Marketing

ChippingSodbury

RoboRat wrote: »

Which is still marketing. But, if you want growth and investment you need to invest in marketing... growth and investment are the lifeblood of a company and product.

Take for example a company develops a revolutionary product. They are first to the market but the idea is not patentable or even if it was, a patent is only as good as how much you are willing to invest in defending it. So, they go down the route of not investing in marketing and letting the product grow organically. If it starts getting attention, it won't be long until a big business picks it up and does it themselves. The can do it cheaper as they have the means to mass produce and they will also market it. Its not long before they eclipse the original and become associated with the original product themselves.

This is also not taking into account retailers who want their cut if they are to sell the product, some even require you to pay them to put it in a good position in their store (which is very important for the product to be seen and in turn bought). You now have to factor in margins and if you add a distributor to the mix, you get even less. You also need to factor in returns, logistics, faulty products and other such expenses into your cut. So, now you can see how reducing the cost of production is essential to having a successful product and this can only be done by mass production which can only be facilitated by mass demand.

I am not saying this is across the board, a plumber can operate without these restrictions but if there is demand, then its not long until another plumber comes along and does it cheaper. The same can be said for nightclubs, you know when you see the huge queue outside, thats marketing - the club might only be half full but they will keep a queue outside to get attention. Ever wonder why the back of a pub is cordoned off for no reason? Marketing again, if everybody is towards the entrance then when somebody looks in, the place looks busy, when the crowd picks up, they lift to cordon... job done.

Marketing is everywhere and a company who ignores it, does so at their peril.

No No No No No No. Take Apple as an example. It was just a super product and didn't need marketing. Sure Steve Jobs was only interested in bettering society: all those sneak peeks and presentations were only done because he couldn't hold in his excitement:pac::pac::pac:

mariaalice

This might be an urban myth but apparently one of the expensive preppy branks in America, allowed a certain amount of shop lifting by young blacks teenagers as a way for the clothes to become a status symbol a bit like the way nike use to market when having a pair of nikes was a status symbol.

RoboRat

ChippingSodbury wrote: »

No No No No No No. Take Apple as an example. It was just a super product and didn't need marketing. Sure Steve Jobs was only interested in bettering society: all those sneak peeks and presentations were only done because he couldn't hold in his excitement:pac::pac::pac:

I'm praying that you are being sarcastic!!!

Apple is the biggest culprit for product placement in the history of marketing!

Here is a really good example of why you need to market your products, apple to most people are the creators of digital music but the MPMan F10 was the first mass produced mobile mp3 player. Has anyone ever heard of it? Probably not and it could have been worth billions.

If you want sinister then look at any Irish bank advertisement for mortgages: "90% approval in principle rate" etc - This in no way means that you're approved and it's a bad mark on your credit rating if you don't actually get approved.

I 100% agree with this, agreement on principle is something that should be banned as it in no way indicates that you will get approved. Its purely done for marketing purposes and its something that has really annoyed me since it came out.

Another one which was horrific was johnson's baby shampoo which contained formaldehyde: http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-10-17/washing-the-formaldehyde-out-of-baby-shampoo

DamagedTrax

smash wrote: »

That's not sinister. Just because they're no1 to foreclose on houses in black areas doesn't mean that what they're doing in under developed countries is bad, or that it should be dismissed.

it should be dismissed, totally. its a sinister marketing ploy. in one country they wreak havoc, creating insane poverty thru their own gambling losses, while in a newer economy (read market) they try to portray themselves as saviours... until they do the very same thing again.

and you're right, the pay day loans thing is disgraceful and equally as bad but the GS advert goes a lot deeper than what it says on the tin.

ChippingSodbury

RoboRat wrote: »

I'm praying that you are being sarcastic!!!

Your prayers have been answered!

RoboRat

I always found it hilarious the way some apple exec would 'leave' the latest prototype of their new iphone in a busy bar that would be picked up by a journalist or blogger. Then the comical drama that would ensue to 'get it back' and stop it being 'leaked'

Much like when a car company has snaps taken of their latest prototype.

Marketing is the work of the devil, PR is several leagues lower!!!

DamagedTrax

RoboRat wrote: »

Marketing is the work of the devil, PR is several leagues lower!!!

Bernays on Letterman

DL: good evening Dr. Bernays, so tell us exactly what this PR thing is
EB: its about getting people like you, to call people like me 'Dr', so that people like them [points to the audience] believe what i say.

(or something to that affect)

ChippingSodbury

RoboRat wrote: »

I always found it hilarious the way some apple exec would 'leave' the latest prototype of their new iphone in a busy bar that would be picked up by a journalist or blogger. Then the comical drama that would ensue to 'get it back' and stop it being 'leaked'!

Yeah, it's like when someone from a bank leaves a laptop containing details of all of their customers' on public transport....genius :pac:

Seriously though, most people fall for the "forgotten prototype" trick. It might be cynical but it works. It's not about convincing everyone, just enough to generate mass hysteria in their "new and improved" latest offering.

Wibbs

RoboRat wrote: »

I'm praying that you are being sarcastic!!!

Apple is the biggest culprit for product placement in the history of marketing!

Here is a really good example of why you need to market your products, apple to most people are the creators of digital music but the MPMan F10 was the first mass produced mobile mp3 player. Has anyone ever heard of it? Probably not and it could have been worth billions.

Aye, but as well as being a marketing genius Steve Jobs was also a genius at reading what the general non geeky market wanted. There were Mp3 players before the iPod and "better" ones too. They had more features and options, but Jobs knew that while that appeals to techie types the mainstream market isn't techie and too many options, too much choice actually puts most people off(and it costs more to implement). The majority didn't want multiple formats or graphic equalisers built in and a plethora of buttons, they wanted play, stop, skip, back and forward and a volume knob, wrapped up in something that looked nice.

coopdog85

Roy Keane's book being leaked after being "left on a shelf in tesco by a tesco employee" was a great marketing ploy. What was that 1 book doing in the hands of that employee 5 days before the book went on sale? And why was that 1 book left on a shelf in tesco?

Look at the amount of publicity it drummed up for keane & roddy Doyle. Purely a marketing stunt & it worked.

RoboRat

Roy Keane's book being leaked after being "left on a shelf in tesco by a tesco employee" was a great marketing ploy. What was that 1 book doing in the hands of that employee 5 days before the book went on sale? And why was that 1 book left on a shelf in tesco?

Coincidently in Manchester too... very strange.

AnonoBoy

Everyone knows that marketing doesn't work.

But it's time our culture was given a shake up and we vacuumed up the debris of all this celebrity nonsense. A good shake 'n vac will put the freshness back in our society.

smash

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Everyone knows that marketing doesn't work.

Nearly everything that people buy as a luxury item is because marketing does work!

DamagedTrax

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Everyone knows that marketing doesn't work.

But it's time our culture was given a shake up and we vacuumed up the debris of all this celebrity nonsense. A good shake 'n vac will put the freshness back in our society.

you're making my head hurt! time for a kenco milican... sh1t, i mean a coffee!

DamagedTrax

smash wrote: »

Nearly everything that people buy as a luxury item is because marketing does work!

well it obviously doesnt work on you :pac::D:pac:

(look back over his reply...)

AnonoBoy

smash wrote: »

Nearly everything that people buy as a luxury item is because marketing does work!

I'm afraid you're mistaken my friend.

But don't worry, we can help you overcome those little accidents and mistakes in life. When you need us we're there.

ChippingSodbury

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Everyone knows that marketing doesn't work.

But it's time our culture was given a shake up and we vacuumed up the debris of all this celebrity nonsense. A good shake 'n vac will put the freshness back in our society.

Well f**k you too! I'll be singing that song for the whole day now!!!

AnonoBoy

ChippingSodbury wrote: »

Well f**k you too! I'll be singing that dong for the whole day now!!!

That will give you a headache alright.

I've something for that though. Small tablets that act fast on the location of the ache. For lives bigger than pain.

smash

DamagedTrax wrote: »

well it obviously doesnt work on you :pac::D:pac:

(look back over his reply...)

I saw it after I'd posted

kneemos

Shake'N'Vac?Pretty sure it came from a Chinese chemical plants waste pipe.Lethal stuff.

AnonoBoy

kneemos wrote: »

Shake'N'Vac?Pretty sure it came from a Chinese chemical plants waste pipe.Lethal stuff.

I don't remember that slogan.

I'm pretty sure most cleaning products aren't meant to be ingested though.

Call Me Jimmy

RoboRat wrote: »

I work in marketing and as a previous poster said, everything is done to generate revenue as that is the entire point of a company.

The bottom line is that a lot of people like to be led whether they know it or not. There are so many forms of marketing its actually quite scary. From product placement to guerrilla marketing to word of mouth to social media and celebrity tweets, its all marketing. Companies who ignore marketing are destined to fail because the bottom line is there is no product without customers and there are no customers without awareness.

Some marketing is blatant such as what the OP describes, others much more subtle, its all depends on budgets, audience, timeline and what ROI you are aiming for.

Some campaigns are fascinating, look up De Beers and diamonds, McDonalds and their use of playgrounds, Hallmark and Valentines day... these are companies that play the long game and have reaped the results.

I have to say, as much as I naturally rail against being programmed I accept it is inevitable. We've gone so far down this path I can't see us making a decision as a society to limit it.

But from an analytical perspective it is absolutely fascinating. Television and the internet and billboards and buses all programming my brain! Then there is the use of design principles in the media which would blow your mind; artists use these principles but businesses maximise them imo.

DamagedTrax

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

I have to say, as much as I naturally rail against being programmed I accept it is inevitable. We've gone so far down this path I can't see us making a decision as a society to limit it.

But from an analytical perspective it is absolutely fascinating. Television and the internet and billboards and buses all programming my brain! Then there is the use of design principles in the media which would blow your mind; artists use these principles but businesses maximise them imo.

the way to limit it invading your life is to accept it as background noise.

i work in the music industry so im very techy. im in a position that puts me right in the firing line for some high end product pushing. ive learned that the only advertising i listen to is my ears. it could look like a brick but if it sounds good to me, then it is good. thats all the advertising they need on me.

now if only i could apply that to my everyday life!! (although we do have a rule that the tv gets muted on ads, especially having a teenager around the place)

John_Rambo

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Everyone knows that marketing doesn't work

It 100% does. Post campaign sales results prove it over and over again. Do you think companies have marketing teams for the craic?

DamagedTrax

John_Rambo wrote: »

It 100% does. Pre campaign sales results prove it over and over again. Do you think companies have marketing teams for the craic?

i call for a re-read mu' lawd.

kneemos

AnonoBoy wrote: »

I don't remember that slogan.

I'm pretty sure most cleaning products aren't meant to be ingested though.

Made my skin crawl,and attacked the sinuses.Awful concoction.

topper75

Wibbs wrote: »

Aye, but as well as being a marketing genius Steve Jobs was also a genius at reading what the general non geeky market wanted. There were Mp3 players before the iPod and "better" ones too. They had more features and options, but Jobs knew that while that appeals to techie types the mainstream market isn't techie and too many options, too much choice actually puts most people off(and it costs more to implement). The majority didn't want multiple formats or graphic equalisers built in and a plethora of buttons, they wanted play, stop, skip, back and forward and a volume knob, wrapped up in something that looked nice.

Good insight there again Wibbs. Ditto with Google and their search engine. Mind you, they have abandoned that principle somewhat of late.

AnonoBoy

kneemos wrote: »

Made my skin crawl,and attacked the sinuses.Awful concoction.

May I suggest talc next time?

AnonoBoy

John_Rambo wrote: »

It 100% does. Pre campaign sales results prove it over and over again. Do you think companies have marketing teams for the craic?

Having trouble with reading comprehension? The Adult Literacy Agency can help.

Everyone has a right to read.

Lux23

I was talking to a guy the other day about beer and he said he won't drink any of the massive brands anymore, not because of the taste but of all the marketing they do. I nearly wet myself, I mean a creating a craft beer is a marketing exercise in itself. Some people are complete fools.