The future of RTE Radio 1 LW

Hotblack Desiato

Mickey Mike wrote: »

It would be absolutely fabulous if they put RTE Gold MW 567kHz, surly to god someone somewhere might have a go.

If it became a "proper" station under BAI wreckulation then it'd have to have:

- Ads
- News
- Inane chatter
- "current affairs" i.e. people talking utter shyte, and/or brainless phone-ins
- Irish!

despite the fact that all of the above are amply available on existing FM stations.

It wouldn't and couldn't be what it is now unfortunately, because according to the BAI a pure music station is the work of the Devil and must not be allowed to happen. And all the commercial stations would be up in arms if RTE were given another national broadcast station.

kazoo106 wrote: »

DAB retains the advantages of FM, while offering immediate and tangible improvements to the listener and the sector

Hahahahahahahahahaha

hahahahaha

haha

ha.

Mickey Mike

Mickey Mike wrote: »

I don't know, I hope they take pictures and video the dismantling of the TX, it has been idle for 13 years, no one, group or company bothered with it, the same thing will apply with the Clarkestown TX and that won't be long.

RTE probably wouldn't allow anyone else use the 567 transmitter after they telling everyone else about what terrible technology medium wave is, the taxpayer then footed the bill to have it sitting idle. If they never wanted it working again then they should have torn it down when they shut it down saving a big bill in maintenance.

Te real reason it you're to believe RTE why 567 was shut down was because 252 Khz offered better coverage into the U.K and 252 also offered sufficient coverage for Ireland and also probably more to do with it is the fact it's a solid state transmitter that doesn't need huge expensive power hungry valves and water cooling, the 252 transmitter is probably saving a lot of money especially since it's only working at around 100 Kw max if even during the day.

What was insanely funny is that they even threw the environmental argument into why 567 Khz was shut down, considering data centers can consume 150 Mw+ per site for the big ones and running the largest transmitter in the world is nothing compared to that.

Cube98

Broadcasting RTE Radio 1 on Longwave 252 was one of the biggest mistakes RTE ever made. Due to the declining amount of lw sets in homes and cars the past 20 years along with the transmitter running at low power it's a donkey of a service. Now what should have happened is 567 from Ballycommom should still be on air today. 252 should have been retired after the death of Teamtalk 252.

Cube98

Cube98 wrote: »

Broadcasting RTE Radio 1 on Longwave 252 was one of the biggest mistakes RTE ever made. Due to the declining amount of lw sets in homes and cars the past 20 years along with the transmitter running at low power it's a donkey of a service. Now what should have happened is 567 from Ballycommom should still be on air today. 252 should have been retired after the death of Teamtalk 252.

567 Khz had poorer coverage into the U.K if you are to believe RTE, I don't know how well it got to the UK but a lot of MW stations can sound very wishy washy as it's a very crowded band at night where as LW is a lot more stable. Though some of the more powerful UK transmitters are solid here day and night.

When we were in Wales a few Summers ago we had LW 252 on in the car a lot and it was rock solid anywhere we were all the way up past Birmingham despite the lower power it was like listening in Ireland.

The problem today is the quality of modern LW/MW radios are poor as they are usually designed to pick up very strong signals and at that they can do so poorly where as many cars have much better radios with much better antennas, the rear window heater being used for LW is a great example of this, and very clever.

LW 252 is a solid state transmitter and I'm not sure if there are many LW/MW transmitters of that output that are solid state out there but the advantage is much less maintenance and reduced power.

Still, it would have been nice to see 567 Khz still on the go but sadly it won't be there for much longer, I wonder will someone buy it or will they just scrap it ?

Some might find this very interesting.

http://homepage.eircom.net/~totalbroadcast/athlone2.html

And some reading here.

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/showthread.php?t=26422

rathfarnhamlad

Not RTE but allegedly there is an Italian station who plan on running test transmissions on 207 LW with a view to launching at the end of the year.

I found it while browsing the web last night: https://www.nexus.org/member-services/radio-and-tv/schedules/

It'd be interesting to see what if anything comes from this. Will it be a success or will it end up like that station from the Isle of Man which was talked about in the mid-2000s & never launched?

rathfarnhamlad

rathfarnhamlad wrote: »

Not RTE but allegedly there is an Italian station who plan on running test transmissions on 207 LW with a view to launching at the end of the year.

I found it while browsing the web last night: https://www.nexus.org/member-services/radio-and-tv/schedules/

It'd be interesting to see what if anything comes from this. Will it be a success or will it end up like that station from the Isle of Man which was talked about in the mid-2000s & never launched?

Interesting, thanks for sharing, perhaps worth a new thread ? we could give reception reports in the new thread.

I was disappointed but not surprised that when RTE announced a disruption to FM service earlier in the week from Kippure I think it was that they gave every other way to listen except LW. RTE are a sad organization.

Mickey Mike

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I was disappointed but not surprised that when RTE announced a disruption to FM service earlier in the week from Kippure I think it was that they gave every other way to listen except LW. RTE are a sad organization.

Shutting LW252 is there next goal, and as they might say "With the help of God". If RTE are anyway serious about LW they would retune to 261kHz and raise the power level to 300kw. Since they had no trouble shutting down DAB, they will try LW again, sometime in 2022.

rathfarnhamlad

Mickey Mike wrote: »

Shutting LW252 is there next goal, and as they might say "With the help of God". If RTE are anyway serious about LW they would retune to 261kHz and raise the power level to 300kw. Since they had no trouble shutting down DAB, they will try LW again, sometime in 2022.

Obtaining ITU clearance to change frequency to 261 would make sense but let's face it, it ain't gonna happen.

As bad as this sounds, I reckon RTE will shut off the LW transmitter within a year. I suspect that the mast will come down & the site sold to developers to build houses priced far above what young professionals who commute to work in Dublin will be able to afford </rant>.

Meanwhile up North, BBC Radio Ulster/Foyle is scheduled to shut off its medium wave services in a matter of days. So how many active AM broadcast transmitters will be left on the island of Ireland? Probably in single figures I suspect?

rathfarnhamlad

Deleted User wrote: »

Interesting, thanks for sharing, perhaps worth a new thread ? we could give reception reports in the new thread.

Maybe yeh. I'd be interested in finding out more about the station. I must remember to tune in to the web SDRs every so often & see if I can catch it...

Mickey Mike

Mickey Mike wrote: »

Shutting LW252 is there next goal, and as they might say "With the help of God". If RTE are anyway serious about LW they would retune to 261kHz and raise the power level to 300kw. Since they had no trouble shutting down DAB, they will try LW again, sometime in 2022.

rathfarnhamlad wrote: »

Obtaining ITU clearance to change frequency to 261 would make sense but let's face it, it ain't gonna happen.

As bad as this sounds, I reckon RTE will shut off the LW transmitter within a year. I suspect that the mast will come down & the site sold to developers to build houses priced far above what young professionals who commute to work in Dublin will be able to afford </rant>.

Meanwhile up North, BBC Radio Ulster/Foyle is scheduled to shut off its medium wave services in a matter of days. So how many active AM broadcast transmitters will be left on the island of Ireland? Probably in single figures I suspect?

Yeah they will shut it down next time as the modern RTE has nothing but contempt for AM.

BBC R Ulster will be a shame to loose.

dxhound2005

Just by chance I heard English on 918 kHz on the evening of 28 April. I was not aware that the new station was starting up that day. I can't see them ever going on LW. If they go on 207 kHz they will be up against Iceland on the same frequency.

https://www.bclnews.it/2021/04/28/am-mediumwave-frequency-change-918-khz-to-europe/

rathfarnhamlad

Deleted User wrote: »

BBC R Ulster will be a shame to loose.

Agreed. I presume the mast will be going too at some point which is a pity considering it's one of only a few Blaw-Knox towers outside of the US & has been standing since 1936. Irrelevant to all but anoraks but still...

rathfarnhamlad

rathfarnhamlad wrote: »

Agreed. I presume the mast will be going too at some point which is a pity considering it's one of only a few Blaw-Knox towers outside of the US & has been standing since 1936. Irrelevant to all but anoraks but still...

People have no care, thought or respect for old technology, they dont understand that without it we wouldn't have the tech we have today, though I think sometimes we'd be far better off without a lot of it. One of the greatest travesties, in my opinon of course, is when the computer went from the big box in the room to the pocket.

Thanks for sharing that infor about the BBC R Ulster Tower, I had no idea, very interesting. Yep, they'll be too delighted to tear it down, greeat disprespect for the technology and history.

rathfarnhamlad

Deleted User wrote: »

RTE are a sad organization.

IMO RTE as an organization has been in freefall mode for more than a decade. 567 gone, 252 going any day now, so many of the greats have left or been effectively forced to leave. All this talk of licence fee increases & for what? Less services & even more pi55 poor programming & content?

That being said I do like the Ronan Collins & John Creedon shows. 2 guys who really know their stuff on music & can communicate with their audiences very well. Sometimes I put on Lyric FM in the car or when I'm doing some work in the garage. Otherwise I could easily live without RTE radio, especially 2FM - that station is getting worse & worse by the minute.

As for RTE television, the only time I'd watch that would be for a live event like sport. That's been the case for years now.

Lastly, you know you're running out of ideas when a shows "special guest star" is a member of staff or a presenter from a different show. There really is something rotten in the state of Donnybrook!

rathfarnhamlad

Deleted User wrote: »

People have no care, thought or respect for old technology, they dont understand that without it we wouldn't have the tech we have today, though I think sometimes we'd be far better off without a lot of it. One of the greatest travesties, in my opinon of course, is when the computer went from the big box in the room to the pocket.

Thanks for sharing that infor about the BBC R Ulster Tower, I had no idea, very interesting. Yep, they'll be too delighted to tear it down, greeat disprespect for the technology and history.

I get most of what you're saying. I do have a smart phone myself. To me a phone with a decent camera is a must, especially when carrying out work on equipment & the like. I also have a couple of radio apps installed, plus Shazam which is handy for identifying music that I'm hearing for the first time. Whatsapp is good for keeping in touch with family & friends, groups that I'm involved with & so on.

But when it comes to web browsing, sending & replying to emails, watching videos on youtube etc, then my desktop PC is the only tool for the job.

It's very disappointing to see the trend of radio masts coming down all over Europe these past few years.

225LongWave

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Just by chance I heard English on 918 kHz on the evening of 28 April. I was not aware that the new station was starting up that day. I can't see them ever going on LW. If they go on 207 kHz they will be up against Iceland on the same frequency.

https://www.bclnews.it/2021/04/28/am-mediumwave-frequency-change-918-khz-to-europe/

189 Israel
198 GB BBC R4 400kW*
> 207 Israel 120kW
216
225 Poland 600kW Warsaw
234 RTL 2000kW (French)
243 DR Kalundborg 50kW
252 Algeria TDA Chaine 3/4
1500kW (750)
252 RTE R1 150kW (60kW)
261
270 Czech
279 IOM { 500kW }


RTE have a DRM compatible 300kW transmitter at Summerhill since July 2007 - they just don't employ dedicated staff at Donnybrook to know what that eXpensive Digital asset does yet ?

dxhound2005

This is what is on Long Wave at present.

153 Romania.
171 Morocco
189 Iceland
198 UK
207 Iceland
225 Poland
234 Luxembourg
243 Denmark (very restricted hours)
252 Ireland and Algeria
270 Czechia

rathfarnhamlad

dxhound2005 wrote: »

This is what is on Long Wave at present.

153 Romania.
171 Morocco
189 Iceland
198 UK
207 Iceland
225 Poland
234 Luxembourg
243 Denmark (very restricted hours)
252 Ireland and Algeria
270 Czechia

Are the Mongolian LW transmitters still on the air? What about Turkmenistan on 279?

I think the Czech station is going this year

dxhound2005

According to this list they are. But there is no chance of hearing them here.

http://www.mwlist.org/mwlist_quick_and_easy.php?area=2&kHz=279

rathfarnhamlad

dxhound2005 wrote: »

According to this list they are. But there is no chance of hearing them here.

http://www.mwlist.org/mwlist_quick_and_easy.php?area=2&kHz=279

Thanks for clarifying. I haven't found them yet on any SDR.

dxhound2005

There are some people on a mission to try to get some modulation.

https://ratzer.at/rails/active_storage/disk/eyJfcmFpbHMiOnsibWVzc2FnZSI6IkJBaDdDRG9JYTJWNVNTSWhlbnA2WjJGb056QXhiWE50TW1oMlpXd3hiV0Y2ZW1KaWVIUTFPUVk2QmtWVU9oQmthWE53YjNOcGRHbHZia2tpVldsdWJHbHVaVHNnWm1sc1pXNWhiV1U5SWsxdmJtZHZiR2xoWDB4WFgwUkxPRTlMTG5Ca1ppSTdJR1pwYkdWdVlXMWxLajFWVkVZdE9DY25UVzl1WjI5c2FXRmZURmRmUkVzNFQwc3VjR1JtQmpzR1ZEb1JZMjl1ZEdWdWRGOTBlWEJsU1NJVVlYQndiR2xqWVhScGIyNHZjR1JtQmpzR1ZBPT0iLCJleHAiOiIyMDIxLTA1LTAxVDIwOjE2OjM3LjAxN1oiLCJwdXIiOiJibG9iX2tleSJ9fQ==--ba17d909f83f8e5d0673a6e77aae962322e6b781/Mongolia_LW_DK8OK.pdf?content_type=application%2Fpdf&disposition=inline%3B+filename%3D%22Mongolia_LW_DK8OK.pdf%22%3B+filename%2A%3DUTF-8%27%27Mongolia_LW_DK8OK.pdf

rathfarnhamlad

rathfarnhamlad wrote: »

IMO RTE as an organization has been in freefall mode for more than a decade. 567 gone, 252 going any day now, so many of the greats have left or been effectively forced to leave. All this talk of licence fee increases & for what? Less services & even more pi55 poor programming & content?

That being said I do like the Ronan Collins & John Creedon shows. 2 guys who really know their stuff on music & can communicate with their audiences very well. Sometimes I put on Lyric FM in the car or when I'm doing some work in the garage. Otherwise I could easily live without RTE radio, especially 2FM - that station is getting worse & worse by the minute.

As for RTE television, the only time I'd watch that would be for a live event like sport. That's been the case for years now.

Lastly, you know you're running out of ideas when a shows "special guest star" is a member of staff or a presenter from a different show. There really is something rotten in the state of Donnybrook!

Dee Forbes will get her license fee increase, but what she really wants is reform of the license and I know they will abolish the license and take it from the property tax again penalising People who own their own homes because they'll increase this tax to compensate. But I doubt even a hundred million a year extra could save RTE from self destruction.

RTE is just the Governments Propaganda machine anyway and in my opinion no longer fit for purpose and it's really sad because it used to be a public broadcaster you could actually be proud of that served the interests of the Public but with the digital age they are no longer relevant with their Agendas and liberalism + political correctness.

Dee Forbes knows that a lot of People are copping on that the license adds are no longer scaring people as they have woken up to the fact that not paying your license is not a criminal offence and if you end up in court you ask for a Garry Doyle order and that will be the end of that pretty quickly, to cut a long story short this went to the high court and the order was created in the high court basically These inspector thugs can not trespass onto your private property invading your privacy. RTE/BAI are criminals themselves the way they try force People to pay with their scare tactics and adds misinforming not paying your TV license is a criminal offence.

Hotblack Desiato

Deleted User wrote: »

RTE is just the Governments Propaganda machine anyway and in my opinion no longer fit for purpose and it's really sad because it used to be a public broadcaster you could actually be proud of that served the interests of the Public but with the digital age they are no longer relevant with their Agendas and liberalism + political correctness.

:rolleyes:

TAFKAlawhec

rathfarnhamlad wrote: »

Agreed. I presume the mast will be going too at some point which is a pity considering it's one of only a few Blaw-Knox towers outside of the US & has been standing since 1936. Irrelevant to all but anoraks but still...

To the best of my knowledge, the decapitated Blau-Knox tower at Lisnagarvey is used to presently radiate BBC Radio Ulster on 1341 kHz and Radio 4 (Long Wave service) on 720 kHz - the other three services (Radio 5 Live on 909 kHz, TalkSport on 1089 kHz and Absolute Radio on 1215 kHz) are radiated from a more common T-aerial slung between two freestanding towers.

It's not surprising that Radio Ulster (& Radio Foyle) is closing down its MW transmissions given that there are very few places in NI that can't receive at least a satisfactory mono FM signal of the station - I think it's something like 6-7k people in a population of >1.8 million - that keeping a 100kW burner going is hard to justify, not to mention the 1kW station at Enniskillen that I've long felt was a waste given that reception of 1341 kHz in Enniskillen's reception area was pretty much decent even as far west as Belleek. What will be interesting is how Radio Ulster will handle the odd MW opt-outs in its schedule, which in recent years has been limited to covering GAA & rugby games.

As for the masts themselves, if they have no "reason for existing" once their broadcasting life ends, then unless they have some person on group to fund their maintenance then ultimately they will come down, especially if there is a risk to other buildings or people nearby from a lack of maintenance. Once all of MW goes from Lisnagarvey I can see Arqiva selling the land on - the site already is surrounded by a lot of commercial developments just off the M1 outside Lisburn and it wouldn't be difficult to find a buyer for the land it's on IMO.

Hotblack Desiato

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

:rolleyes:

lol seriously, they were a lot better many years ago than they are today. Hard to believe I know

TAFKAlawhec

dxhound2005 wrote: »

This is what is on Long Wave at present.

153 Romania.
171 Morocco
189 Iceland
198 UK
207 Iceland
225 Poland
234 Luxembourg
243 Denmark (very restricted hours)
252 Ireland and Algeria
270 Czechia

rathfarnhamlad wrote: »

Are the Mongolian LW transmitters still on the air? What about Turkmenistan on 279?

I think the Czech station is going this year

It's hard to get much concrete information about the 279 kHz transmission from Asghabat in Turkmenistan - none of the online SDRs I've noticed are located close enough to receive even the sign of a carrier there, and recent reports have stated that the modulation levels are very low. The guys on MW List have the station still listed and they are usually quick to update their database when a station open/closes, so I'd assume for the time being it is still standing as the last LW TX going in the former USSR.

As for the fate of the remaining LW transmitters in Europe, it's inevitable that RTL on 234 kHz will close in the near future (it's already reportedly running on reduced power), while the fate of BBC Radio 4 on 198 kHz will mostly depend, believe it or not, on the roll out of electrical smart metres in GB as it carries timing signals for some electric metres to listen out to switch for different rates (including the infamous Economy 7) - IIRC the contract for keeping this system going has been extended to at least the end of 2023 as the smart meter rollout has fallen behind (it was already doing so prior to the current pandemic). Czechia Radio are themselves in a process of winding down their MW & LW transmissions. Otherwise, RAS Iceland were planning to roll out some low-mid powered MW transmissions to replace their two frequencies on LW, but they seem to have rolled back on it as the test transmissions on 666 kHz seem to have ended and therefore the LW transmissions stay for the time being. Antenna Satelor Romania on 153 kHz & Chaine 3 Algeria on 252 kHz are probably good for a few more years while Medi 1 Morocco 171 kHz & Radio 1 Poland on 225 kHz could keep going on some years themselves but at the same time I wouldn't be surprised if they were terminated at short notice either.

rathfarnhamlad

TAFKAlawhec wrote: »

It's hard to get much concrete information about the 279 kHz transmission from Asghabat in Turkmenistan - none of the online SDRs I've noticed are located close enough to receive even the sign of a carrier there, and recent reports have stated that the modulation levels are very low. The guys on MW List have the station still listed and they are usually quick to update their database when a station open/closes, so I'd assume for the time being it is still standing as the last LW TX going in the former USSR.

As for the fate of the remaining LW transmitters in Europe, it's inevitable that RTL on 234 kHz will close in the near future (it's already reportedly running on reduced power), while the fate of BBC Radio 4 on 198 kHz will mostly depend, believe it or not, on the roll out of electrical smart metres in GB as it carries timing signals for some electric metres to listen out to switch for different rates (including the infamous Economy 7) - IIRC the contract for keeping this system going has been extended to at least the end of 2023 as the smart meter rollout has fallen behind (it was already doing so prior to the current pandemic). Czechia Radio are themselves in a process of winding down their MW & LW transmissions. Otherwise, RAS Iceland were planning to roll out some low-mid powered MW transmissions to replace their two frequencies on LW, but they seem to have rolled back on it as the test transmissions on 666 kHz seem to have ended and therefore the LW transmissions stay for the time being. Antenna Satelor Romania on 153 kHz & Chaine 3 Algeria on 252 kHz are probably good for a few more years while Medi 1 Morocco 171 kHz & Radio 1 Poland on 225 kHz could keep going on some years themselves but at the same time I wouldn't be surprised if they were terminated at short notice either.

Thanks for the info.

I too haven't been able to locate any web SDR able to pick up Turkmenistan, or any of the Mongolian LW signals for that matter. If Turkmenistan 279 does close then that's good for the upcoming Isle of Man station as they will have a clear channel </sarcasm>.

After Europe 1 & RMC Info ceased broadcasting on LW I thought that RTL would follow suit pretty quickly but thankfully it's still there for now. Enjoy it while it lasts I guess. I tuned into it the other night & heard some Pink Floyd - nice! Decent strong signal & good sound through my old PYE radio, which incidentally was manufactured in a plant that was demolished about 20 years ago to make way for something new & exciting. Who knows what will replace the Dundrum Town Centre when it's reason for existing is no more?

Once or twice I have gotten a usable (just about) signal from the Czech transmitter since early 2014 when the power was dialled way down to its current level.

The Polish station, as far as I am aware, is used to carry the national parliament coverage. I think there was talk a few years back of that programming going to FM & then closing LW. More recently I have read that there is new programming on that transmitter directed at Belarus.

I have caught the Romanian station late at night a few times playing some folky music.

I still haven't been able to pick up the elusive (Dutch?) pirate that broadcasts only extremely intermittently on 261...

Mickey Mike

RTE have a DRM compatible 300kW transmitter at Summerhill since July 2007
Is it even possible to buy a DRM radio? that seems to be the problem in Europe, so that was a waste of time from the get go.