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IBRC Sale of Siteserv at €100 million loss.
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Nope. If it's open to all, then by definition it's public.Banjo String wrote: »Or private depending on how you look at it.
The insurance is set to be mandatory, yes. However, this is not news. It was announced over a year ago, so Denis was a bit slow by his standardsBanjo String wrote: »Regardless, it will be compulsory and mandatory if FG get their way.
Like I said, fierce handy and coincidental that uncle Dennis recently acquired the Beacon with 50% write down.
I wonder will he be leaning on Leo to ram the mandatory, compulsory insurance through.....
Never I hear you say.
Never.
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Nope. If it's open to all, then by definition it's public.
Open to all with a paid up insurance plan. Will all private hospitals then become public by default if this plan goes through?The insurance is set to be mandatory, yes. However, this is not news. It was announced over a year ago, so Denis was a bit slow by his standards
2nd of April 2014 is when this was starting to become news.MINISTER JAMES REILLY today unveiled his ambitious plan for Universal Health Insurance in Ireland which will mean every man, woman and child will have health insurance – subsidised by the State.
http://www.thejournal.ie/universal-health-insurance-cost-1394248-Apr2014/
Then less than a week later on April 7th.....
http://m.independent.ie/business/irish/businessman-denis-obrien-takes-control-of-beacon-hospital-30163314.htmlBusinessman Denis O' Brien is taking over the 214-bed Beacon Private Hospital in Sandyford in Dublin from next Monday.
So if by slow you mean 5/6 days later, fair enough.
Nothing to see here, all a big coincidence so tis.0 -
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What else could they be? If everyone is on UHI where would they get their patients?Banjo String wrote: »Open to all with a paid up insurance plan. Will all private hospitals then become public by default if this plan goes through?
The Journal is a bit slow...Banjo String wrote: »2nd of April 2014 is when this was starting to become news.
http://www.thejournal.ie/universal-health-insurance-cost-1394248-Apr2014/
The Independent 8th February
The Irish Times 21st February
So it would have been about two months later. A lot quicker than I thought, but you did say 'recently'. 0 -
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I'd need to see a balance sheet from that period to really analyse it properly. We're discussing this in the context of a company that said they were going to run out of cash by the end of May 2012 (roughly).
What a balance sheet would tell us is if borrowings had increased: They had an overdraft facility for ten million; had they run that up to the limit? They had an increase in trade creditors of 40% in the previous year; had that gone up again? They'd got an interest only deal until December 2012; were they going to be in a position to start repaying capital again? For example
in 2011 they borrowed more than they repaid (by 1.6 million) and in 2010 they repaid about three million.
I don't have the answer to those questions, but the profit figure has to be looked at in that context. All I can see from those reports is that although profits rose for the half year by 600k, it was on the back of sales increasing by €9 million. Their cost of sales seems to be very high and additional revenues seemed to come at a very high additional cost.
If the profit was to carry forward for the full year, then you could say that they would have generated another €1.2 million in profits and assuming that's a full cash benefit they are still woefully short of any capital repayment schedule that would have to be recommenced.
They just didn't seem to be generating enough cash to pay back their borrowings at any kind of meaningful level. The reports at the time of the sale say that they owed IBRC 150 million. I don't know if that's exact or rounded but if exact, it's an increase of 3 million on the borrowing figure in their 2011 accounts.
The issue of repaying capital is moot, it was pushed out until the 1st of Jan 2013. It is not relevant to Siteservs ability to trade in the time frame we are discussing.
I think though at this stage given the information we actually know, it is quite reasonable to assume that Siteserv at the very least could have traded until year end, probably quite comfortably and in all likely hood in profit. The unverified assertion that it only had 8 weeks left before oblivion, is in my opinion at best an over exaggeration and in truth probably BS. There is no way they would have tied themselves into exclusivity negotiations with one buyer if things were so perilous, was it 50 separate bids whittled down to 8? Siteserv was very very popular. It was actually extremely popular with it's clients too, even with the looming possibility of liquidation, the contracts kept rolling in, especially from state and semi state bodies.
TBF, why wouldn't it be popular. For a finish, one State Owned Bank wrote off the bulk of it's debt with effectively the remaining debt being transferred to our other State Owned Bank, AIB. Like a car wash it comes out the other side, nice portfolio, profitable, with a nice serviceable debt ratio. Jackpot.
I mean if Carlsberg did buyouts of "distressed companies".
I repeat what I said earlier, there was a rush to sell it, not for the reason given, but other factors, timing appears to be everything with Siteserv, impeccable.
I assume the next tender process by Irish Water will be the repair contracts for pipes, I wonder will Siteservs luck hold? The little company that Just Could! 0 -
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The issue of repaying capital is moot, it was pushed out until the 1st of Jan 2013. It is not relevant to Siteservs ability to trade in the time frame we are discussing.
I think though at this stage given the information we actually know, it is quite reasonable to assume that Siteserv at the very least could have traded until year end, probably quite comfortably and in all likely hood in profit. The unverified assertion that it only had 8 weeks left before oblivion, is in my opinion at best an over exaggeration and in truth probably BS. There is no way they would have tied themselves into exclusivity negotiations with one buyer if things were so perilous, was it 50 separate bids whittled down to 8? Siteserv was very very popular. It was actually extremely popular with it's clients too, even with the looming possibility of liquidation, the contracts kept rolling in, especially from state and semi state bodies.
TBF, why wouldn't it be popular. For a finish, one State Owned Bank wrote off the bulk of it's debt with effectively the remaining debt being transferred to our other State Owned Bank, AIB. Like a car wash it comes out the other side, nice portfolio, profitable, with a nice serviceable debt ratio. Jackpot.
I mean if Carlsberg did buyouts of "distressed companies".
I repeat what I said earlier, there was a rush to sell it, not for the reason given, but other factors, timing appears to be everything with Siteserv, impeccable.
I assume the next tender process by Irish Water will be the repair contracts for pipes, I wonder will Siteservs luck hold? The little company that Just Could!
The Chairman of the company said it had eight weeks cashflow left.
Nobody has denied this and there are plenty who would have motivation to do that if it was BS.
You are continually confusing profit and cashflow. They are not the same.0 -
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Banjo String wrote: »Joan Burton calling for unedited/censored details of the share activity in the months before its sale now too.
I can't see how Noonan or Kenny could dismiss her tbh,.
Micheál Martin all over it now too, this story is only in its infancy.
http://m.rte.ie/news/2015/0426/696836-siteserv/
Labours revenge at being handed the poisoned chalice?
It's frustrating to see how stupid people can be.
There is a story in the FOI documents that nobody has noticed and it's about text messages.
A prize for the first person here to figure it out.
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Walter Hobbs said that they eight weeks cash flow left, but this is what the chairman said at the time of the sale:
“Because of leaks to the papers the business came under pressure from its creditors because there were questions around the financial viability of the business,” he explained. “We had to quickly get a transaction done at the best price.”
Mr Cooney said Siteserv was under pressure to complete the deal swiftly at the end. “Because of the media speculation, credit insurers were threatening to withdraw cover, which was putting further pressure on the company … speed was of the essence,” he said.
So the chairman never said anything about the company running out of cash?
Walter Hobbs said nothing about 8 weeks cash flow either.
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