What are the differences between ISIS and the IRA?

barneystinson · 15-03-2015 7:51pm #1

I'm the one who introduced ISIS and Al Qaeda. I asked what the difference is between them and the IRA. How are you getting from that question to a comment in the Dail about water charge protesters??

Mod Note: Here you are folks, a shiny new thread to discuss which of the two above organisations are better/worse than the other. Please keep this kind of stuff off the Sinn Fein thread.

RecordStraight · 15-03-2015 7:54pm

barneystinson wrote: »

I'm the one who introduced ISIS and Al Qaeda. I asked what the difference is between them and the IRA. How are you getting from that question to a comment in the Dail about water charge protesters??

I think your question took a diversion...

RecordStraight · 15-03-2015 7:55pm

Jawgap wrote: »

And the proxy bombs - they killed a few 'agents of the Crown' - was that a legitimate tactic?

At least ISIS suicide bombers seem to be volunteers.

RecordStraight · 15-03-2015 8:13pm

gladrags wrote: »

The answer is the west armed Al Quaida,and ISIS.

The West armed ISIS, and...the East armed the IRA?

Not much of a difference there really. Like shopping in Dunnes versus Tesco.

not yet · 15-03-2015 8:16pm

RecordStraight wrote: »

The West armed ISIS, and...the East armed the IRA?

Not much of a difference there really. Like shopping in Dunnes versus Tesco.

Do you ever read the stuff you put up..

RecordStraight · 15-03-2015 8:18pm

not yet wrote: »

Do you ever read the stuff you put up..

Even better, I write it.

What the hell does where the weapons come from have to do with anything when comparing the two organisations?

It's just a red herring. It's what they do with the weapons that defines them.

Timberrrrrrrr · 15-03-2015 8:22pm

gladrags wrote: »

The answer is the west armed Al Quaida,and ISIS.

IRA's largest contributor were the American citizens.

tomwaterford · 15-03-2015 8:22pm

[quote=" It's what they do with the weapons that defines them.[/quote]

Exactly....no one in their right mind views what the ira did to be in anyway comparable to Isis

Where are the tales of the ira going around beheading children???

tomwaterford · 15-03-2015 8:27pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

A bullet to the head or your throat slit and head cut off, dead is still dead.

This is true....but despite what a lot might think....there is no reports of the ira systematically killing innocent civilians after rocking upto there village ???

tomwaterford · 15-03-2015 8:34pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Again

Dead is dead

Yes....but the original question was....were they different to Isis

You can surly appreciate that there was at least some effort to keep civilian deaths to a minimum (well as much as you can while bombing??)

Phoebas · 15-03-2015 10:25pm

tomwaterford wrote: »

This is true....but despite what a lot might think....there is no reports of the ira systematically killing innocent civilians after rocking upto there village ???

Yeah - the IRA never did anything like that.

tomwaterford · 15-03-2015 10:27pm

Phoebas wrote: »

Yeah - the IRA never did anything like that.

Are you equating the Warrington bomb (as bad as it was) with rocking up to a village and systematically killing/enslaving its population???

Quite a stretch of reality there???

Phoebas · 15-03-2015 10:27pm

tomwaterford wrote: »

You can surly appreciate that there was at least some effort to keep civilian deaths to a minimum (well as much as you can while bombing??)

'tis fierce hard to avoid civilian casualties when you're exploding bombs in their towns and cities.

tomwaterford · 15-03-2015 10:29pm

Phoebas wrote: »

'tis fierce hard to avoid civilian casualties when you're exploding bombs in their towns and cities.

It's long since been proven to be helpful in avoiding casualties in these situations by providing a phoned warning???

c montgomery · 15-03-2015 10:29pm

Gerry Adams has yet to deny being in ISIS

LeeMajors · 15-03-2015 10:34pm

tomwaterford wrote: »

Are you equating the Warrington bomb (as bad as it was) with rocking up to a village and systematically killing/enslaving its population???

Quite a stretch of reality there???

Amazing how Colin Parry can move on with his life even after a tragedy like Warrington.

https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=8&ved=0CEAQFjAH&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mirror.co.uk%2Fnews%2Fuk-news%2Fwarrington-bombing-20-years-on-1775013&ei=tvkFVeybCcWt7gae3oDwDw&usg=AFQjCNHZ6jKU3UZY90rCVUOFRkMWTmDhYw

It's a pity people in this country haven't the gumption to do the same and continue to use his son as a political football.

RecordStraight · 15-03-2015 10:35pm

As I've said elsewhere, the difference is just a matter of degree. ISIS have more power and are more concerned with public demonstrations of brutality, and have certainly been involved in worse atrocities.

But this is not to say that the IRA has not carried out its own atrocities - Warrington being just one of many.

Are/were ISIS and the IRA both terrorist groups? Yes. Just as Accrington Stanley and Chelsea are both soccer teams. Are they the same? No. Chelsea is a much better soccer team than Accrington Stanley. ISIS is a much more violent/successful (at terror) terrorist group than the IRA.

Timberrrrrrrr · 15-03-2015 10:35pm

tomwaterford wrote: »

This is true....but despite what a lot might think....there is no reports of the ira systematically killing innocent civilians after rocking upto there village ???

Jean McConvilles family would probably disagree.

meathstevie · 15-03-2015 10:36pm

Phoebas wrote: »

Yeah - the IRA never did anything like that.

Quite a difference between events like Warrington and taking over a town and systematically slaughtering every non-Sunni.

If you would want to compare ISIS behaviour to PIRA behaviour you'd have to come up with something like 150 militants taking over Aughnacloy and Emmyvale and proceeding to slaughter every non-Republican occupant.

Granted, there have been extremely nasty incidents like Kingsmill and the like but when it comes to comparing the Provo's with ISIS you're really comparing boyscouts with the SS.

Take the mortar attacks at Heathrow for an example. The Provo's probably timed their launch to not hit aircraft full of people while still shutting down the airport. ISIS would RPG the bejaysus out of a taxiing aircraft while running half a dozen suicide bombers into the terminal buildings at the same time looking for maximum casualties.

tomwaterford · 15-03-2015 10:36pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Jean McConvilles family would probably disagree.

She is one person who was far from innocent civilian
It's long been said she was an informer... Going by the Boston tapes

Phoebas · 15-03-2015 10:38pm

tomwaterford wrote: »

It's long since been proven to be helpful in avoiding casualties in these situations by providing a phoned warning???

In the case of Warrington, not only did they not avoid civilian casualties, but the first bomb drove people into the path of the second one.

Witnesses said that "the first explosion drove panicking shoppers into the path of the next blast just seconds later".

What was the non civilian target of the IRA when they planted their bombs outside a McDonald's and an Argos on a Saturday afternoon.

RecordStraight · 15-03-2015 10:39pm

meathstevie wrote: »

Granted, there have been extremely nasty incidents like Kingsmill and the like but when it comes to comparing the Provo's with ISIS you're really comparing boyscouts with the SS.

Indeed. Saying that the IRA is/was as bad as ISIS actually diminishes the seriousness of the IRA's atrocities by normal standards, because you are comparing them to the acme of absolute evil.

Godge · 15-03-2015 10:39pm

meathstevie wrote: »

Quite a difference between events like Warrington and taking over a town and systematically slaughtering every non-Sunni.

If you would want to compare ISIS behaviour to PIRA behaviour you'd have to come up with something like 150 militants taking over Aughnacloy and Emmyvale and proceeding to slaughter every non-Republican occupant.

Granted, there have been extremely nasty incidents like Kingsmill and the like but when it comes to comparing the Provo's with ISIS you're really comparing boyscouts with the SS.

A comparison between ISIS and the IRA is overblown but the IRA were not boyscouts.

I think the Accrington Stanley/Chelsea comparison is apt. Both are soccer teams yet play in a different league. ISIS and the IRA are both terrorist organisations.

An even better comparison might be Barcelona and Finn Harps. One is a soccer team on an international world-wide level, the other is a soccer team whose support is confined to a small part of Ireland.

Timberrrrrrrr · 15-03-2015 10:40pm

Phoebas wrote: »

In the case of Warrington, not only did they not avoid civilian casualties, but the first bomb drove people into the path of the second one.

What was the non civilian target of the IRA when they planted their bombs outside a McDonald's and an Argos on a Saturday afternoon.

Don't forget the Birmingham pub bombings.

Sound of Silence · 15-03-2015 10:41pm

I think a more pertinent question would be, which group would you prefer to control the area you live in?

I'm willing to bet that the IRA would be the more benevolent of the two. Hell, they might even let you keep your head!

RecordStraight · 15-03-2015 10:41pm

tomwaterford wrote: »

She is one person who was far from innocent civilian
It's long been said she was an informer... Going by the Boston tapes

The Boston tapes also say that Adams was responsible for ordering her death. I know you are actually consistent and would say, "yeah, he did it, and he was an IRA commander". But many Sinn Fein supporters would use the Boston tapes to assert she was an informer and then deny the claims about Adams from the very same source.

Which is annoying.

LeeMajors · 15-03-2015 10:41pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Jean McConvilles family would probably disagree.

As far as the PIRA were concerned at the time, she was an informer.

tomwaterford · 15-03-2015 10:41pm

Phoebas wrote: »

In the case of Warrington, not only did they not avoid civilian casualties, but the first bomb drove people into the path of the second one.

What was the non civilian target of the IRA when they planted their bombs outside a McDonald's and an Argos on a Saturday afternoon.

I do fail to see how you have managed to equate that to systemarically killing entire villages

I'm not saying it was right....but I'm intrigued to see how you came to equating the two of them

RecordStraight · 15-03-2015 10:42pm

Sound of Silence wrote: »

I think a more pertinent question would be, which group would you prefer to control the area you live in?

I'm willing to bet that the IRA would be the more benevolent of the two. Hell, they might even let you keep your head!

Agreed.

Mind you, if you were having a pint in the local, you'd want to be careful not to look at anyone sideways. Ask Robert McCartney. I suppose they didn't actually behead him, but they did gut him.

LeeMajors · 15-03-2015 10:44pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Don't forget the Birmingham pub bombings.

The ones where your beloved brit state jailed innocent people for 16 years?

tomwaterford · 15-03-2015 10:44pm

RecordStraight wrote: »

Agreed.

Mind you, if you were having a pint in the local, you'd want to be careful not to look at anyone sideways. Ask Robert McCartney. I suppose they didn't actually behead him, but they did gut him.

Being fair Robert McCartney bravely intervened in a row between the ira and an armed robber (friend of his) and got stabbed for getting between both of them....No one suggests they set out to kill him that night

What are the differences between ISIS and the IRA?

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