Match Thread - Leinster v Ulster - RDS Arena - Fri 27 November 19:35 | TG4 BBC NI

blackdog1

Vdf was excellent and he runs great lines a proper 7. Teo needs to stay. I could him doing a job for Ireland easily if he stays our backline is terrible without him. Ringrose again looked good in his cameo and both him and teo posses offloading skills that our other backs don't. Still think he needs to bulk up more and needs to be minded for this year but he hits Rucks hard and contests well at the breakdown.
Tracey looked great in his cameo fantastic tackling and good in contact.
Ruddock looks back on form too. All in all it was encouraging just missed a few opportunities. Sexton is a worry every time he goes into contact I'm not sure he's going to get up.

Tox56

I think there has to be real consideration of a Te'o-Ringrose centre combination now, especially if Reid is out. Ringrose keeps coming off the bench and looking really impressive, it could simply be the case at this point that he's the best option we have in that position, regardless of age, and we need to give him a start there to prove it. I'd love to see him linking up with Sexton, Nacewa and Fitzgerald, one of the defining characteristics of the great Schmidt team was that we had a backline full of great rugby brains and incredibly creative attacking players who were all on the same sort of wavelength. The likes of Te'o, DK and McFadden can be good at what they do, but they don't have the same 'intelligence' as the guys named above, and I definitely think Ringrose does

molloyjh

Deleted User wrote: »

The last 3 games I've watched Sexton play he's looked in discomfort throughout and has consistently been slow getting off the ground.

Now I don't for a second think there are ongoing concussion issues. Medical staff who know what they are looking for will be watching him like a hawk and I cringe everytime I see people say "he looks like he still has concussion" on the forum.

He does look however like he is carrying something that his limiting his movement a bit. Most sports people know what its like to carry a niggle that doesn't stop you competing but doesn't give you full range of movement pain free. That's where Sexton seems to be at the moment.

Still, his fingerprints were all over the game and we were playing in the right areas of the park consistently. We set up plenty of chances and most of that originated with Sexton. An effective albeit not flashy performance and when Madigan moved to 12 you could see we lost a good bit of our shape, though Ulster were very much on the back foot at that stage having been hammered at for 50 minutes.

Yeah I do think it is the groin issue all right. One thing to note is his little kicks in behind the defensive line. He's done that a few times over the last few weeks to great effect and it's something a few of us here have been crying out for the last few seasons. The difference with having a guy able to execute those kicks well is huge as it then forces the opposition to leave an extra man or two behind the line where as in the last 2 seasons they didn't have to.

stephen_n

.ak wrote: »

Sexton was definitely limping after the game.

He hurt his knee in the first half.

molloyjh

stephen_n wrote: »

He hurt his knee in the first half.

He hasn't been moving right since coming back from the RWC. It's not the first time I've commented on it here and it's something all of us on the terrace have noticed a few times now.

vienne86

There seemed to me to be far fewer Ulster fans than usual down for the match last night, the the KO time would have made it difficult. I had three guys in front of me, one of whom lit up a fag - when I told him it was a no smoking area, he said OK, but finished the fag anyway. He lit up several times again during the match and when I reminded him again about the no smoking rule, he said he didn't care. I always enjoy the Ulster fans, and find them dead sound, so this was disappointing.

errlloyd

Interested Observer wrote: »

Sorry but there's no substantive point here really. He was playing. And if we're going for what if scenarios then what if Leinster had have managed to score instead of knocking on or getting held up?

There's no argument really that Ulster were the better side. And yes VdF played really well.

The substantive point is that we won the match by less than a converted try, we did plenty of defending and our best defender and best player was VDF. A kid pretty fresh out of school. I guess where I was going with that is if Leo had been conservative and played dom Ryan there for instance I genuinely think we may have lost.

CatFromHue

Leinster v Ulster is usually played over the Christmas holidays or on a Saturday so yeah it's much harder to make it down for 7.30 on a Friday.

Interested Observer

errlloyd wrote: »

The substantive point is that we won the match by less than a converted try, we did plenty of defending and our best defender and best player was VDF. A kid pretty fresh out of school. I guess where I was going with that is if Leo had been conservative and played dom Ryan there for instance I genuinely think we may have lost.

Oh cmon, fresh out of school, he's 22.

As I said you're still applying this what if scenario in one direction only. Held up over the line twice. Knocked on over the line. Nacewa couldn't throw a simple pass with a great try scoring chance on offer.

stephen_n

molloyjh wrote: »

He hasn't been moving right since coming back from the RWC. It's not the first time I've commented on it here and it's something all of us on the terrace have noticed a few times now.

It would be natural with a groin injury to carry it like that though, it's something that lingers. But he was noticeably carrying the leg after hurting his knee. His kicking seemed fine too, which is a good sign with a groin strain. I thought he looked ok last night till McGrath went off, though what worries me more, is his body position in the tackle, he still stands up and takes the hit, which is going to lead to more concussions.

errlloyd

Interested Observer wrote: »

Oh cmon, fresh out of school, he's 22.

As I said you're still applying this what if scenario in one direction only. Held up over the line twice. Knocked on over the line. Nacewa couldn't throw a simple pass with a great try scoring chance on offer.

With respect, you don't understand the point I'm making. There is a difference between a controllable what if and an uncontrollable what if.

So for instance "what if Isa hadnt made that mistake" is a fairly meaningless question, becuase it's a simple mistake, it's not as if the coaching team could travel back in time and change it. It happens. A controllable what if is a decision made by the coach that he made not have made. Many of us wouldn't have been surprised if the coach picked Murphy or Ryan. But he didn't.

I do think there is value on reflecting on coaching decisions and analysing whether or not they paid off. This one did.

Journeyman_1

One of my favourite moments of this game was when Sexton stopped and basically picked up Gilroy who was running at close to full speed!

Utah_Saint

Am I right in saying Nacewa didn't play any rugby for 2 years before coming back to Leinster?

If true then that's perfectly shows the problems in Irish province rugby. Ulster have been importing poor quality for a few seasons now and its working out great.... :-(

irishbucsfan

Utah_Saint wrote: »

Am I right in saying Nacewa didn't play any rugby for 2 years before coming back to Leinster?

If true then that's perfectly shows the problems in Irish province rugby. Ulster have been importing poor quality for a few seasons now and its working out great.... :-(

Well Isa retired and got a all that tax money back, I'd imagine coming out of retirement was a bit of a pain to organise, if he'd done it when he got to Auckland I'm sure it would have been even more difficult. It's not like he wasn't playing because he couldn't get a gig, I'm sure the Blues would have loved to have him involved in a playing capacity as well as being a coach.

vienne86

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Well Isa retired and got a all that tax money back, I'd imagine coming out of retirement was a bit of a pain to organise, if he'd done it when he got to Auckland I'm sure it would have been even more difficult. It's not like he wasn't playing because he couldn't get a gig, I'm sure the Blues would have loved to have him involved in a playing capacity as well as being a coach.

He came back to Leinster at the start of the season playing like he had never stopped - I think it is extraordinary. And I'm loving it!

molloyjh

Just watching this back now and on 10 mins Sexton was pinged for a forward pass when he kept running his line after giving the ball and was always in front of it. Surely that then is not a forward pass at all? In real terms the ball actually only went forward about a metre or two.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVkPh2OuGP0

.ak

Yeah it was never a forward pass, I was in line with it and even with momentum it clearly went backwards.

Sometimes I wonder if the refs are aware of the momentum law.

CatFromHue

At the time I thought it was a bad call but that looks ok to me.

Sexton has very little forward momentum when he's passing the ball, if he was running full whack then there might be a case for that, so it looks like he just threw it forward.

.ak

Ah it definitely travels backwards from his hands, I thought it was a lovely cut out pass and I hate to see them pinged like that.

Thelomen Toblackai

That annoyed me at the time too. Looks like a perfectly fine pass. Madigan must have called the ref on it too because he got a talking to for mouthing off immediately after it.

molloyjh

Reddan was really poor in the second half. Only at 53 mins here now but he has made mistake after mistake.

The Rape of Lucretia

.ak wrote: »

Yeah it was never a forward pass, I was in line with it and even with momentum it clearly went backwards.

Sometimes I wonder if the refs are aware of the momentum realtive motion law.

It was a perfectly good pass. Ref error.

CatFromHue

I don't see that pass going backwards.

Sexton is jogging when he passes it and the guy who catches it does so a good meter in front of where Sexton threw it from.

Tox56

CatFromHue wrote: »

I don't see that pass going backwards.

Sexton is jogging when he passes it and the guy who catches it does so a good meter in front of where Sexton threw it from.

The whole momentum argument doesn't stop applying because you aren't full out sprinting, considering he was jogging forward and throwing a pass of considerable length going forward a metre isn't really anything at all, I think it was a perfect pass

CatFromHue

I can feel a science experiment coming on.....if I had the money to waste that is

molloyjh

CatFromHue wrote: »

I don't see that pass going backwards.

Sexton is jogging when he passes it and the guy who catches it does so a good meter in front of where Sexton threw it from.

That he is moving forward slower than he could be doesn't change the fact that he is moving forward. At no time is the ball ahead of where Sexton is, it leaves his hands backwards and it only travels about 1-2 metres forward while he himself is also moving forwards.

Anyway, it was just a query on the laws as much as anything. I actually think Lacey did OK over the 80 for the most part so it's not meant in that way.

mfceiling

.ak wrote: »

Yeah it was never a forward pass, I was in line with it and even with momentum it clearly went backwards.

Sometimes I wonder if the refs are aware of the momentum law.

Remember who the ref was...

.ak

mfceiling wrote: »

Remember who the ref was...

The linesman called it iirc

Dave_The_Sheep

Does that "lines on the pitch, momentum" video have to be posted again?

Clearly not a forward pass.

CatFromHue

You get forward momentum onto the pass when you're running (and usually running fast), look at the clip again and Sexton slows right down to walking speed when he throws the pass and only gets up to a jog after the ball leaves his hand.

I don't think he puts any forward momentum onto the ball as he doesn't have any forward momentum himself.