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2015 - how's your property search going?

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124

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    #92
    cherryghost
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 17,133 Mod ✭✭✭✭cherryghost


    I'll soon be on the market looking to buy but there's definitely been a reduction in new listings the last few weeks. I really hope prices cool a bit further though, some prices are horrendous for the locations.


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    #93
    MarkAnthony
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭MarkAnthony


    Kaizersoze81 wrote: »
    Well it's optimistic from the asking price. 395 is way overpriced for those houses, which were going for 230,000 in 2012.

    I think one thing that gets missed is that although we had a 'height of the boom' we had a 'low of the crash' as well. To say somewhere is overpriced because it's now more expensive than the lowest, of the low point doesn't really stack up.

    Still 400K for a rather unremarkable house, meh not my cup of tea.


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    #94
    Barely Hedged
    Closed Accounts Posts: 992 ✭✭✭Barely Hedged


    MarkAnthony wrote: »
    I'm not sure what the logic behind that statement is. Are we talking asking prices or selling prices?

    Wasn't there a recent discussion about EAs pulling ads that needed a price reduction and putting them back up. Callapso pull their info straight from DAFT and Myhome and there are loads more decreases than increases. That would suggest to me that there has been 'optimistic' asking prices.

    Yes of course there will be properties selling over asking and we'll be unlikely to see that data. The problem there is that suggests the property was priced keenly to attract interest in the first place, or for what ever reason, has significant interest. Without cross referencing it with the actual selling prices I think it's fair enough to take the fact that there are way more decreases than increases at face value.

    I make no comment on particular areas though.

    Asking prices.

    Its in an estate agents interest to publish price drops. It gets peoples attention. Price increases, not so much, unless they want to reduce the number of people ringing their office.

    Could you blame some estate agents at the moment. So many places are going for above the asking price that estate agents are not so sure what reaction theyll get back when they advertise a property. Also the seller might say, number 2 down the road went for 200k last month. Stick 10% onto your valuation there for my house.


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    #95
    Barely Hedged
    Closed Accounts Posts: 992 ✭✭✭Barely Hedged


    MarkAnthony wrote: »
    I think one thing that gets missed is that although we had a 'height of the boom' we had a 'low of the crash' as well. To say somewhere is overpriced because it's now more expensive than the lowest, of the low point doesn't really stack up.

    Still 400K for a rather unremarkable house, meh not my cup of tea.

    Completely agree. A point so many people overlook.

    That house for 400k is pretty terrible looking from the outside.


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    #96
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    MarkAnthony wrote: »
    I think one thing that gets missed is that although we had a 'height of the boom' we had a 'low of the crash' as well. To say somewhere is overpriced because it's now more expensive than the lowest, of the low point doesn't really stack up.

    Still 400K for a rather unremarkable house, meh not my cup of tea.
    We are starting to see something of a return to the way advertised property should be.

    In the boom days you put a property up at an asking price which was basically the minimum you expected to get for it. Between 2002 and 2007 practically every single property sold higher than asking, many of them double-figure percentages higher.

    However in any normal market (and this includes all markets, not just property), it's expected that the asking price the seller puts up is 10% higher than what they're willing to accept. This provides for wiggle room for everyone while cutting out the messers. If I'm only willing to accept €350k minimum, then I don't want people coming in and lowballing me at €320k. Instead I stick it up at €380k.

    But I think a lot of people are still stuck in the boom mindset - so when they see a property advertised at €450k, they shy away because they're only approved up to €410k. When in reality that €450k property is inside their top end of affordability.

    Speak to EAs and they will agree with you when you tell them the asking is optimistic. If you have a limit in what you can afford, don't be afraid to view properties that are 10% or even 15% outside of that.

    One little penny that dropped with me was square metreage -v- price. I've seen other people using it here, but it wasn't until I started using it that it made a lot more sense. It's a quick calculation that will tell you if a seller is off their rocker in comparison to what's around - or if a property is suspiciously cheap.

    Take that Ballinteer property above, as an example. That's priced at €4,193 per sq.m. Dublin 16 prices are typically around the €4k/sq.m. mark at the moment, so this one is priced a little high - 5% higher than it probably should. But, it's nice inside, it's a west facing rear garden and it's close to a lot of amenities.

    Contrast with: http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/22-broadford-crescent-ballinteer-dublin-16/3044076
    Same area, south facing garden, same 3 beds. Priced at ~€3,969/sq.m.. So what's the difference? Well, it's not as nice inside and looks like it needs some work.

    And then you get this:
    http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/27-heather-drive-rathfarnham-dublin-16/3065391
    On first glance, hey, that's nice property. Decent aspect, walk in condition, nice estate. That's worth the extra €20k asking price, right? Well the house is only 79sq.m, putting the price at a whopping €5,253/sq.m.
    So while on paper it's "only" €20k more than the others, it is actually asking 25% more in real terms. In other words, way overpriced. A realistic price for this property is €320k +/- 10%.


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    #97
    The Spider
    Registered Users Posts: 1,273 ✭✭✭The Spider


    Standards & Poor see a 9% increase in prices this year.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/s-p-ireland-to-see-strongest-rise-in-house-prices-in-europe-1.2092501


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    #98
    jay0109
    Registered Users Posts: 2,669 ✭✭✭jay0109


    Barely Hedged wrote: »
    Any examples?

    http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/19-the-close-cypress-downs-templeogue-dublin-6w/3076235
    575k for 1,184 sq ft
    €486 per sq ft


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    #99
    Theboinkmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 3,967 ✭✭✭Theboinkmaster


    seamus wrote: »
    And then you get this:
    http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/27-heather-drive-rathfarnham-dublin-16/3065391
    On first glance, hey, that's nice property. Decent aspect, walk in condition, nice estate. That's worth the extra €20k asking price, right? Well the house is only 79sq.m, putting the price at a whopping €5,253/sq.m.
    So while on paper it's "only" €20k more than the others, it is actually asking 25% more in real terms. In other words, way overpriced. A realistic price for this property is €320k +/- 10%.

    They've stuck that down as Rathfarnham when it is really Ballinteer, so upped the price accordingly. I agree though - terribly overpriced.


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    #100
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    farrerg wrote: »
    I spoke to an EA friend of mine yest, said he his seeing a rush of people trying to buy before the new LTI rules kick in or their approval in principle runs out. Thinks there'll be a mini bubble in some areas for next 6 months until these wash through the system.

    Have you ever met an EA who thought the market would go down in the near future?


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    #101
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    Kaizersoze81 wrote: »
    http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/67-broadford-close-ballinteer-dublin-16/3054135


    This 3 bed semi in Ballinteer is a good example. I viewed it. Current offer is 402,500.

    Apparently this very house was asking €380k in 2005.

    Thank goodness, we're not in a bubble though.


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    #102
    Barely Hedged
    Closed Accounts Posts: 992 ✭✭✭Barely Hedged


    jay0109 wrote: »
    http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/19-the-close-cypress-downs-templeogue-dublin-6w/3076235
    575k for 1,184 sq ft
    €486 per sq ft

    Pretty pricey. Would be interesting to see how much it sells for


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    #103
    Barely Hedged
    Closed Accounts Posts: 992 ✭✭✭Barely Hedged


    seamus wrote: »
    One little penny that dropped with me was square metreage -v- price. I've seen other people using it here, but it wasn't until I started using it that it made a lot more sense. It's a quick calculation that will tell you if a seller is off their rocker in comparison to what's around - or if a property is suspiciously cheap.

    Take that Ballinteer property above, as an example. That's priced at €4,193 per sq.m. Dublin 16 prices are typically around the €4k/sq.m. mark at the moment, so this one is priced a little high - 5% higher than it probably should. But, it's nice inside, it's a west facing rear garden and it's close to a lot of amenities.

    Contrast with: http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/22-broadford-crescent-ballinteer-dublin-16/3044076
    Same area, south facing garden, same 3 beds. Priced at ~€3,969/sq.m.. So what's the difference? Well, it's not as nice inside and looks like it needs some work.

    And then you get this:
    http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/27-heather-drive-rathfarnham-dublin-16/3065391
    On first glance, hey, that's nice property. Decent aspect, walk in condition, nice estate. That's worth the extra €20k asking price, right? Well the house is only 79sq.m, putting the price at a whopping €5,253/sq.m.
    So while on paper it's "only" €20k more than the others, it is actually asking 25% more in real terms. In other words, way overpriced. A realistic price for this property is €320k +/- 10%.

    Essential in commercial property but in residential its less effective because people are idiots or they want to pay a premium for location.

    Its a very good rule of thumb though and a good gauge


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    #104
    crisco10
    Registered Users Posts: 6,177 ✭✭✭crisco10


    gaius c wrote: »
    Apparently this very house was asking €380k in 2005.

    Thank goodness, we're not in a bubble though.

    Being honest, if it was €380 in 2005 it was under priced by 2005 standards. According to the Property Price Register, houses were selling for that price in 2010 when house prices were pretty depressed. Most of the houses in Broadford are similar so reference prices are fairly solid.

    EDIT: Although, just noticed they dip dramatically in 2011. funny looking!


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    #105
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    seamus wrote: »
    Take that Ballinteer property above, as an example. That's priced at €4,193 per sq.m. Dublin 16 prices are typically around the €4k/sq.m. mark at the moment, so this one is priced a little high - 5% higher than it probably should.

    That's €390 per sq ft and as far as I'm concerned, that's an off the rocker valuation for an ugly house on the far outskirts of a city with poor-to-fair public transport links.


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    #106
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    The Spider wrote: »
    Standards & Poor see a 9% increase in prices this year.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/s-p-ireland-to-see-strongest-rise-in-house-prices-in-europe-1.2092501

    This Standard & Poor?


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    #107
    Kaizersoze81
    Registered Users Posts: 1,238 ✭✭✭Kaizersoze81


    gaius c wrote: »
    That's €390 per sq ft and as far as I'm concerned, that's an off the rocker valuation for an ugly house on the far outskirts of a city with poor-to-fair public transport links.

    And that's only the asking price. The current offer is 405,000 so that probably pushes it to near €400 per sq ft.


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    #108
    PixieOD
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭PixieOD


    What would you consider a reasonable price per sq ft?


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    #109
    jay0109
    Registered Users Posts: 2,669 ✭✭✭jay0109


    PixieOD wrote: »
    What would you consider a reasonable price per sq ft?

    €300 per sq ft:D


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    #110
    PixieOD
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭PixieOD


    Was thinking 350 myself


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    #111
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    jay0109 wrote: »
    €300 per sq ft:D

    Bit more reasonable for houses on the far outskirts of a city (and not particularly "catchy" parts of D16) I think.


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    #112
    MarkAnthony
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭MarkAnthony


    PixieOD wrote: »
    Was thinking 350 myself

    three fiddy? :pac:


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    #113
    jay0109
    Registered Users Posts: 2,669 ✭✭✭jay0109


    gaius c wrote: »
    Bit more reasonable for houses on the far outskirts of a city (and not particularly "catchy" parts of D16) I think.

    300 per sq ft for an avg 1,300 sq ft family home = 390k.
    D16 or wherever, 390k is a big chunk of money with average wages anything from 33k to 45k depending on who you listen to/location etc.

    so to me, 300 per sq ft is the max that the long term avg should be hitting


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    #114
    PixieOD
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭PixieOD


    what is the size of the average family home, I would have thought it was around a 1000 sq ft.


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    #115
    jay0109
    Registered Users Posts: 2,669 ✭✭✭jay0109


    PixieOD wrote: »
    what is the size of the average family home, I would have thought it was around a 1000 sq ft.

    I live in an 850 sq ft townhouse and I can tell you it's hard going with a few kids.
    I'm looking for 1,500 sq ft at the moment, but from what I've read the average is much lower than that.

    Hence I picked 1,300 for the example above


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    #116
    PixieOD
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭PixieOD


    That's a lot bigger than the house I grew up in, but I guess we come with a lot more clutter these days eh


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    #117
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    jay0109 wrote: »
    300 per sq ft for an avg 1,300 sq ft family home = 390k.
    D16 or wherever, 390k is a big chunk of money with average wages anything from 33k to 45k depending on who you listen to/location etc.

    so to me, 300 per sq ft is the max that the long term avg should be hitting

    Except that the property that got this sq ft conversation going is 1,014 sq ft.

    Looking around, it's quite difficult to get houses over 1000 sq ft for reasonable value. You'd swear we were ant people living in Hong Kong or something.


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    #118
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    gaius c wrote: »
    That's €390 per sq ft and as far as I'm concerned, that's an off the rocker valuation for an ugly house on the far outskirts of a city with poor-to-fair public transport links.
    As the phrase goes though, a house is worth whatever people are willing to pay for it. So even if you think it should be priced barely above €300k the market rate is closer to €400. Or at least it was 6 weeks ago.

    Who knows where we are now? :D


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    #119
    farrerg
    Registered Users Posts: 133 ✭✭farrerg


    gaius c wrote: »
    Have you ever met an EA who thought the market would go down in the near future?

    Very true!

    Although he's predicting price drops in H2 and very slow sales. Plus a development they were hoping to get may be pushed back as the developer is concerned he won't get the price per unit he wants for another few years


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    #120
    TheDriver
    Registered Users Posts: 12,402 ✭✭✭✭TheDriver


    I am noticing houses that were on the market for 3-4 years appearing back on the market at a good hike which is somewhat laughable, they didn't sell at the reasonable price so now expectations are even higher.......


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    #121
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    TheDriver wrote: »
    I am noticing houses that were on the market for 3-4 years appearing back on the market at a good hike which is somewhat laughable, they didn't sell at the reasonable price so now expectations are even higher.......

    It's simple. They want to pass their NE onto another unfortunate sap.


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