Vegan Ireland

cormie

I just saw this article: http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/books/book-news/stop-feeding-your-cancer-dublin-doctor-shows-patients-how-to-beat-cancer-30804029.html

I've seen many similar claims around the net, but never from an Irish GP. Is the World and Ireland waking up to the possibility that consuming animal products may not be a wise choice or is this just another "quack" pushing an agenda?

Personally, it makes sense to me, not only for health but for the environment and obviously ethically too. I see far more positives than negatives of being vegan and try follow it as much as my will power will allow, that is until something delicious is put in front of me :pac:

I've been following a more plant based diet the last 3/4 years and I'm not sure is it a case of just discovering what's always been available, or is it actually becoming more of a widespread demand and thus more options available in the last few years?

So ignoring all the in your face activism, the judgemental and high horse disapproval of anything animal, all the unhealthy vegetarians and vegans who think eating processed tofu and houmous is an adequate diet, and all the other associated negative stereotypes, would you consider a more plant, nut, seed and legume based diet given so many are thriving on just that, with the possibility of improving your health and making a more positive impact on the World as a whole?

Sheeps

cormie wrote: »

I just saw this article: http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/books/book-news/stop-feeding-your-cancer-dublin-doctor-shows-patients-how-to-beat-cancer-30804029.html

I've seen many similar claims around the net, but never from an Irish GP. Is the World and Ireland waking up to the possibility that consuming animal products may not be a wise choice or is this just another "quack" pushing an agenda?

Personally, it makes sense to me, not only for health but for the environment and obviously ethically too. I see far more positives than negatives of being vegan and try follow it as much as my will power will allow, that is until something delicious is put in front of me :pac:

I've been following a more plant based diet the last 3/4 years and I'm not sure is it a case of just discovering what's always been available, or is it actually becoming more of a widespread demand and thus more options available in the last few years?

So ignoring all the in your face activism, the judgemental and high horse disapproval of anything animal, all the unhealthy vegetarians and vegans who think eating processed tofu and houmous is an adequate diet, and all the other associated negative stereotypes, would you consider a more plant, nut, seed and legume based diet given so many are thriving on just that, with the possibility of improving your health and making a more positive impact on the World as a whole?

If a vegan joins cross fit, which do they start yapping on about first?

Warper

Vegans are judgmental controlling knob heads

cormie

I'm guessing neither of you actually read the article or post and just posted your replies as soon as you saw the word vegan?

Sam Kade

The doc should change his own diet, he's an awful colour. Paper never refuses ink :rolleyes:

wonderfulname

One gp, 6 cancer survivors in 10 years... bet my gp has seen more than that!

There are arguments for cutting animal products from your diet, or cutting down on them, this is not one of them. If he had something valid, which others have had regarding meat consumption and cancer if you want to continue looking at that, he would get it published by a respected journal for the benefit of his profession, not as a self help book.

Tilly

We were only talking about him today in work. Apparently he told one of the girls in work mother that she was fine even tho she had gone back with the same complaint about a lump 3 times. Her mother had cancer and this quack had told her it was nothing to worry about. Not one test did he order. Thank god she got a second opinion.

Sheep Lover

Sheeps wrote: »

If a vegan joins cross fit, which do they start yapping on about first?

Their iPhone, usually.

mikom

cormie wrote: »

I just saw this article: http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/books/book-news/stop-feeding-your-cancer-dublin-doctor-shows-patients-how-to-beat-cancer-30804029.html

I've seen many similar claims around the net, but never from an Irish GP. Is the World and Ireland waking up to the possibility that consuming animal products may not be a wise choice or is this just another "quack" pushing an agenda?

Personally, it makes sense to me, not only for health but for the environment and obviously ethically too. I see far more positives than negatives of being vegan and try follow it as much as my will power will allow, that is until something delicious is put in front of me :pac:

I've been following a more plant based diet the last 3/4 years and I'm not sure is it a case of just discovering what's always been available, or is it actually becoming more of a widespread demand and thus more options available in the last few years?

So ignoring all the in your face activism, the judgemental and high horse disapproval of anything animal, all the unhealthy vegetarians and vegans who think eating processed tofu and houmous is an adequate diet, and all the other associated negative stereotypes, would you consider a more plant, nut, seed and legume based diet given so many are thriving on just that, with the possibility of improving your health and making a more positive impact on the World as a whole?

RASHERS.

Yurt2

Vegans are cultists and complete dullards to be around. Constantly talking about their diet and pushing their pseudo science on 'carnivores'.

AnonoBoy

Anyone who says that you should bypass traditional cancer treatments and follow their 'proven' cure exclusively (whether that be a vegan diet, prayer or some other quackery) should be viewed with huge amounts of scepticism.

Sure diet plays a large part but relying solely on salad to get rid of tumours in your body?

F*ck right off.

Tilly

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Anyone who says that you should bypass traditional cancer treatments and follow their 'proven' cure exclusively (whether that be a vegan diet, prayer or some other quackery) should be viewed with huge amounts of scepticism.

Sure diet plays a large part but relying solely on salad to get rid of tumours in your body?

F*ck right off.

you mean to tell me you don't believe in the powers of iceberg lettuce????

shruikan2553

If you have the cure for cancer and aren't getting published in a real medical thing then it's time to doubt you have a cure.

AnonoBoy

Tilly wrote: »

you mean to tell me you don't believe in the powers of iceberg lettuce????

I believe it can top off a bacon sandwich nicely, yes.

Arsemageddon

Another fine piece of journalism there from the Indo. Sad thing is some poor, sod is actually going to read this nonsense and in their desperation think it might save them.

What the good doctor has are a collection of anecdotes, if he could back up what he says with extensive peer reviewed scientific research then I could take him seriously. For the moment I think he's just a spoofer with a bit of a god complex talking a load of dangerous waffley boll0x.

jamezy

I know many non militant vegan and vegetarians. The really opened my eyes to how good Veggie/Vegan options can be. As a result i have cut down on the amount of meat i eat. The average western diet has too much meat anyway. Also vegan food can be really creative and is like more common foods, it can be really good as well as really ****e.

That been said I love meat and would not cut it out completely. I know where it comes from and it does not weigh on my conscience.


Really restrictive diets are generally not a good idea unless they are short term health/weight goals (excluding alergies)

Kovu

So if a strict vegan diet can cure cancer.......then vegans must also contain this power.


Save the veggies! Eat a vegan! :pac:

Duggy747

Article was written like he was Jesus, couldn't be any further up his hole if it tried.

Spotted the article was written by the same chap who gave the book a glowing review and throws a few snide remarks at conventional cancer treatments (chemo, surgery, etc.)

They stick with their surgery and radiotherapy and chemotherapy even though in many cases it either does not work or offers only limited time. They regard a dietary solution as simplistic or as flaky alternative medicine. What would a mere GP know? After all, they are the experts.

certifiedcrepe

How do you know if someone is vegan?

They'll tell you.

Badum-tish..

AdFundum

certifiedcrepe wrote: »

How do you know if someone is vegan?

They'll tell you.

Badum-tish..

That's actually true! I tell everyone I'm vegan - it just makes me feel so deliciously smug that I reckon I'll have to take up running also when the smugness high starts to wear thin.

I am also a scientist. The "plural of anecdote is not data" and 6 patients is an anecdote. In this case, establishing links requires a population study and 6 is not a population sample although molecular studies can get away with n=3 and a replicate (to be published). In any event, I don't put much stock into such things. I would hazard that it is impossible to "live scientifically" given that even in peer reviewed journals you will find evidence suggesting almost all possible outcomes given an intervention. So, I settle for living smugly - and it feels so, so good!

TheBeardedLady

Grrrr. Dangerous stuff. Basing science on case studies (even if they were cured, who's to say this diet was the cause?). Any self-respecting professional pushing stuff like this will allow their theory to be tested properly and peer reviewed. If it was any good, it wouldn't be published in a bloody self-help book.


The worst part of this is that people with cancer will read that article and opt for it. Completely irresponsible giving this man column inches.


This has fook all to do with your average vegan as I doubt most vegans would claim their diet alone cures cancer. This is the bolloxology of a man trying to get rich quick off the vulnerability of others. People of his ilk should be arrested.

iDave

You don't win friends with salad (or cure cancer)

The_Valeyard

cormie wrote: »

I'm guessing neither of you actually read the article or post and just posted your replies as soon as you saw the word vegan?

steak.

STEAK

STEAKKKKKK NOM NOM NOM NOM

-=al=-

jamezy wrote: »

I know many non militant vegan and vegetarians. The really opened my eyes to how good Veggie/Vegan options can be. As a result i have cut down on the amount of meat i eat. The average western diet has too much meat anyway. Also vegan food can be really creative and is like more common foods, it can be really good as well as really ****e.

That been said I love meat and would not cut it out completely. I know where it comes from and it does not weigh on my conscience.


Really restrictive diets are generally not a good idea unless they are short term health/weight goals (excluding alergies)

I'm quite similar to this myself and find that it's not so bad to cut down on the meat. I was never a big meat eater but I probably eat more fish now and mostly chicken otherwise + very little red meat... I have even been weened onto veggie sausages lately but I'd still have the odd rasher now and again! I'd miss meat completely if I gave it up but cutting down isn't so bad.

I've cut out a lot of stuff such as fast food, processed food, sugary snacks and drinks etc and cut down on the dairy while upping the fruit an veg intake along with seeds, berries and nuts. Nothing too fancy just some simple adjustments along with opting for the healthier alternative and not just eating something just for the sake of eating it.

I'm probably on my way to being one of those vegan douches :pac:


As for the article, I do have a friend of the family who went through and got over cancer treatment and is totally all about the vegan diet. It's a pretty interesting subject and it doesn't hurt to eat a bit better anyway

Grayson

Arsemageddon wrote: »

Another fine piece of journalism there from the Indo. Sad thing is some poor, sod is actually going to read this nonsense and in their desperation think it might save them.

What the good doctor has are a collection of anecdotes, if he could back up what he says with extensive peer reviewed scientific research then I could take him seriously. For the moment I think he's just a spoofer with a bit of a god complex talking a load of dangerous waffley boll0x.

It's really bad reporting but I think the last thing we'd accuse the Indo of is reporting.

There's a lot to be said for moving to a veggie diet or at least cutting down on meat. meat is incredibly carbon intensive to raise/grow. from an environmental stand point everyone could cut down on eating meat a bit and it would make a huge difference to the environment.

From a health point of view, once again people eat too much meat. It's be healthier to cut back or even give it up (only if you can manage to balance it though. I'm so crappy at dietary management that when I don't eat meat I'm eating a meat substitute).

I think eating an excessive amount of red meat has even been linked to cancer.

However saying a cures cancer? that's a load of bollocks.

Teyla Emmagan

If I get cancer I will try it. But there will be no preventary method veganism. Life is too short. I already find the woman in work with her weirdly skinny vegetarian 3 year old depressing enough.

Shenshen

I have been vegetarian for around 7 years now (my husband "converted" me ), but I have to say I find the article highly dubious.

If there is a well-known link between animal protein and cancer as claimed in the article, then by all means that need to be explored and studied. Though I can see it'll be difficult getting the funding for that, there's no interest group out there that would make money out of a potential positive result, and tons of interest groups that might end up losing out big time.

But a few anecdotal "miracles"? No, thanks. That's the same type of proof homeopaths have been pushing forward for decades, and doesn't prove anything at all.

kylith

While I accept that there are great benefits to be had by decreasing meat intake and consuming more fruit and veg I am highly dubious about a vegan diet. I think that any diet that necessitates taking supplements and which is completely impossible to follow eating only locally produced food is not a sustainable one.

BeerWolf

Western vegan diet? Feck off with that... but come an Indian vegetarian dish? Then sure! :pac:

Sam Kade

How will staying away from the demon protein cure all the other causes of cancer?

cormie

cormie wrote: »

I see far more positives than negatives

I'd struggle to come up with one positive and the negatives are vast. For one not eating meat or other dairy, that's a pretty massive negative for a meat and dairy lover like me that never has a meal without one or both. Then there is the damage it would do to agriculture if people turned vegan in large numbers, it would destroy the industry resulting in job losses in the industry and all related industries. Basically it would ruin the country and that only a small number of the vast array of negatives.

Meat FTW!!!