Running Fibre-Optic broadband cables above ground?

Andy From Sligo

rob808 wrote: »

yea rural FTTH of eir not starting till 2017 and NBP won't really start till 2017 as well even doh it suppose start mid 2016.Were in for a long wait but at least when they do start we have something to look forward to .

A lot could happen between now and 2017 ... by that time they might even decide to shelve the plans for FTTH (its possible) or the people carrying out the FTTH contract could go into liquidation (its possible) - and they might just get all existing cabinets FTTC and decide that using the existing copper from cabinet to home achieves good enough acceptable broadband speed for rural area and again shelve it with grunts of it would be un-economical and not viable to get every rural home FTTH enabled. and also if the SIRO venture fails or only makes it to towns and not villages again the competition will be gone and then eir might decide theres no need for FTTH

- its all surmising, but i know from past history from what services were supposed to be launched but shelved in the end or changed. Just call me pessimistic I suppose.

rob808

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

A lot could happen between now and 2017 ... by that time they might even decide to shelve the plans for FTTH (its possible) or the people carrying out the FTTH contract could go into liquidation (its possible) - and they might just get all existing cabinets FTTC and decide that using the existing copper from cabinet to home achieves good enough acceptable broadband speed for rural area and again shelve it with grunts of it would be un-economical and not viable to get every rural home FTTH enabled. and also if the SIRO venture fails or only makes it to towns and not villages again the competition will be gone and then eir might decide theres no need for FTTH

- its all surmising, but i know from past history from what services were supposed to be launched but shelved in the end or changed. Just call me pessimistic I suppose.

well that could happen but it unlikely they just rebrand and siro not gona fail there partner up with Vodafone which know what there doing we need siro to succeed or you be stuck FTTC for a very long time.

The goverment not gona allow eir go back on there word they learn from the pass and the new map not getting update till mid November.They wanna know how eir plans on doing it.

Eir have pick very carefully were there ruining FTTH to rural Ireland most of blue lines are only few Kms long it true that it not economical to run FTTH to all of Ireland that what NBP for which eir hope to win all of it or most of it.

The Cush

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

i have already been told by my present provider (vodafone at home ADSL) when I asked why I am getting only 6mbps on an presently advertised 24mbps is that it falls off per distance away from cabinet... so I said I was near to cabinet ... so they said but you still loose signal down the copper wires thats where the bottleneck is ... so I will be in same boat even if they put FTTC wont I ? - I still maintain copper although I am no expert that its only designed best for voice and not speeds of up to 100mbps - and total fibre FTTH is the best equipment for fast broadband speeds

6Mbps at 413meters from the exchange seems low.

Using my brother's adsl2 connection as an example, he lives 4Km from our local exchange, radio backhaul/no core fibre connection (just like your exchange it appears), his line tests for 10Mb, his modem syncs at 7Mb, he gets about 6 but because its a radio link back to the core network this 6 can drop back to 1 in the evenings/weekends when lots of people in the area get online (congestion).

Our local exchange is due for efibre upgrade early next year just like yours, now this won't benefit him directly as he's beyond the 1.7Km limit for efibre from an exchange but as part of the upgrade they will run fibre backhaul to the exchange and this should remove the congestion for adsl users and give him a stable 6Mbps or a bit more all the time.

efibre speed from the exchange is distance dependant (and line quality dependant of course), see page 47 of this eir document which give you an appox speed based on your distance - http://www.openeir.ie/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=2785. Those figures are for a vectored cabinet (up to 2Km), most exchanges are not vectored so the max distance is about 1.7Km I believe.

Andy From Sligo

OK so i am just getting a handle on this map then. - so the parts where I have highlighted with yellow arrow, is this where the fibre is going to end then and them blue lines does that mean thats as far as they have got to at the moment? or is this as much as they are going to go when its complete?

ED E

If you're within 20m of one of those blue lines you should probably be able to avail of FTTH. They're the plans, to be completed by 2020. Back arse of sligo is likely to be closer to 2020 than 2017.

Andy From Sligo

ED E wrote: »

If you're within 20m of one of those blue lines you should probably be able to avail of FTTH. They're the plans, to be completed by 2020. Back arse of sligo is likely to be closer to 2020 than 2017.

thats the reality .....:rolleyes:

murphaph

In other developed countries the FTTH horizon is more like 2030! Count your blessings.

rob808

murphaph wrote: »

In other developed countries the FTTH horizon is more like 2030! Count your blessings.

That true looking at BT doing G.FAST instead of FTTH and now australia now following BT and not doing FTTH were lucky that both eir and siro are doing FTTH.

Andy From Sligo

fine thats all well and good but FTTH is not totally here yet and people dont really know for certain when its going to happen, I am talking about eircom here and i am giving my area as an example. In our village we didnt get ADSL for years - I kept reading things on the internet (I was using a dish on the roof system at the time pointing to a mast on the mountain - i think it was microwave broadband 3mbps up/down) and I kept reading the eircom website and it would say broadband rollout for your area expected 2nd quarter 2010 and so waited and then 2nd quarter of 2010 came and went and then by 2nd quarter of 2011 came and still no ADSL available it did come eventually but do you see what I mean about history has a habit of repeating itself.

If what I am reading on the 'where & when' about the cabinet will be 'live' FTTC in first part of 2016 will history be repeating itself and I find myself writing that its first part of 2017 and still no VDSL or whatever its going to be .

I have just checked on my mobile phone now, done a speed test and we now have HSPA+ in our area (only had it available for about 4 months - previous all we could get was 2G in the house and most areas in the village) - so now I have just checked speed, on HSP+ I get 4.92mbps down (a poor 430Kbps up) and on my home phone line ADSL all im getting is 6mbps up and i think something like 584kbps up /

well now say if my Mobile phone provider start supplying 4G to our area next but I am still waiting for eir to pull their fingers out and complete the FTTC to the area, well I might just feel like ditching eir/vodafone at home ADSL altogether in favour of Meteor 4G (at least I would be saving on phone line rental as well) - so I wonder sometimes when things take some time to complete or get up and running if the old adage of you snooze you loose comes into play - I realise that other developed countries have same problems facing them in rural areas for broadband but we are in 2015 and ADSL has been around for ages - there have been new kids on the block for years ... but we are only just touching on it.

The way things are going FTTH will only have just been put in and then there will be something else superceding it if they keep waiting years to get broadband and rural infrastructure sorted out for rural areas.

BoatMad

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

fine thats all well and good but FTTH is not totally here yet and people dont really know for certain when its going to happen, I am talking about eircom here and i am giving my area as an example. In our village we didnt get ADSL for years - I kept reading things on the internet (I was using a dish on the roof system at the time pointing to a mast on the mountain - i think it was microwave broadband 3mbps up/down) and I kept reading the eircom website and it would say broadband rollout for your area expected 2nd quarter 2010 and so waited and then 2nd quarter of 2010 came and went and then by 2nd quarter of 2011 came and still no ADSL available it did come eventually but do you see what I mean about history has a habit of repeating itself.

If what I am reading on the 'where & when' about the cabinet will be 'live' FTTC in first part of 2016 will history be repeating itself and I find myself writing that its first part of 2017 and still no VDSL or whatever its going to be .

I have just checked on my mobile phone now, done a speed test and we now have HSPA+ in our area (only had it available for about 4 months - previous all we could get was 2G in the house and most areas in the village) - so now I have just checked speed, on HSP+ I get 4.92mbps down (a poor 430Kbps up) and on my home phone line ADSL all im getting is 6mbps up and i think something like 584kbps up /

well now say if my Mobile phone provider start supplying 4G to our area next but I am still waiting for eir to pull their fingers out and complete the FTTC to the area, well I might just feel like ditching eir/vodafone at home ADSL altogether in favour of Meteor 4G (at least I would be saving on phone line rental as well) - so I wonder sometimes when things take some time to complete or get up and running if the old adage of you snooze you loose comes into play - I realise that other developed countries have same problems facing them in rural areas for broadband but we are in 2015 and ADSL has been around for ages - there have been new kids on the block for years ... but we are only just touching on it.

The way things are going FTTH will only have just been put in and then there will be something else superceding it if they keep waiting years to get broadband and rural infrastructure sorted out for rural areas.

Thems the breaks when you live in the bog !, never mind the turfs cheap

Andy From Sligo

BoatMad wrote: »

Thems the breaks when you live in the bog !, never mind the turfs cheap

I have my own conspiracy theories, the powers that be leave rural areas with sh!te broadband and other services hoping that the cultchies will just go move out of the schticks into the town areas with all the other bods - but it aint gonna work we cultchies are stronger than that. Will take a lot more than poor broadband speeds to move us and our tractors out of our fields into the big smoke just to get new fangled things like fibre optic broadband and cable TV....

rob808

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I have my own conspiracy theories, the powers that be leave rural areas with sh!te broadband and other services hoping that the cultchies will just go move out of the schticks into the town areas with all the other bods - but it aint gonna work we cultchies are stronger than that. Will take a lot more than poor broadband speeds to move us and our tractors out of our fields into the big smoke just to get new fangled things like fibre optic broadband and cable TV....

well to be fair eir have done pretty well with there fttc rollout and there on track to finish it by mid 2016.I hope they do the rural FTTH rollout cant see why they wouldnt.

Gonzo

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I have my own conspiracy theories, the powers that be leave rural areas with sh!te broadband and other services hoping that the cultchies will just go move out of the schticks into the town areas with all the other bods - but it aint gonna work we cultchies are stronger than that. Will take a lot more than poor broadband speeds to move us and our tractors out of our fields into the big smoke just to get new fangled things like fibre optic broadband and cable TV....

40%+ of the population lives in the 'sticks', thats alot of people to serve plus all the engineers, eir managers etc are not gonna down tools mid 2016 and put their feet up, the rural blue fibre routes plus stuff after that like hte FTTH of the entire nation will keep em going for another 10-15 years and constant upgrades. Plenty of employment, wages, jobs for eircom, funding, praise, extra customers, advertising.

Andy From Sligo

rob808 wrote: »

well to be fair eir have done pretty well with there fttc rollout and there on track to finish it by mid 2016.I hope they do the rural FTTH rollout cant see why they wouldnt.

Do you not think that though all cabinets across Ireland including rural areas even by now let alone 2016 should be/ have been upgraded to FTTC ages ago? - what has been the hold up in all of this? - fibre is not exactly new technology, its been around for years. - now these days we should be looking forward in 2016 to the stage of FTTH ... not FTTC that should have been done or started years ago!

I have a feeling there has been some kind of shift whereby originally eircom maybe wanted to bury the fibre optic cables and that was their intention (maybe thats where the hold up comes from) and then its almost like ESB & Vodafone say "we can do better than that, we can run the cables above ground along our Pylon network to customers houses" ... and then eir think "ah yes we could do that too, but on our existing wooden poles!" in competition to ESB/Vodafone - when maybe they should have thought about doing it years ago.

Andy From Sligo

so anyway getting back to these fibre optic cables on the poles - can they not get damaged being overland rather than buried underground especially with Ireland's extreme weather conditions and winds and storm could still bring them down.

What about the characteristics of Fibre cable - its got to be better than copper hasnt it as it relies on fast speed light to carry data, so why are some people saying that the longer you are away from the exchange the lower the speed with FTTH because I thought fibre was a sort of no loss or little loss of signal technology no?

Also with FTTH do you get consistent same Down and Up speeds (Symmetrical)and if they were to offer 100mbps say package with fibre will you guarantee get 100mbps down and up or would it be another one of those "up to 100mbps" caveats?

Also when they get around to making all houses FTTH in rural areas where the FO cable goes across the wooden poles what will they do run it from the pole nearest your house and drill a new hole in the wall and poke the FO cable through the wall and terminate it inside, or for the last few hundred yards bury the cable and bring it into the house that way? - im just curious about how they will work it. If at the last run of the fibre from the cabinet they carry on using the existing copper cable that is already in situ then nothing at all has to change the customers house end apart from the customer changing their ADSL modem router to a VDSL modem router I should imagine

- but if its FTTH offered by eir I cannot see them going to all the trouble of drilling holes in properties walls and bringing in the FO cable in through the walls of the subscribers property especially in rural areas - I just cannot see it, sorry to be so sceptical , but the easiest route for them and less upheaval for customers would be for them to do the last bit in the chain to peoples houses using existing copper cables and supplying a VDSL modem to subscribers.

ED E

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

so anyway getting back to these fibre optic cables on the poles - can they not get damaged being overland rather than buried underground especially with Ireland's extreme weather conditions and winds and storm could still bring them down.

What about the characteristics of Fibre cable - its got to be better than copper hasnt it as it relies on fast speed light to carry data, so why are some people saying that the longer you are away from the exchange the lower the speed with FTTH because I thought fibre was a sort of no loss or little loss of signal technology no?

Also with FTTH do you get consistent same Down and Up speeds (Symmetrical)and if they were to offer 100mbps say package with fibre will you guarantee get 100mbps down and up or would it be another one of those "up to 100mbps" caveats?

Also when they get around to making all houses FTTH in rural areas where the FO cable goes across the wooden poles what will they do run it from the pole nearest your house and drill a new hole in the wall and poke the FO cable through the wall and terminate it inside, or for the last few hundred yards bury the cable and bring it into the house that way? - im just curious about how they will work it. If at the last run of the fibre from the cabinet they carry on using the existing copper cable that is already in situ then nothing at all has to change the customers house end apart from the customer changing their ADSL modem router to a VDSL modem router I should imagine

- but if its FTTH offered by eir I cannot see them going to all the trouble of drilling holes in properties walls and bringing in the FO cable in through the walls of the subscribers property especially in rural areas - I just cannot see it, sorry to be so sceptical , but the easiest route for them and less upheaval for customers would be for them to do the last bit in the chain to peoples houses using existing copper cables and supplying a VDSL modem to subscribers.

1. Yes. Belcarra had some of these issues according to another poster in the know. Wind damage can be a big factor.

2. Its the same speed up to ~10km. Exchanges cover only 7-8km in most areas so all will get max.

3. Its GPON. Thats A-Symmetric. Symmetric is more expensive as its not shared fibre.

4. Read one of a dozen other threads.

5. Leaving copper in the loop is a stopgap as BK has posted a hundred times already. Read the other threads.

seaniefr

ED E wrote: »

1. Yes. Belcarra had some of these issues according to another poster in the know. Wind damage can be a big factor.

2. Its the same speed up to ~10km. Exchanges cover only 7-8km in most areas so all will get max.

3. Its GPON. Thats A-Symmetric. Symmetric is more expensive as its not shared fibre.

4. Read one of a dozen other threads.

5. Leaving copper in the loop is a stopgap as BK has posted a hundred times already. Read the other threads.

Does anyone know if the fact that Eir have certain sections of phone lines underground will this prevent them from running FTTH to an area? I am interested as even though you say that it's 10km max there are certain areas of our exchange there is a mile or so of it underground for some reason

rob808

seaniefr wrote: »

Does anyone know if the fact that Eir have certain sections of phone lines underground will this prevent them from running FTTH to an area? I am interested as even though you say that it's 10km max there are certain areas of our exchange there is a mile or so of it underground for some reason

It better underground than on a pole unless the ducting bad.

Gonzo

in my area there is about a mile of underground lines between the boundary edge of Dunshaughlin town and the area I live in as this one mile stretch has no houses either sides of the road, then once the ribbon development starts the lines appear from the ground and stretched along poles from house to house all the way from the start of the ribbon development, past my house and stops 3 houses past mine as I live near the end of a cul de sac.

My house is only 2km from the nearest cabinet located at the edge of town so hopefully when they finally do get started sometime during 2017 that my area may get looked at that year!.

At a guess I would imagine Eir will building the FTTH network nearest the towns and villages first and work their way further and further out. Some of the FTTH networks stretch up to 8 or 9km from towns, I would imagine thoses would be the last ones to get done by 2020.

rob808

Gonzo wrote: »

in my area there is about a mile of underground lines between the boundary edge of Dunshaughlin town and the area I live in as this one mile stretch has no houses either sides of the road, then once the ribbon development starts the lines appear from the ground and stretched along poles from house to house all the way from the start of the ribbon development, past my house and stops 3 houses past mine as I live near the end of a cul de sac.

My house is only 2km from the nearest cabinet located at the edge of town so hopefully when they finally do get started sometime during 2017 that my area may get looked at that year!.

At a guess I would imagine Eir will building the FTTH network nearest the towns and villages first and work their way further and further out. Some of the FTTH networks stretch up to 8 or 9km from towns, I would imagine thoses would be the last ones to get done by 2020.

They do it like belcarra that used FTTC in the town and run the fibre long poles to rural development.I thought myself the town go FTTH but no they got vdsl.

mobil 222

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

fine thats all well and good but FTTH is not totally here yet and people dont really know for certain when its going to happen, I am talking about eircom here and i am giving my area as an example. In our village we didnt get ADSL for years - I kept reading things on the internet (I was using a dish on the roof system at the time pointing to a mast on the mountain - i think it was microwave broadband 3mbps up/down) and I kept reading the eircom website and it would say broadband rollout for your area expected 2nd quarter 2010 and so waited and then 2nd quarter of 2010 came and went and then by 2nd quarter of 2011 came and still no ADSL available it did come eventually but do you see what I mean about history has a habit of repeating itself.

If what I am reading on the 'where & when' about the cabinet will be 'live' FTTC in first part of 2016 will history be repeating itself and I find myself writing that its first part of 2017 and still no VDSL or whatever its going to be .

I have just checked on my mobile phone now, done a speed test and we now have HSPA+ in our area (only had it available for about 4 months - previous all we could get was 2G in the house and most areas in the village) - so now I have just checked speed, on HSP+ I get 4.92mbps down (a poor 430Kbps up) and on my home phone line ADSL all im getting is 6mbps up and i think something like 584kbps up /

well now say if my Mobile phone provider start supplying 4G to our area next but I am still waiting for eir to pull their fingers out and complete the FTTC to the area, well I might just feel like ditching eir/vodafone at home ADSL altogether in favour of Meteor 4G (at least I would be saving on phone line rental as well) - so I wonder sometimes when things take some time to complete or get up and running if the old adage of you snooze you loose comes into play - I realise that other developed countries have same problems facing them in rural areas for broadband but we are in 2015 and ADSL has been around for ages - there have been new kids on the block for years ... but we are only just touching on it.

The way things are going FTTH will only have just been put in and then there will be something else superceding it if they keep waiting years to get broadband and rural infrastructure sorted out for rural areas.

Coolaney is fed by wireless at the moment but will be fed by core early in
the new year using the route coming from collooney.
Depending on how far you will be from the mobile exchange in the middle of the town 400 Mtrs - 500 Mtrs will get you close to 70 Megs

Andy From Sligo

mobil 222 wrote: »

Coolaney is fed by wireless at the moment but will be fed by core early in
the new year using the route coming from collooney.
Depending on how far you will be from the mobile exchange in the middle of the town 400 Mtrs - 500 Mtrs will get you close to 70 Megs

Thanks for that. When you say 'core' does that mean copper cable or FTTC (fibre to cabinet?)

I see the other day they are putting up some nice new wooden telephone poles and replacing some on the back road (L2101) from Collooney to Coolaney so maye thats what all that is about. I think KN Networks are installing them.

The Cush

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

Thanks for that. When you say 'core' does that mean copper cable or FTTC (fibre to cabinet?)

Core fibre to the exchange to replace the wireless backhaul.

See the green lines on the NGA Fibre Broadband Network map here (select Core Fibre Network at the top of the map to show the green lines) 

Andy From Sligo

mobil 222 wrote: »

Coolaney is fed by wireless at the moment but will be fed by core early in
the new year using the route coming from collooney.
Depending on how far you will be from the mobile exchange in the middle of the town 400 Mtrs - 500 Mtrs will get you close to 70 Megs

Hello there mobil 222 - and sorry to all for resuscitating an old thread first written in 2015 , but do you reckon the cabinet (CNY1_E01) in Coolaney village is still fed by wireless now or is it fed by cable by Collooney do you reckon now? - its just you answered back then and I thought you might me knowledgeable guy on it? - thanks.