Cork GAA Discussion Thread

thinkstoomuch1

CORKDOUBLE wrote: »

No way shouldwe go to an outside manager ....John Evans no way Michael Quirke said when he had him at club level he was very old school ...look what he did in Roscommon this year disaster.

I always loose faith in a pundit when I see names picked like those
Fair enough everyone is wrong but Evans name just wildcard candidates no logic at all
R

The same scenario in just cause he's kerry we had with George durrant just cause he happened be kerry minor played few McGrath cup games some fans had him cork team this year great things
Superb club Player but not inter county
If he was kerry would played him


It's cleary job of if he wants it
He's declared interest and with look bad if board over look him again

zetecescort

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/michael-moynihan/a-deepening-crisis-on-leeside-345791.html

Looks like there are differing views on the executive and people don't look to be afraid to say them either

Amprodude

Figsy32 wrote: »

Sunday was a tactical failure? What other tactics should he have employed?

I'll happily agree JBM isn't a great tactical manager but we were completely overrun by Galway the last day. Tactics had nothing to do with Glynn cleaning out Walsh, then Murphy and finally Ellis. Tactics had nothing to do with the fact our back line couldn't cope with the Galway forwards, even with having an extra defender.

We don't have the players. It's as simple as that. Harnedy is top class. After that how many of our players get close to starting with Kilkenny, Tipp or even Galway and Waterford?

Lehane is top class on his day but is way too inconsistent. I'm one of Hoggy's biggest defenders on here but he blows very hot and cold and can be marked out of it if in the corner. I think Cooper has shown himself to be an excellent player this year to be fair. I still don't think any of those are certainties to get into the other opposition's teams though. Joyce would probably get in most teams and he was a huge loss this year.

JBM has weaknesses tactically and he has been criticised for that here especially after the two Warerford games. In fairness, he rectified that somewhat afterwards with the sweeper system. Being honest and this isn't nice to have to say, it wouldn't have mattered what tactics we employed last Sunday, Galway were just a lot better team than us.

If he wants another year I think he deserves it. Getting to an AI and winning a Munster with these lads gives him enough rope to excuse this year IMO.

What about last year demolition job Tipp did on us?

Figsy32

Amprodude wrote: »

What about last year demolition job Tipp did on us?

That was a disaster tactically. Which I said at the time. To be fair we had nobody to mark Callanan, but it definitely should not have been O'Neill, who got skinned. We tried to play a sweeper while still playing three men in the full forward line. It made no sense and we got destroyed in midfield by McGrath, Woodlock and Noel McGrath.

A lot of people said it at the time. The idea that JBM doesn't get criticised on here isn't true.

Even if we went 15 on 15 or played a normal sweeper they still would've killed us though. I'll ask again. How many of our lads get into that Tipp team? Three maybe?

Every year of his tenure bar this year JBM has the team to a level past where they're at IMO. That's why I think he should get another go.

thinkstoomuch1

Jack sheehan played well for eirns own again last night at half forward
Needs be looked at for cork at full back or half
He's good man win ball and this lad has potential when I saw him any game he played

Deise_2012

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Jack sheehan played well for eirns own again last night at half forward
Needs be looked at for cork at full back or half
He's good man win ball and this lad has potential when I saw him any game he played

That's the lad for UL who did well on Maurice Shan last year? He's a good player but there's a bit of a difference between Crystal cup in January and hurling in the summer. Worth a try though, ye have a good few players to try out. I'd definitely keep JBM for another year

thinkstoomuch1

Figsy32 wrote: »

Sunday was a tactical failure? What other tactics should he have employed?

I'll happily agree JBM isn't a great tactical manager but we were completely overrun by Galway the last day. Tactics had nothing to do with Glynn cleaning out Walsh, then Murphy and finally Ellis. Tactics had nothing to do with the fact our back line couldn't cope with the Galway forwards, even with having an extra defender.

We don't have the players. It's as simple as that. Harnedy is top class. After that how many of our players get close to starting with Kilkenny, Tipp or even Galway and Waterford?

Lehane is top class on his day but is way too inconsistent. I'm one of Hoggy's biggest defenders on here but he blows very hot and cold and can be marked out of it if in the corner. I think Cooper has shown himself to be an excellent player this year to be fair. I still don't think any of those are certainties to get into the other opposition's teams though. Joyce would probably get in most teams and he was a huge loss this year.

JBM has weaknesses tactically and he has been criticised for that here especially after the two Warerford games. In fairness, he rectified that somewhat afterwards with the sweeper system. Being honest and this isn't nice to have to say, it wouldn't have mattered what tactics we employed last Sunday, Galway were just a lot better team than us.

If he wants another year I think he deserves it. Getting to an AI and winning a Munster with these lads gives him enough rope to excuse this year IMO.

Jbm given cork everything and gone everything out limited resources but he has to go in he's outgrown the team it is now after reaching its peak under him and huge defeat Galway means even jbm energy and drive gone
Cork needs new voice
Tactics were not so much the problem but the perfection was in three games implementation when as my fear was wasn't refined cohesive enough in should be done all league
Yes jbm deserves credit for changing it but as Cusack said Cork had be under him kicked screamed this system and he doesn't like system and Imo you wouldn't marry someone just to put up them for convenience you would only marry you truly loved them as if true true true love not there then cracks marriage will appear sooner or later in you fool no one but you self

Same concept jbm forced change system but has honesty said not favour sweeper and tactics so Imo every game he has do it It's against he's will
Players sense that too and imo everyone must to total belive system work
Cork sweeper wasn't problem v Galway problem was sweeper wasn't refined or practices enough games best orthodox Galway in fine v sweeper cork still hadn't fully understood sweeper beat Galway width and pace

Pat mulchay right you can't expect system work short time has been practices over over again
Jbm didn't do that
Jbm done good with Cork and made cork better when took over
He's improved Ellis Harnedy Kearney cooper lehane Murphy etc
He hasn't been ruthless enough at times with horgan
Walsh hurling hasn't improved
Lawton done well last day taken off when he moved half forward
Lawton average hurler in orthodox team but could be great team player defined role like last two games
He's role was changed v Galway
That wasn't he's fault
Jbm has been there four years and like daly Dublin last year outgrew team
Cork hurling needs fresh voice
This isn't slight jbm as he's done more other done panel available and while tactics wise been off done well cork
But he should go and probably will

thinkstoomuch1

Figsy32 wrote: »

That was a disaster tactically. Which I said at the time. To be fair we had nobody to mark Callanan, but it definitely should not have been O'Neill, who got skinned. We tried to play a sweeper while still playing three men in the full forward line. It made no sense and we got destroyed in midfield by McGrath, Woodlock and Noel McGrath.

A lot of people said it at the time. The idea that JBM doesn't get criticised on here isn't true.

Even if we went 15 on 15 or played a normal sweeper they still would've killed us though. I'll ask again. How many of our lads get into that Tipp team? Three maybe?

Every year of his tenure bar this year JBM has the team to a level past where they're at IMO. That's why I think he should get another go.

Cork had plenty to mark Callan
Joyce should of etc
The players look tired in body and mind with system
New system only way go forward and jbm heart isn't fully in system
That's not harsh he's said it himself
Forget about few said jbm wasn't critsed he was we all know those posters had nothing else to cling in defence football management all it ever was imo tactical manoeuvre deflect attention from the football
I see few posted since the football
Some us here may be wrong at times but least we post in victory and defeat cork
Real support imo

thinkstoomuch1

zetecescort wrote: »

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/michael-moynihan/a-deepening-crisis-on-leeside-345791.html

Looks like there are differing views on the executive and people don't look to be afraid to say them either

In fairness this has long been over due in cork and absoultey credit and fair play to the lads were going to resign

They must of do so be applauded for their courage conviction honesty cork gaa and should say why they left

Pressure needs be kept on by clubs now
If executive wants stay on all well and good let have he's stadium makes it him happy
He's going to stay he won't be going anywhere
But if he gets what he wants certain things need be given
More investment gaa under age like Derek kavanagh cried out for
No member none absoultey none this nonsense board member picking management team
Picked former proven men pick management
Shannon article I highlights the board members travelling on the team bus

Key appointment now in minor football minor hurling and senior football with possible senior hurling

Clubs must now accept cork players former great should not given jobs unless proven management record
Awful truly awful week cork gaa but if lesson learned and executive is actually held accountable and Cork gaa run decormatic then least positives were got from this week
In cork it's always been what the board want they get
Unfortunately they need to realise you don't always get what you want but Cork gaa public have wanted lot past few years not always got them

Board are in a tough position now as they don't and cant afford any drama now with the pairc
I can't see why croke park had problems comments Cusack made rte
They fast enough to say before let cork sort own problems and didn't really want to get involved
Are croke park upset also regards loughanne comments on clare hurling chairman
No doubt Cusack could chosen choice words better but brolly seems be able to be same context he's critsim things in all fairness

Fair play to Tracey Kennedy
I have always been a fan and her and ger lane I always belived are two board members could change cork in time

Figsy32

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Cork had plenty to mark Callan
Joyce should of etc
The players look tired in body and mind with system
New system only way go forward and jbm heart isn't fully in system
That's not harsh he's said it himself
Forget about few said jbm wasn't critsed he was we all know those posters had nothing else to cling in defence football management all it ever was imo tactical manoeuvre deflect attention from the football
I see few posted since the football
Some us here may be wrong at times but least we post in victory and defeat cork
Real support imo

We didn't have someone to mark Callanan. I don't think you could realistically throw Joyce in to play full back for the first time at Intercounty level in an AI semi to mark such a good player. Cahalane and McDonnell would have gotten cleaned against him too.

The Galway game wasn't lost because the system wasnt refined enough IMO. We lost that game because we had a half forward line who couldn't win primary possession and a defence that couldn't hold their men. Mannion 7 pts off Murphy, Flynn and Whelan running amock against the usually steady O'Neill and McDonnell etc. The sweeper was worked around by Galway because they were so dominant out the pitch.

All I'm saying is that the decision as to whether JBM stays or go should be left to him.

thinkstoomuch1

Figsy32 wrote: »

We didn't have someone to mark Callanan. I don't think you could realistically throw Joyce in to play full back for the first time at Intercounty level in an AI semi to mark such a good player. Cahalane and McDonnell would have gotten cleaned against him too.

The Galway game wasn't lost because the system wasnt refined enough IMO. We lost that game because we had a half forward line who couldn't win primary possession and a defence that couldn't hold their men. Mannion 7 pts off Murphy, Flynn and Whelan running amock against the usually steady O'Neill and McDonnell etc. The sweeper was worked around by Galway because they were so dominant out the pitch.

All I'm saying is that the decision as to whether JBM stays or go should be left to him.

Joyce had two years inter county and suited to Callan
Course the sweeper had direct impact on the game cork should be playing short possession running game
But of course some think that ruminations cork hurling when truth be told players available would be saviour cork hurling going forward

Figsy32

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Joyce had two years inter county and suited to Callan
Course the sweeper had direct impact on the game cork should be playing short possession running game
But of course some think that ruminations cork hurling when truth be told players available would be saviour cork hurling going forward

Full back is a specialist position though. I think he would have struggled having never played there before. We can agree to disagree about that.

It had an impact of course. But it wasn't the winning or losing of the game IMO. The losing of the game is that when it came to it our players were beaten by their direct opponents in most positions.

Do you think we have the players to compete with Tipp/Kilkenny?

How many of our players who've played this year would start for Waterford for instance?

thinkstoomuch1

Figsy32 wrote: »

Full back is a specialist position though. I think he would have struggled having never played there before. We can agree to disagree about that.

It had an impact of course. But it wasn't the winning or losing of the game IMO. The losing of the game is that when it came to it our players were beaten by their direct opponents in most positions.

Do you think we have the players to compete with Tipp/Kilkenny?

How many of our players who've played this year would start for Waterford for instance?

No we don't have the players tipp kk
Only way is a system


Waterford credit due have system but problem is system isn't refined attacking sense and struggling beat Dublin


Ist real test tippeary beat them as Tony considine said in second gear in tippeary only focus is kk and Galway dangerous opponents for them on that basis
Tippeary win all ireland have peak all ireland final of its kk has been game their lives
Kk real test for waterford and we'll see how good they are
Credit due absoultey beat kk but kk real test
Waterford players good with few exceptions being great but players all team aren't great it's system play good
Problem now though is while defence good you need score v kk lot to win
I still don't see the talk waterford have arrived at the top level yet
Absoultey made huge progress but under twenty one players lost game vital in give them success and tippeary beat them so beating cork Dublin nothing like beating tippeary or kk

There's huge gap between the top two and the rest imo
Kk are going even if tipp win this year dominate hurling the next five years imo

Amprodude

Figsy32 wrote: »

That was a disaster tactically. Which I said at the time. To be fair we had nobody to mark Callanan, but it definitely should not have been O'Neill, who got skinned. We tried to play a sweeper while still playing three men in the full forward line. It made no sense and we got destroyed in midfield by McGrath, Woodlock and Noel McGrath.

A lot of people said it at the time. The idea that JBM doesn't get criticised on here isn't true.

Even if we went 15 on 15 or played a normal sweeper they still would've killed us though. I'll ask again. How many of our lads get into that Tipp team? Three maybe?

Every year of his tenure bar this year JBM has the team to a level past where they're at IMO. That's why I think he should get another go.

Good Systems and tactics can beat superior teams. Tipp were good but they aren't Kilkenny and really do blow hot and cold like Galway Limerick and Waterford. In 2007 a really bad Tipp team beat a pretty good Cork team and we had a poor manager. How many of Tipps players back then would have got on that Cork team? Limerick almost beat Cork in 2004 and 2006 and their team wasn't a patch on Cork at the time but effective tactics did the job of almost causing upsets. Teams alone won't win games if they cant deal with tactics.

zetecescort

Cork 2-17 Tipp 0-10 in camogie 1/4 final

zetecescort

All Ireland Intermediate Final v Galway fixed for Gaelic Grounds Limerick Saturday next 8th August at 7pm

Rightwing

I's not all doom and gloom down by the Lee so.

Rightwing

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Jbm given cork everything and gone everything out limited resources but he has to go in he's outgrown the team it is now after reaching its peak under him and huge defeat Galway means even jbm energy and drive gone
Cork needs new voice
Tactics were not so much the problem but the perfection was in three games implementation when as my fear was wasn't refined cohesive enough in should be done all league
Yes jbm deserves credit for changing it but as Cusack said Cork had be under him kicked screamed this system and he doesn't like system and Imo you wouldn't marry someone just to put up them for convenience you would only marry you truly loved them as if true true true love not there then cracks marriage will appear sooner or later in you fool no one but you self

Same concept jbm forced change system but has honesty said not favour sweeper and tactics so Imo every game he has do it It's against he's will
Players sense that too and imo everyone must to total belive system work
Cork sweeper wasn't problem v Galway problem was sweeper wasn't refined or practices enough games best orthodox Galway in fine v sweeper cork still hadn't fully understood sweeper beat Galway width and pace

Pat mulchay right you can't expect system work short time has been practices over over again
Jbm didn't do that
Jbm done good with Cork and made cork better when took over
He's improved Ellis Harnedy Kearney cooper lehane Murphy etc
He hasn't been ruthless enough at times with horgan
Walsh hurling hasn't improved
Lawton done well last day taken off when he moved half forward
Lawton average hurler in orthodox team but could be great team player defined role like last two games
He's role was changed v Galway
That wasn't he's fault
Jbm has been there four years and like daly Dublin last year outgrew team
Cork hurling needs fresh voice
This isn't slight jbm as he's done more other done panel available and while tactics wise been off done well cork
But he should go and probably will

I knew you would finally agree with me someday about JBM.

thinkstoomuch1

Rightwing wrote: »

I knew you would finally agree with me someday about JBM.

The day I need to take advice from you with greatest respect is the day I need to question my knowledge
As you are indeed the same fella said limerick better division two, Kilmallock win all ireland, limerick yes win all ireland this year and would beat tipp
You rated tj Ryan last year jumped ship
Your own thread a few with greatest respect even called in to question your view limerick would benefit hurling division two
Jbm done best could done them but tactics modern game problem
Your argument was to defend Ryan you saying jbm bad and whatever jbm faults are ten times management Ryan with be
I wouldn't mind if you were from kk but come cork thread look down your nose doom gloom cork is ironic when ye haven't won senior forty two years and still counting
Anyway I ain't taking your bait going tit tat so have the last word please buy I owed you courtesy showing up your last post with respect be nonsense
And before you get carried away as much loved limerick win all ireland under twenty one with Cork ross Corbett involved and indeed many geuine fans limerick thread no ye won't win under twenty one this year as superbly coached Wexford jj doyle will buy yes yere day will come
But you flip flop from writing a team off to suddenly being greatest think since sliced pan you should learn to add realism and logic to predictions


And no not all doom and gloom by lovely Lee as what heard tonight if true outstanding football management team senior going be put in
Minor hurling if true isn't exactly promising though if what hear true

Jbm hasn't left but would imagine he will and maybe we get good candidate
Unfortunately limerick are stuck with Ryan two more years and best ye hope for is new selectors
So despite yere better underage talent ye could actually end up worse coach cork next year or at best equal so with Ryan charge I don't think Cork will fear limerick at all at all and ye will not win all ireland next year division two
But ye are lucky in league changing two years as ye wouldn't beat clare next year get promotion

zetecescort

zetecescort wrote: »

Ladies football fixtures next weekend

Monday August 3 at 3pm, Cork v Meath in Thurles followed by Cork v Galway in the All Ireland minor final. a repeat of last years final which was one of the games of the year in any code

both games confirmed for TG4

Rightwing

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

The day I need to take advice from you with greatest respect is the day I need to question my knowledge
As you are indeed the same fella said limerick better division two, Kilmallock win all ireland, limerick yes win all ireland this year and would beat tipp
You rated tj Ryan last year jumped ship
Your own thread a few with greatest respect even called in to question your view limerick would benefit hurling division two
Jbm done best could done them but tactics modern game problem
Your argument was to defend Ryan you saying jbm bad and whatever jbm faults are ten times management Ryan with be
I wouldn't mind if you were from kk but come cork thread look down your nose doom gloom cork is ironic when ye haven't won senior forty two years and still counting
Anyway I ain't taking your bait going tit tat so have the last word please buy I owed you courtesy showing up your last post with respect be nonsense
And before you get carried away as much loved limerick win all ireland under twenty one with Cork ross Corbett involved and indeed many geuine fans limerick thread no ye won't win under twenty one this year as superbly coached Wexford jj doyle will buy yes yere day will come
But you flip flop from writing a team off to suddenly being greatest think since sliced pan you should learn to add realism and logic to predictions


And no not all doom and gloom by lovely Lee as what heard tonight if true outstanding football management team senior going be put in
Minor hurling if true isn't exactly promising though if what hear true

Jbm hasn't left but would imagine he will and maybe we get good candidate
Unfortunately limerick are stuck with Ryan two more years and best ye hope for is new selectors
So despite yere better underage talent ye could actually end up worse coach cork next year or at best equal so with Ryan charge I don't think Cork will fear limerick at all at all and ye will not win all ireland next year division two
But ye are lucky in league changing two years as ye wouldn't beat clare next year get promotion

But weren't you the man telling us on the Limerick thread that JBM was going to achieve 3 in a row. When I saw that I said this post is either genius or half-wit stuff. I knew the answer when Cork failed to beat a very average Clare team in '13.

I wouldn't like to see JBM go out in this fashion, a drubbing by Galway who luckily shot 23 wides on the day. I agree with you about TJ Ryan, like JBM, a very nice chap but tactically not the best.

As for the your footballers, they were very unlucky this year, could easily have got to the AI. And I don't think the hurlers are nowhere near as bad as last week, so certainly not all doom and gloom. If every county had a Donal og Cusack complaining on Rte we'd get no match analysis, just attacks on county boards.

Horse84

Just don't see this talk as helping especially coming from a man in his position with the u-16's. All it's doing is heaping pressure on young fellas and it's not fair. I don't see this breakthrough taking place anytime soon and cork aren't within 10 years of senior success not to mind 4.

zetecescort

Horse84 wrote: »

Just don't see this talk as helping especially coming from a man in his position with the u-16's. All it's doing is heaping pressure on young fellas and it's not fair. I don't see this breakthrough taking place anytime soon and cork aren't within 10 years of senior success not to mind 4.

how can clubs pay for coaches when they'll be paying for PUC?

sean mac

I think diarmuid is being optimistic but he has my full respect for putting the effort he is into the underage scene, like so many of the 2010 footballers who are also putting in the effort with the underage groups. In fairness to diarmuid he highlights the absence of full time coaches and he is right to do so. The man is looking at what is being done and his opinion should be respected, even donal o grady thinks 2020 is possible!!

Gary Neville

Rightwing wrote: »

But weren't you the man telling us on the Limerick thread that JBM was going to achieve 3 in a row. When I saw that I said this post is either genius or half-wit stuff. I knew the answer when Cork failed to beat a very average Clare team in '13.

I wouldn't like to see JBM go out in this fashion, a drubbing by Galway who luckily shot 23 wides on the day. I agree with you about TJ Ryan, like JBM, a very nice chap but tactically not the best.

As for the your footballers, they were very unlucky this year, could easily have got to the AI. And I don't think the hurlers are nowhere near as bad as last week, so certainly not all doom and gloom. If every county had a Donal og Cusack complaining on Rte we'd get no match analysis, just attacks on county boards.

Yeah and if every county had a Frank Murphy - we'd still be dining at the Top Table.

A key report commissioned by Cuthbert's Development Squads Committee was implemented in 2013 and has (according to Denis Walsh in today's Sunday Times) led to dramatic improvement - Some of our 2010 Football Squad have got involved and Kevin O Donovan (The excellent CB Coaching Officer) is now recruiting from the O Grady/Allen squads.

However, the failure to provide a centre of excellence could be a huge issue for us - Tyrone will soon see the benefits of theirs and likewise Kerry.

The_Kew_Tour

How in God's name did Cork footballers get beat to that last week

cantwbr1

Because Kildare didn't fear Cork. Cork had only beaten Clare in the championship. Clare who were beaten by Longford, who Kildare beat by 19 points.
Cork who were beaten by 11 points by Dublin when it counted.
What was there to be afraid of?

The_Kew_Tour

cantwbr1 wrote: »

Because Kildare didn't fear Cork. Cork had only beaten Clare in the championship. Clare who were beaten by Longford, who Kildare beat by 19 points.
Cork who were beaten by 11 points by Dublin when it counted.
What was there to be afraid of?

By that logic Dublin will crush Kerry to pieces

cantwbr1

Seriously, when wat the last time Cork best a division 1 team in the championship?

The_Kew_Tour

You making no sense