New England Patriots Thread Mod Warning Post #253

AbusesToilets

Close call today, but the lads dug deep and pulled it out. Kudos to Mac for doing his part. he's had a lot of scrutiny lately, but to his credit, he didn't let it phase him. Stood tall and delivered the performance the team needed.

Mr. Guappa

Jakobi Meyers looking good again for the Raiders. Swapping him for Smith-Schuster has proven to be an atrocious decision.

The Kicker situation is another that's been terribly managed. Folk has been (and continues to be in Tennessee) one of the most reliable kickers in the league, but every off season they seemed to think they needed to find better.

It's horrible rooting for them to lose, miss kicks, etc., but that's where we are.

DJ_Eoghan

Well, in losing, at least we won the Desperation Bowl, and move one step closer to securing a really high pick. At this stage, I think Mac is irredeemable. O-line play has improved in recent weeks, so I don't think he can use that excuse. My big issue is that he is not improving in his game. This is the 4th week in a row where he has thrown an interception because he was throwing off his back foot. Mechanical issues can always be fixed, but if he does it 4 weeks in a row, that tells me he's either not trying to fix it, or he is and he's not getting it. Neither of those are good. Mac could go on to be a decent QB someplace else, but I think in NE he's done.

The kicking situation is what it is. Fact of the matter is that Folk doesn't have the leg for past 50, and in particular didn't have the leg for kicking touchbacks, obviously he's deadly inside 50. They wanted to change, we changed. Think we should take our lumps with Ryland, at least for another year. Also, don't think the rest of the kicking operation has been smooth all year. Cardona seems to have been carrying an arm injury all year (not on the injury report but he started wearing a sleeve out of nowhere this year), and the other 2 parts of the operation are new, which just makes it hard to get it running efficiently.

At this stage, I think we should just lean into what we do best for the rest of the season, which is running the ball, and then a bit of play-action off it. I don't expect this to deliver wins (but then again I don't want them given the opportunity cost). What I think it will do is at least let the team keep their chin up by being competitive every week, as there is a possibility that things could fall apart in the dressing room as the losing continues. Also think we need to throw heavily to Thornton and Boutte, and really find out what we have or don't have before the season ends (we know what we have in Douglas, he's a keeper).

Looking to the draft, I'm less concerned about the O-line now that our starting unit is set. Brown is PFF's 8th rated left tackle in PBWR, and has been solid all season. Onwenu has been the 8th-rated PBWR since moving to the right. I think depth is a bigger issue, so picking up at least 1/2 quality OL is essential, but I don't think they necessarily need to be franchise cornerstones. Looking at FA, there doesn't seem to be many quality tackles that are likely to hit the market, so I don't think there's anything there for us, as even JAGs will command more than they're really worth.

To me the key focus for the draft is a quality QB that can start, and a top of the line WR. Depending on where we land our pick, I'm open to the prospect of trading out that position to acquire an extra pick either in the first round or that can be bundled to acquire a first round, with a view to landing a top 2/3 QB and and a top 2/3 WR. Maybe we could also pick up another top-of-the-line receiver from FA, but I would want it to be someone who isn't in their final stretch e.g. no Mike Evans types, great receiver but history dictates he can only go one way at this stage.

Defensively, I don't really think we need much. We could pick up a quality pass rusher in FA as Judon is coming towards the end (and Uche may test FA). Also we need to fix the free safety conundrum, as aside from injuries that has been the biggest problem all season long. Again, suspect that's something we can fix through FA. If we can fix those 2 issues, I think the defence is set up well "if we're running a belichick-type system".

Of course, a lot of this will be dictated by whether Bill is there or not, and in what role. New coach in and all bets are off on defence. Our defence is a specific fit of players to scheme, if we change the scheme I don't feel as confident in the talent we have (Barmore, Gonxalez, Dugger, Judon, Peppers probably do well in any scheme, the rest I'm not so sure about). I wonder is there some solution where Bill only shops for defensive groceries, and within an agreed window of picks e.g. Bill, you can use 1 third, 2 4ths, a 6th and 5 undrafted. The OC/Personnel get to pick the offensive ones.

eagle eye

The Panthers need to get their ass in gear and win a couple of games.

ArmaniJeanss

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121423919#Comment_121423919

Bucs twice, Saints and Falcons in Div match-ups where all teams have losing records. Home to Packers and away to Jaguars.

They really should find wins in there, especially with no particular incentive to tank as Bears have their 1st round pick.

Coreyhotline

Bears would make great trading partners if we could get number 1. Possibly want a new qb, have 2 first round picks but not a lot else, I think a package of number 1 + maybe a second, third and something else could get their 2 first rounders which would mean we could pick 2 high end talents. Haven’t done the maths on the old Jimmy Johnson chart, but that feels about the ballpark.

eagle eye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121424345#Comment_121424345

If we had two early picks one of them would be spent on defense. We need a QB, at least one tackle and a guard.

Coreyhotline

We could spend one on defence and get a stud, but I don’t think that swings the needle. Current defence is very serviceable, they’d probably be top 5 in the league if it weren’t for injuries and the offence continually giving extra possessions to our opponents. Still need to replace McCourty, as that is creating issues in coverage and big plays, but I don’t see the value in a defensive stud if the offence can’t do anything with the ball. Also think we could pick up 2/3 high quality players in free agency (casting a quick glance over spotrac, I see more I like on the defensive side than the offensive side).

Definitely think we need depth on OL as much as if not more than starters (also don’t like the look of FA market for tackles in 24). Anytime someone goes down from our starting 5 (brown, Andrews, sow, onwenu, strange), the drop-off is catastrophic. Used to be that we always had a guy or two who could come in and play competently (ted karras and Dan Connolly spring to mind). I think you can get those guys in rounds 2/3 (definitely should not be in round 1). For me a receiver who can get open often, take the top off a defence and can win a moss type ball is essential if we get a top qb. The receivers we have (aside maybe from Douglas and bourne) don’t give a rookie qb any room for error. I think a rookie wr stud paired with a top free agent wr gives us the best shot of maximising any stud qb we get (I’m ignoring the fact that we can’t pick or develop rookie wrs obviously).

eagle eye

This draft has a wealth of QBs, wide receivers and tackles.

Like you've got the top four QBs and then Jayden Daniels who I'm starting to consider as maybe the best in.the class. Shedeur Sanders looks like a good one too, he has a great arm.

No doubt Marvin Harrison jr.will be a top ten pick but his teammate Egbuka, I think is his name, looks really good too. Then you've got two good ones at Texas, I can only remember Xavier Worthy, my son is Xavier, and he's like lightning and he's tough too. There's a top class guy at Florida State too and I'm sure there's a couple from teams I didn't get to see this year.

Joe Alt from Notre Dame is a great tackle but he'll be an early pick. If you get to watch Georgia v Alabama you'll see two very talented left tackles. There's more highly rated ones, I think it's Oregon State that has one of them.

paulie21

Never been so disappointed in a win. Hopefully can stay in the top 3 picks at least.

AbusesToilets

It's kinda **** that a good performance makes one depressed, but here we are.

eagle eye

Same as you guys, pick more important at this stage. It's horrible to want them to lose but it's for the future.

I really hope BB packs in the GM role too. Love the man but at 70 he really only should be concentrating on one job and it's coaching I want him at.

Coreyhotline

Yeah, think the feeling about Thursday is the same across the board. My brother is a big Steelers fan, it’s the first time I’ve ever rang him and gave out to him for the Steelers losing!

I’d like to think that Bill is self aware enough to know that the gm bit isn’t working out, and he would jack it in, as he’s still the best defensive coach in the league and I don’t even think it’s close. However, I do worry about stuff I hear coming out of the building that a lot of the picks aren’t his e.g. harry wasn’t his pick is one that comes to mind. I’d worry he’s thinking about more control in grocery shopping than less. Anyway, off season issue I guess.

On a side note, if we don’t end up with top pick, just a high one, how do people feel about not spending it on a qb? We’ve bags of money in cap space, and the Cards and Kyler Murray seems to be a relationship where neither party is all in, and his expensive contract reduces his trade value. Personally, I don’t think Murray is elite, he seems to me like a guy who will always throw 200-250 yards and 1-2 tds a game at roughly 66% completion, but equally won’t get sacked or give the ball away much. Paired with an elite defence, and enough offensive playmakers, I could see that as a formula for winning, and the high pick could then be spent on a elite receiver or tackle.

eagle eye

There's so many WBs in this draft who could be great and there's question marks over the top QBs.

Kaleb Williams has been looked at as a generational talent but the two times he's ran into a top defense he's struggled.

Drake Maye finished the season badly.

There's every chance that Penix, Daniels and Nick are available in the middle of the first round. You've got McCarthy, Ewers, and then Taulia Tagovailoa who I think is very underrated. Shedeur Sanders did some job at Colorado without an offensive line, he's not even in the conversation.

There's more too, I'm just pointing out the amount of talent and two at the end the that I like.

I wouldn't be against trading down a bit like what the Bears did, get an elite receiver from the team we trade with and a tackle with the first round pick. Then gamble on a QB later in the second round, that's not a huge gamble in this draft. Hold onto Mac and sit the rookie for at least a few games while the offense finds it's feet.

el Fenomeno

Looking unlikely that Trent Brown will be back next year. His latest tweet taking a shot at the coaches for not giving Malik Cunningham a shot.

eagle eye

We are better off without Trent Brown even if I agree that Malik should have got a shot.

He's exactly where I expected him to be, was sure the Ravens would draft him late, as he's the perfect backup for Lamar. Sat behind him at Louisville and then started for a couple of years in the exact same offense and did it well.

Coreyhotline

I’d say zappe is crapping himself after seeing the injury report. There’s a high prospect that in 12 personnel his blind side protection will be Lowe, mafi and gesicki! If ever there was a line-up that could get a player killed, that’s probably it. On the plus side, we should be one loss closer to pick 1.

paulie21

Down to 4th now, suppose small consolation it ended the Broncos playoff hopes. Anyway, Happy Christmas to ye all.

AbusesToilets

Hoping for a strong performance today from the Bills. Pretty sure Bill won't be able to help himself and go all out to beat the Jets.

eagle eye

Just need Zappe to do what he did this week and we should be fine next week.

AbusesToilets

So, in a theoretical where Belichick walks, who would be a good option to replace him? Harboraugh would be an obvious one, with a pretty solid pedigree. Wouldn't be to keen on Bienemy, strikes me as someone made to look amazing because of Mahomes. Has to be a reason no team has picked him up. Not sold on the idea of Mayo taking over, don't think that he's shown enough.

Any promising coaches in college land who would be worth considering?

Christy42

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121567242#Comment_121567242

I suspect Harbaugh is not an option for the Pats. Herbert would be a massive draw for any coach.

Other college coaches will be a risk but a risk must be taken. Coaching in college is just a different skill set.

eagle eye

Which Harbaugh? John will never be in New England. I personally wouldn't want him, not that it makes any difference what I want.😁

There's a possibility Jim leaves Michigan with all the current controversy.

colmufc

Mike Vrabel

AbusesToilets

Now we wait. I'm not expecting anything tomorrow, but I think it really comes down to whether Bill is willing to accept bringing in someone from the outside to be involved with the GM side.

CMcsporty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121585323#Comment_121585323

Hope that Bill and Kraft part ways this week. If it doesn't happen this week it will be acrimonious and somewhat spoil what's gone before.

Plus it will be enthralling to see BB at another team. No way he's going to walk away without trying to win another SB.

I don't understand the beat down on BB and saying it was mostly Brady that won those 6 SBs.

el Fenomeno

Initial quotes are positive if you take it them at face value.

https://twitter.com/ezlazar/status/1744338665482998023?s=20

Of course, given that it's Belichick - that could be a standard autofill response to brush off the question.

My ideal scenario is that Belichick remains as head coach, Mayo stays in his current position, and a new GM comes in.

I'm torn on the offence and whether I want a completely new offensive coordinator, or I want BOB to stay and allowed fill out his own staff. He wasn't allowed do the latter last year so I'm somewhat willing to give him a pass.

Whatever happens, there is a massive ask on offence as you need to invest heavily at almost every position, and I'm not sure there's enough flexibility in the draft and FA to hit all the positions.

eagle eye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121586592#Comment_121586592

When did you start supporting the Patriots? Are you a fairweather fan that cannot take a couple of bad seasons? Do you realise how tough it is to stay on top as long as the Patriots did.

I suppose you put all the success down to Tom Brady.

You couldn't be more wrong if you do. Our defense won two of our Superbowls and shared two more, Brady and the offense won the other two. At least two of our losses, to the Giants twice seen the offense not score 20 points. In those two losses the defense conceded 17 and 21 points.

Tom Brady is the greatest NFL player of all time but no player can win Superbowls on his own. Bill Belichick is the great coach of all time.

He should step back from the GM role, we've had a couple of bad drafts and at 70 he should only be concentrating on one job and that's being the head coach of the New England Patriots.

We are four players away from being serious contenders again, that's a QB, two offensive tackles and an elite wide receiver.

To have the temerity to suggest that Bill should should be fired is plain ridiculous and stupid.

Apologies if my honesty offends you.

CMcsporty

Get off your high horse

I lived in Boston and went to Foxboro long long before you appeared on boards OR Brady even in NE

As for calling people stupid...read the post again 'eagle eye'

& you can shove your insincere apology

eagle eye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121590495#Comment_121590495

I lived in Boston long before I was on boards. I was a season ticket holder for a few seasons.

It started out as bad times when we were a joke of a franchise just before Bob Kraft bought it.

So you can shove your know-it-all crap.

You want the greatest coach in the history of the NFL fired. It's the first sentence in the post I quoted. That's the stupid bit.

If you look at the team, the defense is still great. All we need is a good draft and some good signings in FA for the offense and we'll be serious contenders again.

We need four players, two offensive tackles, an elite wide receiver and a QB. We can get the QB in the draft, we can get a tackle in the draft and we could get lucky and find that receiver too. Whatever we can't get there we need to sign in FA.

Tbh I'm not sure we even need a QB, get the tackles and the receiver and all you need to start out is a game manager.

Now I've said I'd like Bill to step back from his GM role, he's too defense oriented to do that job, you need somebody with balance in that position. He's still an awesome coach.

The other thing we need to do is resign Kyle Dugger.