Poppy

The Moldy Gowl · 29-10-2014 3:43pm

*swoon*

My hero.

cajonlardo · 29-10-2014 3:48pm

Heres an odd one for you.

Both my grandfather and grandmother were seriously active during the war of independence. My Grandmother's two brothers got an awful time of it during the sacking of Balbriggan. One of them was bayoneted several times and thought dead, he later escaped the town and went on the run. BUT my grandfather fought in both ww1 & 2 and was awarded the military cross in 2nd world war and he was fatally wounded in Africa. One of my uncles also died in combat and 2 more returned home and led productive lives after the war.

Now my grandmother, who had moved weapons around and delivered messages etc became a very complex person through the '50's and '60's. She was one of the very first Irish people to wear a poppy. Because she now lived in a town and among people who did not know her family and her history, she became a target for gob****es. She was spat at several times and verbally abused regularly. Never bothered her in the slightest and as far as I know she never opened her mouth to her tormentors. My father and his brothers could have shut these people up very quickly but she didn't allow it.
I still know people who hold it against her memory that she, in her grief,
wore a tiny red weed and it somehow helped her deal with the pain of losing her husband and her son. Not sure what else I can say, except maybe live and let live.

My name is URL · 29-10-2014 3:52pm

Remember folks, wearing a poppy isn't just a way to pay tribute to those that died in WW1.. but to all soldiers that served in the British forces

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/06/world/africa/uk-colonial-compensation/

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/10/05/kenyans-can-sue-uk-over-colonial-era-torture-rape-by-british-forces/

You won't see any romanticized BBC documentaries about what happened there

FTA69 · 29-10-2014 3:56pm

Just to let ye know that's it's the tenth anniversary of me first saying on this site that the poppy is a load of triumphalist b*llocks.

Nodin · 29-10-2014 4:02pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Remember folks, wearing a poppy isn't just a way to pay tribute to those that died in WW1.. but to all soldiers that served in the British forces

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/06/world/africa/uk-colonial-compensation/

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/10/05/kenyans-can-sue-uk-over-colonial-era-torture-rape-by-british-forces/

You won't see any romanticized BBC documentaries about what happened there

or here
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/apr/09/malaya-massacre-villagers-coverup

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-20302280

http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,2031992,00.html

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2004/may/17/military.iraq1

...to give but a few examples.

AudreyHepburn · 29-10-2014 4:03pm

Tornaxx wrote: »

My grandfather fought at Ypres too, with the Dublin Fusiliers. I think he was shot in the leg but made it home okay. Lived 'til he was 93.

My great-grandfather suffered a shrapnel would which became infected and it had to be amputated. I think a shell exploded near him.

Having been to Ypres and seen the trenches and the graves I think it's miracle anyone made it home. And I understand better than ever why remembrance is so important.

MadYaker · 29-10-2014 4:03pm

i thought this thread was going to be about heroin

Timberrrrrrrr · 29-10-2014 4:04pm

3 pages in and the whataboutery is flying :rolleyes:

The_Valeyard · 29-10-2014 4:06pm

Poppies for some, abortions for others?

statesaver · 29-10-2014 4:07pm

Was waiting for some gobshíte to start this theard.

Hopefully it dies a quick death

Sunnyisland · 29-10-2014 4:09pm

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Don't we have a poppy forum?

at this stage its a poppy acre...

My name is URL · 29-10-2014 4:10pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

3 pages in and the whataboutery is flying :rolleyes:

What a lazy counterargument that is.

Are people only allowed to remember the 'good' bits of history and pretend that nothing bad ever happened? I know that's how triumphalists and jingoists in britain like to rewrite history but it's not the case here.

Do you dispute that remembrance day is for all that fought for Britain and not just those that didn't torture, rape and oppress people?

Sunnyisland · 29-10-2014 4:12pm

anyway i have to go and catch a plane,see yis next week.

ya its a slow plane.

Timberrrrrrrr · 29-10-2014 4:13pm

paulieG89 wrote: »

Nobody died for me !!

They died for themselves and their families. My own view is (god be good) may anybody that fought against the Germans in either war burn in the deepest depths of hell.

My name is URL wrote: »

What a lazy counterargument that is.

Are people only allowed to remember the 'good' bits of history and pretend that nothing bad ever happened? I know that's how triumphalists and jingoists in britain like to rewrite history but it's not the case here.

Do you dispute that remembrance day is for all that fought for Britain and not just those that didn't torture, rape and oppress people?

Not in the least do i dispute it,

Do you dispute that the MAJORITY of soldiers who have served in the BA have served with dignity and great conduct?

Snickers Man · 29-10-2014 4:16pm

Oh FFS not again!!

But if you must......

Let's do a "Poppy Watch". See how many poppies you can count on people's tits in Irish streets over the next two weeks. Maybe even post photographs with times, dates and places. (NO FACES!!!!!!!) eg Grafton St, 30/Oct/14, 15:06.

I've been in Dublin centre already today. Total count so far: zero.

Expect regular updates.

My name is URL · 29-10-2014 4:17pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Not in the least do i dispute it,

Do you dispute that the MAJORITY of soldiers who have served in the BA have served with dignity and great conduct?

I think a blanket nationalistic day of remembrance is pretty disgusting when the countless cases of torture, rape and oppression are completely ignored while people and the media fawn over the likes of WW1, and grossly romanticise it all.

Why can't people just pay tribute to relatives in their own way without all the jingoistic and pseudo-historical bull**** attached?

Cantremember · 29-10-2014 4:18pm

Snickers Man wrote: »

Oh FFS not again!!

But if you must......

Let's do a "Poppy Watch". See how many poppies you can count on people's tits in Irish streets over the next two weeks. Maybe even post photographs with times, dates and places. (NO FACES!!!!!!!) eg Grafton St, 30/Oct/14, 15:06.

I've been in Dublin centre already today. Total count so far: zero.

Expect regular updates.

I see what you did there. Thinly veiled tit watching exercise.

Timberrrrrrrr · 29-10-2014 4:19pm

My name is URL wrote: »

I think a blanket nationalistic day of remembrance is pretty disgusting when the countless cases of torture, rape and oppression are completely ignored while people and the media fawn over the likes of WW1, and grossly romanticise it all.

So the deeds of the many should be brushed under the carpet and forgotten because of the deeds of a few?

FTA69 · 29-10-2014 4:22pm

It's a million times worse here. You can't go for a sh*t in England for the next two odd months without someone trying to slap a poppy on you for the occasion.

The_Valeyard · 29-10-2014 4:22pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

So the deeds of the many should be brushed under the carpet and forgotten because of the deeds of a few?

leonard nimoy is cool.

Timberrrrrrrr · 29-10-2014 4:24pm

The_Valeyard wrote: »

leonard nimoy is cool.

We come in peace, Shoot to kill

MakeEmLaugh · 29-10-2014 4:27pm

Lapin wrote: »

Thankfully however, for a good part of previous threads, there are many comments that recognise the sacrifice and loss of almost 50,000 Irish men and women in the Great War.

I'm just wondering, does that figure only refer to men from what is now the Republic of Ireland, or does it include men from Northern Ireland?

Nodin · 29-10-2014 4:28pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

So the deeds of the many should be brushed under the carpet and forgotten because of the deeds of a few?

Whats this 'deeds of a few'?The Empire was not created and maintained by a "few bad eggs". It was done by threat and force for hundreds of years across the globe.

Skylinehead · 29-10-2014 4:33pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

So the deeds of the many should be brushed under the carpet and forgotten because of the deeds of a few?

You've a funny notion of "few".

Timberrrrrrrr · 29-10-2014 4:35pm

Nodin wrote: »

Whats this 'deeds of a few'?The Empire was not created and maintained by a "few bad eggs". It was done by threat and force for hundreds of years across the globe.

I mean the HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS that died, I mean the MILLIONS who have served and done good. You can harp on about the government, the royal family and soldiers who did things in far flung places hundreds of years ago but the fact remains that the MAJORITY of soldiers who have and do serve in the BA are good honest people.

brummytom · 29-10-2014 4:36pm

FTA69 wrote: »

It's a million times worse here. You can't go for a sh*t in England for the next two odd months without someone trying to slap a poppy on you for the occasion.

Can't say I've ever experienced that at all. I don't wear a poppy and have often said 'no thanks' to the old biddies/veterans from the British Legion.

Personally, I don't really see the point. My grandad fought in WW2 (strangely, he was Irish, and my English grandad didn't serve), and my great uncle was killed in Italy the week the war ended. Other members of my family had their lives made hell by British troops in Ireland.

I think it's nice to have a day of remembrance, and I use the minute silence to think of my family who served and lost their lives. But I'm not going to wear a poppy, the proceeds of which mainly go to veterans of more recent conflicts, none of which I hold any respect for, tbh.

Irish Guitarist · 29-10-2014 4:40pm

My granduncle fought in World War 2. I saw a picture of him in his uniform years ago. Until I had seen it I had no idea he had fought in the war or that he even existed.

I'm not going to wear a poppy anyway. It's not going to bring him back. If I were to wear one though I'd pick a poppy from the ground rather than buy an 'official' one and support the armed forces in Britain.

Lapin wrote: »

No doubt the usual thanks whoring will come in the posts that follow with ccomments like 'oh for fcuk's sake, not again' or I am disappoint OP, I was hoping for a thread on heroin cultivation.

Actually I was hoping it would be a thread about this Poppy.

Nodin · 29-10-2014 4:40pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I mean the HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS that died, I mean the MILLIONS who have served and done good. You can harp on about the government, the royal family and soldiers who did things in far flung places hundreds of years ago but the fact remains that the MAJORITY of soldiers who have and do serve in the BA are good honest people.

The vast majority who served would have served maintaining the Empire. The majority served UK Government policy, which was evil, racist and Imperialistic up until the late 20th century.

things in far flung places hundreds of years ago

All examples I gave were post 1945. You should read what I linked, then get back to me.

Snickers Man · 29-10-2014 4:41pm

MakeEmLaugh wrote: »

I'm just wondering, does that figure only refer to men from what is now the Republic of Ireland, or does it include men from Northern Ireland?

It includes all of Ireland. But it's a misleading figure because it also includes all men who died serving in Irish regiments, many of whom would not have been Irish at all. There were eight infantry regiments allocated to the 32 Irish counties, as well as the Irish Guards, a few "Irish" cavalry regiments and of course Irishmen would have served in large numbers in the "specialist" regiments like the engineers and artillery. Not to mention of course the Navy and the Royal Flying Corps.

Discounting non-Irishmen who served in the Irish regiments most historians concede that the the true figure for "Irishmen" killed in the First World War is closer to 30,000 than 50,000. But it's impossible to say.

It was announced this week that the combined might of the Irish and Belgian states and Google is to seek to determine the true number of Irish WWI casualties.

But it's really an exercise in trying to determine the length of a piece of string.

Timberrrrrrrr · 29-10-2014 4:41pm

Nodin wrote: »

The vast majority who served would have served maintaining the Empire. The majority served UK Government policy, which was evil, racist and Imperialistic up until the late 20th century.

All examples I gave were post 1945. You should read what I linked, then get back to me.

Oh i read them last year, and the year before, and the year before :rolleyes:

So because they served in the army they were "evil" in your eyes by proxy?

Poppy

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