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Cardinal suggests Irish voters are worse than the pagans

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24

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    #32
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    And the pagan way is much more tolerant and and pluralistic :rolleyes:
    Actually it is. Paganism is an insanely varied set of practices, most of them with a Gaia-esque focus demanding respect for nature, animals and humanity.

    The Abrahamic religions by contrast take a far more authoritarian approach to all of these things.

    There is a massive amount of flexibility in paganism, some types practiced ritual sacrifice, others none at all. Many pagan sects are even atheist.


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    #33
    It wasn't me!
    Registered Users Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    Pagans were just as ruthless as Christians, it's nonsense to assume that head hunting and human sacrifice are enlightened practices.

    Or cannibalism...


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    #34
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    Pagans were just as ruthless as Christians, it's nonsense to assume that head hunting and human sacrifice are enlightened practices.

    Pagans arent /werent a definitive group. Pagans encompasses everything from Aboriginees through native americans , witches, Druids and Buddhists.


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    #35
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    It wasn't me! wrote: »
    Or cannibalism...

    Also called transubstantiation....... BODY OF CHRIST!!!:P


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    #36
    mg1982
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,772 ✭✭✭mg1982


    Actually a lot of pagan rituals involve worship of nature which makes a lot more sense to me than worshiping a man with a beard who lives in the sky. I think if we stuck to nature worship we would be a lot closer to the true meaning of life and the universe.


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    #37
    MRnotlob606
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,642 ✭✭✭MRnotlob606


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    Pagans arent /werent a definitive group. Pagans encompasses everything from Aboriginees through native americans , witches, Druids and Buddhists.

    You know well I'm talking about Celtic Poltheism given the context of the article ?


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    #38
    old_aussie
    Registered Users Posts: 3,410 ✭✭✭old_aussie


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    Well, 80%ish of us seem to really dig crucifiction.

    Could be positions opening up for you guys soon in the middle east, I see they're recruiting.


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    #39
    crockholm
    Registered Users Posts: 2,448 ✭✭✭crockholm


    seamus wrote: »
    Actually it is. Paganism is an insanely varied set of practices, most of them with a Gaia-esque focus demanding respect for nature, animals and humanity.

    The Abrahamic religions by contrast take a far more authoritarian approach to all of these things.

    There is a massive amount of flexibility in paganism, some types practiced ritual sacrifice, others none at all. Many pagan sects are even atheist.

    The Irish branch of pre-xtian paganism certainly did have human sacrifices.


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    #40
    TwoShedsJackson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,438 ✭✭✭TwoShedsJackson


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    And what good is paganism ,other than a psuedo religion revived by new age hippies ?

    What good is Christianity other than for those within the organisation to attempt to exercise control over others, whilst relieving them of as much as cash as they can too, of course?

    Why don't you tell us about the last time a pagan tried to influence what way you voted on something, or asked you to contribute to their coffers despite the billions they have squirreled away in banks, then we can see which is worse.


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    #41
    nelly17
    Registered Users Posts: 1,210 ✭✭✭nelly17


    Man in funny hat resorts to name calling when things dont go his way


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    #42
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    What about pagans executing Christians in the amphitheatres around Roman Europe , in fact it was the shared collective consciousness of suffering and persecution that helped Christianity thrive. You have a selective bias ?
    You might find it interesting to note that part of the reason the Romans persecuted the Christians was because they accused Christianity of being pagan :D

    Roman religion was basically a mish-mash of everything, but first and foremost identified a higher authority, be that the roman gods or the roman emperor or whoever.

    Paganism by contrast while sometimes having a godly or deistic figure, rarely has an active authoritarian figure at the top.

    Paganism was roundly outlawed in ancient Rome, especially after the Christians took control.


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    #43
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Clearly the wikipedia-page hit for paganism has skyrocketed in the past 30 minutes.


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    #44
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    crockholm wrote: »
    The Irish branch of pre-xtian paganism certainly did have human sacrifices.
    Some of them sure did. There was a good documentary a few weeks back about how they reckon the bog bodies found all over Ireland and the UK are likely high kings or other members of high society who were sacrificed in order to appease the Gods after a bad harvest.


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    #45
    MRnotlob606
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,642 ✭✭✭MRnotlob606


    TwoShedsJackson wrote: »
    What good is Christianity other than for those within the organisation to attempt to exercise control over others, whilst relieving them of as much as cash as they can too, of course?

    Why don't you tell us about the last time a pagan tried to influence what way you voted on something, or asked you to contribute to their coffers despite the billions they have squirreled away in banks, then we can see which is worse.

    Well I'm a secularist, and equally oppose anybody who tries to influence people in the way they vote. But you can just say all Christians are the same in one sweeping statement. Not all Christians try to influence others.


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    #46
    corner of hells
    Registered Users Posts: 8,362 ✭✭✭corner of hells


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    My wifes a Pagan/ Wiccan. Its as batty as anything else but her hot witchy friends regularly flounce round me garden by moonlight getting pissed. Nice...:D
    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    IS= Yes totally. I live with one. She ignores my atheism and I ignore her Wicca (except her mates romping about the garden by moonlight.)

    When's the next moonlight flounce ? Ive a couple of deck chairs and loads of cans.


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    #47
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    Well I'm a secularist, and equally oppose anybody who tries to influence people in the way they vote. But you can just say all Christians are the same in one sweeping statement. Not all Christians try to influence others.

    He clearly means The Vatican/Church Leaders.


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    #48
    TwoShedsJackson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,438 ✭✭✭TwoShedsJackson


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    Well I'm a secularist, and equally oppose anybody who tries to influence people in the way they vote. But you can just say all Christians are the same in one sweeping statement. Not all Christians try to influence others.

    I can say that, but I didn't.


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    #49
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    corner of hells wrote: »
    When's the next moonlight flounce ? Ive a couple of deck chairs and loads of cans.

    Ummmm. Summer Solstice I think. Hope its warm.


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    #50
    MRnotlob606
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,642 ✭✭✭MRnotlob606


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    He clearly means The Vatican/Church Leaders.

    Well should be more specific, Just as I was asked to.


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    #51
    kylith
    Registered Users Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    What about pagans executing Christians in the amphitheatres around Roman Europe , in fact it was the shared collective consciousness of suffering and persecution that helped Christianity thrive. You have a selective bias ?
    Didn't happen. There is no record of Christians being killed in the Colosseum outside of Christian sources. http://www.the-colosseum.net/history/martyrium_en.htm

    In fact, the main source of unhappiness with Christians in Rome was their complete lack of respect for other religions* and a reported tendency to set fire to stuff. For these crimes they were executed, but not in the Colosseum.


    * Romans had no problem with different religions as long as you at least paid lip service to the Roman gods. Their problem wasn't that Christians believed in a different god, it was claiming that their god was the only real one that pissed the Romans off.


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    #52
    Gazzmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 816 ✭✭✭Gazzmonkey


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    My wifes a Pagan/ Wiccan. Its as batty as anything else but her hot witchy friends regularly flounce round me garden by moonlight getting pissed. Nice...:D

    Hot witchy friends..... nice


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    #53
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    Well should be more specific, Just as I was asked to.

    Dont jump to persecution complex led conclusions.


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    #54
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    kylith wrote: »
    Didn't happen. There is no record of Christians being killed in the Colosseum outside of Christian sources. http://www.the-colosseum.net/history/martyrium_en.htm

    In fact, the main source of unhappiness with Christians in Rome was their complete lack of respect for other religions* and a reported tendency to set fire to stuff. For these crimes they were executed, but not in the Colosseum.


    * Romans had no problem with different religions as long as you at least paid lip service to the Roman gods. Their problem wasn't that Christians believed in a different god, it was claiming that their god was the only real one that pissed the Romans off.
    So they were effectively behaving like terrorists?


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    #55
    Knasher
    Registered Users Posts: 2,370 ✭✭✭Knasher


    Does anyone know how the ancient pagans felt about gay people? If the pagans respected their rights, and it took us until now to get back to the same position, then clearly he has a point.


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    #56
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    Knasher wrote: »
    Does anyone know how the ancient pagans felt about gay people? If the pagans respected their rights, and it took us until now to get back to the same position, then clearly he has a point.

    I cant speak for all the strands of paganism but Wicca has one central 'commandment' if you will:
    If it harms no one, do what you will.
    They have no view either way on homos.


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    #57
    MRnotlob606
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,642 ✭✭✭MRnotlob606


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    Dont jump to persecution complex led conclusions.

    Don't try tarring all christians with the one statement.


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    #58
    Ghost Buster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭Ghost Buster


    MRnotlob606 wrote: »
    It's a fact, Don't you know the history christianity ?

    Dont you know the difference between past and present tense?


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    #59
    Flippyfloppy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,748 ✭✭✭Flippyfloppy


    I think perhaps mother and baby adoption homes run by the Catholic Church and paedophile priests were kind of actually a defiance of humanity.


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    #60
    MRnotlob606
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,642 ✭✭✭MRnotlob606


    Ghost Buster wrote: »
    Dont you know the difference between past and present tense?

    of course.What I am trying to say initially is that some criticisms of Christians are unmerited.


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    #61
    WheatenBriar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,170 ✭✭✭WheatenBriar


    A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »
    Surprisingly, this is not a Waterford Whispers news story. Super-conservative senior Cardinal Raymond Leo Burke has said that Irish people have gone further than the pagans in their "incredible" defiance of God

    http://www.thetablet.co.uk/news/2108/0/ireland-is-worse-than-the-pagans-for-legalising-gay-marriage-says-senior-cardinal

    Has the Roman Catholic Church officially lost the run of itself?

    The Vatican's secretary of state, Cardinal Pietro Parolin, recently claimed that the Irish vote was a "defeat for humanity".

    The whole church is entering the realm of satire. Cardinal Burke's wiki page reads like something from Fr Ted. His views on 'female altar-servers' causing a "man crisis" is another clanger from this nutter
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raymond_Leo_Burke#Priest_shortage

    Someone should remind him that these things are God's will


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