What is wrong with the site? (Please read updated post #1)

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

338-12 now. 350 people have voted.

Out of interest, how many posters do people feel need to have voted for it to become representative? Or is such a thing possible?

511

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

338-12 now. 350 people have voted.

Out of interest, how many posters do people feel need to have voted for it to become representative? Or is such a thing possible?

nesf

Wibbs wrote: »

Communities of like minded people, or they can be and in many cases on Boards were and some still are(though a few have gone the private forum route).

That is neither what a forum is nor something intrinsic to a forum, any regular grouping of conversations around a topic/ethos will allow for this. It'll be killed off by any system that doesn't allow for groups to "have their own threads" similar to how it can be killed off by subdividing a forum too much or a large influx of users diluting the userbase can change things but it's not automatically killed by not having forums at every level of "splitting off the conversations."

Maguined wrote: »

I particularly like how the different forums can have their own ethos or individual standards. You can theoretically discuss the same topic on AH or the LGBT forums but you will get vastly different experiences due to the different standards applied in the different forums and to take that away would be an absolute disaster for Boards.

This is why I'm not sold on it as an idea as an overall structure for a site but I'm curious about its potential for managing traffic in larger more general forums in something like AH or for allowing sorting within a category like Gaming.

511

^^^While I'm sure many people appreciate the aesthetics of coloured bell curves, that is totally meaningless.

^^^Why's that?

Edit* hullaballoo deleted his post.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

511 wrote: »

colourful graph above, don't think it needs to be quoted

So about 5% then. Ok. Still leaves us at at least 90% disapproval.

Dav

This site, as a "Forums" site is shrinking - a combination of changes in how people simply consume and create internet content combined with After Hours being seen as the "catch all" forum on the site has seen to that (that's by no means a criticism of AH or it's regulars, quite the opposite). All the specialist forums get quieter and quieter. Hardly makes sense to stick to a "Forums" structure when it's clearly eating itself. A tag system makes forums redundant, but it doesn't kill off communities. It does make them interact with one another though. Again, I state, we're not a forums site, we're a community site. Community revolves around discussion of a common interest which is why forums lend themselves quite well, but so do groups on Facebook or Lists on Twitter or even hashtags on Instagram. I'm not suggesting we simply copy what they're doing, but there's surely something to be learned from them given their global success? Look, it's an idea that's been in my head for a while and has rarely left it, I was just trying to share some ideas with the rest of you - encourage a bit of creative thinking from us all about where we drive this bus.

For those of you who seem to simply hate the new site, well the good news is that I can guarantee you that the Legacy site isn't going anywhere for 2016 and the boss has indicated that if it doesn't cause us problems, he may leave it live indefinitely (that is not a guarantee by any means).

smash

Dav, boards isn't a social network in the same vain as other sites you've mentioned, which are all wildly different to each other. They all do something specific and to mangle them together would be a disaster.

You simply can not look at the success of the largest social networks on the planet and decide it's the way forward. This is when you get eaten alive!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Dav wrote: »

This site, as a "Forums" site is shrinking - a combination of changes in how people simply consume and create internet content combined with After Hours being seen as the "catch all" forum on the site has seen to that (that's by no means a criticism of AH or it's regulars, quite the opposite). All the specialist forums get quieter and quieter. Hardly makes sense to stick to a "Forums" structure when it's clearly eating itself. A tag system makes forums redundant, but it doesn't kill off communities. It does make them interact with one another though. Again, I state, we're not a forums site, we're a community site. Community revolves around discussion of a common interest which is why forums lend themselves quite well, but so do groups on Facebook or Lists on Twitter or even hashtags on Instagram. I'm not suggesting we simply copy what they're doing, but there's surely something to be learned from them given their global success? Look, it's an idea that's been in my head for a while and has rarely left it, I was just trying to share some ideas with the rest of you - encourage a bit of creative thinking from us all about where we drive this bus.

For those of you who seem to simply hate the new site, well the good news is that I can guarantee you that the Legacy site isn't going anywhere for 2016 and the boss has indicated that if it doesn't cause us problems, he may leave it live indefinitely (that is not a guarantee by any means).

It's not the content or the orgainsation for me, it's purely the visual appaearnce of large bubble-like posts with huge adds or blank spaces at the side of the screen.

As to the redundant forums: there are a lot of them and I feel that some of the categories could be merged: example, the TV forum. Does every popular show need its own forum? One thread would be enough in a standard TV forum.

Same for local: can every region have a thread, rather than a forum?

gandalf

Dav boards is a forums site to move away from that is to lose what makes it unique. It you try to copy social media sites like you suggest then boards will die.

I'm glad that some sense has been seen by management but I would suggest the enforced use of the new site for users outside Ireland be suspended until the site is fit for purpose.

anothernight

Dav wrote: »

Community revolves around discussion of a common interest which is why forums lend themselves quite well, but so do groups on Facebook or Lists on Twitter or even hashtags on Instagram.

An advantage of the current format is that it is very searchable, which is great when it comes to more permanent types of content. Just the other day I directed my English friend to some threads about what to see in and around Dublin. Good luck finding previous relevant discussions on Facebook and Twitter.

There are communities and there are communities. I don't think the formats you seem to favour suit the type of community (I hope) you want to encourage.

gandalf

Dav just out of curiosity is this new direction that you are evangelising coming from interaction with an outside source? Did Boards.ie get advice from an outside web design company for example? Or is this just all the developers coming together and basing it on their desires?

Bazzo

I don't really buy the "Well Facebook, Twitter etc are doing it so we should too!" You don't make a succesful site by trying to copy what the industry leaders are doing, because they're doing it better and they always will be, you make it by being unique. You say that you won't destroy the community feel to boards, I couldn't disagree more; where's the community feel to facebook or twitter or any of those other sites? It doesn't exist. Down this path I feel you're losing what makes boards boards.

ED E

The tags system is very well developed with the stack exchange network. Great for Q&A, terrible for community building, terrible for user retention.

/r/Ireland will eat boards' userbase over time. Even with the old layout available the tyranny of the default will, IMO, kill the flow of new users that stay for more than 10 posts. Without a certain flow of replenishments the sites doomed.

@Dav: Could you perhaps let us know what % of regular users still have the old vBulletin theme applied?

StupidLikeAFox

Dav wrote: »

A tag system makes forums redundant, but it doesn't kill off communities. It does make them interact with one another though. Again, I state, we're not a forums site, we're a community site. Community revolves around discussion of a common interest which is why forums lend themselves quite well, but so do groups on Facebook or Lists on Twitter or even hashtags on Instagram. I'm not suggesting we simply copy what they're doing, but there's surely something to be learned from them given their global success? Look, it's an idea that's been in my head for a while and has rarely left it, I was just trying to share some ideas with the rest of you - encourage a bit of creative thinking from us all about where we drive this bus.

I think what you are trying to achieve is that a thread with a title "Tax implications for new rock band" could be tagged with Bands, Entrepreneurial & Business and Tax- meaning you are likely to get seen by a wider audience (musicians, business people and accountants) and encourage discussion across a greater variety of people, without cross-posting to multiple forums. I think this would be an excellent way to browse topics on boards

The tag functionality is already implemented but not used a whole lot. You could introduce a controlled list of tags, make it more prominent and/or mandatory when creating a new thread, and maybe add a new tab on the homepage which is something like "Browse by tag". If you wanted to get fancy you could have some text analysis as you type the reply which provided "suggested tags" as you type.

Could definitely see this working, but you have an opportunity to gradually introduce this and let people get used to it, then phase out the forum structure when people have stopped using it.

cherryghost

boards isn't a community nor a forum. It's a COMMUNITY FORUM. Listen to what the people want. At the end of the day THEY drive your traffic and revenue, and therefore is your best interest.

Just because YOU and a HANDFUL of others think its a good idea, doesnt mean that the THOUSANDS of us agree with it. And judging by the feedback over the last few days its clear that you haven't listened, and some of the posts back from you guys show us you're wanting to steamroll ahead anyway.

smash

If boards staff want to dismiss the opinion of the users then it's up to them. The staff might think they're right, but they're not. But to dismiss the opinions of moderators, the people who give up their time to run the site for no reward... that's a big no no!

Wibbs

Dav wrote: »

This site, as a "Forums" site is shrinking - a combination of changes in how people simply consume and create internet content combined with After Hours being seen as the "catch all" forum on the site has seen to that (that's by no means a criticism of AH or it's regulars, quite the opposite). All the specialist forums get quieter and quieter. Hardly makes sense to stick to a "Forums" structure when it's clearly eating itself.

Maybe there can be a lesson to be taken from the Politics Cafe D? TBH I did not fancy its chances at all and said so, but I was wronger than a wrong thing and it's flying along and gained traction pretty damned fast. I'd bet most of that is down to the fact it's directly accessible from AH. Let's face it AH has become the gateway to the site(after Google), so rather than worry about that, use it. So is there any way to use it as an actual gateway and create/grow other forums the way PC did?(I see the irony in calling it PC ;-)) Maybe have the broad topics sub forums directly accessible from AH? I dunno, but better brains could come up with better ideas. The site also needs pruning and that's a hard pill to swallow. "Trending" forums need to be pushed to the top, front and centre and dead or dying forums left further down the access chain. Regulars of said forums will likely have them subbed anyway. EG the Palaeontology forum, should be renamed the Adam Khor forum as without that chap who is worth his weight in fossils the forum would be deader than the dinosaurs. It still has value because of his efforts and I would check in on a near daily basis, but it wouldn't get the bums on seats.

I'm not suggesting we simply copy what they're doing, but there's surely something to be learned from them given their global success?

Not really D. Or less than it seems on the surface. For a start they're very different entities. Secondly Reddit is flying along as are a number of other "old style" forums out there. If anything Arsebook is fading a little. IMH you should play to the unique selling points of Boards, not try to copy others that you quite simply can't compete with, certainly not by adding extra buttons while removing the stuff that made Boards so welcome. Plus Ireland is a unique enough environment it seems. Other Boards style forums elsewhere never really got much traction.

Look at forums that are doing OK. I've seen some specialty forums die while others live on and grow. I've seen it with car forums. They mostly die by becoming too specialised or specialised in one model of car that is no longer produced and then they hit Arsebook or a new smaller forum springs up.

For those of you who seem to simply hate the new site, well the good news is that I can guarantee you that the Legacy site isn't going anywhere for 2016 and the boss has indicated that if it doesn't cause us problems, he may leave it live indefinitely (that is not a guarantee by any means).

Thank you D. Genuinely.

gandalf wrote: »

Dav boards is a forums site to move away from that is to lose what makes it unique. It you try to copy social media sites like you suggest then boards will die.

This.

Dav

I was talking ideas folks, not concrete decisions - can we please stop taking everything I'm saying about tags and other platforms as literal?

Lemming

Dav wrote: »

I was talking ideas folks, not concrete decisions - can we please stop taking everything I'm saying about tags and other platforms as literal?

When the landing page looks like twitter, and the thread layout looks like twitter, with a sprinkling of facebook mixed in for good measure, it looks rather literal Dav and is hard to take what you say as anything else other than statement of intent.

Dravokivich

Dav wrote: »

I was talking ideas folks, not concrete decisions - can we please stop taking everything I'm saying about tags and other platforms as literal?

I don't think anyone took it as anything more than challenging a concept you presented. But it is kind of confusing what direction Boards is taking in line with the new site due to be implemented. The responses since then only serve to high light that.

Nody

Dav wrote: »

I was talking ideas folks, not concrete decisions - can we please stop taking everything I'm saying about tags and other platforms as literal?

But you are the boards version of Gabe Newell

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Harry Palmr

Many years ago under a different account name I lamented the "balkanisation" of boards, of course that was a passing moan and no one was likely to take a blind bit of notice but here we are now with a structure that is stuffed with countless "legacy" forums that are moribund It would be a good idea to get ruthless with the countless sub boards that are dead or dying.

smash

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

I think this is partially the reason that posters have stopped engaging as much. Nobody will read a mega-thread unless they've been participating in the discussion from the start.

hullaballoo

Into the next phase of redevelopment, the annexation of the Balkans.

_Kaiser_

smash wrote: »

I think this is partially the reason that posters have stopped engaging as much. Nobody will read a mega-thread unless they've been participating in the discussion from the start.

This is true.. even if you have, some of them move so fast and contain so much pointless bickering (the IW one for example) that you'd need a fair bit of time to catch up.

T-K-O

'This site, as a "Forums" site is shrinking - a combination of changes in how people simply consume and create internet content combined with After Hours being seen as the "catch all" forum on the site has seen to that (that's by no means a criticism of AH or it's regulars, quite the opposite). All the specialist forums get quieter and quieter. Hardly makes sense to stick to a "Forums" structure when it's clearly eating itself'

This is interesting from Dav - have the specialist forums gone even quieter since the change to the front end? These days, I visit one forum where as before I would browse the site and always find something interesting to chat about.

For me, boards has become a soccer forum & that appears to be a common outcome

*couldn't quote

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

GLaDOS

Yeah serious cull or merging of forums would not be a bad idea at all. I think it has been done on a small scale in the sports and religion fora?

smash

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Couple that with mandatory closure of inactive accounts, and deletion of old accounts with 0 posts. This will free up the database, free up available usernames and also give a more accurate number of users.