Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2016, Mod Warning in OP, 10/7

Buford T. Justice XIX

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Sakho is good at football. I'll look forward to welcoming him back into the fold post ban.

He's better at painting though.

I imagine he will have to whole stadium given a good lick of paint before next season and will start on the surrounding area to keep in shape before the ban ends:)

Tbh, I really don't give a toss about doping. I have assumed that a large section of professional sports are at it with years and when one scam comes to light, the dopers are already onto the next drug.

The only difference if authorities desire and willingness to tackle it.

Keep samples from every test for 10 years and if new drugs come to light through new and better testing, take all trophies won off teams with large fines and allow teams to sue those players for those sums. Make it financially unattractive for them to dope and it stops the majority of it.

punk_one82

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

Of course it has, that's why he has risked his future and professional integrity :rolleyes:

Your comparison with any other footballer's stats is irrelevant BTW. Sakho's performance wouldn't have been at the level it is without PED's otherwise he wouldn't be taking them and if he didn't perform to the level he has been some of his interceptions, last ditch tackles and goals may not have been made. Is it really that hard for you to join the dots?

It's not irrelevant at all. His stats are pretty similar to a defender who has played close to the same amount of games and finds his team getting relegated. You can roll your eyes all you want pal, you don't know what Sakho has been found to have in his system or how much it has affected his performances or our results as a result. It's unquantifiable and quite clearly nominal. If you really want to have a look at stats how about you check the stats for all central defenders in the premiership who have played over 30 games and see how much of a variance there is. Hyperbole doesn't do your argument any justice. Yeah Sakho scored easy headers because he took some pills :rolleyes:

martyos121

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Looks like we after Mustafi now as well but I think we will be linked to lots of CB's over the next few months.

I want to believe that so badly but I just can't. He's on the verge of being a world class centre half, Valencia's best player by miles this season. Him and Lovren or Matip together would be some wall of a defence.

The likes of Barca, Real Madrid and Munich are all after him so I'd say there's a 0% chance of it happening unfortunately.

54and56

punk_one82 wrote: »

It's unquantifiable and quite clearly nominal.

Which is it unquantifiable or clearly nominal? Is Engligh your first language?

BTW, the stats (interceptions, blocks, tackles etc) of a defender playing in one of the worst teams ever to grace the PL who were over run in virtually every game they played will always be higher than a team who are dominating their opponents. If a team has 0 shots on target and as a result Ming has 0 saves in a game does that make him a worse goalkeeper than a guy who faced 15 shots in a game, made 7 saves (wo must be a deadly keeper right?) but let 8 in?

Sakho wouldn't have taken performance enhancing drugs unless they gave him............wait for it.............an improved performance. Once you grasp that concept you'll find yourself understanding that without that boost in performance (whether it was 1%, 10% or 25%) he couldn't have performed as he did and if he didn't perform as he did more goals would have been scored against us and he may not have had the alertness or physical ability to score those "easy" headers.

If you can't see the logic in that you're just in denial so carry on, don't let me spoil your buzz.

punk_one82

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

Which is it unquantifiable or clearly nominal? Is Engligh your first language?

BTW, the stats (interceptions, blocks, tackles etc) of a defender playing in one of the worst teams ever to grace the PL who were over run in virtually every game they played will always be higher than a team who are dominating their opponents. If a team has 0 shots on target and as a result Ming has 0 saves in a game does that make him a worse goalkeeper than a guy who faced 15 shots in a game, made 7 saves (wo must be a deadly keeper right?) but let 8 in?

Sakho wouldn't have taken performance enhancing drugs unless they gave him............wait for it.............an improved performance. Once you grasp that concept you'll find yourself understanding that without that boost in performance (whether it was 1%, 10% or 25%) he couldn't have performed as he did and if he didn't perform as he did more goals would have been scored against us and he may not have had the alertness or physical ability to score those "easy" headers.

If you can't see the logic in that you're just in denial so carry on, don't let me spoil your buzz.

Doesn't need to be quantifiable to see that it's not having a major effect on his performances given how his stats don't differ much from most central defenders. Can't you keep up? So, unquantifiable - I'm not putting any made up stats to it. Nominal - it's effects were quite clearly minor. Does it need to be explained further?

You're clutching at straws. For a start, has it been confirmed that he was taking performance enhancing drugs? Clearly not given the fact that UEFA haven't opened any investigation yet. Come back to me when you know what he had in his system and what effects it had on his performance.

I'm absolutely not in denial, just not exaggerating somethings effects to prove a point while turning a blind eye to other blatant cheating in the sport we love

MonkeyTennis

The person after me starts the match thread.

bluefinger

yarmolenko's agent at stadium

https://lockerdome.com/8013736577348929/8098590972191764

MonkeyTennis

you're it.

galwaylad14

Surely it doesn't matter what percentage he improved because of the PED's, the fact is he obviously improved some bit by taking banned substances (otherwise he wouldn't take them) and that makes him a cheat.

Comparing him to other defenders stats is neither here nor there, maybe the other defenders are better players than Sakho but his doping has allowed him compete at a similar level to them?

No one can ever possibly say what bearing his doping had on the Liverpool results over the last while. Maybe it was nothing at all, maybe it was the difference between him making a few vital headers/clearances/interceptions that ultimately made a huge difference to his team?

No one can ever really say but I really hope he gets the book thrown at him. He's a cheat and football has to take a hard line on cheaters. And I'm not saying he's the only one or anything, but he's caught now and has to be punished to send out a message that this won't be tolerated in the game.

I think the real question is was he doing it of his own accord or were Liverpool complicit in this cheating? And if they were then I'm sure Sakho wasn't the only own gaining a "chemical advantage". Interesting times ahead.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

galwaylad14 wrote: »

I think the real question is was he doing it of his own accord or were Liverpool complicit in this cheating? And if they were then I'm sure Sakho wasn't the only own gaining a "chemical advantage". Interesting times ahead.

I'm getting the impression some people actually want this to be the case more than expressing any logical viewpoint.

Harry Palmr

Someone start a match thread, yes Liverpool are playing in a European semi final tonight.

corwill

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Someone start a match thread, yes Liverpool are playing in a European semi final tonight.

Sort it out, bluefinger, rules is rules.

I've sworn off them for life after the Southampton/Squirtle debacle. GP is saying I should consider electroshock, if I ever want to feel love or hope again.

Harry Palmr

I'm not touching it!

paulie21

Have to have a bit of faith lads . Match thread up

54and56

galwaylad14 wrote: »

Surely it doesn't matter what percentage he improved because of the PED's, the fact is he obviously improved some bit by taking banned substances (otherwise he wouldn't take them) and that makes him a cheat.

Comparing him to other defenders stats is neither here nor there, maybe the other defenders are better players than Sakho but his doping has allowed him compete at a similar level to them?

No one can ever possibly say what bearing his doping had on the Liverpool results over the last while. Maybe it was nothing at all, maybe it was the difference between him making a few vital headers/clearances/interceptions that ultimately made a huge difference to his team?

No one can ever really say but I really hope he gets the book thrown at him. He's a cheat and football has to take a hard line on cheaters. And I'm not saying he's the only one or anything, but he's caught now and has to be punished to send out a message that this won't be tolerated in the game.

100% correct. Anyone who doesn't agree with this is in denial. We either want to strive for a clean game or not. Look at the mess turning a blind eye to doping led to in cycling. Despite the fact FIFA and UEFA became dysfunctional at the top level the grass roots is based on honest hard working people who train hard and compete on a level playing field. If you start to undermine that you are on a very slippery slope to destroying the sport we all love. Saying "they're all at it" or "loads of them are at it" is the laziest most irrational argument anyone can possibly make. Doping has to be challenged and stopped not excused.

galwaylad14 wrote: »

I think the real question is was he doing it of his own accord or were Liverpool complicit in this cheating? And if they were then I'm sure Sakho wasn't the only own gaining a "chemical advantage". Interesting times ahead.

If LFC management, medics and/or coaches were systematically doping players and I mean in a club wide coordinated manner not one or two rogue individuals it would effectively be the end of the club as we know it. Sponsors would withdraw, the global fanbase would disappear and we'd be relegated at least two divisions and be hit with the biggest fine in history and rightly so. I really think there is zero chance that is the case but you can never say never until all the facts are known.

Milkers

Can we get some scouting reports of Villareal from people who watch a lot of La Liga? I haven't a breeze about them tbh.

galwaylad14

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

I'm getting the impression some people actually want this to be the case more than expressing any logical viewpoint.

It doesn't bother me one way or the other. I'm just saying that one of Liverpool's players has now been exposed as a cheat, it is possible that he is just a rogue individual that decided of his accord to go out and fill himself with some substance that would improve his performance.

It is also possible that whatever he took was over seen by someone at the club and that others at the club may also be in receipt of something similar to boost their performances.

It's a possibility. No more and no less.

MightyMandarin

30day suspension for Sakho from UEFA.

Not sure if it's a full ban but he'd miss the final anyway.

Agent Coulson

Sack him now terminate his contract he is useless to us.

martyos121

MightyMandarin wrote: »

30day suspension for Sakho from UEFA.

Not sure if it's a full ban but he'd miss the final anyway.

Surely that isn't his full ban? Don't get me wrong, I'd be over the moon if it was, but is that just a provisional suspension pending a full hearing?

54and56

Liverpool defender Mamadou Sakho has been suspended for 30 days by Uefa after it opened disciplinary proceedings against him following a failed drugs test.

The suspension is provisional until a final decision is taken by Uefa's control, ethics and disciplinary body.

Sakho, 26, tested positive for what is thought to be a type of fat burner after the Europa League win against Manchester United on 17 March.

He chose not to challenge the results.

The date of a disciplinary hearing will be announced at a later stage.

The France international and his club had already agreed he would remain unavailable while a Uefa investigation was completed.

http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/36161272

It's an initial suspension to give UEFA time to consider what if any further action they need to take against him once they have examined all the facts.

Boom_Bap

martyos121 wrote: »

Surely that isn't his full ban? Don't get me wrong, I'd be over the moon if it was, but is that just a provisional suspension pending a full hearing?

That's just to cover the investigation they have started.

Turtyturd

Would be hilarious if Cissokho ended up getting the ban.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

galwaylad14 wrote: »

It doesn't bother me one way or the other. I'm just saying that one of Liverpool's players has now been exposed as a cheat, it is possible that he is just a rogue individual that decided of his accord to go out and fill himself with some substance that would improve his performance.

It is also possible that whatever he took was over seen by someone at the club and that others at the club may also be in receipt of something similar to boost their performances.

It's a possibility. No more and no less.

It's not really for reasons outlined in a different responce.

In order to believe it is a possibility, you'd have to believe that players are never tested for drugs after matches and training; and that every time a team has a player fail a drugs test that they are implicit. You'd also have to suspect the FFF of doping players. He plays for them too.

One of those things is factually incorrect, the other astronomcially unlikley (to the point it's never actually happened). So no - the possibility is not there.

So my belief, as I said in my first repsonce, is that people are thinking, "hey - it's Liverpool! wouldn't it be great, if.....

Buford T. Justice XIX

Turtyturd wrote: »

Would be hilarious if Cissokho ended up getting the ban.

Do they test Championship level teams......

galwaylad14

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

It's not really for reasons outlined in a different responce.

In order to believe it is a possibility, you'd have to believe that players are never tested for drugs after matches and training; and that every time a team has a player fail a drugs test that they are implicit. You'd also have to suspect the FFF of doping players. He plays for them too.

One of those things is factually incorrect, the other astronomcially unlikley (to the point it's never actually happened). So no - the possibility is not there.

So my belief, as I said in my first repsonce, is that people are thinking, "hey - it's Liverpool! wouldn't it be great, if.....

We'll agree to disagree so. As I said already, time will tell.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

I'm getting the impression some people actually want this to be the case more than expressing any logical viewpoint.

galwaylad14 wrote: »

We'll agree to disagree so. As I said already, time will tell.

QED

Turtyturd

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Do they test Championship level teams......

In his defence he's a couple of levels above that rubbish.

54and56

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

It's not really for reasons outlined in a different responce.

In order to believe it is a possibility, you'd have to believe that players are never tested for drugs after matches and training; and that every time a team has a player fail a drugs test that they are implicit. You'd also have to suspect the FFF of doping players. He plays for them too.

One of those things is factually incorrect, the other astronomcially unlikley (to the point it's never actually happened). So no - the possibility is not there.

So my belief, as I said in my first repsonce, is that people are thinking, "hey - it's Liverpool! wouldn't it be great, if.....

I'm amazed anyone can think it's actually 100% impossible that a club sanctioned systematic program of doping could happen. No one believes it's likely or that there is even a 5% chance it could happen but it's not flat out impossible. Even if there's only a 0.01% chance then it's still a possibility.

Athletes are frequently tested for drugs and lot's of them found ways to defeat such tests in the past by using other "clean" peoples urine etc. I'm sure it's much stricter now and that if Sakho passed a test earlier in the season it does indeed mean this was a once off kind of deal but we can't just assume that until the facts are known.

I also think the siege mentality that the world is against LFC is pathetic. The support and respect shown to the JFT96 campaign by clubs all over the UK and world wide shows how much goodwill there is towards the club not the opposite. Sure a few w@nker$ who support other clubs will always troll when they have an opportunity but that's life, don't equate their noise with the whole world being against us.

JB81

Luckycharms_74 wrote: »

Think it will be very similar to your line up but I think Sturridge will be on the bench and bring him on for last 30 when the games is stretched and spaces open up.
I'm sure Klopp will be thinking, I need to get a full 90 from Sturridge in the home leg, therefore resting him this game.


Mig
Clyne Toure Lovren Moreno
Lucas
Allen Milner
Lallana Coutinho
Firmino

I think he has to start and will start Sturridge.
Firmino has been relatively poor last few games, albeit popping up with a goal here and there. I get what your saying with the work rate etc..
But I think the chance to get an away goal on the break or to get something out of nothing up front Sturridge will start.
He could possibly drop Coutinho ( as his work rate would not be as high as Lallanaa or Firmino either ) in order to have those three in midfield ( Lucas, Allen, Milner).
I feel Countinho best work is done when Sturridge is on the field and if Sturridge is not there when Coutinho gets the ball and looks up, who's there? His effectiveness is decreased.