A different sort of immigration topic

PittIsIt · 31-10-2015 12:07am #1

So, I'm quite familiar that there is a sort of immigration... event happening in Europe. Some people see it as an issue (or disaster) and some people see it as an opportunity. I've read numerous places where people hate "the Polish" or "the Brazilians" etc coming in and taking jobs. I get that to some degree, I have my own opinions but they're kind of irrelevant to the topic at hand.

So starting my part of the story. I'm a young American, and it's in my head that I want to uproot my family and move across the Atlantic to Ireland. I'm an experienced Chemical Engineer with additional experience managing people, and part of my reasoning is Ireland's burgeoning pharma industry. Part of it is the landscape and mild climate. Most of it lies in that America is a wreck socially and I want to connect myself therewith to a progressive, peaceful state. Add in the fact that I have 1.4L of Irish blood (1 grandparent for those too lazy to do the math) and it's a slam dunk.

I'm well aware this is a difficult road. I'm seeing it already, even though the government specifically calls out my background as a "needed skill" and makes it easy for me to come to work, it's hard finding a company that doesn't put you below Irish citizens, just because. I get that, and I fully accept it as a barrier. But I'm going to continue trying.

Now the fun part. People seem to have disdain for immigrants because they come in, take low skill jobs away from others who need them, and end up on welfare being paid for by taxpayers (heavy stereotypes, I'm aware). Not everyone will come out and say it, but I would bet that for everyone who speaks out, another 3-4 hold it secretly. If I were to successfully carry out my plan, that would make me an immigrant. But, truth be told, I'm bringing a family, a savings, a plan to live there permanently. I'm also bringing a skill, one labeled as deficient by the Irish government, and I wouldn't be just taking a job at a hotel or at a bar.

We get this a lot in America. This mentality that all immigrants are bad typically stems from Mexicans coming over to do hard labor, but there are many other people from around the globe who come to try to make their lives better. When a Chinese or an Indian intellectual come to attend college, or get a job with a large company, the xenophobia rages. They say "can't you hire an American, they're taking a job away" when in truth, the company just wants to hire who is most qualified. Sometimes, that's an intellectual from another country. But haters hate regardless, it's a serious issue around here.

In short, I'm asking what yinz think will happen when I finally move. Will I be treated as an outsider, hell bent on stealing precious jobs that should be filled with Irish intellectuals? Will I be lumped in with every other immigrant? Or are the xenophobic reports blown out of proportion because that side is louder?

If you could, I'd ask that you give:
1) your personal opinion
2) your gauge of what the typical herd opinion of people in Ireland, and how I'd be treated.

And of course, the reason I came here is because I'm finding people on this board brutally honest, so please do your worst if it's the truth. I mean, Donald Trump is vying to be my president, I've heard it all.

shane9689 · 31-10-2015 12:13am

First off, Americans will always get treated differently to other migrants because they are considered part of the "western world".

ALOT of irish people have an american conenction and alot of Irish people feel a personal or family bond to the United States....also youre a native english speaker, which helps alot.
So with that said, most Irish people will welcome you! and be curious about you!

However, you may always be "The American" but you wont be the only person of your kind and if you put in enough effort, you can usually intergrate quite well...racist and xenephobic people are everywhere, so ignore stupid comments if you get them (they should be rare anyways)

look up a guy called Des Bishop.... He was from Boston but had an Irish connection. He moved back to Ireland and intergrated quite well. He even speaks irish fluently!

Sir Osis of Liver. · 31-10-2015 12:14am

As long as you don't eat our swans you're welcome.

tomwaterford · 31-10-2015 12:15am

Watch the film the field

shane9689 · 31-10-2015 12:15am

also, i want to add. The migrants coming from third world countries are viewed in a completely different light as those coming from america or other countries in Europe.... Culturally theres not as many barriers between Ireland and the U.S. and if anything, the Irish are stealing the jobs in the U.S not the other way around :P

major bill · 31-10-2015 12:18am

As Brendan Gleeson said to the yank in the film 'in Bruges' ''Just try not to be too loud or Crass''

Tigger · 31-10-2015 12:21am

do you like beer ?

PittIsIt · 31-10-2015 12:24am

shane9689 wrote: »

look up a guy Des Bishop!

I love des! The fact that I get the humor is great.

One eyed Jack · 31-10-2015 12:25am

In your case OP, the grass definitely seems to be 40 shades greener.

I cannot stand the "dey tuk our jawbs" mentality myself as though people think they should be hired for a job, or entitled to call dibs on a job that doesn't yet exist for anyone, simply based upon their nationality, or the fact that they were born here.

Hell if you're coming here to contribute to our economy and make a better life for yourself at the same time, why wouldn't you take the opportunity when you're in a career that's in demand?

Nice to see the brain drain coming our way for a change!

PittIsIt · 31-10-2015 12:25am

Tigger wrote: »

do you like beer

People think it's hilarious when I order Guinness at a restaurant. I can't drink piss bud light, or miller light, or Yeungling. Stuff just doesn't look right.

Tigger · 31-10-2015 12:26am

Des Bishop is a bit done and he dosen't drink beer
try i liked Des before he was soo overplayed

PittIsIt · 31-10-2015 12:29am

One eyed Jack wrote: »

In your case OP, the grass definitely seems to be 40 shades greener.

I cannot stand the "dey tuk our jawbs" mentality myself as though people think they should be hired for a job, or entitled to call dibs on a job that doesn't yet exist for anyone, simply based upon their nationality, or the fact that they were born here.

Hell if you're coming here to contribute to our economy and make a better life for yourself at the same time, why wouldn't you take the opportunity when you're in a career that's in demand?

Nice to see the brain drain coming our way for a change!

Thanks for that.

The hardest part is going to be that I am qualified for intellectual jobs, but not too the point that companies would fight to have me work there. I was talking with a recruiter, he said the biggest thing is that companies see hiring an expat as a huge risk, especially since there is s price to pay the government and a price to pay for relocation. I think my best bet is going to be networking, but not being in the actual country really hampers networking ability.

Junkyard Tom · 31-10-2015 12:30am

G'WAY. :mad:

jamesbere · 31-10-2015 12:31am

You'll easily get a good welcoming. If you meet anyone that has a problem with you and your family moving over to Ireland to settle tell them to f**k off and remind them how many Irish have settled in America to live.

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 12:36am

It seems strange that someone with your level of education would have such poor command of the English language.
If I were you I wouldn't harp on about your 1.4 liters of Irish blood or you might find yourself the subject of derision.
Before leaving America it might be an idea to familiarise yourself with world events.

Junkyard Tom · 31-10-2015 12:39am

Keep off the moors, stick to the roads.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJHIL0A3WA4

Tigger · 31-10-2015 12:41am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

It seems strange that someone with your level of education would have such poor command of the English language.
If I were you I wouldn't harp on about your 1.4 liters of Irish blood or you might find yourself the subject of derision.
Before leaving America it might be an idea to familiarise yourself with world events.

i'm sorry but WHAT?

Sheep Lover · 31-10-2015 12:41am

Stay out of Cavan, there be the monsters.

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 12:42am

Tigger wrote: »

i'm sorry but WHAT?

I accept your apology. What, what?

Tigger · 31-10-2015 12:43am

whats wrong with you, like really?

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 12:46am

Tigger wrote: »

whats wrong with you, like really?

Ah I see. You are obviously like totally a valley girl.

PittIsIt · 31-10-2015 12:56am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

It seems strange that someone with your level of education would have such poor command of the English language.
If I were you I wouldn't harp on about your 1.4 liters of Irish blood or you might find yourself the subject of derision.
Before leaving America it might be an idea to familiarise yourself with world events.

On language, I'll admit my opener wasn't the best, it's hard making a mini epic sound great without editing. And editing is hard with a one year old pawing at the screen.

Nationality is a real thing in America. Practically no one is truly Native American, we're all European immigrants. It would be the same if the Irish kept track of how much of their line were native Pict-like people, first invasion Celts, Norman or Anglo-Saxon, etc, but yinz are able to see past most of that. Or maybe that was just so long ago you don't can't really know.

I'd be really interested in a list of pertinant world events. I'm from a generation where we're shying away from traditional news sources. I get a lot of news from other places. Even so, most American news is American centric. I hate saying no one cares about Europe, but 99% of people don't even know basic facts about Europe. I know that there is a Syrian immigration crisis, which most of my colleagues don't even know exists. I have read opinions about the developing countries' immigrants in Europe flooding into developed ones looking for jobs. I also am well aware of a certain referendum earlier this year. What else would you suggest I don't really have a grasp on?

31-10-2015 1:03am

What's "yinz"?

Junkyard Tom · 31-10-2015 1:04am

PittIsIt wrote: »

What else would you suggest

Learn to ignore people who have little else to do but nit-pick others' posts in an attempt to feel better about themselves. Generally we're a welcoming bunch in Ireland.

Deleted User wrote: »

What's "yinz"?

It's a bit like "you'uns", 'you ones', 'you guys', or 'ye'.

PittIsIt · 31-10-2015 1:10am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What's "yinz"?

Western Pennsylvania colloquialism for a plural "you". It originally came from Scots-Irish immigrants. The theory is that the Irish had a hard time differentiating that there were two different forms for "you" in Irish but only one in English, so they typically used "you ones" in the plural. This became yinz.

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 1:10am

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Learn to ignore people who have little else to do but nit-pick others' posts in a an attempt to feel better about themselves. Generally we're a welcoming bunch in Ireland.

If the OP is job hunting a badly constructed C.V will harm his prospects.
Feel free to be all diddly idddly if you want but being realistic would better help the OP.

31-10-2015 1:11am

PittIsIt wrote: »

Western Pennsylvania colloquialism for a plural "you". It originally came from Scots-Irish immigrants. The theory is that the Irish had a hard time differentiating that there were two different forms for "you" in Irish but only one in English, so they typically used "you ones" in the plural. This became yinz.

Interesting. Never have seen it written before.

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 1:12am

PittIsIt wrote: »

On language, I'll admit my opener wasn't the best, it's hard making a mini epic sound great without editing. And editing is hard with a one year old pawing at the screen.

Nationality is a real thing in America. Practically no one is truly Native American, we're all European immigrants. It would be the same if the Irish kept track of how much of their line were native Pict-like people, first invasion Celts, Norman or Anglo-Saxon, etc, but yinz are able to see past most of that. Or maybe that was just so long ago you don't can't really know.

I'd be really interested in a list of pertinant world events. I'm from a generation where we're shying away from traditional news sources. I get a lot of news from other places. Even so, most American news is American centric. I hate saying no one cares about Europe, but 99% of people don't even know basic facts about Europe. I know that there is a Syrian immigration crisis, which most of my colleagues don't even know exists. I have read opinions about the developing countries' immigrants in Europe flooding into developed ones looking for jobs. I also am well aware of a certain referendum earlier this year. What else would you suggest I don't really have a grasp on?

I am aware that Americans qualify their Nationality with their ancestry . If someone who is patently American claims Irishness they can be subject to ridicule or sideways looks.
I am not saying this is right but it is something to be aware of.
As regards your spelling and sentence construction ,I mention it as you put yourself forward as an intellectual and frequently people misrepresent themselves on boards.
I think the BBC or Channel 4 (UK) are good sources of news if you have access to them.

Stheno · 31-10-2015 1:21am

PittIsIt wrote: »

Thanks for that.

The hardest part is going to be that I am qualified for intellectual jobs, but not too the point that companies would fight to have me work there. I was talking with a recruiter, he said the biggest thing is that companies see hiring an expat as a huge risk, especially since there is s price to pay the government and a price to pay for relocation. I think my best bet is going to be networking, but not being in the actual country really hampers networking ability.

This will be your biggest challenge, are you active on linkedin?

Also what truly specialist skills do you have that no one out of 320 million people in the EU Have?

As someone in their mid forties, I can go to Australia as I have very specialist It related skills, do you have the same?

31-10-2015 1:24am

One Irish grandparent, assuming that person was born in Ireland, entitled to an Irish passport, does not have to compete with EU citizens to obtain a visa, just has to compete with them the way any other EU citizen does.

Tigger · 31-10-2015 1:25am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

Ah I see. You are obviously like totally a valley girl.

Obviously

Stheno · 31-10-2015 1:27am

Deleted User wrote: »

One Irish grandparent, assuming that person was born in Ireland, entitled to an Irish passport, does not have to compete with EU citizens to obtain a visa, just has to compete with them the way any other EU citizen does.

I missed that apologies.

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 1:29am

Tigger wrote: »

Obviously

I can't remember who said it and about who but it reminds me of you. "They are the kind of person who if you were playing tennis with them would pick up the ball and put it in their pocket."

Tigger · 31-10-2015 1:32am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

I can't remember who said it and about who but it reminds me of you. "They are the kind of person who if you were playing tennis with them would pick up the ball and put it in their pocket."

ok I don't know who said it about who but it reminds me of you
"That bloke is a gob****e "

Junkyard Tom · 31-10-2015 1:34am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

you put yourself forward as an intellectual

Your reading comprehension isn't serving you well. OP did not claim to be an intellectual.

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 1:36am

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Your reading comprehension isn't serving you well. OP did not claim to be an intellectual.

OP says he is qualified for intellectual jobs which leads me to surmise that he considers himself an intellectual.

Billy86 · 31-10-2015 1:37am

PittIsIt wrote: »

Thanks for that.

The hardest part is going to be that I am qualified for intellectual jobs, but not too the point that companies would fight to have me work there. I was talking with a recruiter, he said the biggest thing is that companies see hiring an expat as a huge risk, especially since there is s price to pay the government and a price to pay for relocation. I think my best bet is going to be networking, but not being in the actual country really hampers networking ability.

Irish companies also tend to have a strange fetish almost for foreign experience, so that will help.

All should be grand, but if you've got a noticeable accent you can expect the urine to be extracted on a couple of occasions.

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 1:38am

Tigger wrote: »

ok I don't know who said it about who but it reminds me of you
"That bloke is a gob****e "

Ah Tigger are you "like" upset?

PittIsIt · 31-10-2015 1:41am

Stheno wrote: »

This will be your biggest challenge, are you active on linkedin?

Also what truly specialist skills do you have that no one out of 320 million people in the EU Have?

As someone in their mid forties, I can go to Australia as I have very specialist It related skills, do you have the same?

I'm getting more active. LinkedIn is tough for young people, since it mostly connects people with lots of professional experience, but it's getting better. I do see your point about super specialized skills, but by the same token there are not just a few jobs either. Lots of engineers are needed to keep the country on the direction it's going. The flip side of this is to wait the 15 years until I have a deep understanding (so to speak) of specialized skills, which isn't the most appealing. If I'm in my mid forties before being judged worthy of Irish alien status, then it'll probably be too bad

Junkyard Tom · 31-10-2015 1:43am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

OP says he is qualified for intellectual jobs which leads me to surmise that he considers himself an intellectual.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wb4a_CLHtBs

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 1:47am

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wb4a_CLHtBs

I take it that means no apology for your erroneous comment.

Stheno · 31-10-2015 1:50am

PittIsIt wrote: »

I'm getting more active. LinkedIn is tough for young people, since it mostly connects people with lots of professional experience, but it's getting better. I do see your point about super specialized skills, but by the same token there are not just a few jobs either. Lots of engineers are needed to keep the country on the direction it's going. The flip side of this is to wait the 15 years until I have a deep understanding (so to speak) of specialized skills, which isn't the most appealing. If I'm in my mid forties before being judged worthy of Irish alien status, then it'll probably be too bad

If you are young that suggests you don't have the specilised skills and experience,

Engineers are easy to come by in the Eu, coming from the US you'd need more.

Azalea · 31-10-2015 1:54am

When the OP says "intellectual" they probably just mean "highly-skilled".

OP, just as a point of interest, if you're of Scotch-Irish (or Ulster-Scots) stock, you'd trace your roots to Northern Ireland/Scotland. As far as I know, the latter gravitated more towards the north-east of the US, whereas the former gravitated towards further south-east. That's actually quite a different heritage to Irish catholic.

PittIsIt · 31-10-2015 2:00am

Azalea wrote: »

When the OP says "intellectual" they probably just mean "highly-skilled".

OP, just as a point of interest, if you're of Scotch-Irish (or Ulster-Scots) stock, you'd trace your roots to Northern Ireland/Scotland. As far as I know, the latter gravitated more towards the north-east of the US, whereas the former gravitated towards further south-east. That's actually quite a different heritage to Irish catholic.

Yup yup

I trace back to Co. Cork originally, the yinzer in me was picked up once I moved to Pittsburgh, and not original.

Billy86 · 31-10-2015 2:01am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

As regards your spelling and sentence construction ,I mention it as you put yourself forward as an intellectual and frequently people misrepresent themselves on boards.

Engineering is not English; the forms of intellect used in each are very different.

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 2:06am

Billy86 wrote: »

Engineering is not English; the forms of intellect used in each are very different.

The point is the OP indicates a high level of education but this does not seem to be borne out by the evidence of his posts.
Wouldn't be the first Walter Mitty to sign up on boards.

Billy86 · 31-10-2015 2:09am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

The point is the OP indicates a high level of education but this does not seem to be borne out by the evidence of his posts.

The fact is English classes are not part of an engineering curriculum (any engineers reading, feel free to correct me on this!).

PittIsIt · 31-10-2015 2:11am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

The point is the OP indicates a high level of education but this does not seem to be borne out by the evidence of his posts.

Maybe there is a logical disconnect here. The "intellectual" tag getting thrown around seems to have a really distinct meaning (philosopher, professor, research professional maybe) but I guess I'm taking it to be someone with a background in a technical field. This standing in stark contrast to your typical grunt with little to his name except a high school education, or a journeyman who has applied himself to learn a trade.

Although I really didn't think my language is would be enough to judge that on. I might not be speaking Latin or King James' English but it sure beats 99% of the world.

... this is a forum after all.

Isaiah · 31-10-2015 2:11am

The Irish get on fantastically well with Americans. You will be treated as well as any Irish or British person. You certainly won't be considered an immigrant in the negative sense of the word. Irish companies of repute certainly do not give preference to Irish workers, in fact it is illegal to do so here.

There is a minority who may spout hate about immigrants on internet forums, but in Real life in Ireland you will not experience anything of the sort and those idiots tend to direct their hate towards people from non-English speaking nations. You wouldn't be considered very foreign.

Americans, Canadians, Australians, Kiwi's, White South Africans and British would be the least likely immigrants to experience discrimination here because they were all at some stage British colonies (Except Britain of course) and are therefore familiar. In Ireland we are a welcoming friendly helpful bunch. As an American you will be considered almost one of our own by many.

Even people who come from more diverse backgrounds will rarely if ever experience discrimination. Ireland is not a racist or unwelcoming country in any way. For example; we are probably the only country in Europe who doesn't have a right wing in politics.

What you might find however is that the US governments foreign policy is rather unpopular by and large. Particularly its actions in the Middle East. With that in mind as long as your not going around telling people " We saved your asses in WW2" you will be fine.

Mark Tapley · 31-10-2015 2:12am

The OP is considering a life changing move and is getting a lot of "sure be grand" if that makes me the bad guy so be it.

Isaiah · 31-10-2015 2:13am

Mark Tapley wrote: »

The OP is considering a life changing move and is getting a lot of "sure be grand" if that makes me the bad guy so be it.

He's gonna have to get used to things being 'grand' if he is moving to Ireland.:)

A different sort of immigration topic

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