Does murder interest you?

Ann22

Ann22 wrote: »

I too am interested in murder stories. Just read a great true whodunit set in Victorian times -The Suspicions of Mr Whicher'. Don't Google it in case it gives away anything.

A particularly fascinating read is 'The Stranger Beside Me' by Ann Rule. She was a ex policewoman turned crime reporter who was friends with Ted Bundy and never suspected a thing about the monster he was, all through the years. I must've read it about 6 or 7 tines.

I've read oountless books on true crime among them- the Moors Murders, Fred and Rose West, The Green River killer, the Night Stalker, The Yorkshire Ripper, a few about Jack the Ripper and many compilations. The Ted book was in a league of its own though.

Does the material being true make them better to read? And how so?

Genuinely curious.

expatinator

Candie wrote: »

Does the material being true make them better to read? And how so?

Genuinely curious.

That is such an interesting question. You should read some bits that Norman Mailer says. He goes on about that difference and how to play around with truth.

Imo, everything is a little different when it's true crime versus fiction crime. Even a minor act of violence is hard to respect when you know it's history and not fiction.

But, because of the way the stories are often told, true crime are rarely a hundred percent truthful. The writer can't resist getting a little into the killers heads and that does skew things ever so slightly.

An interesting example is the book 'Beyond Reason: The true story of a shocking double murder'. The author portrayed her as some kind of incredibly devious liar, but others see her as the victim.

In my opinion, true crime can be more interesting, but a little more horrifying.

expatinator

expatinator wrote: »

Also, wasn't there a case many, many years back where they found body parts of a young boy in a river? I think it was in Ireland, but this was when I was a child.

I cited the Sweet Fanny Adams case above.

There was a torso found in the Thames much more recently, but afaik remained unidentified and linked to ritual killings.

I guess the river one here that comes to mind was the "Scissors Sisters" one, think the body was found in a canal afair.

AulBiddy

Quite like learning about massacres and unsolved mysteries. At the moment I'm reading No Easy Answers by Brooks Brown, who was close friends with one of the shooters at Columbine High School. Was also reading up on Elisa Lam and the mystery behind her death last night.

Intriguing stuff.

expatinator

expatinator wrote: »

That is such an interesting question. You should read some bits that Norman Mailer says. He goes on about that difference and how to play around with truth.

Imo, everything is a little different when it's true crime versus fiction crime. Even a minor act of violence is hard to respect when you know it's history and not fiction.

But, because of the way the stories are often told, true crime are rarely a hundred percent truthful. The writer can't resist getting a little into the killers heads and that does skew things ever so slightly.

An interesting example is the book 'Beyond Reason: The true story of a shocking double murder'. The author portrayed her as some kind of incredibly devious liar, but others see her as the victim.

In my opinion, true crime can be more interesting, but a little more horrifying.

I suspect, like misery porn, that it appeals to something of the voyeur in people. Writing will always be influenced by the authors predjudices and preconceptions I suppose, it's an occupational hazard.

I've no appetite for it, but I've little appetite for fictional violence either.

boobar

Big fan of the dexter books and tv series.

The TV series really glamourised murder and in particular serial murders.

Grays Sports Almanac

Mars Bar wrote: »

I'm glad loads of you guys are fascinated by it too. I think if the secret services was to see my "recommended" and "viewed" sections of Youtube they'd be worried about what I was planning to do!

Those '48 Hours Mystery' videos on are excellent!

There's a ton of them to get through.

I enjoy watching interviews with serial killers and movies based them too.

Morbid, perhaps, but the mind of a killer is truly fascinating. Also, it's frightening what some seemingly normal people are capable of when 'pushed'.

punisher5112

Ah ya can't beat a good ould murder sure what else would one be doing.


Just back from a good ould murder.

Simon2015

punisher5112 wrote: »

Ah ya can't beat a good ould murder sure what else would one be doing.


Just back from a good ould murder.

Sure there is nothing else for the kids to do.

punisher5112

Simon2015 wrote: »

Sure there is nothing else for the kids to do.

Well they had plenty to be running away from:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

Shandashey

Would have an interest too. Have read lots about Jack the Ripper, the Zodiac killer, Jeffery Dahmer, Charles Manson, Fred and Rose West and Harold Shipman. So messed up. Ian Hindley too and the horrific moors murders. Catherine Nevin gets a shout out too!

Kalman

Deleted User wrote: »

As a topic, hopefully not as a pastime!

Just watching 10 Rillingron Place on BBC4, the classic film based on Ludovic Kennedys famous book of the John Reginald Christie killings.

My wife finds it a bit macabre, but have bookshelves full of books on murder. Usually historic stuff, Jack the Ripper, the Moors Murders, the Yorkshire Ripper, the William Herbert Wallace mystery, Fabian of the Yard and Charles Walton and the like. Have little interest in current one, no interest in the Graham Dwyer case for example. I like the murders of Victorian or Edwardian England, gaslight, misty streets, the hangmans noose and so on.

Ao you interested in true crime? Any particular crime, such as Jack the Ripper? What do you think draws us in? And any good book
recommendations?

Try : "Forty Years Of Murder" by Professor Keith Simpson.

Bernard Spilsbury>>his life and cases.

r93kaey5p2izun

Yes I love reading about murders and serial killers. Not about the gory details of the act itself, but about the setting, the killer's background, mindset and motivations, the victim's background and how they came to be in that situation. And how (if) the crime was solved and the killer caught. People can call it voyeuristic if they like, though there's a strong hint of snobbery in most such dismissals in my experience, but personally I find it odd that somebody would not be interested in how and why humans can carry out such extreme actions - particularly when it comes to serial killers or elaborate murder plots, rather than spur of the moment crimes of passion and the like.

MadDog76

MadDog76 wrote: »

You said you find even the idea of violence nauseating so I just found it odd that you would want to contribute to a thread titled "Does Murder Interest You?" .......... just my opinion honey-buns

Hmm. That's a fair point tbh. Don't know why I replied. I do find murder nauseating, I think I just wanted to register that.

Love you babes. :pac:

Ann22

Candie wrote:

Does the material being true make them better to read? And how so?

I don't know about being better to read. That all depends on the reader's taste in books. A good writer will hold the attention regardless of whether it's a true story or not but I personally find a true story more compelling and more scary as it's actually happened in reality and it's no harm to be aware of the dangers that do exist around us.

moc moc a moc

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Love you babes. :pac:

Your grammar is terrible.

Kalman

Kalman wrote: »

Try : "Forty Years Of Murder" by Professor Keith Simpson.

Bernard Spilsbury>>his life and cases.

Have it, worn to a shred, compulsory toilet reading.

expatinator

Hmmm, do you think books/movies can glorify serial killers?

I find it funny that serial killers, murders, in tv-shows are always attractive charismatic people. While, in reality, a lot of the killers are maladjusted psychopaths, or have a form of mental illness. They don't show things like glazed eyes, nervous tics or lack of personal hygiene.

FouxDaFaFa

I would say I do have an interest in murder. There's something a little base in learning about it, I think.

Learning about it can reassure us that we are still alive, or that we are "good" people. And that we're part of a "we". Us V Them.

There are definitely some things I wish I could unsee, like the details of the death of Junko Faruta or the transcript of the tape that the "Toy Box Killer" would play for his victims as they woke from a drug-induced state of unconsciousness. Even reading the transcript, I was overwhelmed by its cruelty and the fact that it's only purpose was to inspire pure panic in the victims because that's how David Parker Ray got his kicks.

It's interesting someone mentioned concentration camps too. I went to Auschwitz last week. I felt disconnected from what had happened due to the sheer number of tourists and found myself asking what we were all doing there. If any good could actually come of it. Then we moved onto Birkenau and there was a group of jewish teenagers gathered around a memorial, crying and praying. They were distraught. I found the layout of Birkenau and the level of emotion on show so uncomfortable that I wanted to run from the place but it did hammer home its purpose. If people are educated about it, it is hopefully less likely to happen again.

I also find the cult of personality interesting. There was a good Rolling Stone piece a few years back. The author went to visit Charles Manson in prison, where he had somehow convinced a young woman who wasn't old enough to remember the "family" to carve a swastika into her forehead and marry him. The (heterosexual male) author described how Manson casually touched him on the arm or shoulder and he felt this connection to him.

I nod, because for a moment, with his hand on my skin, sliding up, I can see how it was. It feels OK. It feels unexpectedly good to go with the flow, even if it is Charlie Manson's flow and even if, since he's touching me, he can kill me, which is probably how it was way back when, too.

There are so many interesting aspects to it. What is different in his head compared to mine? What is sanity? Is there such a thing as "evil"? What is justice for this crime? And so on.

boobar

expatinator wrote: »

Hmmm, do you think books/movies can glorify serial killers?

I find it funny that serial killers, murders, in tv-shows are always attractive charismatic people. While, in reality, a lot of the killers are maladjusted psychopaths, or have a form of mental illness. They don't show things like glazed eyes, nervous tics or lack of personal hygiene.

And they have great taste in business cards with no problem getting a table in Dorsia.

Saralee4

expatinator wrote: »

Hmmm, do you think books/movies can glorify serial killers?

I find it funny that serial killers, murders, in tv-shows are always attractive charismatic people. While, in reality, a lot of the killers are maladjusted psychopaths, or have a form of mental illness. They don't show things like glazed eyes, nervous tics or lack of personal hygiene.

Actually one of the symptoms of being a psychopath is a kind of superficial charm and charisma. Ted Bundy is a good example. He had loads of female supporters and didn't he propose to one in court while he was defending himself and she was in the dock, in a manipulative approach to romanticise his situation?

A lot of psychopaths and serial killers appear completely normal and most of the time it's only when people look back that they spot the red flags.

MadDog76

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Hmm. That's a fair point tbh. Don't know why I replied. I do find murder nauseating, I think I just wanted to register that.

Love you babes. :pac:

Fair enough, wasn't having a go, was just curious ............

Love me enough to meet me alone in a nicely secluded little spot I know near the Dublin mountains? Just for privacy sake hun xxx

Saralee4

MadDog76 wrote: »

Fair enough, wasn't having a go, was just curious ............

Love me enough to meet me alone in a nicely secluded little spot I know near the Dublin mountains? Just for privacy sake hun xxx

How charming MadDog76;94983274! She should go for it

MadDog76

expatinator wrote: »

Hmmm, do you think books/movies can glorify serial killers?

I find it funny that serial killers, murders, in tv-shows are always attractive charismatic people. While, in reality, a lot of the killers are maladjusted psychopaths, or have a form of mental illness. They don't show things like glazed eyes, nervous tics or lack of personal hygiene.

It's estimated that there are approximately 300 active serial killers in the US at any one time with only 8% of them being psychopaths ......... whereas it's estimated that 3% of the population of the US are psychopaths meaning that of roughly 9 million psychopaths only 24 of them are actually serial killers.

punisher5112

MadDog76 wrote: »

It's estimated that there are approximately 300 active serial killers in the US at any one time with only 8% of them being psychopaths ......... whereas it's estimated that 3% of the population of the US are psychopaths meaning that of roughly 9 million psychopaths only 24 of them are actually serial killers.

Few thanks for all that info I feel so much better now.

Oh hold on there is someone knocking at the back window wait a minute how could they be there it's a

MadDog76

Saralee4 wrote: »

How charming MadDog76;94983274! She should go for it

They usually do ............

kerry4sam

I have ordered & started to read some of the most fascinating books I've read in a while from postings in this here thread, so

Thanks,
kerry4sam

expatinator

MadDog76 wrote: »

It's estimated that there are approximately 300 active serial killers in the US at any one time with only 8% of them being psychopaths ......... whereas it's estimated that 3% of the population of the US are psychopaths meaning that of roughly 9 million psychopaths only 24 of them are actually serial killers.

Well, thank God they know where to find all those serial killers so that they can question them...

I was using the word psycopath more as a phrase.

MadDog76

expatinator wrote: »

Well, thank God they know where to find all those serial killers so that they can question them...

I was using the word psycopath more as a phrase.

Sorry, I was using the word psychopath more as a literal word.

expatinator

MadDog76 wrote: »

Sorry, I was using the word psychopath more as a literal word.

Let's have a drink