Marriage Equality Referendum

J_E

xrp wrote: »

Mary
Virgin blue
Crock of gold rainbow
Stupid regal look on her face

I think it's a bit of a daft image but you would seriously decide gay marriage is not ok because someone posted an idealistic photo somewhere?

Aard

Tbh I find some of the Vote Yes images a bit alienating. Not just the images in fact, but a lot of the rhetoric is sickly sweet and so middle class left wing. There's a lot of choir preaching going on by the looks of things, which gives the impression that there is more support than there actually is. I worry then that that is adding to the complacency of a lot of people who are would-be yes voters but who are taking for granted that the referendum will pass.

alaimacerc

Aard wrote: »

Tbh I find some of the Vote Yes images a bit alienating. Not just the images in fact, but a lot of the rhetoric is sickly sweet and so middle class left wing. There's a lot of choir preaching going on by the looks of things, which gives the impression that there is more support than there actually is. I worry then that that is adding to the complacency of a lot of people who are would-be yes voters but who are taking for granted that the referendum will pass.

I think it's a concern, but it comes with the territory. Who's bothered about doing much in the way of "preaching" at all at this point? And who's listening? This may change as people get more engaged, as the No campaign picks up, and the "how will it look if this fails?" effect kicks in to people in a apathetic middle. That last especially if there's seen to be a certain amount of international attention. (Are we quite sure Ireland has a "guilt" culture, and not a "shame" one?)

I think there's a huge awareness in the "yes" campaign of the dangers of complacency. I know I've lost track of the number of times I've heard it said. The harder question is of course what to do about it. On a canvas one can only ask someone so many times if they're actually going to vote before one has to take "yes" as an answer...

Daith

Aard wrote: »

Tbh I find some of the Vote Yes images a bit alienating. Not just the images in fact, but a lot of the rhetoric is sickly sweet and so middle class left wing. There's a lot of choir preaching going on by the looks of things, which gives the impression that there is more support than there actually is. I worry then that that is adding to the complacency of a lot of people who are would-be yes voters but who are taking for granted that the referendum will pass.

There's huge complacency. When everyone is telling you to Vote Yes, odds are it won't go that way.

Trying to get people to canvass highlights this for me.

Ash885

Aard wrote: »

Tbh I find some of the Vote Yes images a bit alienating. Not just the images in fact, but a lot of the rhetoric is sickly sweet and so middle class left wing. There's a lot of choir preaching going on by the looks of things, which gives the impression that there is more support than there actually is. I worry then that that is adding to the complacency of a lot of people who are would-be yes voters but who are taking for granted that the referendum will pass.

Hit the nail on the head for me. Alienating to the extreme. My facebook and twitter have been over run by negative campaigning of people enaging with obvious anon. trolls and it's getting a little tiresome if not sabotaging promting accounts which would not get recogniton otherwise. I'm all for engaging in debate but not quite sure what some people's version of that is when they retweet and favourite the opposing person's trolling whilst saying in caps locks PLZ VOTE YAAAAAAZ

Mind boggles.

Annasopra

Ash885 wrote: »

Hit the nail on the head for me. Alienating to the extreme. My facebook and twitter have been over run by negative campaigning of people enaging with obvious anon. trolls and it's getting a little tiresome if not sabotaging promting accounts which would not get recogniton otherwise. I'm all for engaging in debate but not quite sure what some people's version of that is when they retweet and favourite the opposing person's trolling whilst saying in caps locks PLZ VOTE YAAAAAAZ

Mind boggles.

Huh? I dont see the connection there to what Aard said

Ash885

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Huh? I dont see the connection there to what Aard said

On reading the whole thread I totally missed what you all were talking about and the majority of Aard's point >_O

I just focused on ailenated and "image". Opps. I thought it was about the other "YES" side images that are being spammed on social media of David Quinn photoshoped in bed with another man or with Breda having Yes Equality plastered around it and not Mary. They're all funny for a while, I did chuckle, but reading some of the comments on them from what I could presume as middle of the field people was a bit worrying!

Will know in future not to hastily quote without reading a few more lines, sorry for derailing! :pac:

wakka12

Aard wrote: »

Tbh I find some of the Vote Yes images a bit alienating. Not just the images in fact, but a lot of the rhetoric is sickly sweet and so middle class left wing. There's a lot of choir preaching going on by the looks of things, which gives the impression that there is more support than there actually is. I worry then that that is adding to the complacency of a lot of people who are would-be yes voters but who are taking for granted that the referendum will pass.

This is true. Being around a young demographic in middle class Dublin its almost hard to believe that anyone will vote no in the referendum. Some guy in my college got fraped the other day, his friend posted 'no to equality 2015.' and there was about 10 abusive and shocked replies left within as many minutes! made me laugh..

Also many students will be sitting exams around the time of the referendum, and Im sure a lot of others will be on their holidays abroad. I hope the timing doesn't affect the numbers of students voting. College students are such a crucial demographic in this referendum.

alaimacerc

wakka12 wrote: »

This is true. Being around a young demographic in middle class Dublin its almost hard to believe that anyone will vote no in the referendum.

I keep hearing from the YE peeps that it's 40+ men they're most concerned with as a voting block. Hence there's an alleged shove on to try to "normalise" voting yes for this group. Not quite surer how that's working out for them thus far...

I guess "wait twenty years for the 20+ students to be the new cohort of 40+'s" is always a fallback plan...

Some guy in my college got fraped the other day

Much as I hate to date myself, the word "frape" had passed me by to this point. Only wish it had passed me by for rather longer...

J_E

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Yes Equality badly needs more canvassers everywhere in the country. Please please please please everyone consider doing it. You can do 1 afternoon or 10 afternoons between now and May 22nd - it really is upto you But I think if lgbt people dont engage and canvass on the doorsteps its another hampering of the campaign.

To be honest I think door-to-door canvassing is a little intrusive and could not in good conscience do it. I don't like when politicians to it, when Jehovah's Witnesses do it, and by principle, equality voters. I think this is how I feel about a lot of the campaign in general. There is one story I heard where an award recipient was asked to step down so an Equality group could get it, 'for the cause' and such, I am not going to specify but more than 1 person confirmed it to me.. Think that's really awful.

alaimacerc

J_E wrote: »

To be honest I think door-to-door canvassing is a little intrusive and could not in good conscience do it. I don't like when politicians to it, when Jehovah's Witnesses do it, and by principle, equality voters.

Fair enough. It's still a legitimate thing to do, and frankly given the apparent apathy about the measure, a very necessary one.

There's no doubt it'll get some people's backs up, though. One person when asked how he was going to vote got very shirty, and said "are you telling me how I should vote?" Um, not rather the exact opposite, were they actually listening to what was said, as opposed to just looking for a pretext on which to be offended. Possibly even motivate them to vote against! ... but I suspect it's largely going to be a matter of confirming existing views, in such cases.

There is one story I heard where an award recipient was asked to step down so an Equality group could get it, 'for the cause' and such, I am not going to specify but more than 1 person confirmed it to me.. Think that's really awful.

Obviously I don't know what ward you're referring to, but I'm a bit puzzled by what you mean by "an Equality group". You mean the Yes Equality campaign, or one of its local branches? Or are we sliding entirely off the "referendum" point here?

Annasopra

J_E wrote: »

To be honest I think door-to-door canvassing is a little intrusive and could not in good conscience do it. I don't like when politicians to it, when Jehovah's Witnesses do it, and by principle, equality voters. I think this is how I feel about a lot of the campaign in general. There is one story I heard where an award recipient was asked to step down so an Equality group could get it, 'for the cause' and such, I am not going to specify but more than 1 person confirmed it to me.. Think that's really awful.

Thats your personal opinion. Fair enough. However most people don't share your view its intrusive and are friendly and pleasant on the doorsteps. The reality is it if isnt done in this referendum it will be lost.

Aard

According to this article http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0419/695192-garda-yes-campaign-photo/ it's possible to register to vote up until the 5th of May. Can anybody confirm this, as I had thought that some time in April was the cutoff date. Also, which form is the correct one up until the 5th? Still trying to round up first-time voters here to register

alaimacerc

Aard wrote: »

According to this article http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0419/695192-garda-yes-campaign-photo/ it's possible to register to vote up until the 5th of May. Can anybody confirm this, as I had thought that some time in April was the cutoff date. Also, which form is the correct one up until the 5th? Still trying to round up first-time voters here to register

Yes, that's the date I've consistently been told for the Supplemental Register. The April date (25th I think?) is for a postal or special vote, which are absurdly hard to get in any case.

Arm yourself with a sheaf of RFA2s! (And don't forget RFA3s for the change of address people.) Also, I've heard of several registration "events" where they'll have the forms on hand and a Gard available to countersign them. One-stop shopping. You might want to check your area for similar.

Aard

Ok great thanks! I've printed out some RFA2's so I'm good to go. I'm assuming you can simply turn up at a local Garda station with ID and they'll oblige?

alaimacerc

Aard wrote: »

I'm assuming you can simply turn up at a local Garda station with ID and they'll oblige?

That's my understanding!

If I manage to fix the massive blowout in my bike tyre I might pop into a Garda station em route to Aldi to double-check on that...

Annasopra

Aard wrote: »

Ok great thanks! I've printed out some RFA2's so I'm good to go. I'm assuming you can simply turn up at a local Garda station with ID and they'll oblige?

Yes.

Some gardai just stamp and dont even look for ID.

Rememver as well that Monday 4th is a bank holiday

LoganRice

My friend wants to register and vote yes how can he do this?
Also how can people get more involved in the Yes campaign?
Thanks y'all

Daith

LoganRice wrote: »

My friend wants to register and vote yes how can he do this?
Also how can people get more involved in the Yes campaign?
Thanks y'all

First head to

https://www.checktheregister.ie/

and check if he's registered. If not download form RFA2 to get on the Supplemental List
https://www.checktheregister.ie/appforms/RFA2_English_Form.pdf

Fill in and go to Gardai station with ID before May 5th (1st May really)

Then head to https://www.yesequality.ie/yes-equality-map/ and find your local area and join

Annasopra

Daith wrote: »

First head to

https://www.checktheregister.ie/

and check if he's registered. If not download form RFA2 to get on the Supplemental List
https://www.checktheregister.ie/appforms/RFA2_English_Form.pdf

Fill in and go to Gardai station with ID before May 5th (1st May really)

Then head to https://www.yesequality.ie/yes-equality-map/ and find your local area and join

Remember RFA2 form has to be stamped by gardai first. If you physically go into a County Council office on May 5th they have to accept the RFA2 form

feardeas

Did the change of address one before the Presidential election in 2011. Garda looked for id so bring it just in case.

Will be interesting to see the numbers that join the suplementary register before the deadline. Saw that there were 300 registered in Galway one day last week. Good going.

Leonard Hofstadter

I lolled so much listening to this RTÉ News clip http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0419/695192-garda-yes-campaign-photo/.

According to Paddy Monaghan, gays apparently "already have equality" because "they can get married - as long as it's to a member of the opposite sex" :eek: :eek: !

What an absolute moron. People like him are the reason I hope the Yes side wins, and wins well. Unfortunately I can't vote being non resident, but everyone in Ireland deserves to be treated equally, not the current situation where all people are equal, but some are more equal than others.

hotmail.com

captainspeed wrote: »

I lolled so much listening to this RTÉ News clip http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0419/695192-garda-yes-campaign-photo/.

According to Paddy Monaghan, gays apparently "already have equality" because "they can get married - as long as it's to a member of the opposite sex" :eek: :eek: !

What an absolute moron. People like him are the reason I hope the Yes side wins, and wins well. Unfortunately I can't vote being non resident, but everyone in Ireland deserves to be treated equally, not the current situation where all people are equal, but some are more equal than others.

Comments like this need to keep coming to ensure a Yes vote. Breda's not having sex comment is another gem.

hotmail.com

feardeas wrote: »

Did the change of address one before the Presidential election in 2011. Garda looked for id so bring it just in case.

Will be interesting to see the numbers that join the suplementary register before the deadline. Saw that there were 300 registered in Galway one day last week. Good going.

I genuinely hope all of them turn out on the day. Registering is one thing..please turn out on the day.

Aard

Spoke to some younger voters today. The level of belief that the referendum will pass with flying colours (paraphrasing there) is astonishing. When I highlighted my concern that the referendum won't pass they were equally astonished. I am increasingly of the belief that this referendum will pass or fail based solely on turnout of students and graduates.

marienbad

Aard wrote: »

Spoke to some younger voters today. The level of belief that the referendum will pass with flying colours (paraphrasing there) is astonishing. When I highlighted my concern that the referendum won't pass they were equally astonished. I am increasingly of the belief that this referendum will pass or fail based solely on turnout of students and graduates.

Not so, if only students and graduates vote yes is will be defeated easily .

Aard

That's....not what I said

marienbad

Aard wrote: »

That's....not what I said

Ok then, let me rephrase if all students and graduates vote yes and very little else then it will fail - satisfied ?

What will win this vote is the middle ground - not your natural base . The young and educated are the yes sides natural base, the old, the conservative religious are the no sides natural base.

It is the uncommitted middle ground who will decide , as they do in virtually every election.

Aard

I did the calculations. Because I am that boring.

I crossed the recent IT poll with Census data. If the two are to be believed, then there are 537,000 people between the ages of 18 and 30 who will vote 'yes'. Give or take a couple of thousand.

Then take all of the "don't know"s and "won't vote"s. Across all age groups. There are 411,000 people in the country aged 18+ who either do not know how they will vote or who will not vote.

It is imperative for young people to vote in order for the referendum to pass. They will make more of an impact than the don't knows and won't votes combined.

Anyway. This was a wasted half-hour. Over-and-out.

alaimacerc

I think there are two differentials here. There's the middle-aged cohort ("40+ males" in particular, we're told), who're well-used to voting, but may not trouble themselves to vote on this measure. Then there are the first-time (non!) voters, or 20+ people who're not yet significantly engaged in "conventional politics" at all.

If neither of these trouble to vote, and turnout if down in the miserably low 30s (cf Children's Rights and Nice I), this is going to go down in flames, and there will be much embarrassed coughing from the one, and looks of aghast horror from the other.