Principal Officer in the Civil Service

bubbatj

Uriel. wrote: »

were the appointments themselves Dublin or regional based locations?

Both people and PO posts were Dublin based

kippy

The_Conductor wrote: »

A lot of the issue arises from the manner in which DPER imagine that any civil servant is a commodity- and can be placed in any Department- and function to a high level- regardless of what their background or experience may be. So- an architect could be over a section dealing with taxation policy (for example)- whereas- a chartered accountant could end up over a section dealing with animal welfare (extreme examples).

In my opinion- the entire recruitment process is a mess- as is the haphazard manner in which people are placed willy-nilly without any regard whatsoever to the wealth of experience or skills they may to bring to posts.

This is across the board mind, its not confined to PO or APO grades.........

100 % agree with this.
Well said.
Whats the point of college, education and experience if they are disregarded when recruiting.

Uriel.

The_Conductor wrote: »

A lot of the issue arises from the manner in which DPER imagine that any civil servant is a commodity- and can be placed in any Department- and function to a high level- regardless of what their background or experience may be. So- an architect could be over a section dealing with taxation policy (for example)- whereas- a chartered accountant could end up over a section dealing with animal welfare (extreme examples).

In my opinion- the entire recruitment process is a mess- as is the haphazard manner in which people are placed willy-nilly without any regard whatsoever to the wealth of experience or skills they may to bring to posts.

This is across the board mind, its not confined to PO or APO grades.........

Your examples aren't that extreme at all to be honest

Nocrac

Whatever about other grades, as senior managers, POs don't need to be specialists.

However, there contradictions between efforts to specialise the service while also increasing mobility.

Really the civil service is too small for excessive specialisation.

planstan

The_Conductor wrote: »

A lot of the issue arises from the manner in which DPER imagine that any civil servant is a commodity- and can be placed in any Department- and function to a high level- regardless of what their background or experience may be. So- an architect could be over a section dealing with taxation policy (for example)- whereas- a chartered accountant could end up over a section dealing with animal welfare (extreme examples).

In my opinion- the entire recruitment process is a mess- as is the haphazard manner in which people are placed willy-nilly without any regard whatsoever to the wealth of experience or skills they may to bring to posts.

This is across the board mind, its not confined to PO or APO grades.........

The_Conductor wrote: »

A lot of the issue arises from the manner in which DPER imagine that any civil servant is a commodity- and can be placed in any Department- and function to a high level- regardless of what their background or experience may be. So- an architect could be over a section dealing with taxation policy (for example)- whereas- a chartered accountant could end up over a section dealing with animal welfare (extreme examples).

In my opinion- the entire recruitment process is a mess- as is the haphazard manner in which people are placed willy-nilly without any regard whatsoever to the wealth of experience or skills they may to bring to posts.

This is across the board mind, its not confined to PO or APO grades.........

Your examples are most certainly not extreme. My experience working with a PO and an AO with zero experience or skills in the field they've been assigned to has resulted in a bizarre situation where I work.

The recruitment process is a total mess and these large competitions for CO up to PO are shambolic. There's a lack of transparency for candidates - look at the thousands of posts here from people with no clue of what's going on and getting conflicting answers when they enquire.

The policy of looking for references before a job offer is even on the table is ridiculous. We can talk about the high numbers of applicants in open competitions but realistically, how many bother to follow them up and complete the assessments at home and the supervised tests?
I've been told anecdotally that it's less than 35% despite the bluster about massive competition in the perceived fight to get into the civil service.

kippy

Nocrac wrote: »

Whatever about other grades, as senior managers, POs don't need to be specialists.

However, there contradictions between efforts to specialise the service while also increasing mobility.

Really the civil service is too small for excessive specialisation.

It helps if they have some experience in the field they are over or at least a qualification in that area - that would be common sense - surely?

Too small? Really?

Nocrac

kippy wrote: »

It helps if they have some experience in the field they are over or at least a qualification in that area - that would be common sense - surely?

Too small? Really?

It helps, but is not essential. A PO steers their staff towards the achievement Department goals. Strategic perspective, good judgement and harnessing the knowledge of your staff are key. Some of the best managers I've had have had no prior knowledge of the area, have challenged assumptions and made significant and lasting improvements.

The civil service makes up only 10% of the public service and is relatively small by EU standards.

kippy

Nocrac wrote: »

It helps, but is not essential. A PO steers their staff towards the achievement Department goals. Strategic perspective, good judgement and harnessing the knowledge of your staff are key. Some of the best managers I've had have had no prior knowledge of the area, have challenged assumptions and made significant and lasting improvements.

The civil service makes up only 10% of the public service and is relatively small by EU standards.

In areas I am familiar with, it is, in my opinion, absolutely essential. Especially when the salaries are in excess of 100K per annum - is it too much to ask for experience in the area as well as what you've outlined?
Some of the worst managers I have had have been experts in their field, but useless managers - that doesn't prove or disprove anything.

I've seen PO's come into IT areas from the business and the show almost fall down around them, taking years to get to grips with the role, never mind the trends and how best to utilise newer techs to achieve those goals.

36,000 staff not a small organisation by any stretch.

Sorry, am taking this off topic. Last post on the subject.
To all those on the panel, good luck.

GiffordPinchot

Panel member decloaking.

Thanks to all who have been contributing here and providing updates on progress.

I am in the upper 60's and haven't been contacted with regard to clearance or offers.

Can anyone advise how the clearance process is kicked off - does the candidate get a phone call or email?

Uriel.

GiffordPinchot wrote: »

Panel member decloaking.

Thanks to all who have been contributing here and providing updates on progress.

I am in the upper 60's and haven't been contacted with regard to clearance or offers.

Can anyone advise how the clearance process is kicked off - does the candidate get a phone call or email?

Not sure about PO competition but for others it has been forms to complete. Message to publicjobs account and emailed forms from what I've heard in relation to other Open Competitions.

Last I heard, no further movement on the panel and heard a suggestion that there won't be until post budget.

RiseToMe

I know of an early 60s being offered last week if folk are still eager to find out where the panel are at numbers wise

The_Conductor

RiseToMe wrote: »

I know of an early 60s being offered last week if folk are still eager to find out where the panel are at numbers wise

Was this for an 'unusual' decentralised location?

RiseToMe

Not that unusual, outside of Dublin city but extremely commutable, in fact when looked at, it will be a shorter commute than into city. 40 mins if even.

So not far flung like Cork/Donegal or something you'd consider moving house for.

Uriel.

RiseToMe wrote: »

I know of an early 60s being offered last week if folk are still eager to find out where the panel are at numbers wise

Are offers made subject to clearance or is clearance done first,. If clearance done first then that would suggest that up to somewhere in the 60s has gone through clearance.

RiseToMe

Uriel. wrote: »

Are offers made subject to clearance or is clearance done first,. If clearance done first then that would suggest that up to somewhere in the 60s has gone through clearance.

It's not myself that got the offer and I'm not in the civil service so I can't shed much light on that, but I think offers and then clearance.

This situation is slightly altered as the person in question went through clearance for another role within the last year anyway and as such has a lot of ducks in a row and an estimated start date depending on the finish date in current role.

coleraine1

From below, the person in question has accepted this post I take it then??

Is the person in question moving Department or public bother??

RiseToMe

Yes they accepted the position and as a promotion as they are already within the civil service but not in the same department.

Grey AP

To resolve the mystery of what happens as your place on the panel approaches (sadly, I think, still an insurmountable distance from mine), I went back to source. The email telling me I'd qualified said this.

"Should your place on the order of merit be reached, we will commence a clearance process before offering you an appointment."

I think that if they are now going to appoint four million nurses, junior doctors, consultants, gardai and teachers, vetting priority may not be ours.

Any news on what the numbers are like now? I am going to contact the PAS next week and suggest that they put up a table, 1-164, and mark off numbers as people are appointed, perhaps with the date. I can't see any FoI or privacy issue with this and it would save the PAS, and the rest of us, a lot of grief.

Uriel.

Grey AP wrote: »

To resolve the mystery of what happens as your place on the panel approaches (sadly, I think, still an insurmountable distance from mine), I went back to source. The email telling me I'd qualified said this.

"Should your place on the order of merit be reached, we will commence a clearance process before offering you an appointment."

I think that if they are now going to appoint four million nurses, junior doctors, consultants, gardai and teachers, vetting priority may not be ours.

Any news on what the numbers are like now? I am going to contact the PAS next week and suggest that they put up a table, 1-164, and mark off numbers as people are appointed, perhaps with the date. I can't see any FoI or privacy issue with this and it would save the PAS, and the rest of us, a lot of grief.

I doubt they'll do that, I'm not disputing it as a decent idea I just don't think they'll do that. Would be handy though

I'd say they'd still make appointments subject to clearance as someone provided the example/experience above.

Their initial email about clearance happening first isn't a rule rather a policy which I am sure can be relaxed as necessary. When you take it that many panellists are serving APs it seems like reasonable approach if vacancies need filling ASAP and clearance takes a while.

More money for many departments and more projects may mean a need for additional staff to manage them etc so you might see more movement in addition to just filling retirement vacancies

VirgilBrigman

Just re clearance and offers - I got regional offers before I was ever asked for clearance. The clearance only happened as they got near my number for a Dublin offer and the clearance commenced before I got the actual offer. Clearance process is emailed forms to fill out and send back. It looks like once you hit clearance you're pretty sure to be getting a Dublin offer. Good luck to all remaining on the panel. They must be in the fifties somewhere now.

Uriel.

VirgilBrigman wrote: »

Just re clearance and offers - I got regional offers before I was ever asked for clearance. The clearance only happened as they got near my number for a Dublin offer and the clearance commenced before I got the actual offer. Clearance process is emailed forms to fill out and send back. It looks like once you hit clearance you're pretty sure to be getting a Dublin offer. Good luck to all remaining on the panel. They must be in the fifties somewhere now.

congratulations. when did you get your Dublin offer, if you don't mind me asking?

Grey AP

Any updates on where the panel is now?

I made my suggestion, through the public jobs feedback email, that the PAS post simple tables of each current panel, listing by place on the panel and striking through each place as that person is appointed or leaves the panel. Nice and anonymous, so shouldn't be a problem on a public page. Even then, it could go somewhere where all the members of that panel could see it when logged in. It would save the PAS a lot of time and work in replying to our anxious queries and, if there was a page with tables for all current panels, would be pretty popular, I'd say. I'm an exceedingly optimistic character, so watch this space.

The_Conductor

How about a weekly update to the AHCPS- and candidates contact the union for information- taking the heat off PAS? They already get a monthly briefing- so just make it more frequent, and get them to nominate an officer to be contacted for information if/when candidates are seeking clarification?

GiffordPinchot

I telephoned PAS yesterday and they said that they have appointed up to No. 49, but not everybody higher up the panel than 49 has been appointed (this would tally with the post earlier in this thread describing how some on the panel are holding out for a particular location).

That is not to say that the post by RiseToMe is inaccurate - it might well be the case that someone in the early 60's accepted a role outside of Dublin, but PAS presumably would stick to what I might call the 'ordinary' figure - excluding any outlier cases where they had to skip several candidates to fill a particular role.

I didn't ask any follow-up questions, for example whether there are further candidates that have accepted offers but are not yet appointed.

bubbatj

GiffordPinchot wrote: »

I telephoned PAS yesterday and they said that they have appointed up to No. 49, but not everybody higher up the panel than 49 has been appointed (this would tally with the post earlier in this thread describing how some on the panel are holding out for a particular location).

That is not to say that the post by RiseToMe is inaccurate - it might well be the case that someone in the early 60's accepted a role outside of Dublin, but PAS presumably would stick to what I might call the 'ordinary' figure - excluding any outlier cases where they had to skip several candidates to fill a particular role.

I didn't ask any follow-up questions, for example whether there are further candidates that have accepted offers but are not yet appointed.

It would be interesting to know how many on the panel above 49 have yet to accept offers. The number 'reached' on the panel is a bit meaningless if there's people above that and also appointments already made below it! I think the restricted availability of an anonymouslist is a good ideas but also doubt PAS will see it that way!

GiffordPinchot

The latest AHCPS newsletter, dated 11 November, said:

"To date there has been 39 appointments – 5 did not take up offers so assignments have been up to and including number 44."

This is less than the figure of 49 I mentioned previously. It may be just a time lag between the provision of the information to AHCPS and the publication of the newsletter.

I see there is a new AP competition announced. I'm guessing a new PO competition is not far away (but I have no idea of PAS plans in this regard).

If there is a new PO competition announced, it will be interesting to see if PAS pull down the shutter on the current panel straight away or let it trundle on for bit while the initial stages of the new competition get underway.

The_Conductor

Was there not an end-date announced for the panel at the outset?
Normal practice would be to state that the panel has a lifespan of 12 (or 18) months from the date of first appointment from the panel (not from when the panel competition is called, or the panel constituted). PAS could, perhaps, clarify this- if a panel member cared to ask?

cee_jay

The_Conductor wrote: »

Was there not an end-date announced for the panel at the outset?
Normal practice would be to state that the panel has a lifespan of 12 (or 18) months from the date of first appointment from the panel (not from when the panel competition is called, or the panel constituted). PAS could, perhaps, clarify this- if a panel member cared to ask?

From the AHCPS ezine it seems they are awaiting a decision from DPER.

PO Open Panel: A total of 164 people were placed on the panel. The Association is still awaiting a decision from DPER on the expiry date of the panel. To date there has been 39 appointments – 5 did not take up offers so assignments have been up to and including number 44.

Grey AP

I asked PAS last week where the panel is up to, but no reply so far. Perhaps that is because I used ordinary email, rather than logging in to my candidate page. Still, releasing the state of the panel is hardly a threat to national security.

I did hear a reasonably founded rumour that DPER is slow to give permission to fill posts because the competition did not yield the desired results - a panel with at least half of the top 100 from outside the civil or public service.

In my view, while that objective was quite successful in the last couple of AP comps, with a lot of people coming in for the first time as APs, AP pay is as good as or better than the private sector at that management level.

However, private sector people who have seen the PO job spec tell me that candidates at that level could expect €110 k or more to start, plus a car and education and health benefits i.e. a senior management package. So, firstly, the comp was unlikely to attract private sector candidates who are qualified for the post, as the pay is too low. Secondly, after a year or more waiting for an offer, most private sector candidates could reasonably be expected to have found a job somewhere else.

At this stage, if the rumour has foundation, DPER either needs to accept that it won't get what it wants, it has spent a shedload of money, it has a group of people qualified to do the job regardless of origin and get on with appointing them, or admit it wants to scrap the deal, burn the money and start again. All views welcome.

The_Conductor

Grey AP - what you're saying makes sense- and indeed, they (presumably DPER) are leaking comments in the media about the PO and higher grades, and how the payscale simply is insufficient to attract candidates (simultaneously using the large numbers who have applied for the TCO/CO/EO and AO competition as justification for stating that the starting salaries for those grades is obviously sufficient (the large numbers who bugger off after one of two pay cheques is apparently being conveniently ignored)).

PAS are working on a 'business as usual' basis- turning over panels in the historically prescribed manner- that is, all panels having a life of 12 months from date of first appointment from the panel. As far as I know there still hasn't been any statement regarding an end-date for the PO competition- however, given they've had two more withdrawals from offered posts in recent weeks- the writing is on the wall.

WTE Sanctioned ceilings- are still an issue- particularly in Departments with large state bodies under their auspices who aren't kept on a tight leash. This is partially why you have so many APs on Acting up Allowances- and a proliferation of 'Directors' rather than ASGs.........

I don't think anyone is going to publicly comment on the candidates who went for the competition- not directly anyway- its more this balloon flying with statements about how the salary scale is not commensurate with the posts on offer for higher management positions- hint, hint- read between the lines, type statements.........

Its yet another mess- in this case, one that they're not willing to acknowledge, as it would highlight the irrefutable fact that the civil service payscales at this grade (and at other grades- whether they're willing to acknowledge it or not)- simply is not commensurate with the jobs on offer.

At lower grades- they have decided that EOs are now graduate recruitment grades (i.e. the AO grade is effectively being morphed into the HEO grade- and now, almost for the first time- an AO will be expected to manage often large cohorts of staff etc). The EO grade meanwhile- is problematic in some respects- for example the SO grade- an intermittent grade between CO and EO- has better annual leave entitlements- which is partially why many current SOs don't bother going for EO- sure why would you?

At HEO grade- there is mass disillusionment- as the perception is that career progression has effectively been halted (this hasn't quite hit the EO grade- as there hasn't been an open HEO competition thus far). HEO grades- the perception is- if you want a promotion- your best bet is to take a decentralised post that no-one else wants- particularly in the internal panels. AP and higher- well, anyone who was eligible took the 'incentivised' (read gun to your head) early retirement scheme- on the basis that however bad things were- they were only going to get worse...........

The biggest issue going forward- is of course going to be change management- the amount of knowledge walking out the door in the next decade, is staggering. Its all well and good telling APs that their sections need all encompassing 'Procedures Manuals' which are to detail pretty much every possible encounter a staff member may have on a daily basis- unfortunately the vast majority of what a lot of people deal with- is not black and white- and very often there may be damn good reasons for not detailing some scenarios- wholly aside from the fact that all these manuals would make the Library of Congress proud.

The civil service- as a body- is disillusioned, I wouldn't go as far as saying there is a persecution complex- but it is something that must concern a significant number of staff, given the lumps that are torn out of it on an almost daily basis in the media- stories that are seldom rebutted, clarified or quantified.

Change is good- however, the irrefutable fact that any organisation's greatest asset is its staff- seems to be a simple enough fact that DPER seem loathe to admit.

Dodge

FWIW the EO grade has always been handled by graduate recruitment in PAS (or the CSC of ye olde time)

The_Conductor

Dodge wrote: »

FWIW the EO grade has always been handled by graduate recruitment in PAS (or the CSC of ye olde time)

Its actively being sold as graduate recruitment these days- whereas in the past AO was 'the graduate recruitment grade of the Civil Service Commission' (have the lovely little booklet from the late 90s here).

Anyhow- we digress- its not particularly relevant to this thread- the point I was more interested in making- is the manner in which necessity, particularly over the last 12 years, has pressured grades to take over the responsibilities associated with those more senior- its across the board- there has been a blurring of lines (which isn't in itself a bad thing)- however, there is little or no acknowledgement of the manner in which roles and responsibilities have evolved.

Riskymove

The_Conductor wrote: »

is the manner in which necessity, particularly over the last 12 years, has pressured grades to take over the responsibilities associated with those more senior- its across the board- there has been a blurring of lines (which isn't in itself a bad thing)- however, there is little or no acknowledgement of the manner in which roles and responsibilities have evolved.

Work has tended to "follow the promotee" if you like

over the time of the boom, expansion, turnover and promotion of people with little experience in grades led to people more and more doing the same work at the higher level as the lack of experience or coaching meant they were unaware of the new role

This seems to be particularly at AP and PO level

conversely, in my experience, this has lead to a lessening of work carried out at lower grades

Riskymove

The_Conductor wrote: »

Grey AP - what you're saying makes sense- and indeed, they (presumably DPER) are leaking comments in the media about the PO and higher grades, and how the payscale simply is insufficient to attract candidates (

The problem was DPER's view (or perhaps even just the then Minister's view) that PO level pay would attract experienced private sector managers or specialists....it doesn't

The_Conductor

Riskymove wrote: »

The problem was DPER's view (or perhaps even just the then Minister's view) that PO level pay would attract experienced private sector managers or specialists....it doesn't

Even at lower ranks- its becoming near impossible to keep EOs or HEOs who have experience in IT or Finance- the pay for commensurate rolls in the private sector can be twice or three times as high as in the public sector. When you add the process for 'promotions' into the equation- you end up with the best and most experienced staff- walking. Its hard to blame them. Its far from being unique to AP and PO grades. The promotional prospects for staff is not what it once was- and is leading to this haemorrhaging of key personnel.

GiffordPinchot

I rang PAS last week again just to get an update.

They have assigned up as far as no. 58 on the panel. As before, there are a few higher up the panel holding out for particular locations, plus one or two assignments from further down the panel than 58, where they had to skip ahead a bit to find someone willing to take a particular post.

Requests to PAS from Departments for people from the panel to fill posts are random, so it is not possible to say that there is a steady trend of 'X assignments per month'.

doc11

The_Conductor wrote: »

Grey AP - what you're saying makes sense- and indeed, they (presumably DPER) are leaking comments in the media about the PO and higher grades, and how the payscale simply is insufficient to attract candidates (simultaneously using the large numbers who have applied for the TCO/CO/EO and AO competition as justification for stating that the starting salaries for those grades is obviously sufficient (the large numbers who bugger off after one of two pay cheques is apparently being conveniently ignored)).

I find it hard to believe many CO/EO disappear after a few weeks

The_Conductor

doc11 wrote: »

I find it hard to believe many CO/EO disappear after a few weeks

There are some remarkably qualified candidates going for CO and EO these days- according to PAS its more common than not for them to hold third level qualifications, often professional qualifications- and in many cases, significant private sector experience. This shows through in the fact that at least one of the candidates on the PO panel- was a serving CO- and the top scoring internal candidate on the recent internal AP panel in two Departments were serving COs. A lot of people entered these competitions- as a stopgap measure until something better came along- which would never have happened in the past. Its the new norm.

Riskymove

The_Conductor wrote: »

There are some remarkably qualified candidates going for CO and EO these days- .

The latest addition here is an HEO, who became an EO last July and a CO about 10 months before that

That person could be on the AP panel next!

doc11

The_Conductor wrote: »

There are some remarkably qualified candidates going for CO and EO these days- according to PAS its more common than not for them to hold third level qualifications, often professional qualifications- and in many cases, significant private sector experience. This shows through in the fact that at least one of the candidates on the PO panel- was a serving CO- and the top scoring internal candidate on the recent internal AP panel in two Departments were serving COs. A lot of people entered these competitions- as a stopgap measure until something better came along- which would never have happened in the past. Its the new norm.

CO getting promoted to PO and AP is the opposite to them just leaving after a few weeks.:pac:

In relation to the quality of candidates going for roles would be mixed in my view, of the 30000 that applied only half could pass a basic verbal/numeric test. When about 40% of the population have degrees, it isn't really that hard to believe that the top thousand out of 30000 would be very well qualified.
New CO topping internal panels isn't that amazing, lots of deadwood in many small departments who were hired in times when competition wasn't an issue.Would many CO,EO and HEO be in there position now if they faced the same competition and tests as todays candidates face.

Using a CO job as a stopgap? common you'd literally waiting years for a position between all the stages never mind the fact that most people are leaving jobs to enter the CS. The employee churn seems tiny too.

Grey AP

Yes, this is an ongoing trend. While there may be some recovery, large parts of the private sector are still shedding middle management (presumably because the private sector is neither very efficient nor very responsive to economic triggers, which is partly why we get boom and bust). Accordingly, as was noted above, a lot of very experienced people are joining the CS through whatever is available and then doing open comps as they come up. I know of a couple of cases where senior people, finding themselves out in the cold but mortgage free courtesy of a good redundancy, joined up - as a CO in one case and an EO in the other. The EO is now an AO and doing the latest AP competition and the CO got got the AP within a year and is now appointed.

I don't see this as a bad thing - all organisations need new blood and different life experiences coming in and people like these have vast experience ready to go - and clearly the AP conditions are attractive enough to do that. However, PO pay isn't, at least not directly (I'm sure both of our new intake are planning for the next open PO, from the inside), so DPER should accept this and get on with sanctioning PO posts from this panel.

planstan

The_Conductor wrote: »

There are some remarkably qualified candidates going for CO and EO these days- according to PAS its more common than not for them to hold third level qualifications, often professional qualifications- and in many cases, significant private sector experience. This shows through in the fact that at least one of the candidates on the PO panel- was a serving CO- and the top scoring internal candidate on the recent internal AP panel in two Departments were serving COs. A lot of people entered these competitions- as a stopgap measure until something better came along- which would never have happened in the past. Its the new norm.

I can only speak anecdotally but out of six new CO/EO in my department, four are actively applying for jobs elsewhere.

The days of a job for life being hugely attractive are gone in the main, for those under 35 anyway. The working world has changed massively in the past 15 years and many people like to change, upskill, take on new challenges beyond waiting years on a panel in the civil service.

Yes those four people left private sector jobs for the civil service but the jobs they left weren't jobs for life either, one year contracts etc.

Two TCOs offered longer contracts also declined and left.

planstan

doc11 wrote: »

In relation to the quality of candidates going for roles would be mixed in my view, of the 30000 that applied only half could pass a basic verbal/numeric test. When about 40% of the population have degrees, it isn't really that hard to believe that the top thousand out of 30000 would be very well qualified.

I've been told that the numbers applying and the numbers who actually follow up and do the first round of tests are very different.
From there the numbers who bother to turn up for the second round and interviews falls again. So the 30,000 number isn't quite accurate.

bubbatj

Just heard that up to late 60s / 70 have gone into clearance stage.

Grey AP

bubbatj wrote: »

Just heard that up to late 60s / 70 have gone into clearance stage.

That's a bit of a pick-up in pace. Perhaps the retirement cliff got a battering in the Christmas storms.

FlyingTiger

I know someone in the mid 70s now going through clearance and an actual offer has gone up as far as late 60s/early 70s. The pace has definitely picked up.

Uriel.

FlyingTiger wrote: »

I know someone in the mid 70s now going through clearance and an actual offer has gone up as far as late 60s/early 70s. The pace has definitely picked up.

Both that offer and the mid 70s clearance must surely be for non Dublin posts?

FlyingTiger

No definitely Dublin

FlyingTiger

To clarify - the offers to the late 60s/early 70s have been Dublin offers. Those going through clearance at the moment may well receive offers from outside Dublin but, given the pick up in the pace, they will likely get Dublin offers too.

Uriel.

FlyingTiger wrote: »

To clarify - the offers to the late 60s/early 70s have been Dublin offers. Those going through clearance at the moment may well receive offers from outside Dublin but, given the pick up in the pace, they will likely get Dublin offers too.

Cheers for that bit of an increase in pace alright. GreyAP, you might be in with a shout yet