International cricket thread

byronbay2

dfx- wrote: »

If there's any play tomorrow, Pakistan will find a way to lose, it's their speciality, as already seen in the first test.

Looked an absolutely certain draw half an hour ago but Pakistan 4-down now @ 17.45 and new ball has just been taken. Surely they couldn't lose from this situation??

MFPM

byronbay2 wrote: »

Looked an absolutely certain draw half an hour ago but Pakistan 4-down now @ 17.45 and new ball has just been taken. Surely they couldn't lose from this situation??

Hopefully not, they don't really deserve a 2-0 scoreline, they'll long regret that first test second innings.

byronbay2

All over, draw agreed.

Strumms

Two quick wickets and England were into the tail. Thought they might have persisted for another 20 minutes but not to be. Mr Conservative Root should have put more men around the bat, put pressure ON the opposition instead of letting them just go block city. England couldn’t loose, the test, the series so why have even a single boundary rider ? Why ? Fûcking ball boys for all the use and influence towards a result.... entertain people ! put fielders up in the faces and eye-line of the batsmen, catching positions and go for it... Anderson was getting no help from his captain and looked like he’d rather be at home playing FIFA as block...block...blockkkk and anytime a false shot was induced there wasn’t a fielder to be seen.... entertain, force a result, do something.

Gillespy

Very surprised they didn't keep going a bit longer. Six wickets in 15 overs isn't out of the question especially with Pakistan's long tail. With a new ball. Must be sick of it at this stage.

Strumms

Gillespy wrote: »

Very surprised they didn't keep going a bit longer. Six wickets in 15 overs isn't out of the question especially with Pakistan's long tail. With a new ball. Must be sick of it at this stage.

Yeah it had.. “look, we won the series, we showed up, played the game, what more do you want, job done, enough now, out of here....”

Think just as a cricket fan I’m a little cheated there. I’d looked forward to an entertaining watch, ass on the couch... With covid and the weather I wanted it to be competitive, entertaining.... Joe Root, as a cricket fan, a sports fan just boils my piss. Absolute gifted player of that there is zero doubt but sulky, conservative, negative test match captain... that was piss poor.

Gillespy

I don't feel cheated at all. It's part of the game. You have to lower your entertainment expectation when watching test cricket and enjoy it for what it is. Root is captaining fine, they're a lot more consistent and have a great spirit, they never give up. It's why they won this series. First test was lost before a great fightback by Woakes and Buttler. That comes from Root as captain.

Strumms

Gillespy wrote: »

I don't feel cheated at all. It's part of the game. You have to lower your entertainment expectation when watching test cricket and enjoy it for what it is. Root is captaining fine, they're a lot more consistent and have a great spirit, they never give up. It's why they won this series. First test was lost before a great fightback by Woakes and Buttler. That comes from Root as captain.

Wokes and Buttler used skill, bravery, determination and resolve to get those runs. Root was up on the balcony.

If Root displays a fraction of those qualities in the field it’s a far more entertaining ending to the test match, either an English win or a dramatic draw... Remember.... England couldn’t loose here... but... yes, no close catchers and field well spread. Anderson looked angry as fûck.

MrKingsley

Gillespy wrote: »

I don't feel cheated at all. It's part of the game. You have to lower your entertainment expectation when watching test cricket and enjoy it for what it is. Root is captaining fine, they're a lot more consistent and have a great spirit, they never give up. It's why they won this series. First test was lost before a great fightback by Woakes and Buttler. That comes from Root as captain.

Test cricket is about getting the better of your opponents over 4 innings/5 days/however it works out. That’s what I want to see.

Root should’ve declared earlier and given his bowlers a full, or close to full, session to get after Pakistan on Satruday

England still won the series so fair play. But I love test cricket more than any other format. It’s enthralling and the way a 400-500 over match can swing on 30 minutes of exquisite bowling or aggressive batting it what keeps me watching. England batted themselves out of a win in this test.

Root, as Strumms has pointed out, was too concerned about not losing the match. Despite the fact that that really couldn’t have lost it from around 2pm onwards on Friday

Strumms

I think if Root has employed those tactics in front of an English crowd in the seats at the Ageas he would be booed back to Sheffield, only booed if lucky.

byronbay2

Strumms wrote: »

I think if Root has employed those tactics in front of an English crowd in the seats at the Ageas he would be booed back to Sheffield, only booed if lucky.

I don't know if you can remember as far back as Root's predecessor as England captain? :pac::pac: Alastair Cook ALWAYS waited too long to declare (when the opportunity arose!) and I don't recall him ever being booed for it.

It seems to be an English thing, the fear of declaring too early and losing the match but I (like you) would prefer a more Antipodean approach, with an early declaration and an attempt to win the match.

Strumms

byronbay2 wrote: »

I don't know if you can remember as far back as Root's predecessor as England captain? :pac::pac: Alastair Cook ALWAYS waited too long to declare (when the opportunity arose!) and I don't recall him ever being booed for it.

It seems to be an English thing, the fear of declaring too early and losing the match but I (like you) would prefer a more Antipodean approach, with an early declaration and an attempt to win the match.

There is being cautious and then being Joe Root... ie. waiting probably too long / overly cautious and probably not giving yourself a chance.

Joe Root had England post 583 first innings runs. 583 runs ? W H Y ? ...100 runs too many (at least) given the weather and situation in the game. Then in urgent need of wickets posts men on the boundary ropes, one close catcher at short leg. If I was James Anderson I’d have a face like a smacked arse too running in to bowl. 583 runs ? Come on, thats boneheaded.

Gillespy

MrKingsley wrote: »

Test cricket is about getting the better of your opponents over 4 innings/5 days/however it works out. That’s what I want to see.

Root should’ve declared earlier and given his bowlers a full, or close to full, session to get after Pakistan on Satruday

England still won the series so fair play. But I love test cricket more than any other format. It’s enthralling and the way a 400-500 over match can swing on 30 minutes of exquisite bowling or aggressive batting it what keeps me watching. England batted themselves out of a win in this test.

Root, as Strumms has pointed out, was too concerned about not losing the match. Despite the fact that that really couldn’t have lost it from around 2pm onwards on Friday

It is absolute nonsense to say England batted themselves out of winning this game. 583-8 declared in 155 overs, I really don't see the problem. Again, you are applying arguments used for batting too long in the third innings to first innings batting. Batting once and making them follow on is as good a tactic as any. Even with so much time lost to rain, England had plenty of time to force a win after their first innings. Root's problem is the pitch flattened out and Bess and Archer were hopeless.

Drawn test match, not the end of the world. Not worth crucifying Root over that's for sure. Crawley's innings made this game memorable for me. I maintain that was as good as anything I've seen. Total control, so fluent, he never looked like getting out. Made it look so easy.

And we saw Jimmy getting to 600 wickets.

MrKingsley

Gillespy wrote: »

It is absolute nonsense to say England batted themselves out of winning this game. 583-8 declared in 155 overs, I really don't see the problem. Again, you are applying arguments used for batting too long in the third innings to first innings batting. Batting once and making them follow on is as good a tactic as any. Even with so much time lost to rain, England had plenty of time to force a win after their first innings. Root's problem is the pitch flattened out and Bess and Archer were hopeless.

Drawn test match, not the end of the world. Not worth crucifying Root over that's for sure. Crawley's innings made this game memorable for me. I maintain that was as good as anything I've seen. Total control, so fluent, he never looked like getting out. Made it look so easy.

And we saw Jimmy getting to 600 wickets.

I don’t believe that is nonsense. I think that’s exactly what happened. They went 15/20 overs too long. I said it at the time and will stand by it.

I’m not crucifying Root but I think he should be held accountable for it.

Also not saying it wasn’t an enjoyable test match

MrKingsley

And just to add.

I don’t mind trying to bat the other team out of the game as a tactic. But as I pointed out last night, when it was time to put the pedal down and crush Pakistan Buttler actually eased up. What is the point of having a SR or 30 odd when you are pushing for a declaration

Gillespy

Buttler admitted he lost some rhythm there. Pakistan were very defensive too. Good shots only got one with men spread on the boundary. Part of the game, he's not a machine. Crawley was the only one that made batting look easy really. Buttler and Azhar Ali were more workmanlike innings.

Impossible to say an extra 20 overs on day two would have yielded more than the three wickets it did. That short period of batting with a 10 minute turn around after so long in the field is worth a lot too. Damn good position to be in after two days I think. Any captain would take that after winning the toss and batting.

MrKingsley

Gillespy wrote: »

Buttler admitted he lost some rhythm there. Pakistan were very defensive too. Good shots only got one with men spread on the boundary. Part of the game, he's not a machine. Crawley was the only one that made batting look easy really. Buttler and Azhar Ali were more workmanlike innings.

Impossible to say an extra 20 overs on day two would have yielded more than the three wickets it did. That short period of batting with a 10 minute turn around after so long in the field is worth a lot too. Damn good position to be in after two days I think. Any captain would take that after winning the toss and batting.

I agree with all of that. England were in a great position. I just don’t think they used it to it’s full potential.

Maybe Pakistan would’ve blocked out an extra 20 overs no problem. Maybe they would’ve been 6 instead of 3 down and the close of play.

Impossible to say and that’s probably why Test cricket is my favourite sport

Gillespy

Nothing beats it. Pakistan could have batted a lead enough for Yasir to bowl at. It has all happened before.

Elephant in the room is Bess and Archer. Pitch was slow and flat and they offered no threat. It needed quality spin or express pace. Is Archer fit, he has lost the magic he had last summer. Wood deserved another go. Was excellent in South Africa.

MrKingsley

Gillespy wrote: »

Nothing beats it. Pakistan could have batted a lead enough for Yasir to bowl at. It has all happened before.

Elephant in the room is Bess and Archer. Pitch was slow and flat and they offered no threat. It needed quality spin or express pace. Is Archer fit, he has lost the magic he had last summer. Wood deserved another go. Was excellent in South Africa.

Yeah wood really is the forgotten man. I wonder if they just want 4/5 seamers that they know they can really on fitness wise.

He is a beautiful bowler

Gillespy

Mark Wood is very likable, great character. Can't help but root for him. Keeps coming back from injury. Big part of the world cup team and Root will want him fit for away series. Good argument pace isn't that important in England, Woakes like bowlers thrive there but are less effective away.

Good break now until the next test match. Hopefully all goes ahead in New Zealand and Australia. India going there after winning the last time should be very good. Australia a different animal with Warner and Smith back and add Labuschagne too.

byronbay2

Gillespy wrote: »

Nothing beats it. Pakistan could have batted a lead enough for Yasir to bowl at. It has all happened before.

Elephant in the room is Bess and Archer. Pitch was slow and flat and they offered no threat. It needed quality spin or express pace. Is Archer fit, he has lost the magic he had last summer. Wood deserved another go. Was excellent in South Africa.

If you want to blame someone for England not winning that test, Bess and Archer are far more culpable than Root. Both were absolutely awful: Bess almost looked like he didn't want to take a wicket, just keep the run-rate down. As Gillespy says, Archer is unrecognizable from the scary, snarling fast bowler we saw last summer. I know that pitch was tough for him but he didn't look like he was trying too hard. I wonder has he integrated very well with the squad? Just a feeling I have.

MrKingsley

byronbay2 wrote: »

If you want to blame someone for England not winning that test, Bess and Archer are far more culpable than Root. Both were absolutely awful: Bess almost looked like he didn't want to take a wicket, just keep the run-rate down. As Gillespy says, Archer is unrecognizable from the scary, snarling fast bowler we saw last summer. I know that pitch was tough for him but he didn't look like he was trying too hard. I wonder has he integrated very well with the squad? Just a feeling I have.

How do you mean integrated with the squad?

There seemed to be no issues when they were winning the World Cup

Strumms

Questions have to be asked about the selection of Dom Bess.

Why is he in the side ? After 10 test matches he has an average of 40.57 with the ball, each wicket costs him 40.57 runs.

He’s played 10 tests. Hmmmmm

In 10 tests and 15 innings he averages a hair over 27 batting with one half century to his name.

Generally for an all rounder you want if not picking up many wickets and making an impact with the ball.... You are averaging mid to high 30’s with the bat, minimum...at test level.

If you are only averaging in the mid 20’s as he is, you want to be pickings up wickets, he isn’t.

There is potential, one five for certainty don’t advocate his kicking to the curb but, he need to start making an impact.

Gillespy

He's young for a test match spinner. Problem the selectors have is he did well in SA when Leach was unavailable. So he became the man in possession of the spin bowler slot and kept him in. Had little to do this summer, holding role mainly. Leach has a better record and would have been better suited to Pakistan's team full of right handers. Bess does bowl some nice deliveries just not enough of them. Can't imagine India being too worried about him touring there but his age means he should improve.

MFPM

First 20/20..Nice batting by Banton...joined by Morgan now, both hitting big boundaries.

MFPM

I jinxed Banton, he skied one and is out!

MFPM

And now Morgan, good response by Pakistan.

Mysterypunter

MFPM wrote: »

I jinxed Banton, he skied one and is out!

I wouldn't mind being jinxed on 71. Was flying for a while, Morgan out as well now

Mysterypunter

120/5 now

Mysterypunter

Rain delay at 131-6