Protestant/Catholic megathread

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MrPudding wrote: »

No, I'll pass, thanks. I see the request as just a little short of sectarianism. I appreciate that some might not like reading about and interacting with other religious beliefs. Whilst it might be a silly comparison (I'll make it anyway), I am from Northern Ireland, and I think a lot of the trouble we see there stems from a very similar attitude. Separate school, separate shops in some areas, separate football team, separate politicians. It is ridiculous and it isn't helpful. This is just an extension of that kind of attitude, and it is unhelpful.

Aside from the fact that I don't agree with it in principle, I think it is a silly idea in practical terms too. There isn't a huge amount of footfall in this forum, and I see no evidence to suggest that this change would change that. Splitting a not very busy forum into two forums just seems like a recipe to kill at least one of them off. Added to that, where does it stop? There are over 33 thousand flavours of christianity, how many forums would we need?

You guys are all supposedly christians, I find it difficult to understand why you can't just get along. I know us atheists have a reputation of be troublesome and problematic here (I know I am occasionally guilty of perhaps, maybe, sometime possibly, perhaps saying something I shouldn't) I do find that some of the nastiest stuff seem sot be blue on blue.

MrP

Posts 19 & 20 say it all MrP. Its firmly tongue in cheek with a lot of hope behind it

Unfortunately, not all who claim to be Christian are Christian. As Jesus Himself said in response to those whose hope was in the fact that they did miracles in His Name .. "You will say to me, Lord, Lord and I'll say I never never knew you".

Jellybaby1

LordSutch wrote: »

But of course you wouldn't be changing your religion, just your Christian denomination within Christianity. If you like music and you're good singers, then you should certainly check us out )

We also have Sunday school too! lots of colouring books, drawing, painting etc for the kids . . .

PS: We're also of the catholic Church, but with a small c.

LordSutch, I was always of this opinion too until I recently read this.....

http://ireland.anglican.org/about/

That capital 'C' really surprised me!

LordSutch

Well that really throws a spanner in the works )

It was always so easy to differentiate between Catholics & catholics, but now?

I could sware that when I was confirmed (many moons ago), the teaching was that we too were catholic, but with a small c.
Therein lied the difference (between Roman Catholics & Anglicans), who are also of the catholic faith, but who are not instructed by Rome.

So I've been a Catholic all along and I didn't know it :eek:

Jellybaby1

I got the same teaching at Confirmation class. Some spanner isn't it? Y'learn something new every day. What with capital 'C's' and Anglo-Catholics, where will it all end? Does this mean one day we will all be one church as Christ intended? Wow! That's wonderful! Now all we need to do is address the (few?) differences between us and eliminate them! RC to offer Communion to other Christians is first on the list. Would Protestants take the second step and what would that be? I'm not praying to Mary anyway! No way Pedro! :P

uck51js9zml2yt

Jellybaby1 wrote: »

I got the same teaching at Confirmation class. Some spanner isn't it? Y'learn something new every day. What with capital 'C's' and Anglo-Catholics, where will it all end? Does this mean one day we will all be one church as Christ intended? Wow! That's wonderful! Now all we need to do is address the (few?) differences between us and eliminate them! RC to offer Communion to other Christians is first on the list. Would Protestants take the second step and what would that be? I'm not praying to Mary anyway! No way Pedro! :P

Why would protestants or any others take communion in the RCC? The fundamental stumbling block is the idea of transubstantiation.
And why pray to someone who has been redeemed just like me?
It's an interesting picture of the church in the old testament tabernacle. All the boards which made up the walls were covered in silver on the base.
The picture represents the redeemed ones (us), the silver represents redemption. All the boards are level with each other.
No one in the church is greater than the other, all needed to be redeemed by Jesus's death.

Jellybaby1

I was trying to be light-hearted tatranska. All I can say is that if a RC priest offered me Communion I would accept it, I don't believe in transubstantiation, but if Communion was offered I would accept it. I would feel closer to my RC relatives and friends, and I would feel welcome. In Protestant churches all are welcome to participate and to receive Communion. I'd like that same welcome to be offered by the RC church.

Note to LordSutch. There are plenty of spanners on the CoI website. This is so convoluted it is difficult to get my head around it: http://ireland.anglican.org/information/6

solodeogloria

Good evening!

As an Anglican I'd never accept being a big C Catholic.

The reality is the church is both catholic and Reformed and most members find themselves somewhere in the middle. I'm pretty much right on the Reformed / conservative evangelical end. So much so that I'd never use the word "catholic" to refer to my beliefs because it's confusing and unnecessary.

It is actually against Roman Catholic teaching for a Protestant to take communion in a Catholic Church . I think that's probably sensible as most would object to transubstantiation anyway. I personally hold a memorial view of the Lord's Supper. Namely that the primary purpose of it is to remember Christ's passion and death.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

Jellybaby1

solodeogloria wrote: »

Good evening!

As an Anglican I'd never accept being a big C Catholic.

The reality is the church is both catholic and Reformed and most members find themselves somewhere in the middle. I'm pretty much right on the Reformed / conservative evangelical end. So much so that I'd never use the word "catholic" to refer to my beliefs because it's confusing and unnecessary.

It is actually against Roman Catholic teaching for a Protestant to take communion in a Catholic Church . I think that's probably sensible as most would object to transubstantiation anyway. I personally hold a memorial view of the Lord's Supper. Namely that the primary purpose of it is to remember Christ's passion and death.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

Yes, that's what I understand all right but, and its a big BUT, if the RC priest offered me Communion I would take it. Sadly he would not be allowed to offer it to me.

MrPudding

Jellybaby1 wrote: »

Yes, that's what I understand all right but, and its a big BUT, if the RC priest offered me Communion I would take it. Sadly he would not be allowed to offer it to me.

Presumably, if it was such a big deal, God would alert him to your non-RCCness and he would know not to offer you...

MrP

The Bishop Basher

These Catholic forum requests always appear to be just another opportunity for certain posters to remind everyone how Catholic they are and how uncatholic everyone else is as if that's something to be proud of.

I just find it very sad that grown people (who are supposedly Christian) can think and act that way.

It's the kind of behaviour you'd expect to see in a school yard, not from adults on an Internet forum.

My willy's bigger then yours wah wah wah.

It's really pathetic.

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Swanner wrote: »

These Catholic forum requests always appear to be just another opportunity for certain posters to remind everyone how Catholic they are and how uncatholic everyone else is as if that's something to be proud of.

I just find it very sad that grown people (who are supposedly Christian) can think and act that way.

It's the kind of behaviour you'd expect to see in a school yard, not from adults on an Internet forum.

My willy's bigger then yours wah wah wah.

It's really pathetic.

While I agree, an RCC forum would allow a certain user to talk to himself and leave the rest of us to get on with being grown ups and debate the issues in a reasonable manner.:D

MrPudding

Atlas Gorgeous Shutterbug wrote: »

While I agree, an RCC forum would allow a certain user to talk to himself and leave the rest of us to get on with being grown ups and debate the issues in a reasonable manner.:D

He has so many people on ign

MrPudding

Atlas Gorgeous Shutterbug wrote: »

While I agree, an RCC forum would allow a certain user to talk to himself and leave the rest of us to get on with being grown ups and debate the issues in a reasonable manner.:D

He has so many people on ignore he practically is talking to himself.

MrP

Delirium

MOD NOTE

Back on topic everyone please.

Thanks for your attention.

Jellybaby1

I have gone back to Post #1, and I have read the title of this thread, but I am none the wiser as to what the thread is actually for. We all have the same core beliefs but with some differences. Walk down any street, through any town or city and you will find churches and schools and other centres of every religious hue. We are already separate! Now, to have a Protestant/Catholic thread, or even, a Catholic/Protestant thread (we must be fair!) then of course there is going to be banter or argument about beliefs because we are already separated by certain church rules or teachings, and Biblical evidence. So where is this thread going? Do you want to know what I believe?

I believe in God, the Father almighty,
creator of heaven and earth.
I believe in Jesus Christ, God’s only Son, our Lord,
who was conceived by the Holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died and was buried;
he descended to the dead.
On the third day he rose again;
he ascended into heaven,
he is seated at the right hand of the Father,
and he will come again to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit,
the holy catholic Church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and the life everlasting.

Taken from CoI website, in this case they have a small 'c'. Wish they would make up their mind really, its confusing for us ordinary CoI pewdwellers!

Personally, I don't believe that good works and a multitude of prayers will get me into heaven. Faith in Christ is key.

I don't believe that Mary was given any powers by God as I have never seen anything Biblical about it. If Christ or God did not tell me to pray to Mary then I won't do that. If the CoI suddenly were to tell me to do so, I still won't.

There are other differences but there isn't enough time to go into absolutely everything. Anyway I don't know it all.

Nekarsulm

If I am at a ceremony in the local RC Chapel, when communion time comes I would stay in my seat. Much to the inconvenience of others who have to clamber past me.
If I were to receive communion, would there be any censure on the Priest, were it to be notified to his superior that he had given Communion to a non RC, despite the Priest not knowing me or my denomination?

lazybones32

Nekarsulm wrote: »

If I were to receive communion, would there be any censure on the Priest, were it to be notified to his superior that he had given Communion to a non RC, despite the Priest not knowing me or my denomination?

I can't say for certain but I doubt the priest would be in trouble if he were genuinely unaware. If he knowingly did it, there could be consequences but it depends on the scenario. I think JPII gave Communion to a Jew once and the man was healed of his illness. JP didn't know the man was a Jew but it was only after he was healed that he came clean about not being a Catholic.

Jellybaby1

lazybones32 wrote: »

I can't say for certain but I doubt the priest would be in trouble if he were genuinely unaware. If he knowingly did it, there could be consequences but it depends on the scenario. I think JPII gave Communion to a Jew once and the man was healed of his illness. JP didn't know the man was a Jew but it was only after he was healed that he came clean about not being a Catholic.

Lazybones, I can't find that story. Could you provide a link to it please?

Delirium

Jellybaby1 wrote: »

Lazybones, I can't find that story. Could you provide a link to it please?

I'm guessing this is the story lazybones was referring to

Jellybaby1

Thank you Delirium. Curious all right. Though I keep noticing that both religions can change rules when it suits them.

lazybones32

Jellybaby1 wrote: »

Thank you Delirium. Curious all right. Thought I keep noticing that both religions can change rules when it suits them.

? No rules were changed for this incident: as I wrote and the article confirmed, the Jewish man didn't tell anyone he wasn't in the correct disposition to receive. Reception of the Eucharist is still reserved to Roman Catholics.

Nekarsulm

Time to unfollow......

Jellybaby1

lazybones32 wrote: »

? No rules were changed for this incident: as I wrote and the article confirmed, the Jewish man didn't tell anyone he wasn't in the correct disposition to receive. Reception of the Eucharist is still reserved to Roman Catholics.

You are right, in relation to the incident quoted. However this is at the bottom of the article:

"Under the rules of the Church, five years must pass after a candidate's death before a cause may be opened.
However the Pope waived this for Mother Teresa!

Would it be fair to say the rules were changed in this instance?

lazybones32

Jellybaby1 wrote: »

You are right, in relation to the incident quoted. However this is at the bottom of the article:

"Under the rules of the Church, five years must pass after a candidate's death before a cause may be opened.
However the Pope waived this for Mother Teresa!

Would it be fair to say the rules were changed in this instance?

Oh right...it's just the arc of the thread was about non-Catholic's receiving the Eucharist. How was anyone to know?
I don't know if he waived it or changed it. It's not a dogma and not anywhere near an important Church topic imo.

Jellybaby1

lazybones32 wrote: »

Oh right...it's just the arc of the thread was about non-Catholic's receiving the Eucharist. How was anyone to know?
I don't know if he waived it or changed it. It's not a dogma and not anywhere near an important Church topic imo.

Fair enough.

martinedwards

Jellybaby1 wrote: »

Would it be fair to say the rules were changed in this instance?

rules are changed all the time in all religions and denominations.

celibate priests in the RC was a late innovation..... Peter had a mother in law after all.....

Female clergy in many of the protestant denominations

etc etc etc

I'm glad to see that the vast majority of both sides of the RC/Prod divide don't see the other lot as the spawn of Satan any more.

Jellybaby1

martinedwards wrote: »

rules are changed all the time in all religions and denominations.

celibate priests in the RC was a late innovation..... Peter had a mother in law after all.....

Female clergy in many of the protestant denominations

etc etc etc

I'm glad to see that the vast majority of both sides of the RC/Prod divide don't see the other lot as the spawn of Satan any more.

Absolutely. I suggest this is mainly due to a more educated population. Though there are exceptions of course.

LordSutch

We have quite a few RCs (ex RCs)? in our congregation these days.
I guess the opposits happens too, with some ex Anglicans going to RC Mass.

...which is nice.

Wouldn't/couldn't have happened twenty years ago!

Jellybaby1

LordSutch wrote: »

We have quite a few RCs (ex RCs)? in our congregation these days.
I guess the opposits happens too, with some ex Anglicans going to RC Mass.

...which is nice.

Wouldn't/couldn't have happened twenty years ago!

Yep, it's nice that each can go where they want and don't feel they will go to hell for it. Could ask if Protestants get any positions of authority in the RC church like some RCs do in the CoI?

mdebets

Nekarsulm wrote: »

If I am at a ceremony in the local RC Chapel, when communion time comes I would stay in my seat. Much to the inconvenience of others who have to clamber past me.
If I were to receive communion, would there be any censure on the Priest, were it to be notified to his superior that he had given Communion to a non RC, despite the Priest not knowing me or my denomination?

I don't think that the priest would have to fear any consequences, even if he would give the Eucharist knowingly to a Protestant (even so there have been some high profile cases in Germany, some years ago, but this was the case where it was done rather as a provocation and highly public.)

Even Pope Benedict and Pope John-Paul II have given the Eucharist knowingly to a Calvinist pastor (Frere Rogere, the founder of the Taiz community). Pope Benedict (then Card. Ratzinger) even live on TV during the funeral mass of Pope John-Paul II.