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What's so bad about eating red meat?

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24

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    #32
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    The thread is about red meat!
    Only saw some of horizon. Did he address how cattle are fed and raised? If not then any conclusions are worthless. Its all about how cattle are fed and their environment.

    How does this affect the quality of the meat?


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    #33
    ford2600
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,457 ✭✭✭ford2600


    jh79 wrote: »
    How does this affect the quality of the meat?

    Cattle are a herd animal and ruminants; they ingest large volumes of grass and then sit and chew it. "Chewing the cud" which is how they breakdown the grass.

    Fed lots in the USA fed concentrates to the cattle and keep them enclosed in lots packed together. IMHO mass produced chicken/pig meat is as bad.

    Grass fed beef/lamb FTW. Wild venison if your a red neck like me!

    Roughly USA produces 20% of world beef from memory.


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    #34
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    ford2600 wrote: »
    Cattle are a herd animal and ruminants; they ingest large volumes of grass and then sit and chew it. "Chewing the cud" which is how they breakdown the grass.

    Fed lots in the USA fed concentrates to the cattle and keep them enclosed in lots packed together. IMHO mass produced chicken/pig meat is as bad.

    Grass fed beef/lamb FTW. Wild venison if your a red neck like me!

    Roughly USA produces 20% of world beef from memory.

    But how does this make the meat bad for you ?


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    #35
    Bruno26
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Bruno26


    jh79 wrote: »
    How does this affect the quality of the meat?

    Cattle are meant to eat grass not corn or grain. Grass fed cattle are healthy. Corn / grain fed cattle are not healthy / as healthy. Google Michael Pollan for definitive answers.


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    #36
    Alf Veedersane
    Registered Users Posts: 24,553 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    bluewolf wrote: »
    I may or may not have had 400g of beef for dinner

    fight the system!!!1

    Proper paleo, innit.

    Eat enough eat in one sitting in case you have a bad week on the hunting front.


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    #37
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    Cattle are meant to eat grass not corn or grain. Grass fed cattle are healthy. Corn / grain fed cattle are not healthy / as healthy.

    Why would Horizon need to consider this sure what influence could this have on whether meat is healthy or not ?


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    #38
    Alf Veedersane
    Registered Users Posts: 24,553 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    jh79 wrote: »
    Why would Horizon need to consider this sure what influence could this have on whether meat is healthy or not ?

    Of course what the animal ingests has an influence on the quality of meat and it's effect on people.

    How could it not?


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    #39
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Alf Veedersane wrote: »
    Of course what the animal ingests has an influence on the quality of meat and it's effect on people.

    How could it not?

    Taste but beyond that there is no reason to believe that Irish grass fed beef is healthier than other type.


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    #40
    Bruno26
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Bruno26


    jh79 wrote: »
    Why would Horizon need to consider this sure what influence could this have on whether meat is healthy or not ?

    Grass fed cattle are healthy. Corn fed cattle in US feedlots are given antibiotics to keep them alive until big enough to slaughter. Think about it- which beef would you prefer to eat?


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    #41
    ford2600
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,457 ✭✭✭ford2600


    Alf Veedersane wrote: »
    Of course what the animal ingests has an influence on the quality of meat and it's effect on people.

    How could it not?

    Changing their social structure completely, feeding them an alien diet could have no effect on meat quality/hormones/fat composition and levels. Don't worry about the trans fats before you fry it in some lovely healthy vegetable oil

    Don't worry about the daily drugs needed to combat the effects of removing chewing the cud from diet.

    Meat is meat. You'll be grand.


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    #42
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    Grass fed cattle are healthy. Corn fed cattle in US feedlots are given antibiotics to keep them alive until big enough to slaughter. Think about it- which beef would you prefer to eat?

    Any evidence that the use of antibiotics produces beef that is in any way less healthy, what is in the meat that makes it less healthy?


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    #43
    ford2600
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,457 ✭✭✭ford2600


    jh79 wrote: »
    Taste but beyond that there is no reason to believe that Irish grass fed beef is healthier than other type.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/16500874/


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    #44
    Bruno26
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Bruno26


    jh79 wrote: »
    Any evidence that the use of antibiotics produces beef that is in any way less healthy, what is in the meat that makes it less healthy?

    A long but excellent description of industrial beef production in USA.

    http://michaelpollan.com/articles-archive/power-steer/


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    #45
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    A long but excellent description of industrial beef production in USA.

    http://michaelpollan.com/articles-archive/power-steer/


    Doesn't explain why you consider this meat to be less healthy and why the Horizon program should have covered this.


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    #46
    Bruno26
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Bruno26


    jh79 wrote: »
    Doesn't explain why you consider this meat to be less healthy and why the Horizon program should have covered this.

    Ok you didn't read it then. It does. It doesn't matter what animals are fed- at the end of the day meat is meat isn't it!!


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    #47
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    Ok you didn't read it then. It does. It doesn't matter what animals are fed- at the end of the day meat is meat isn't it!!
    .

    Evidence from a limited number of U.S. studies suggests that beef from both grass/forage-fed or finished and grain-finished cattle contributes a wide variety of important nutrients to the U.S. diet and consumption of either can be compatible with efforts to improve the cardiovascular health of Americans.

    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174013004944?via=ihub


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    #48
    Bruno26
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Bruno26


    jh79 wrote: »
    .

    Evidence from a limited number of U.S. studies suggests that beef from both grass/forage-fed or finished and grain-finished cattle contributes a wide variety of important nutrients to the U.S. diet and consumption of either can be compatible with efforts to improve the cardiovascular health of Americans.

    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0309174013004944?via=ihub

    I see who paid for that study! Very impartial indeed.


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    #49
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    I see who paid for that study! Very impartial indeed.

    Not a study, a review of other studies. So are they wrong?


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    #50
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    ford2600 wrote: »
    Changing their social structure completely, feeding them an alien diet could have no effect on meat quality/hormones/fat composition and levels. Don't worry about the trans fats before you fry it in some lovely healthy vegetable oil

    Don't worry about the daily drugs needed to combat the effects of removing chewing the cud from diet.

    Meat is meat. You'll be grand.

    A small difference in fat content it seems, so a perfectly safe nutritional source.


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    #51
    Bruno26
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Bruno26


    jh79 wrote: »
    Not a study, a review of other studies. So are they wrong?

    Yes.


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    #52
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    Yes.

    How? Based on what evidence ?


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    #53
    moc moc a moc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,299 ✭✭✭moc moc a moc


    bluewolf wrote: »
    Only 65g?! Wat

    Sure you'd practically breathe that in walking past a farm


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    #54
    Bruno26
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Bruno26


    jh79 wrote: »
    How? Based on what evidence ?

    It's fairly simple. Cattle like humans are designed to eat real food. In the case of cattle that is grass. Anything different impedes the natural process.


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    #55
    deadlybuzzman
    Registered Users Posts: 1,874 ✭✭✭deadlybuzzman


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    I see who paid for that study! Very impartial indeed.

    Unless it's from a very reputable source where there's less of a chance they were bankrolled by a vested interest, presume every 'study' is working backwards from a desired goal.


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    #56
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    It's fairly simple. Cattle like humans are designed to eat real food. In the case of cattle that is grass. Anything different impedes the natural process.

    Research to date doesn't support your theory.


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    #57
    Bruno26
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Bruno26


    jh79 wrote: »
    Research to date doesn't support your theory.

    The research reaches the result industry wants.


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    #58
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Bruno26 wrote: »
    The research reaches the result industry wants.

    Strange how the grass fed industry can't get the result they want.


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    #59
    Bruno26
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Bruno26


    jh79 wrote: »
    Strange how the grass fed industry can't get the result they want.

    Not much need for research when cattle are living the way they've lived for a few thousand years.


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    #60
    Call Me Jimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 8,449 ✭✭✭Call Me Jimmy


    It's an interesting question about the lives and health of animals affecting the nutritional value of the meat.
    I would like to know if there is a notable difference nutritionally, it seems like a very simple test.


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    #61
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    Call Me Jimmy wrote: »
    It's an interesting question about the lives and health of animals affecting the nutritional value of the meat.
    I would like to know if there is a notable difference nutritionally, it seems like a very simple test.

    No significant effect it seems.


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