3171
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    TallGlass wrote: »
    Actual pictures of the incident bring it home to people. I'd like to think.
    Bigus wrote: »
    I'll restate , no harm for ordinary people see reality immediately like the unfortunate traffic corps do daily.
    I'm not disagreeing with either of you.

    But it's protocol that names or identities in tragic deaths aren't released until it's confirmed that those who need to know, have been informed in private.

    It's not about "protecting" people from disturbing imagery, it's about acknowledging that a person should not learn about the death of close friend/loved one from a public broadcast.


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    #3172
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,349 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    i know someone who as a cub reporter was several times given the task of the 'death knock' - usually the equivalent of drawing the shortest straw in journalistic terms, calling to the family of the bereaved for a statement. obviously most journalists hated it.


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    #3173
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,349 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    damien o'tuama on today FM now.


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    #3174
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,455 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    The second photo is quite shocking if you happen to have a big screen, I hadn't copped the helmet on the ground in the first one.

    In two minds, I think it needs to be shown, but I think if I knew the guy it would screw me up. No idea which is the right way to go.


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    #3175
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,349 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    i know someone who as a cub reporter was several times given the task of the 'death knock' - usually the equivalent of drawing the shortest straw in journalistic terms, calling to the family of the bereaved for a statement. obviously most journalists hated it.
    actually, forgot to mention - on one of the death knocks this chap did, the door was answered, and he immediately mumbled an excuse about being at the wrong house based on the demeanour of whomever answered. as he was walking back down the driveway, a garda car was pulling up outside.


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    #3176
    robyntmorton
    Registered Users Posts: 4,263 ✭✭✭robyntmorton


    This is a difficult one.

    On one hand, it needs to be shown. This is the aftermath of when it all goes horribly wrong.

    On the other, is the immediate aftermath the right time to plaster this kind of image over every news site and social media site going? I personally don't think so. There is a time for it, but this is not it.


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    #3177
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    Danbo! wrote: »
    Are these usually left hand drive?

    Yeah. I used to think it was dual drive but I only ever noticed the driver on the left.


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    #3178
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,455 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    actually, forgot to mention - on one of the death knocks this chap did, the door was answered, and he immediately mumbled an excuse about being at the wrong house based on the demeanour of whomever answered. as he was walking back down the driveway, a garda car was pulling up outside.

    I remember a journalist calling to a friends house after his younger sibling had passed away, asking, quite uncaringly for a picture for a national paper and if he could get a few words from them.

    The parish priest, a quiet man nearly threw him clean over the garden fence. It is a tough job but some people are not cut out for it.

    Honestly, journalists should not be doing death knocks, it is a time of shock, grief and in time acceptance. Asking for a quote from a bereaved family shows how debased some people have become IMO


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    #3179
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,349 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    sure look at what happened with the deaths on the pier in buncrana.
    http://donegalnews.com/2016/04/mail-on-sunday-apologises-for-buncrana-interview/

    iirc, the journalist claimed merely to be a well wisher and did not identify herself as a journalist.


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    #3180
    fiachraX
    Registered Users Posts: 122 ✭✭fiachraX


    IT has taken down the photo with the bike now. Only the other two photos of the truck remain.


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    #3181
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    TallGlass wrote: »
    If that was me, publish away if it means it stops and gets people thinking.

    It's too common a headline reading some static heading 'cyclist killed' with a stock image means nothing these days.

    Actual pictures of the incident bring it home to people. I'd like to think.

    At this point I agree. As a horrible image as it is, a mangled bike and personal effects might hit home to some motorists that it's a person on the bike, not a bike that's just an impersonal piece of steel or metal.


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