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IS IT DISCRIMINATION???

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13

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    #62
    Gannicus
    Registered Users Posts: 1,736 ✭✭✭Gannicus


    Arbiter of Good Taste wrote: »
    OP can you clarify exactly your point please? Do you think people should be forced to live with people they don't want to live with, or should they only be forced to waste time meeting and interviewing people that they have no intention of living with?

    My point is why when everywhere else in Irish society is it wrong to be exclusionary based on gender but when its renting a room to someone its socially acceptable.

    I've met some great people (male and female) who are really nice and friendly and I've met some awful troglodytes (both male and female) there's good and bad in each so to specify one is not welcome is just as wrong when it comes to a rental situation.


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    #63
    smcgiff
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,943 ✭✭✭smcgiff


    Gannicus wrote: »
    My point is why when everywhere else in Irish society is it wrong to be exclusionary based on gender but when its renting a room to someone its socially acceptable.

    I've met some great people (male and female) who are really nice and friendly and I've met some awful troglodytes (both male and female) there's good and bad in each so to specify one is not welcome is just as wrong when it comes to a rental situation.

    Seriously, how can you not get this? Just because you are comfortable with strangers of either sex, not everybody is. Some people are very wary of men that are unknown to them.

    It seems a reasonable precaution to me, and in no way should be taken personally.


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    #64
    Gannicus
    Registered Users Posts: 1,736 ✭✭✭Gannicus


    smcgiff wrote: »
    Seriously, how can you not get this? Just because you are comfortable with strangers of either sex, not everybody is. Some people are very wary of men that are unknown to them.

    It seems a reasonable precaution to me, and in no way should be taken personally.

    I get that much but what I don't get is If I was renting a room out and wrote "No blacks allowed" I'd find myself either up in front of a judge for racial discrimination or on the front of the papers for it.


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    #65
    o1s1n
    Registered Users Posts: 34,631 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    Gannicus wrote: »
    I get that much but what I don't get is If I was renting a room out and wrote "No blacks allowed" I'd find myself either up in front of a judge for racial discrimination or on the front of the papers for it.

    Because there are socially acceptable reasons in wanting to live with your own gender.

    Are there any socially acceptable reasons to not want to live with a black person?

    Comparing women and men is not the same as comparing blacks to whites.


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    #66
    smcgiff
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,943 ✭✭✭smcgiff


    Gannicus wrote: »
    I get that much but what I don't get is If I was renting a room out and wrote "No blacks allowed" I'd find myself either up in front of a judge for racial discrimination or on the front of the papers for it.

    So, you're okay with this discrimination, you're just wondering how come you cant openly discriminate against, say, skin colour?

    I'm not sure if it's legal or not. I'd say it wouldn't be, but the media may refuse to take your ad. Why? well... for historical reasons, such as in the not too distant past we enslaved and mistreated people based on their colour.

    Same with homosexuals, we had it as an illegal act up to very recently, so sensitivity is in order.

    As such, I'd imagine the mainstream media would be slow to allow it to appear in their paper.


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    #67
    Gannicus
    Registered Users Posts: 1,736 ✭✭✭Gannicus


    o1s1n wrote: »
    Because there are socially acceptable reasons in wanting to live with your own gender.

    Are there any socially acceptable reasons to not want to live with a black person?

    Comparing women and men is not the same as comparing blacks to whites.

    Well maybe some people feel safer living with just white people or don't want to socialise with black people. similar reasons for a gender divide but still not socially acceptable.
    smcgiff wrote: »
    So, you're okay with this discrimination, you're just wondering how come you cant openly discriminate against, say, skin colour?

    I'm not sure if it's legal or not. I'd say it wouldn't be, but the media may refuse to take your ad. Why? well... for historical reasons, such as in the not too distant past we enslaved and mistreated people based on their colour.

    Same with homosexuals, we had it as an illegal act up to very recently, so sensitivity is in order.

    As such, I'd imagine the mainstream media would be slow to allow it to appear in their paper.


    I'm not okay with discrimination at all. I am curious as to why its is discrimination in relation to one section is okay but to others its not.


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    #68
    o1s1n
    Registered Users Posts: 34,631 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    Gannicus wrote: »
    Well maybe some people feel safer living with just white people or don't want to socialise with black people. similar reasons for a gender divide but still not socially acceptable.

    It's not just from a safety point of view though, there are practicalities too.

    Maybe some women aren't comfortable hanging out their underwear on a clothes horse sharing with a male tenant?

    Maybe some men don't want to have women's toiletries all over their bathroom?

    There can be big living condition variances such as this between genders.

    You can't apply the same logic with skin colour. Maybe you can with country of origin, but once you start talking about racial profiles which cover billions of people (ie 'black people') then any form of justification goes out the window and you just sound like a racist.


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    #69
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,027 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    _Brian wrote: »
    Seriously, they're renting a room in their house, they have every right to pick and choose based on whatever grounds they feel suitable.

    they don't.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #70
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,027 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Gannicus wrote: »
    Why? If you were refused for sexual orientation, ethnicity/nationality its classed as discrimination.


    If the ad said "whites only" there would be mayhem (rightly so).
    i agree.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #71
    o1s1n
    Registered Users Posts: 34,631 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    end of the road wrote: »
    they don't.

    How so?

    So if I want to live in your house you can't stop me? Great, I'll pack my bags now.


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    #72
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users Posts: 23,695 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    end of the road wrote: »
    they don't.


    They do, and there are numerous ways in which an advertisement can be worded so that it's not directly discrimatory, but the conclusion wouldn't take a genius either.


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    #73
    smcgiff
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,943 ✭✭✭smcgiff


    o1s1n wrote: »
    How so?

    So if I want to live in your house you can't stop me? Great, I'll pack my bags now.

    I'm waiting for the next thread to be along the lines of...

    "I saw this ad. Room available - must pay rent of €600 per month.

    What outrage is this - this is discriminating against those that don't want to pay for their accommodation. What's Joe Duffy's phone number?"


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    #74
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,718 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    o1s1n wrote: »
    How so?

    So if I want to live in your house you can't stop me? Great, I'll pack my bags now.

    Owner occupier situation is a totally different scenario to a group of strangers sharing a common space.


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    #75
    Triceratops Ballet
    Registered Users Posts: 4,894 ✭✭✭Triceratops Ballet


    imo this is the op looking to find offence where none exists. Plenty of house share ads out there say professionals only, or no couples, is this discrimination too? no its not, none of it is!


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    #76
    o1s1n
    Registered Users Posts: 34,631 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    smcgiff wrote: »
    I'm waiting for the next thread to be along the lines of...

    "I saw this ad. Room available - must pay rent of €600 per month.

    What outrage is this - this is discriminating against those that don't want to pay for their accommodation. What's Joe Duffy's phone number?"

    People pick who they want to live with shocker! :pac:
    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Owner occupier situation is a totally different scenario to a group of strangers sharing a common space.

    Why can't people sharing a space decide who they live with?

    Would a group of asthmatic non smokers not be able to reject a 20 major a day smoker, no?


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    #77
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,946 ✭✭✭Daith


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Owner occupier situation is a totally different scenario to a group of strangers sharing a common space.

    Why are they a group of strangers? I know people who have shared with each other in various accommodation since college. Or just friends.

    I'd never want to view my living arrangements as a group of strangers who share a kitchen and bathroom.


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    #78
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    Kim Kardashi Un wrote: »
    That way they get tipsy one night and do feminism on each other and blame it on the drink the next day.

    ???


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    #79
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,718 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    Daith wrote: »
    Why are they a group of strangers? I know people who have shared with each other in various accommodation since college. Or just friends.

    I'd never want to view my living arrangements as a group of strangers who share a kitchen and bathroom.
    I couldn't agree more with you, I was lucky throughout my house sharing experiences to always have a couple of friends in the house as well which really helped the atmosphere.

    In reality though, it's totally different for most people, and it often is as cold as sharing a kitchen and a bathroom with little or no interaction outside of general housekeeping, bills etc.


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    #80
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,718 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    o1s1n wrote: »

    Why can't people sharing a space decide who they live with?

    Would a group of asthmatic non smokers not be able to reject a 20 major a day smoker, no?

    Ultimately, yes of course they can.


    But a fair crack of the whip should be given to all when wording an add*



    *Except smokers of course, nobody wants to be breathing in other people's unwanted toxins.


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    #81
    Gannicus
    Registered Users Posts: 1,736 ✭✭✭Gannicus


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    In reality though, it's totally different for most people, and it often is as cold as sharing a kitchen and a bathroom with little or no interaction outside of general housekeeping, bills etc.

    A friend of mine was in a situation like that before. everybody just stayed in their respective rooms, the kitchen and the bathroom were the only communal area used. hell he told me how nobody wanted to use the living room in case some (any) noise irked someone else.


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    #82
    Riskymove
    Registered Users Posts: 10,887 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    end of the road wrote: »
    they don't.

    they do

    this isn't a service industry or an employment law situation, etc.


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    #83
    Riskymove
    Registered Users Posts: 10,887 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    padd b1975 wrote: »


    But a fair crack of the whip should be given to all when wording an add*

    I don't get that view

    isn't everyone better off being honest about it and not wasting time


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    #84
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,027 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    dottie_lottie wrote: »
    imo this is the op looking to find offence where none exists. Plenty of house share ads out there say professionals only, or no couples, is this discrimination too? no its not, none of it is!
    it is and it should be banned. in this current climate people renting should be glad of the money, its not the celtic tiger any more

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #85
    Tordelback
    Registered Users Posts: 677 ✭✭✭Tordelback


    Such nonsense. How does the OP feel about the fact that there are separate public toilets for men and women, separate changing rooms and so on? Is that discrimination? And yet there aren't separate toilets for non-whites (as there were right into the '60s in the US), or or non-heteros?

    The latter are obviously skin-crawlingly discriminatory, the former something society expects and even insists on. And so it is with gender preferences in shared accommodation. It's a cultural and societal norm which essentially no-one objects to, hence it persists. Those other discriminatory practices, we've pretty much all had enough of, and hence they no longer exist.


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    #86
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,027 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Riskymove wrote: »
    they do

    this isn't a service industry or an employment law situation, etc.
    it is . it is the provision of a service, IE the paying of rent in turn for a room or a full house

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #87
    RobYourBuilder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,541 ✭✭✭RobYourBuilder


    end of the road wrote: »
    it is and it should be banned. in this current climate people renting should be glad of the money, its not the celtic tiger any more

    You're mad for banning sh*t. In nearly every other post you make you are calling for something or other to be banned.


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    #88
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,718 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    Riskymove wrote: »
    I don't get that view

    isn't everyone better off being honest about it and not wasting time

    Common sense tells me you're right, and hopefully that's what kicks in when the final decision has to be made.

    Unfortunately mountains will be made out of mole hills when some thin skinned offence seeker spots a poorly worded add.


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    #89
    reprise
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,372 ✭✭✭reprise


    Whether it's cheese or your housemate, to choose is to discriminate.


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    #90
    Triceratops Ballet
    Registered Users Posts: 4,894 ✭✭✭Triceratops Ballet


    end of the road wrote: »
    it is and it should be banned. in this current climate people renting should be glad of the money, its not the celtic tiger any more

    in what climate? it's a landlords market, there are plenty of people looking to rent and rents are rising like crazy.

    What exactly will banning it achieve? If my housemate (male) was to move out and I had to replace him, and I thought to myself well I'd like to have another bloke living here cos its handy for reaching things down of top shelves for me, and I just don't get on with girls, all that drama(I don't feel that way btw) so I think I'll look for a male, non smoking, professional housemate. Up goes the ad, without these specifications and I have to waste my time, and applicants time responding to people who are not the kind of people I want to live with ie: female/unemployed/smokes 20 a day/all of the above. How on earth does that benefit anyone?


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    #91
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,027 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    RobYourBuilder wrote: »
    You're mad for banning sh*t. In nearly every other post you make you are calling for something or other to be banned.
    no i'm not. on either count

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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