Do the Irish have an inferiority complex?

IamtheWalrus

I think we do. It's in our psyche to feel inferior to others. We feel inferior to the more powerful British for one. Most Irish people have an inferiority complex, me included, as much as I hate to admit it. We are second class citizens. We 'make do' with what we have.

It might have something to do with the church. I think it's changing but I resent it. It's held me back in life.

Sheep Lover

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

It's held me back in life.

It's probably just you then, lots of us are doing grand even with that massive chip on our shoulder.

stimpson

I think our inferiority complex is better than the British one.

El Weirdo

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

It's held me back in life.

Well... that and your flippers and huge teeth.

The_Valeyard

Probably more to do with various British invasions than the church. Irish were viewed very low in magazines like Punch. Same with work signs in the USA 'no Irish need apply' Combination of our history, not a new thing, goes back hundreds of years.

66ad

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

I think we do. It's in our psyche to feel inferior to others. We feel inferior to the more powerful British for one. Most Irish people have an inferiority complex, me included, as much as I hate to admit it. We are second class citizens. We 'make do' with what we have.

It might have something to do with the church. I think it's changing but I resent it. It's held me back in life.

Will you go away out of that, and get back in your box.

millie35

stimpson wrote: »

I think our inferiority complex is better than the British one.

anything they can do, we can do better

BoJack Horseman

Generally, yes.

pidgeoneyes

Not me. I'm great!

kingchess

Well,at least we can console ourselves that -thank Christ-we are not Welsh. (only joking)

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

I actually think I'm class. Especially when compared to the British. Or anyone for that matter.

Links234

We're all equally inferior to robots

Mister Vain

Only in places like killinaskully.

The Backwards Man

Balls.

Grand place this, full of cnuts granted, but so is everywhere. I've never bowed or knelt or tipped my hst to anyone in my life because I felt beneath them, load a shíte.

JAMES VI

Oh I dunno about that, Sir! If I may? I think... Oh no, you wouldn't want to hear what I think I'd assume. Oh well, thanks for taking the time to read my post, I really appreciate somebody like you taking the time to read my post. Thank you. Please, please. Thank you.

Matta Harri

Ah we probably do. I couldn't escape it anyway.

Britian is better than Ireland.
The rest of the country is superior to the west.
Galway and Mayo are nicer than Roscommon.
The South of the Roscommon is better the us in the middle.
That parish is classier than our one.
That half parish had better footballers than here.
The neighbours have better land than us etc etc.

I never had a hope.

IamtheWalrus

I'm not talking about the self-esteem of individuals. I'm talking about the Irish as a nation. There is a subconscious undercurrent of inferiority. You think you're doing well in life but only by judging yourself on a limited Irish scale.

Eugene Norman

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

I'm not talking about the self-esteem of individuals. I'm talking about the Irish as a nation. There is a subconscious undercurrent of inferiority. You think you're doing well in life but only by judging yourself on a limited Irish scale.

You are correct. Individually we are normal enough but have a collective self-disregard.

The Backwards Man

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

I'm not talking about the self-esteem of individuals. I'm talking about the Irish as a nation. There is a subconscious undercurrent of inferiority. You think you're doing well in life but only by judging yourself on a limited Irish scale.

Balls again. I'm in Ireland.

I've got a little black book with my poems in
Got a bag with a toothbrush and a comb in
When I'm a good dog they sometimes throw me a bone in

I got 569 channels of shít on the TV to choose from

I got electric light

I got a silver spoon on a chain
Got a grand piano to prop up my mortal remains.

We got it good here.

eamonnq

When I pick up the phone............theres still nobody home.

or something like that...........oh babe.

philstar

we're a good for nothing race...

....the only thing we're good for is getting drunk and planting bombs

Omackeral

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

I'm not talking about the self-esteem of individuals. I'm talking about the Irish as a nation. There is a subconscious undercurrent of inferiority. You think you're doing well in life but only by judging yourself on a limited Irish scale.

"Sure everyone loves the Irish"

"We're the best fans in the world"

AllGunsBlazing

philstar wrote: »

....the only thing we're good for is getting drunk and planting bombs

And we're not even top of the pile in the whole terrorism lark anymore.

How are we supposed to compete suicide bombs, mass shootings and ritual beheading?!

darkdubh

Well at least we realised that cricket is **** unlike most former British colonies.We have that to be thankful for.

bodice ripper

I got elastic bands keeping my shoes on
Got those swollen hand blues.



But then, I am not in Ireland so it may not be relevant.

darkdubh

philstar wrote: »

we're a good for nothing race...

....the only thing we're good for is getting drunk and planting bombs

In the same order?No wonder the Muslims have passed us out in the latter.

dxhound2005

The_Valeyard wrote: »

Probably more to do with various British invasions than the church. Irish were viewed very low in magazines like Punch. Same with work signs in the USA 'no Irish need apply' Combination of our history, not a new thing, goes back hundreds of years.

Some people think the No Irish Need Apply is an urban myth. Can you prove it ever happened?

http://www.irishcentral.com/roots/no-such-thing-as-no-irish-need-apply-signs-argues-history-professor-211727201-237597051.html

The fact that Irish vividly "remember" NINA signs is a curious historical puzzle. There are no contemporary or retrospective accounts of a specific sign at a specific location. No particular business enterprise is named as a culprit. No historian, archivist, or museum curator has ever located one ; no photograph or drawing exists.

Kiwi in IE

I wouldn't be in the slightest bit suprised if there was a national inferiority complex. The first cultural milestone for the majority of you is to be taken to be cleansed of some imaginary 'sin' a few weeks after birth, and then if the 'sin' indoctrination doesn't continue at home, 97% of primary schools will fix that! Hardly self esteem building I'd imagine!

DoYouEvenLift

Eugene Norman

Kiwi in IE wrote: »

I wouldn't be in the slightest bit suprised if there was a national inferiority complex. The Catholic church is hardly self esteem building is it? The first cultural milestone for the majority of you is to be taken to be cleansed of some imaginary 'sin' a few weeks after you are born, and then if the 'sin' indoctrination doesn't continue at home, 97% of primary schools will fix that!

And yet the 1.2 billion or so other catholics and a billion or so other christians don't seem to have that inferiority complex.

( although you quite clearly feel superior).

No quite simply. We don't for sure have a superiority complex - there's no tradition of feeling superior to our neighbours, there are no English jokes, and we've internalised a general dislike of our own culture.

StupidLikeAFox

We have a curious condition where we hate ourselves but think we are better than everyone else.

dxhound2005

Eugene Norman wrote: »

And yet the 1.2 billion or so other catholics and a billion or so other christians don't seem to have that inferiority complex.

( although you quite clearly feel superior).

No quite simply. We don't for sure have a superiority complex - there's no tradition of feeling superior to our neighbours, there are no English jokes, and we've internalised a general dislike of our own culture.

You may have, I haven't.

The_Valeyard

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Some people think the No Irish Need Apply is an urban myth. Can you prove it ever happened?

http://www.irishcentral.com/roots/no-such-thing-as-no-irish-need-apply-signs-argues-history-professor-211727201-237597051.html

The fact that Irish vividly "remember" NINA signs is a curious historical puzzle. There are no contemporary or retrospective accounts of a specific sign at a specific location. No particular business enterprise is named as a culprit. No historian, archivist, or museum curator has ever located one ; no photograph or drawing exists.

Here are some examples I have found:

New York Times, 1854

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NINA-nyt.JPG#mw-jump-to-license

Evening Post

17 July 1828, New-York (NY) Evening Post, pg. 3, col. 1 ad:
WANTED a woman to cook, wash, and iron, for a small private family. One who understands her business, and can come well recommended, will find a good and steady place by applying at 297 1/2 Broadway.
N. B.—No Irish need apply.




12 July 1830, New-York (NY) Morning Herald, pg. 3, col. 3:
“NO IRISH NEED APPLY.”—Several advertisements with this insulting appendage have been from time to time left on our hook for insertion, but which we rejected with disdain for their authors. If one Irish servant maid commits a fault, is that a reason that all other Irish girls must be bad? Surely not. Those who write those illiberal and foolish advertisements ought to remember thatthe misconduct of a few can afford no ground for insulting a whole nation; and a nation like Ireland—renowned for the virtues of her females, and the genius and generosity of her sons. That American cannot be patriotic who would deliberately offer an insult to the country of General Montgomery and Commodore barry. When we were making the great struggle for our liberties, were we not nobly assisted by IRISHMEN?

The New Monthly Magazine
1836
Pg. 358:
Advertisements frequently run in these terms:—“Wanted. so and so.—No Irish need apply.” But the usual phraseology is — “Wanted, an English or American,” &c. Notwithstanding this, the Irish constitute the great mass of domestic servants, and without them I cannot conceive what could be done.

18 May 1841, New-York (NY) Tribune, pg. 3, col. 4 ad:
WANTED—An America Woman to do the general housework of a small family. (...) No Irish need apply.

10 November 1854, New York (NY) Times, pg. 5 classified ad:
GIRL WANTED—In a small private family—a young ril, 14 or 15 years old, either American or German, to take care of a young child. She must have good references. Wages $3 a month. No Irish need apply. Call at No. 89 McDougal St.

Eugene Norman

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Some people think the No Irish Need Apply is an urban myth. Can you prove it ever happened?

http://www.irishcentral.com/roots/no-such-thing-as-no-irish-need-apply-signs-argues-history-professor-211727201-237597051.html

The fact that Irish vividly "remember" NINA signs is a curious historical puzzle. There are no contemporary or retrospective accounts of a specific sign at a specific location. No particular business enterprise is named as a culprit. No historian, archivist, or museum curator has ever located one ; no photograph or drawing exists.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Irish_Need_Apply#/media/File:NINA-nyt.JPG

dxhound2005

The_Valeyard wrote: »

Here are some examples I have found:

New York Times, 1854

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NINA-nyt.JPG#mw-jump-to-license

Evening Post

17 July 1828, New-York (NY) Evening Post, pg. 3, col. 1 ad:
WANTED a woman to cook, wash, and iron, for a small private family. One who understands her business, and can come well recommended, will find a good and steady place by applying at 297 1/2 Broadway.
N. B.—No Irish need apply.




12 July 1830, New-York (NY) Morning Herald, pg. 3, col. 3:
“NO IRISH NEED APPLY.”—Several advertisements with this insulting appendage have been from time to time left on our hook for insertion, but which we rejected with disdain for their authors. If one Irish servant maid commits a fault, is that a reason that all other Irish girls must be bad? Surely not. Those who write those illiberal and foolish advertisements ought to remember thatthe misconduct of a few can afford no ground for insulting a whole nation; and a nation like Ireland—renowned for the virtues of her females, and the genius and generosity of her sons. That American cannot be patriotic who would deliberately offer an insult to the country of General Montgomery and Commodore barry. When we were making the great struggle for our liberties, were we not nobly assisted by IRISHMEN?

The New Monthly Magazine
1836
Pg. 358:
Advertisements frequently run in these terms:—“Wanted. so and so.—No Irish need apply.” But the usual phraseology is — “Wanted, an English or American,” &c. Notwithstanding this, the Irish constitute the great mass of domestic servants, and without them I cannot conceive what could be done.

18 May 1841, New-York (NY) Tribune, pg. 3, col. 4 ad:
WANTED—An America Woman to do the general housework of a small family. (...) No Irish need apply.

10 November 1854, New York (NY) Times, pg. 5 classified ad:
GIRL WANTED—In a small private family—a young ril, 14 or 15 years old, either American or German, to take care of a young child. She must have good references. Wages $3 a month. No Irish need apply. Call at No. 89 McDougal St.

They all seem to be from families seeking servants and are small ads not signs placed by employers at their factories or shops. Two of these are mentioned in the article I posted. There seem to be no proof of any employers putting up NINA signs.

Tombi!

You're asking for two different things; NINA existed. If it iexisted as a sign, that's a differnet story.

The_Valeyard

dxhound2005 wrote: »

They all seem to be from families seeking servants and are small ads not signs placed by employers at their factories or shops. Two of these are mentioned in the article I posted. There seem to be no proof of any employers putting up NINA signs.

I would count a family offering a wage for a servant is an employer. Servant was a career job back then.

Kiwi in IE

Eugene Norman wrote: »

No quite simply. We don't for sure have a superiority complex - there's no tradition of feeling superior to our neighbours, there are no English jokes, and we've internalised a general dislike of our own culture.

Well in fairness I'm not suprised if there is an internalised dislike of the religious aspect of the culture. Along with it has come a history of socially conservative policy that has held the country back. Past laws on contraception, married women working outside the home and divorce, the current abortion laws and religious state schools are backward compared to the rest of the first world quite frankly. I can't think what else would account for the supposed inferiority complex, aside from the religious bollocks it is a great country.

The Backwards Man

bodice ripper wrote: »

I got elastic bands keeping my shoes on
Got those swollen hand blues.



But then, I am not in Ireland so it may not be relevant.

That's cause you got fading roots

GalwayGuitar

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

I think we do. It's in our psyche to feel inferior to others. We feel inferior to the more powerful British for one. Most Irish people have an inferiority complex, me included, as much as I hate to admit it. We are second class citizens. We 'make do' with what we have.

It might have something to do with the church. I think it's changing but I resent it. It's held me back in life.

What are you on about? If you feel inferior that's your issue. I'm proud of this country.

bodice ripper

The Backwards Man wrote: »

That's cause you got fading roots

The inevitable pin hole burns.

Eugene Norman

Kiwi in IE wrote: »

Well in fairness I'm not suprised if there is an internalised dislike of the religious aspect of the culture. Along with it has come a history of socially conservative policy that has held the country back. Past laws on contraception, married women working outside the home and divorce, the current abortion laws and religious state schools are backward compared to the rest of the first world quite frankly. I can't think what else would account for the supposed inferiority complex, aside from the religious bollocks it is a great country.

Let's not go overboard.

ComfortKid

darkdubh wrote:

Well at least we realised that cricket is **** unlike most former British colonies.We have that to be thankful for.

And we still bet them at it!

jank

800 years, rabble rabble rabble. Yes, we do but I think we are getting better.

Minderbinder

personally i've always felt quite intimidated speaking to british and americans. they seem a lot better at expressing themselves and more coherent than irish people. they also have an air of confidence in what they're saying and don't sit on the fence even in the company of strangers or foreigners. irish people don't have the same belief in themselves. that's why outsiders like us but don't respect us. (because we're not a threat)

TheBeardedLady

I'd say we do. No harm acknowledging our history might've had some impact on the national psyche. Discounting it with "rabble rabble" comments doesn't help.

Fratton Fred

darkdubh wrote: »

Well at least we realised that cricket is **** unlike most former British colonies.We have that to be thankful for.

It's probably the fastest growing sport in Ireland at the moment.

jimgoose

We're all basically Spailpíns and tinkers without land, dancing around a campfire like naked, devil-worshipping hussies. God made the world, but seaweed made that field, biy.

Robsweezie

I think of Ireland as the scruffy little brother of the more sophisticated UK, the runt of the family who is yet to prove himself living In the shadow of its older, mature European countries with their good looks and college diplomas.

Fratton Fred

Fratton Fred wrote: »

It's probably the fastest growing sport in Ireland at the moment.

Coming from a very low base though, mainly consisting of protestants, immigrants from Britian / former British colonies and the wealthy 'old money' type of catholics. :pac:

Fratton Fred

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Coming from a very low base though, mainly consisting of protestants, immigrants from Britian / former British colonies and the wealthy 'old money' type of catholics. :pac:

So is Martin McGuinness a protestant, an immigrant or old money Catholic type?