My maiden DART voyage

devnull

And another useless failure this morning with no information at stations, no scrolling display message and no announcements and staff not knowing what is going on, "Signal Failure and minor delays" when asked.

Turns out almost two hours ago Irish Rail posted on their website that a tree had come down on the line, after waiting for a short while people realised and exited the station to get the bus after checking their smartphones, when an announcement was made that there would be a short delay whilst a signal failure is fixed.

Why not just say what is actually going on and a tree was onn the line? Colleagues waiting at DART stations waiting for a train on this "Short delay" to fix a signal problem, not knowing atree had come down.

As with Black Friday, once again at station information is lacking, if they knew two hours ago there was a tree on the line, why were they saying an hour later, that it was a signal failure and minor delays?

Class response from Irish Rail here:
https://twitter.com/IrishRail/status/519001563592151040

Rashers72

I am stuck in a Dundalk to Connolly suburban train north of Malahide. Not a single announcement from the driver since I got on the train.

devnull

Same failings from Black Friday, just a different day, unbelievable that when criticised they are now saying that it was posted on twitter ages ago, seem to think they don't need to give any info at stations.

Would it not be a good idea to get the people doing service alerts on the website the ability to uupdate screens at stations and make announcements?

Rashers72

Rashers72 wrote: »

I am stuck in a Dundalk to Connolly suburban train north of Malahide. Not a single announcement from the driver since I got on the train.

Still silence from our driver, but train ran through Malahide and made unscheduled stop for passengers at Portmarnock. Now stuck north of Clongriffen. So definitely running late, but have services presumed? Displays still showing services suspended.....

devnull

Services have resumed according to Twitter.

L1011

I see they've moved to providing the same level of covering for all failings with pathetic defences on Twitter as is done on here then. Usually you put the sane customer care staff on Twitter...

Frank Lee Midere

MYOB wrote: »

I see they've moved to providing the same level of covering for all failings with pathetic defences on Twitter as is done on here then. Usually you put the sane customer care staff on Twitter...

Well to be fair the twitter feed did mention the delays.

Highflyer13

devnull wrote: »

Same failings from Black Friday, just a different day, unbelievable that when criticised they are now saying that it was posted on twitter ages ago, seem to think they don't need to give any info at stations.

Would it not be a good idea to get the people doing service alerts on the website the ability to uupdate screens at stations and make announcements?

No, because thats a sensible idea. IR don't do sensible unfortunately.

devnull

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

Well to be fair the twitter feed did mention the delays.

It does not defend lack of information at stations and inaccurate information at stations, accurate information should be provided at both.

The fact is communication between central control and station staff, and station staff and customers is a disgrace.

How can the person posting on twitter know right away, but the staff at the station still do not an hour later?

Highflyer13

devnull wrote: »

Same failings from Black Friday, just a different day, unbelievable that when criticised they are now saying that it was posted on twitter ages ago, seem to think they don't need to give any info at stations.

Would it not be a good idea to get the people doing service alerts on the website the ability to uupdate screens at stations and make announcements?

No, because thats a sensible idea. IR don't do sensible unfortunately.

cython

In contrast to the above, I almost think that whatever driver was responsible for my train in on the Maynooth line must have been reading this thread, as he couldn't have been more informative with announcements after every group of passengers boarded. Even going so far as to point out the reason for the delay was a tree on the line blocking him getting into the station to start the service back in to Dublin. However this might have been him taking the initiative rather than control, since he didn't have to be told about the tree..... Later services and their information would have been a better metric.

n97 mini

There should be signs on the platforms and in every carriage showing the twitter feed.

devnull

end of the road wrote: »

did the staff in the station even know what happened. its not as if informing staff never mind passengers is a priority for the relevant people in irish rail as known from experience at wexford station where the staff used to at least be the last to know anything.

Signal Failure at Howth Junction (the seemingly default excuse) and a slight delay was the official reason given just before 7am, which has no basis on reality when trains were suspended due to a tree on the lines. None of this information was given on train, platform or displays, only by asking a staff member in the station, who didn't make an announcement.

Regardless of who is at fault, it is just not good enough, the same person should be able to manage disruption communications on all mediums, but it's fairly obvious these days that customer communication is completely disjointed and clearly not a priority at IE.

Either way their communications was not acceptable this morning like several other occasions in the past. The fact that they don't even see a problem with it suggests nothing will improve unless there are some changes within the company or the NTA force them to improve.

Hilly Bill

n97 mini wrote: »

There should be signs on the platforms and in every carriage showing the twitter feed.

It's bad enough with some trains not showing the correct destination without wanting twitter feed shown as well.

devnull

The last few weeks has taught me that twitter has been by far more accurate than the staff at stations, and the displays that are there now.

Hilly Bill

devnull wrote: »

Signal Failure at Howth Junction (the seemingly default excuse) and a slight delay was the official reason given just before 7am, which has no basis on reality when trains were suspended due to a tree on the lines. None of this information was given on train, platform or displays, only by asking a staff member in the station, who didn't make an announcement.

Regardless of who is at fault, it is just not good enough, the same person should be able to manage disruption communications on all mediums, but it's fairly obvious these days that customer communication is completely disjointed and clearly not a priority at IE.

Either way their communications was not acceptable this morning like several other occasions in the past. The fact that they don't even see a problem with it suggests nothing will improve unless there are some changes within the company or the NTA force them to improve.

Where we're you told of a slight delay?. There was a tree on the overheads at killbarack. There is no excuse not to know what the delay is to be honest, all they need to do is pick up the phone. All station managers would have had the notification by text or email.

LXFlyer

devnull wrote: »

The last few weeks has taught me that twitter has been by far more accurate than the staff at stations, and the displays that are there now.

That tends to be the case with most transport companies nowadays due to the sheer immediacy with which you can get messages to customers.

The real problem is how to get live status updates to staff on the ground - some GB TOCs are issuing station staff with tablets so that they can get up-to-the-minute updates. Maybe this is something IE should consider.

It's quite clear that the content of CTC texts are not getting through to the frontline staff all of the time - and that to me is a problem that needs addressing.

Passengers should not be left waiting more than 5 minutes without an announcement on the event of a delay.

devnull

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Where we're you told of a slight delay?. There was a tree on the overheads at killbarack. There is no excuse not to know what the delay is to be honest, all they need to do is pick up the phone. All station managers would have had the notification by text or email.

At the Dart station I went to get the train this morning.

I know the problem now since when I heard the staff member say that it was due to a signal fault at Howth Junction and t thought it sounded a bit suspect having heard the minor delays line before when it was much more than that.

I then look on Irishrail.ie and it says services are suspended and that had been posted much earlier yet it was being advertised as minor delays due to a signalling fault according to staff at the stations.

devnull

lxflyer wrote: »

The real problem is how to get live status updates to staff on the ground - some GB TOCs are issuing station staff with tablets so that they can get up-to-the-minute updates. Maybe this is something IE should consider.

It's quite clear that the content of CTC texts are not getting through to the frontline staff all of the time - and that to me is a problem that needs addressing.

Passengers should not be left waiting more than 5 minutes without an announcement on the event of a delay.

Well surely staffed stations should have the technology in the ticket office to actually allow them to get straight away notifications of what is happening?

If they have an internet enabled computer surely they can do it already without need for a tablet? Surely the ticket office staff should be able to make announcements and get data quickly?

whatever way they do it now, it doesn't work, so if it requires tablets and can be done no better way I'm all for it, the data getting there is one thing, even when it does the speed of it getting out at stations and at trains is way too slow.

Surely they need to serious consider a situation where there is a co-ordinated control centre that can send out and make announcements for twitter, the web, and displays and announcements all concurrently?

LXFlyer

devnull wrote: »

Well surely staffed stations should have the technology in the ticket office to actually allow them to get straight away notifications of what is happening?

If they have an internet enabled computer surely they can do it already without need for a tablet? Surely the ticket office staff should be able to make announcements and get data quickly?

whatever way they do it now, it doesn't work, so if it requires tablets and can be done no better way I'm all for it, the data getting there is one thing, even when it does the speed of it getting out at stations and at trains is way too slow.

Surely they need to serious consider a situation where there is a co-ordinated control centre that can send out and make announcements for twitter, the web, and displays and announcements all concurrently?

It's pretty obvious they don't have that technology as otherwise they'd be able to make announcements about what is going on.

When I mentioned tablets, I was referring to platform/ticket gate staff - they're not near a PC yet everyone expects them to know what's going on. Short of issuing them with tablets, how else are they going to know?

The issue appears to be how decisions are communicated from CTC to frontline staff. They are getting to the people who man the twitter account and website alerts (which I believe is the comms department) but they don't appear to be getting to the people in the stations who directly interface with customers.

That's where the system breaks down.

devnull

lxflyer wrote: »

It's pretty obvious they don't have that technology as otherwise they'd be able to make announcements about what is going on.

There should be a central control room who is able to do all of that, which then takes the whole issue of all these different departments, at the moment there seems to be a number of different departments all of which do different parts of communicating outages which leads to many chances of a breakdown in communication or information being incorrect.

When I mentioned tablets, I was referring to platform/ticket gate staff - they're not near a PC yet everyone expects them to know what's going on. Short of issuing them with tablets, how else are they going to know?

The issue appears to be how decisions are communicated from CTC to frontline staff. They are getting to the people who man the twitter account and website alerts (which I believe is the comms department) but they don't appear to be getting to the people in the stations who directly interface with customers..

I agree for gate staff and frontline staff needing to have some way of knowing what is going on, that much is clear, but again this would be less required if the announcements from the station and ticket office staff who are not on the gate line, also knew what was going on and made announcements to that effect.

The problem isn't just platform and gate staff, it's also in the smaller stations where there is only one guy in the ticket office who also does not know what is going on, as illustrated by incorrect announcements when they are made, or nothing at all as has happened recently as well. The gate-line staff obviously won't have access to information easily, but the station and ticket office staff certainly should but still there is a lack of communication.

I just can't fathom how we can have an outage and half an hour later or an hour later in some cases, no staff in the station is aware of what is going on, whether they be ticket office staff or gate line.

Central control should be able to play a far bigger role in this, a control centre should have access to change the screen and make announcements if need-be, and that is something the company should address.

Judging by the defensive attitude of IR on twitter though, I don't hold my breath, their view seems to be look on the website or twitter, they don't seem to think they have a problem

Hilly Bill

devnull wrote: »

Well surely staffed stations should have the technology in the ticket office to actually allow them to get straight away notifications of what is happening?

If they have an internet enabled computer surely they can do it already without need for a tablet? Surely the ticket office staff should be able to make announcements and get data quickly?

whatever way they do it now, it doesn't work, so if it requires tablets and can be done no better way I'm all for it, the data getting there is one thing, even when it does the speed of it getting out at stations and at trains is way too slow.

Surely they need to serious consider a situation where there is a co-ordinated control centre that can send out and make announcements for twitter, the web, and displays and announcements all concurrently?

A simple phone is good enough either to get a text about delays or to use to ring and find out whats going on.

Hilly Bill

lxflyer wrote: »

It's pretty obvious they don't have that technology as otherwise they'd be able to make announcements about what is going on.

When I mentioned tablets, I was referring to platform/ticket gate staff - they're not near a PC yet everyone expects them to know what's going on. Short of issuing them with tablets, how else are they going to know?

The issue appears to be how decisions are communicated from CTC to frontline staff. They are getting to the people who man the twitter account and website alerts (which I believe is the comms department) but they don't appear to be getting to the people in the stations who directly interface with customers.

That's where the system breaks down.

The duty manager should be informing them and making sure that announcements be made and all the staff on the ground are up to date as to what is going on.

Hilly Bill

devnull wrote: »

There should be a central control room who is able to do all of that, which then takes the whole issue of all these different departments, at the moment there seems to be a number of different departments all of which do different parts of communicating outages which leads to many chances of a breakdown in communication or information being incorrect.



I agree for gate staff and frontline staff needing to have some way of knowing what is going on, that much is clear, but again this would be less required if the announcements from the station and ticket office staff who are not on the gate line, also knew what was going on and made announcements to that effect.

The problem isn't just platform and gate staff, it's also in the smaller stations where there is only one guy in the ticket office who also does not know what is going on, as illustrated by incorrect announcements when they are made, or nothing at all as has happened recently as well. The gate-line staff obviously won't have access to information easily, but the station and ticket office staff certainly should but still there is a lack of communication.

I just can't fathom how we can have an outage and half an hour later or an hour later in some cases, no staff in the station is aware of what is going on, whether they be ticket office staff or gate line.

Central control should be able to play a far bigger role in this, a control centre should have access to change the screen and make announcements if need-be, and that is something the company should address.

Judging by the defensive attitude of IR on twitter though, I don't hold my breath, their view seems to be look on the website or twitter, they don't seem to think they have a problem

They do, its them that sends out the alerts and makes announcements over the tannoys. There was an intermittent fault with the pa system this morning.

devnull

The only messages i hear reguarly at stations are automated ones and testing 1234 a lot as well.

Thargor

So is the signal fault at Howth Junction an in-joke for IE staff or something? Code for go fcuk yourselves? I remember missing a Citylink bus Id bought a ticket for once because a DART stopped after Landsowne Road for 40 minutes, half an hour in the driver came on and said it was a signal fault at Howth Junction, checking Twitter later I saw it was because there were fox cubs on the track at Pearse station.

Hilly Bill

devnull wrote: »

The only messages i hear reguarly at stations are automated ones and testing 1234 a lot as well.

You would have thought they would have perfected 1234 at this stage

Rashers72

Yes seemed to have been a bad morning for information to passengers. When I was walking up to my Northern suburban train station, met lots of people leaving, and car park was only a quarter full. When got to the platform, only about 10 passengers v's the normal 100-150. Got on a Dundalk to Connolly ICR, but knew it was a risk, as they were telling passengers that DB accepting IE tickets. Train pulled into Malahide, about 30% full. At this point, not a single announcement. Lots of passengers prepared to get off to try and get a DB. Low and behold after after about 1 minute, train leaves. We then get stuck outside Portmarnock, and driver makes an announcement. Unfortunately PA system garbeled so make out about 50%. Mentions problems, and says this train will call at all Dart stations to Connolly. Does apologise. Platform displays now changed to reflect services resuming, but not 20 mins late like the LED displays indicate, as the train ahead of us was 36 mins late to Bray. Train gets packed as we hit town, so not sure if passengers left behind. Into Connolly, no staff to be seen, 1 of the 2 exit gates locked shut, so all funnelled into 1 exit. And down escalator broken. All in all, another bad morning. I will note that when services do run, they are normally good. But when things go wrong, it is like everyone runs for cover, and they actually seem to try not to tell passengers what is happening.

devnull

Did you come into Platform 1 at Connolly? Had that happen to me as well if so, where there was several hundred people get off the train and one of the narrow gates was open whilst the other one closed, wanted to change fot the DART so had to walk all the way from Platform 1 to Platform 7 all the way around the outside, long walk when people were going almost isingle file through.

Not helped by a group of people doing the same in the other direction, for the train that was going straight back to Maynooth. Almost a crush in there.

Hilly Bill

Rashers72 wrote: »

Yes seemed to have been a bad morning for information to passengers. When I was walking up to my Northern suburban train station, met lots of people leaving, and car park was only a quarter full. When got to the platform, only about 10 passengers v's the normal 100-150. Got on a Dundalk to Connolly ICR, but knew it was a risk, as they were telling passengers that DB accepting IE tickets. Train pulled into Malahide, about 30% full. At this point, not a single announcement. Lots of passengers prepared to get off to try and get a DB. Low and behold after after about 1 minute, train leaves. We then get stuck outside Portmarnock, and driver makes an announcement. Unfortunately PA system garbeled so make out about 50%. Mentions problems, and says this train will call at all Dart stations to Connolly. Does apologise. Platform displays now changed to reflect services resuming, but not 20 mins late like the LED displays indicate, as the train ahead of us was 36 mins late to Bray. Train gets packed as we hit town, so not sure if passengers left behind. Into Connolly, no staff to be seen, 1 of the 2 exit gates locked shut, so all funnelled into 1 exit. And down escalator broken. All in all, another bad morning. I will note that when services do run, they are normally good. But when things go wrong, it is like everyone runs for cover, and they actually seem to try not to tell passengers what is happening.

Plenty of staff in Connolly this morning. Which one exit? All the exit barriers would have been available to walk through . Plenty of other ways to exit the station apart from the one escalator.
Arnt you contradicting yourself by saying that they try not to tell passengers what is happening when you had announcements on the train. ?