AMD Zen Discussion Thread

Samuel T. Cogley

2070 Super is a good card but don't jump too early - new generation of cards due Q3/Q4.

Cuddlesworth

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

2070 Super is a good card but don't jump too early - new generation of cards due Q3/Q4.

The last generation came in at a higher price point.

Komsomolitz

Isn't the next generation cards in septemberish expected to be more affordable?

But yeah my 2070 super arrived the last week there and it's been a dream, certainly recommend it.

Samuel T. Cogley

I expect them to be about the same tbh.

wotzgoingon

Komsomolitz wrote: »

Isn't the next generation cards in septemberish expected to be more affordable?

I doubt it. We are talking about Nvidia, money grabbers. I'm more interested in the RDNA 2 cards but they won't be cheap either.

seraphimvc

seraphimvc wrote: »

I am quite mad that they are stuck at 'Deliver the shipment at the airport' somewhere at Austria since last friday. (the order dispatched on 24-Jun)...

still stuck at the Austrian airport :mad:

circadian

wotzgoingon wrote: »

I doubt it. We are talking about Nvidia, money grabbers. I'm more interested in the RDNA 2 cards but they won't be cheap either.

Rumours are the new Navi cards are impressive, possibly better than Nvidias offering. Pinch of salt I know but I'm running a water cooled R Vii and can hit 2080ti performance on some games with that.

I'd AMD can refine their GPU and get a handle on cooling I could see RDNA3 in particular being a huge leap. Not due until 2021 at the earliest though.

H3llR4iser

I don't know if this really belong here, but maybe it's gonna help to keep the threads clean - AMD still seems to suffer an absolutely p1ss poor reputation amongst system integrators and IT managers.

I'm in the process of putting together specifications for a couple of machines we need for work, one is a midrange server and the other a middle-high tier workstation/client machine; I had specced an EPYC server, and mentioned for the workstation we'd need a Ryzen 9 or Threadripper as CPU (the workload will be heavily multithreaded)

The response, from two different sysadmins, were to go witn Xeon and Core i9 (which ain't even in the same category as a Threardipper) as, respecitvely, "AMD is crap" and "Ryzen/Threadripper is all marketing gimmicks". The latter went on to argue that "benchmarks show the Core i9 is faster". Go feckin' figure.

Now I don't give a sh*t, it's company systems, yet the sheer ignorance from people who should know better.

Cuddlesworth

H3llR4iser wrote: »

I don't know if this really belong here, but maybe it's gonna help to keep the threads clean - AMD still seems to suffer an absolutely p1ss poor reputation amongst system integrators and IT managers.

Now I don't give a sh*t, it's company systems, yet the sheer ignorance from people who should know better.

Most of them are incompetent, especially in Ireland.

But....... Intel has the advantage of basically changing nothing for over a decade. Their mid range stuff is rock solid and reliable from the hardware, drivers and the software.

H3llR4iser

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Most of them are incompetent, especially in Ireland.

But....... Intel has the advantage of basically changing nothing for over a decade. Their mid range stuff is rock solid and reliable from the hardware, drivers and the software.

All pretty much spot on - but to go and claim an i9 is "shown in benchmarks" to be performing better than an R9 and especially than a Threadripper, holy fcuck, it takes a special level of cluelessness. I will admin I was left speechless - then again, it's not my systems. I tried to get them better performing machines. They buy whatever they want.

circadian

As a sysadmin/architect I managed to get our new Vmware hardware moved to Ryzen. Granted most of our footprint is in the cloud now but we still have a significant of vmware hosts.

It took a bit of work to persuade the money makers since the vendor obviously wants to push Intel for a higher margin but after showing a price performance rating of everything it made sense. We refresh every 3-5 years anyway so it's no biggie if AMD somehow falls behind in the next few years.

Homelander

circadian wrote: »

Rumours are the new Navi cards are impressive, possibly better than Nvidias offering. Pinch of salt I know but I'm running a water cooled R Vii and can hit 2080ti performance on some games with that.

Well in fairness that might be true in some cherry picked games that prefer AMD, but in general a 2080ti smashes the Radeon VII.

In general even a 2080 non-super is broadly faster.

.G.

Been playing around with my 3600. On stock with PBO on auto its pretty much always a 1.39v with a max boost very very briefly of 4.3 on one core, rest anywhere from 4 to 4.2. I have it on 4.4 all core at 1.25v stable as of now.

Slutmonkey57b

Not terribly interested in overclocking so not worried about boosts etc but have to say I'm disappointed in reviewers failing to mention how hot the frigging thing gets. 60 degrees under mild load, and that's the 3600. With stock cooling it was 80-90 degrees playing civ 6.

Have it down to 60-65 now having bought a noctua L12s and an extra 15mm fan in push/pull mode but the top fan is pressed right up against the psu housing in my sg06.

wotzgoingon

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

Not terribly interested in overclocking so not worried about boosts etc but have to say I'm disappointed in reviewers failing to mention how hot the frigging thing gets. 60 degrees under mild load, and that's the 3600. With stock cooling it was 80-90 degrees playing civ 6.

Have it down to 60-65 now having bought a noctua L12s and an extra 15mm fan in push/pull mode but the top fan is pressed right up against the psu housing in my sg06.

I never actually monitored mine but I have played games with the CPU fan on silent so you can't hear it and it never shut down or have I heard of anybody else online having their PC shut down from getting too hot.

It's just the way the chiplet design is rather than traditional monolithic. I wouldn't worry too much about what temp you are getting it would matter if your pc starts shutting down from getting too hot.

Slutmonkey57b

It means the PSU is operating in a hot box though. A VERY hot box.

E.g. the rated operating temp of one of the best PSU's on the market (corsair SF600 platinum) is max 50*c.

Hardly good.

.G.

The only reason I'm manually OCing mine is to reduce the voltage as far as i can get it so the temps are more sensible. If my sample is anything to go by it fires loads of voltage at it when it doesn't need to. I'm on 4.5ghz all core now and temps are more sensible to boot. They don't jump all over the place at the drop of a hat either.

With a 2080ti and a PCIE 4.0 M2 in there, theres enough heat inside the case! Any lowering of heat output is good for me.

K.O.Kiki

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

It means the PSU is operating in a hot box though. A VERY hot box.

E.g. the rated operating temp of one of the best PSU's on the market (corsair SF600 platinum) is max 50*c.

Hardly good.

All PSUs have a fan that will keep them from overheating though, plus being at the bottom of the case they will be fed fresh, cool air.

The only way to hotbox them to failure would be to have no exhaust at all.

Slutmonkey57b

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

All PSUs have a fan that will keep them from overheating though, plus being at the bottom of the case they will be fed fresh, cool air.

The only way to hotbox them to failure would be to have no exhaust at all.

I'm using a Sugo SG06, so the PSU mount is directly above the CPU. Currently flipped so it's taking air in from the roof vents but it's still a concern if there's a wall of 70-80* air immediately below it. I'm liking the build overall but one of my main reasons for the build was to avoid having a boiling hot laptop screaming for air when I was doing hard work on it. 3600 was supposed to be more efficient, quieter, cooler etc and that's just not the case. Yes, running a tiny shoebox case I can't expect great thermals but even in an open bench the CPU was still running 70 odd celcius on stock.

That's something that would have made me think twice about the purchase. Googling suggests equivalent Intels also run hot, but not to this level.

K.O.Kiki

That's on the cooler/cooling setup, not the CPU.
Ryzen 3600 uses around 50-80W depending on load & voltage settings.

I have my 3600X under a 360mm AIO at minimum fan speeds and it's a reported 39-45C average, with spikes to 60C.
And that's with PBO so it's hitting up to 1.4V per core at times & low fan speed.

If you're still that worried about temps, get a better cooler like Arctic Freezer 11 LP (€15-17), Alpenföhn panorama (€25) or Scythe Shuriken 3/be quiet Shadow Rock LP (€40).

circadian

Homelander wrote: »

Well in fairness that might be true in some cherry picked games that prefer AMD, but in general a 2080ti smashes the Radeon VII.

In general even a 2080 non-super is broadly faster.

I think you missed the point about the card being liquid cooled. I've overclocked it and the R Vii is stable but if it was on traditional cooling it wouldn't stand a chance. My point was, if AMD can get control of the thermals on the new chipsets then I could see them offering something much closer to the high end Nvidia cards.

BloodBath

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

It means the PSU is operating in a hot box though. A VERY hot box.

E.g. the rated operating temp of one of the best PSU's on the market (corsair SF600 platinum) is max 50*c.

Hardly good.

Eh no it's not. Your PSU should be drawing air from outside of the case for a start. The temp inside your case should still be quite low even if your cpu is hot. 70c or so is not really hot either for a cpu.

It's not blowing 70c air around either. That's not how it works. Your temp inside your case is probably only about 5-10c above ambient. Maybe 20c above ambient directly coming from the cooler exhaust.

Cuddlesworth

BloodBath wrote: »

It's not blowing 70c air around either. That's not how it works. Your temp inside your case is probably only about 5-10c above ambient. Maybe 20c above ambient directly coming from the cooler exhaust.

Yeah, its a PC case not a oven.

K.O.Kiki

Talking of temps, I'm now considering switching case to something smaller & airflow-focused - likely be quiet's new 500DX; as well as moving the AIO to GPU & getting a small tower for CPU.

It would also free up more space in the room for the gf...:o

Anima

How big is your case? How is small is your gf? Many questions...

K.O.Kiki

Fractal Design Define R6 TG (543 x 233 x 465 mm / 55.9L & 12.4kg bare).

The 500DX is only 450 x 232 x 443mm / 46L & 7.8kg

Rossi IRL

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

Talking of temps, I'm now considering switching case to something smaller & airflow-focused - likely be quiet's new 500DX; as well as moving the AIO to GPU & getting a small tower for CPU.

It would also free up more space in the room for the gf...:o

Received the 500dx this morning from overclockers, was sold out everywhere else.

DX is the way to go.

K.O.Kiki

Went ahead and ordered the 500DX from Reichelt; €111.45 delivered.

wotzgoingon

Same size as my own case except it is wider at the width. Height and length are the same.