Driving around roundabouts

Daaryl

What is it with people not being able to use roundabouts properly? I have been cut up a load of times on roundabouts and it's mostly by women and had a few lads do it to me too, And they look at me like i'm in the wrong when i beep at them! Had a few encounters with old people driving and it's really frustrating, I do know that everybody isn't perfect at driving, But some Women and Men take the cake at driving dangerously on the roads and have not got a notion of what's going on around them while driving, From being pulled out on to getting cut up on roundabouts and they have the cheek to look at you like you done something wrong.

Rant Over!

punisher5112

I just hit them.

The old system of free licence and years of no proper trainning or even enforcement sure why would they worry themselves on how to drive correctly or indicate.

Supergurrier

In fairness alot of roundabouts exit onto two lanes so it is possible in normal use to get cut up and for nobody to be in the wrong.

the twelve o'clock rules doesn't always apply

Damien360

We have far too many roundabouts where local rules apply.

I don't see too many problems in Dublin with a few glaring exceptions like walkinstown but once you get out, even to Kildare, local rules often apply. Starting on the left lane and cutting across to the inside is regular and they could be going straight on or taking 3 o'clock exit.

I have started profiling the car ahead to guess what comes next. Avensis (mammy with kids), micra (ould wan), RAV4 (seems to be old mans new car of choice) and I wait for it to happen. You can even judge it on confidence of driver as they approach any junction.

edburg

punisher5112 wrote: »

I just hit them.

The old system of free licence and years of no proper trainning or even enforcement sure why would they worry themselves on how to drive correctly or indicate.

+1 on this.

Happens most days to me out and about and feel prepared for it.

The horse roundabout at mallow on n20/n72 junction is hilarious, it like a free for all no rules seem to apply.

myshirt

I was going round a roundabout in Limerick last week and the car behind me made it through before me. How? They drove around the wrong way.

Woman. Late 20's. Irish.

my3cents

The problem I find is with smaller roundabouts that that have two approach lanes and room for two cars side by side going around. Cars that are going straight across (second exit) start on the inside lane then just drive in a straight line towards their exit. Anyone turning right that dares use the inside of the roundabout gets cut up. On such roundabouts when turning right (3rd exit) I just assume I'll be cut up so hang back I with my hand covering the horn so I at least have the satisfaction of waking anyone up who doesn't see me and cuts me up.

Pops_20

my3cents wrote: »

The problem I find is with smaller roundabouts that that have two approach lanes and room for two cars side by side going around. Cars that are going straight across (second exit) start on the inside lane then just drive in a straight line towards their exit. Anyone turning right that dares use the inside of the roundabout gets cut up. On such roundabouts when turning right (3rd exit) I just assume I'll be cut up so hang back I with my hand covering the horn so I at least have the satisfaction of waking anyone up who doesn't see me and cuts me up.

This happened to me just tonight, and regularly. Same type of roundabout where the person going straight ahead cuts into the inside lane of the roundabout (even though lanes aren't painted onto road). I always hang back, having to make changes to my driving to account for other people's ignorance.

The most annoying part is that a relative who happened to be travelling behind me at the time says, 'I saw you nearly crashed into that taxi on the roundabout'. The majority of people just don't understand roundabouts.

agent graves

myshirt wrote:

Woman. Late 20's. Irish.

How do you know she was irish? And what difference does it make.

challengemaster

agent graves wrote: »

How do you know she was irish? And what difference does it make.

Eh, probably that you could (partially) forgive a foreigner for driving the wrong way around a roundabout in a temporary lapse of memory for which side of the road they should be on. At the very least you'd have some logical reason for why they did it.

With an Irish person it's just pure stupidity or ignorance.

Cabaal

challengemaster wrote: »

Eh, probably that you could (partially) forgive a foreigner for driving the wrong way around a roundabout in a temporary lapse of memory for which side of the road they should be on. At the very least you'd have some logical reason for why they did it.
H
With an Irish person it's just pure stupidity or ignorance.

But how do you know they're Irish from just looking at them in the car? Very easily could be any number of nationalities

aphex™

I worked in an office with a lot of Polish and Slovakians. They had no idea how roundabouts work and it had to be explained to them.

They don't really have roundabouts in Eastern Europe, but they might be starting to introduce a few now.

In Slovakia they have some really convoluted rule about one road joining a more important one, and the guy had trouble explaining it.

Boskowski

Probably that rule that is in effect all over central europe which is called 'right before left'. Meaning if you come to a junction with no sign, no lights and therefore two roads of similar ranking crossing each other you yield to the car to your right. if translated to Irish roads it would probably be the reverse - 'left before right'. But I never heard of this getting a mention here.

myshirt

agent graves wrote: »

How do you know she was irish? And what difference does it make.

It matters because of context. She should have known better having been an Irish driver, presumably of a few years experience on Irish roads, both as a passenger and a driver.

I know because I pulled into Chawkes petrol station after she did, thinking it was a young joyrider and I'd have to take the keys off him + call the guards. But it wasn't. It was a young woman, perfectly sober, and totally at a loss to the significance of what she had done. Anyway, I think she got it on mature reflection, she looked like she was going to cry, so I got my coffee and a packet of minstrels and I moved on.

But going back to the op, I do believe this is an example of the awful problem with women drivers like this on the roads.

Stheno

myshirt wrote: »

But going back to the op, I do believe this is an example of the awful problem with women drivers like this on the roads.

Just the women drivers?

Daaryl

Daaryl wrote: »

What is it with people not being able to use roundabouts properly? I have been cut up a load of times on roundabouts and it's mostly by women and had a few lads do it to me too, And they look at me like i'm in the wrong when i beep at them! Had a few encounters with old people driving and it's really frustrating, I do know that everybody isn't perfect at driving, But some Women and Men take the cake at driving dangerously on the roads and have not got a notion of what's going on around them while driving, From being pulled out on to getting cut up on roundabouts and they have the cheek to look at you like you done something wrong.

Rant Over!

If it is happening loads of times maybe you ARE doing something wrong.

pablo128

Deleted User wrote: »

If it is happening loads of times maybe you ARE doing something wrong.

I doubt it. I see it all the time too. And I agree with the dub/country thing too. Culchies simply have a panic attack when they come to a roundabout, often stopping and waving other traffic on when they themselves have the right of way.

my3cents

Deleted User wrote: »

If it is happening loads of times maybe you ARE doing something wrong.

Not necessarily. On one roundabout I use anyone that tries to use it correctly to make a right hand (3rd exit) turn gets cut up. All you can do is hang back and make sure your not in a position to get cut up by drivers that take the shortest route straight ahead (2nd exit).

The problem is no one seems to ever check their blind spot to see whats on their right... or left.

punisher5112

Drive like your dunk and they all seem to stay well clear:P

cletus

On the bundle of sticks roundabout on the way in to Naas, this is a regular occurrence. Two lanes leading into the roundabouts heading towards the town. 1st exit leads you to the ring road, 2nd exit leads to town, 3 rd exit leads to a shopping complex. As a result at 8.30 in the morning the left lane is by far the busiest.

However there are relatively few mornings as I drive to work that somebody does not skip the queue in the left lane, come down the right, then try and shoehorn back in to leave at the 2nd exit. If you bother to beep at them, you just get the "what the **** is your problem" look

Daaryl

Deleted User wrote: »

If it is happening loads of times maybe you ARE doing something wrong.

And i suppose when it's happens to others it's there fault too....

Topper Harley

my3cents wrote: »

The problem I find is with smaller roundabouts that that have two approach lanes and room for two cars side by side going around. Cars that are going straight across (second exit) start on the inside lane then just drive in a straight line towards their exit. Anyone turning right that dares use the inside of the roundabout gets cut up. On such roundabouts when turning right (3rd exit) I just assume I'll be cut up so hang back I with my hand covering the horn so I at least have the satisfaction of waking anyone up who doesn't see me and cuts me up.

I'll admit, I'm sometimes guilty of this, but only when there are no other cars on or near the roundabout or me. But I can't get my mind around why people do it when there are others on the roundabout with them, especially right beside them.

I initially read your post to mean people in the right lane and going straight (2nd exit) were cutting you up when you were in the left lane and going right (3rd exit). While I realise this is not the case for you, it does happen and is another thing I can't get my head around. Why would anyone go in the left lane to turn right, especially considering that on many roundabouts the right lane is marked for those going straight as well as right.

Voodoomelon

One of the big problems with roundabout usage, is the MASSIVE confusion on how they actually work.

Who remembers this poll from 2011: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056163797

Just look at the results, incredible. It was a poll regarding whether the 12 o'clock rule should be used, or the counting number of exits rule should be used.

As you can see, the results are almost perfectly split, resulting in, on average, 2 different drivers taking two different lanes to take the same exit.

That poll is pretty much reflective of the general motoring population; everything thinks they're right, when in fact a full 50% odd are wrong.

As the RSA say, use the clock face system for determining entering lanes and exit choice. If you are using any other method of navigating a roundabout, you are WRONG.

visual

Many don't trust or have enough confidence in RSA to take their advise as being correct. Especially as previously political appointed ex tv presenter man of God was obsessed with speeding and points as if the motorist was spawn of evil.

The root cause of the bad driving is simply they where never thought, don't know and now just plodding along unaware.

my3cents

Voodoomelon wrote: »

One of the big problems with roundabout usage, is the MASSIVE confusion on how they actually work.

Who remembers this poll from 2011: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056163797

Just look at the results, incredible. It was a poll regarding whether the 12 o'clock rule should be used, or the counting number of exits rule should be used.

As you can see, the results are almost perfectly split, resulting in, on average, 2 different drivers taking two different lanes to take the same exit.

That poll is pretty much reflective of the general motoring population; everything thinks they're right, when in fact a full 50% odd are wrong.

As the RSA say, use the clock face system for determining entering lanes and exit choice. If you are using any other method of navigating a roundabout, you are WRONG.

But that really doesn't matter that much if you actually look before you change lanes on the roundabout or pull off it.

The problem is awareness of other traffic. If you know there is a car in the lane you are going for then you can avoid cutting them up.

carzony

People are not able to use roundabouts in Ireland. Especially when it comes to indicating correctly but with lack of enforcement, basic training, no driving assessment after you driving test we are asking for a bad standard of driving really..

madmaggie

In Bagenalstown, Co. Carlow, there is one mini roundabout. The usual driver behaviour is to approach it, stop, and look at the other drivers to see who will move first. The exception to this are lorries, because of their size, they do whatever the hell the feel like doing, and who's going to argue with an artic? How the drivers manage on a normal size roundabout is a mystery to me.

pablo128

madmaggie wrote: »

In Bagenalstown, Co. Carlow, there is one mini roundabout. The usual driver behaviour is to approach it, stop, and look at the other drivers to see who will move first. The exception to this are lorries, because of their size, they do whatever the hell the feel like doing, and who's going to argue with an artic? How the drivers manage on a normal size roundabout is a mystery to me.

I have seen this in Bagnalstown, and many other towns like it around the country. It's as if the drivers are terrified to make a move.

horse7

Just been stuck for 5 minutes(seemed like forever) twentyish female comes tearing out of phoenix park ashtown gate to me at bend in main road, lovely newish black bmeer,with mammy in the passanger seat, she tried to force me across road so i would have to go around her,she refused to back up,sorry i had taken my dash cam down,her driving was priceless.

edburg

horse7 wrote: »

Just been stuck for 5 minutes(seemed like forever) twentyish female comes tearing out of phoenix park ashtown gate to me at bend in main road, lovely newish black bmeer,with mammy in the passanger seat, she tried to force me across road so i would have to go around her,she refused to back up,sorry i had taken my dash cam down,her driving was priceless.

Got a lot of that when used to be out in trucks, putting feet up on dash and pulling book out tends to get them moving :pac:

Plopli

Multilane roundabouts are an aberration, there is no way some combination of entrance/exit will not cause one vehicle to cut another one.
And then you have some that have been designed by a 5 years old on LSD like Walkinstown.

Considering that, I'm always amazed there are no more accidents.

horse7

edburg wrote: »

Got a lot of that when used to be out in trucks, putting feet up on dash and pulling book out tends to get them moving :pac:

Got the impression I'm in a bmeer get out of the way, she kept blabbering on ,until she drove out in front of me.

Thargor

myshirt wrote: »

I was going round a roundabout in Limerick last week and the car behind me made it through before me. How? They drove around the wrong way.

Woman. Late 20's. Irish.

Did she have red hair and green eyes and wearing a shawl?

horse7

Thargor wrote: »

Did she have red hair and green eyes and wearing a shawl?

So you've come across her before.

robtri

Multilane roundabout on the N25 just outside waterford on way to New Ross..

on approach from waterford the n25 exit to new ross is the second exit, passed 12 o'clock, two lanes...
for ages numerous people using the left lane to go all the way around to this exit... causing chaos for people using the right lane...

so much so that the council then painted arrows on the entry to the roundabout, clearly showing left lane is first exit only (turn left) and right lane is for second exit and third exit...

Still a lot of fecking muppets and i mean around 60%, are using the left lane to take the second exit and then beep at you for using the proper lane....

horse7

Could we put up some dash can action in this thread?

FishOnABike

Maybe it's a crazy idea but I think a lot of the confusion about lane use in roundabouts could be resolved if lane markings tapered / spiralled out to the appropriate exit instead of being concentrically painted like a target bullseye. Follow the lane markings, never cross over into the lane to your left, join the lane developing to your right if you are taking a later exit.

Canadel

challengemaster wrote: »

Eh, probably that you could (partially) forgive a foreigner for driving the wrong way around a roundabout in a temporary lapse of memory for which side of the road they should be on. At the very least you'd have some logical reason for why they did it.

With an Irish person it's just pure stupidity or ignorance.

Not necessarily. Take driving in many parts of Dublin city for an Irish person who doesn't drive there regularly for example -the increased volume of traffic, combined with the typical poor Irish signposting, and regular city drivers tearing around the place, can make it a very hostile environment for both Irish and foreign drivers. While the standard of driving may be higher in Dublin, road etiquette and an understanding for drivers obviously not used to city driving is quite poor, compared to elsewhere in the country where I believe there is more understanding among local drivers. Just my experience but there does seem to be a serious issue of aggressive driving in Dublin city, as opposed to defensive driving.

endacl

agent graves wrote: »

How do you know she was irish?

Freckles and a rosary?

9935452

cletus wrote: »

On the bundle of sticks roundabout on the way in to Naas, this is a regular occurrence. Two lanes leading into the roundabouts heading towards the town. 1st exit leads you to the ring road, 2nd exit leads to town, 3 rd exit leads to a shopping complex. As a result at 8.30 in the morning the left lane is by far the busiest.

However there are relatively few mornings as I drive to work that somebody does not skip the queue in the left lane, come down the right, then try and shoehorn back in to leave at the 2nd exit. If you bother to beep at them, you just get the "what the **** is your problem" look

what i dont understand here is, if you are in the RH lane and want to take the first exit , why they dont just go all the way around the roundabout and then take the first exit and skip the que and be doing nothing wrong .

check_six

FishOnABike wrote: »

Maybe it's a crazy idea but I think a lot of the confusion about lane use in roundabouts could be resolved if lane markings tapered / spiralled out to the appropriate exit instead of being concentrically painted like a target bullseye. Follow the lane markings, never cross over into the lane to your left, join the lane developing to your right if you are taking a later exit.

There's a couple of roundabouts like that near the Carlton Hotel in Blanchardstown. I think they are called "turbo roundabouts". Grand if you know what's happening, but bloody alarming when you are happily following your lane and you start being spun out towards the exit.

My concern was that they only worked as long as everyone followed the lane markings, failing that you would have some ding-dong piling into the side of you as they followed an imaginary lane that would match the lane they took on other roundabouts.

So, in summary, they are good as long as everyone knows how to follow the lanes correctly. I'd guess 50% of people don't, so you need to know those odds when approaching these kind of road layouts!

horse7

Forget about roundabouts, people can not manage simple junctions.

my3cents

horse7 wrote: »

Forget about roundabouts, people can not manage simple junctions.

We are learning, it often surprises me that people have just about got the idea of keeping out of box junctions until the exit is clear. It did take some time though.

When we will finally see the end of cars swinging left before making a right turn, driving like a tractor with a big trailer I don't know, maybe its a rural gene?

Alun

my3cents wrote: »

When we will finally see the end of cars swinging left before making a right turn, driving like a tractor with a big trailer I don't know, maybe its a rural gene?

Or cutting the corner off on right turns almost taking the front of my car off in the process. You'd think nobody had power steering these days.

the dark phantom

I find the standard of driving has got a lot worse. Drivers crawling off 3/4 seconds after the lights turn green seems to be a thing here in Cork now.

Gasherbraun

the dark phantom wrote: »

I find the standard of driving has got a lot worse. Drivers crawling off 3/4 seconds after the lights turn green seems to be a thing here in Cork now.

I agree fully. I actually just try to keep calm and accept that driving is just the way it is but it is getting harder by the day.

Had some guy last week who joined the N4 East at Junction 4 and charged across all lanes to try and squeeze through in front of me in the 2nd overtaking lane - I was actually passing an N plated driver pottering in the middle lane. He could not make the gap between me and the N plate so sped back through the traffic into the bus lane and proceeded to undertake three cars before speeding back out into the 2nd overtaking lane. About a minute later he had to force his way back through the traffic to leave the N4 at Liffey valley. Twat.

(for the record I did not speed up or block him in any way....simply maintained my speed to pass the N plate)

Better still was the red headed, mid 20's, girl driving a metallic lime green 1996 Carlow reg supra down Ballyboden Road a couple of mornings back. I walked out onto a pedestrian crossing when the traffic lights went red (I like to see the light red) and she looked straight at me and just kept driving through. I can live with that almost but the fact I had my 2yo in his pushchair really f*cks me off.

Still got most of her number and can find out her details but not really sure it is worth the stress.

hi5

madmaggie wrote: »

In Bagenalstown, Co. Carlow, there is one mini roundabout. The usual driver behaviour is to approach it, stop, and look at the other drivers to see who will move first. The exception to this are lorries, because of their size, they do whatever the hell the feel like doing, and who's going to argue with an artic? How the drivers manage on a normal size roundabout is a mystery to me.

I went through this junction the other day and all the paint has now completely worn away to the point where I thought it had been changed back to a standard junction, its a ridiculous junction for a roundabout anyway as the roads are not even opposite one another, add to that the traffic that's usually parked along the sides hiding the signage.

https://www.google.ie/maps/@52.7009429,-6.957164,3a,75y,180h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sbr1P0omSYm2nKGpP_eSEag!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

looksee

Since anecdotal evidence is being used to demonstrate that women and old people are a major part of bad driving on the roads, can I use anecdotal evidence to 'prove' that they are not?

I passed my first driving test in 1968, first time, then when I came to Ireland I had to take it again and again passed first time. If anything the test abroad was more 'in depth' than the one here and covered more areas of expertise. Apart from one incident a week after the first test, which involved a newly wetted corrugated dirt road (like driving on black ice), I have not had an accident in 46 years of driving, no penalty points.

My husband has stopped driving now, he was one of the people given a licence without a test, he never had an accident in some 55 years of driving, no penalty points.

My sister has also been driving for some 45 years. Never had an accident, has had some speeding points. On one occasion she controlled the car with a sudden burst tyre on a motorway safely to the side of the road.

Good for us! What does all that prove. Nothing. But if bad driving can be defined by 'a 20 year old woman' 'an middle-aged woman' 'an old guy who never took a test' then I can counter with age and sex related definitions of competent and safe driving.

redlead

The quality of driving on roundabouts is definitely worse than it used to be. Two observations I've made:

1. Drivers from the greater Dublin area are the most likely to not bother indicating on roundabouts which drives me nuts. A common occurnance is to only indicate when exiting a roundabout when they are taking the third exit. Constantly not indicating when taking a first exit too which will prohibit you from entering the roundabout when you have the chance.

2. Drivers from outside the greater Dublin area literally don't have a clue how to drive on roundabouts with multiple lanes. The amount of times some dope has nearly gone through the side of my car is astonishing.

Colser

redlead wrote: »

The quality of driving on roundabouts is definitely worse than it used to be. Two observations I've made:

1. Drivers from the greater Dublin area are the most likely to not bother indicating on roundabouts which drives me nuts. A common occurnance is to only indicate when exiting a roundabout when they are taking the third exit. Constantly not indicating when taking a first exit too which will prohibit you from entering the roundabout when you have the chance.

2. Drivers from outside the greater Dublin area literally don't have a clue how to drive on roundabouts with multiple lanes. The amount of times some dope has nearly gone through the side of my car is astonishing.

What a sweeping post..unbelievable.

redlead

Colser wrote: »

What a sweeping post..unbelievable.

not really, I'm talking about drivers that make errors, not drivers in general. There is a hell of a lot less roundabouts with multiple lanes outside greater Dublin than in it so it is a pretty obvious mistake to be more common. I don't really have an explanation as to why drivers around Dublin are so poor at indicating but I see it every single day. They are also a lot less likely to indicate when overtaking on a motorway. just gone lax perhaps due to being on them a lot more.